I find it kind of funny that this is the chapter that caused a bunch of Dynasty commenters to turn on the manga when I think it's very much in line with chapter 1, which was also a relatively mediocre trope-fest that relied on the reader's knowledge of the villainess genre to paper over the rough edges. So far chapter 2 is the outlier, unfortunately (though of course with only three chapters there's still plenty of time for it to return to the quality of chapter 2).

I think, for me at least, part of the difference is that it was the first chapter. I can excuse a bit of brevity and overreliance on tropes, when setting the stage, if it helps an author get to the more interesting and unique bits more quickly, so they can focus on those. However, we're now seeing the payoff for some of that initial setup and they're treating it in the same way, so it's harder to say that this is just an introduction getting handwaved so they can get to the real story.

Kinda feel bad for Lilian. This world seems very heteronormative and, while Evris got her ticket out, Lilian might just... be left on the roadside and stuck with the douche prince, because of how her (very bad) plan turned out. I hope she gets something better later.

And it's hard to really hate her when she saved Evris, although it wasn't in the way she expected.

Well I still think the series is cute personally, I'm looking forward to seeing more of it.

wow, this is going in an interesting direction! looking forward to seeing where it goes

WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS TO MEE!? "I wanted to be that prince..." NOOOOO TOT

Lilian deserves to be with a girl too ;-;

last edited at Sep 9, 2023 9:32PM

But it's an arc that really needed to take place over multiple chapters; in a normally paced story Lillian would be the antagonist of the entire first volume, not just this single chapter.

I'm wondering if we're speedrunning tropes and story beats because the story needs to fit in only one volume or something.

But it's an arc that really needed to take place over multiple chapters; in a normally paced story Lillian would be the antagonist of the entire first volume, not just this single chapter.

I'm wondering if we're speedrunning tropes and story beats because the story needs to fit in only one volume or something.

Possible, but unlikely I think. Chapter 3 is too early for the manga to be axed, and if it was originally planned to be only one volume, I don't think they would've done such a plot-heavy premise. If I had to guess, the mangaka has a vision for how they want to end volume 1 and they need Lillian to be an ally for it to work, so they had to speedrun Lillian's "redemption arc" to get her character where it needs to be in time.

It is a shame because, again, I think this arc could've worked very well with more time spent on it and a couple more editing passes. Show us Lillian and Evris's friendship so we can actually feel the weight of both Lillian's "betrayal" and her reasons for doing so. Reveal that Lillian deliberately manipulated Evris and Ciel into meeting for the first time, to deal with a previous poster's complaint that Lillian's plan relied on a huge coincidence. Establish some real stakes so that Ciel has a reason for following Lillian's demands other than...actually I'm honestly not sure why she felt the need to prove herself to Lillian lol. Maybe set Lillian up as more overtly antagonist at first so her true motivation comes as a twist at the end. Hell, bring Mark along too so that we can (a) learn how exactly he knows that Ciel is a woman and (b) show us that Lillian has him on a leash instead of just being told that in exposition. I can imagine in my head a version of this arc that's legitimately very good, unfortunately I just don't think that's the version we got.

The pacing is weird, yeah. My only guess is that maybe the author intends this to be a slow self-awakening/love story. Though, it's a bit too fast for even that.

Lilian deserves to be with a girl too

Honestly I wouldn't be shocked if it ends up that way.

The most "typical" way for the manga to play out from this point is to have slowly fall in love and then have the climax of the plot center around the public discovering Ciel's true gender. Then the adversity of the situation forces the two to take a stand for their ability to be together (and either they run off together or convince Ciel's parents and the public to accept them).

It looked like Lillian in this chapter was doing some heteronormative self-denial, so the perfect ending/epilogue would have her break up with Mark and follow their example.

last edited at Sep 10, 2023 11:00PM

Lilian deserves to be with a girl too ;-;

Mark's redemption arc should include transing their gender, problem solved

Did people miss that Lillian implied that her plan specifically involved pushing Ciel towards coming to Evris aid?

last edited at Sep 30, 2023 7:11PM

I swear, why are manga artists so terrible at having characters face consequences or even apologise. I cannot count the ammount of times ive seen ppl pull some insane shit and then just say "but i meant well" and every1 goes yea thats fair moving on. (shoutout to Whispering you a love song for peak levels of that shit). Like really you couldnt even make her friend fuckin apologize once for the shit shes put the mc through ??

Apology scenes tend not to happen for the same reason people don't say goodbye at the end of phone calls in movies: they don't want to take up the time showing something that won't contribute to the plot. Especially if that apology is just reflecting on stuff we've already seen happen and showing the feelings of a character that isn't a main one. A scene of Lillian expressing her regret out loud for what she's done just isn't important to the story, at least for the moment. You can infer it from other thoughts and actions but it's not worth taking up a bunch of time to highlight.

last edited at Oct 2, 2023 10:42AM

So, how did she end up with a double bed? Was Ciel that straightforward in her advances, or did Eve "rearrange" some furniture without paying conscious attention?

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

So, how did she end up with a double bed? Was Ciel that straightforward in her advances, or did Eve "rearrange" some furniture without paying conscious attention?

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

They're probably sharing a queen, rather than a double, since the latter would be rather cramped with two people. Though I think the actual question was "How did they end up sharing a bed?" and I think that's still a good question, since they didn't seem that close at the end of the last chapter.

last edited at Oct 22, 2023 10:47PM

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

One with a single pillow, usually. Since, you know, most adults only have one head. ;-)

They're probably sharing a queen, rather than a double, since the latter would be rather cramped with two people. Though I think the actual question was "How did they end up sharing a bed?" and I think that's still a good question, since they didn't seem that close at the end of the last chapter.

That's why I assumed they are not actually sleeping together, but maybe I was wrong. I was very confused by the transition from page 19 to 20, where Eve appears to be both surprised and embarrassed by the fact that not only is the bed made for two, but Ciel also stores her clothes and perfume in her room, as well. It's almost like this is the first time she realizes that they were setting her room up for two people all along.

last edited at Oct 23, 2023 3:49AM

They are closer to third base

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

One with a single pillow, usually. Since, you know, most adults only have one head. ;-)

I dunno, pretty much every double bed I've ever seen or slept in had two pillows (or more). ┐⁠(⁠￣⁠ヘ⁠￣⁠)⁠┌

Coming out, eh?

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

One with a single pillow, usually. Since, you know, most adults only have one head. ;-)

I dunno, pretty much every double bed I've ever seen or slept in had two pillows (or more). ┐⁠(⁠￣⁠ヘ⁠￣⁠)⁠┌

Which brings us to my original question: how and when did Eve end up with a double bed in her supposedly single-occupant room? :-) I realize that the implication is that either she or Ciel are not-so-subtly preparing for married life with this, but the pace is still rather breakneck and I was wondering whether I have missed something.

last edited at Oct 23, 2023 1:43PM

What kind of bed do you expect for an adult human?

One with a single pillow, usually. Since, you know, most adults only have one head. ;-)

I dunno, pretty much every double bed I've ever seen or slept in had two pillows (or more). ┐⁠(⁠￣⁠ヘ⁠￣⁠)⁠┌

Which brings us to my original question: how and when did Eve end up with a double bed in her supposedly single-occupant room? :-)

... have you considered she has the sort of bed ordinary people have in real life just for themselves?

Seriously, that's pretty normal-- I've had a double since I was like twelve and most of that time is just been me in it. I know single people with queens or even occasionally a king, too.

I realize that the implication is that either she or Ciel are not-so-subtly preparing for married life with this, but the pace is still rather breakneck and I was wondering whether I have missed something.

To this point, if they are sleeping together, then yes, I agree it's a bit fast. But I'm not going to assume that until it's actually shown. ┐⁠(⁠´⁠ー⁠｀⁠)⁠┌

Y'all, I think she's made her choice.

. . . . goodness, this is moving fast.

i mean a bed like that is pretty normal fantasy fair. It's a princess bed

Single people can have wider beds because it's nice, and multiple pillows because they like propping their head up, or leaning against pillows while they read.

Yes Yes YES