Yes. Very happy.

I'm not sure if it's better or worse that she wasn't chosen by a True Fae with an alien viewpoint but actually the brother on a weird whim...

tbf its more like she accidentally got in the way of the seed as it was supposed to be implanted in Natalia. But the brother was a bit of a dick about it lol. All in all a pretty crazy situation to be in, but he did a good thing at least saving her life.

Yeah he's concerned for his sisters well being and sees the opportunity to keep close to her, someone who will love her enough to change her depressive and suicidal tendencies. The sword would likely be nothing without a competent handler anyway, and the princess was not in the mental state to survive long without Sara. He ends up being right about the effect she'd have but what's really great is how the two women have ended up affecting each other in positive ways. They both have issues and flaws that the other helps account for. Now the girls have a lot of troubles to get through together.

last edited at Dec 1, 2023 7:48AM

It's good that Yuna let Rena in a bit and Rena unknowingly did a good job of reinforcing how much she trusts Yuna and values her. Now Rena is aware of Yuna's insecurities and struggles at least somewhat. Rena's blaming herself, but it's a better place to be in then when Yuna was hiding all of it, to the point of implosion. Interested in how they navigate things from here but a step in the right direction.

Yundao realizes that nothing she could have done would have changed anything. It's unfortunate. Xingyuan made the perfect point in that her and Yundao are the same. Xingyuan is basically going through the same thing Yundao did and teetering on making the same mistakes too. They really do mirror each other but by talking in the way she did, Xingyuan unknowingly highlighted some differences in how they view Xiaoen that seperate her from Yundao and I think Yundao could feel that.

Things didn't go the way Yundao wanted with Xiaoen because Yundao was/is a different person than Xingyuan and she realizes that there's nothing that would have changed that reality. Its really unfortunate since she's clearly retracing her steps in search of where the errors were in her life and she can't seem to firmly grasp anything that isn't tied to her own choices or lack thereof. Seems like she feels trapped by it. Maybe she'll get something out of this though, some closure.

last edited at Nov 28, 2023 6:42AM

Once again, Grandpa with the assist.

That was 120% definitely a confession!

Definitely. But out of the two, she's the one who has always been aware of (and somewhat upfront with) her growing feelings, while our bartender feels too inadequate to even consider it a possibility that she could measure up to her.

last edited at Nov 27, 2023 2:52PM

ERRATA
————

Where it says:

“If I'm that important to you, why didn't you tell me earlier that you could like girls?”

It should say:

“If I'm that important to you, why didn't you GO AFTER ME?!?”

Or "If I'm that important to you, why wasn't I the one able to make your realize you could like girls? What did I do wrong or what did I miss?"

last edited at Nov 27, 2023 2:47PM

I think I am getting more and more confused because it seems to me that both series are on different time line.

Me too. Like, Saori and Shizuku are dating now? Since when?

They're not dating, Shizuku's just acknowledged her own feelings for Saori. This is probably why Saori is asking about confessions, either she's thinking of confessing, or she's recognized that Shizuku has caught actual feelings and is expecting one. But they're not official, so Saori says "I'm not dating anybody" and describes the planned shrine visit as being "with a friend."

They're a couple. She's just being coy and the joke is that her sister immediately picked up on it and panicked. She also mentioned confessing "without words," not just confessing. The point is that she wanted Shizuku to pick up on the obvious but instead she had to confess through words (as posted by the commenter above).

She's "jealous" that her sisters relationship actually went the way she wanted hers to go, where the relationship was just obvious and no one had to make a confession. This is something she complained about to Shizuku before. She's jealous that her sister's gf wasn't as dense as hers.

When she says "I wouldn't keep secrets," you can see her looking "at the camera" or looking away from her sister. The end of chapter text also says it's about sisterly estrangement (joke being that they've now reached the point where the little sister creates space from the big sister and keeps relationship secrets).

last edited at Nov 27, 2023 9:45AM

OK, this is purely me playing devil’s advocate (I was an early adopter of the “Yundou is into Xiaoen” theory, and still hold to it), but was there anything more explicit in this chapter to support that premise than we’ve seen before?

There certainly was more of the same—statements with implied subtext, significant expressions, meaningful framing and cuts from panel to panel, etc. Is it the quantity of suggestions/focus on Yundou’s feelings that sealed the deal for previous doubters?

For me it wasn't quantity, but the fact that the question Yunduo asked was so specific, and that she is visibly disappointed in the answer :P Hard for me to come up with any other interpretation after this. Although no, it's not 100% explicit but I wouldn't bet on my initial guess being right anymore.

The author also seems very specific and intentional, so when Yundao says this and how she chooses to say it potentially means a lot. The previous chapter set up a lot about where her mind is at. Then, here, she asks the question after making sure to reposition herself as close to Xiaoen as possible. She kneels before her and reaches her hand out, near her. She positions herself as close to Xiaoen as possible and looks up in her eyes. That's as intimate as you can get for a "simple" question and reveals where her head was likely at when she asked it. Then all the rest you said, as well. She's not the type of person who will likely ever be explicit.

last edited at Nov 27, 2023 8:38AM

Yunduo's feelings are complex and her question to Xioaen can't be separated from her current dissatisfaction with her life. She loves her children but clearly regrets where she's ended up somewhat. Did she actually know about her feelings for Xiaoen back then or is she searching for a lifeline that wasn't there? She's definitely latched onto her current feelings for Xiaoen as a "what if," though. It's unfortunate.

What's great is you could see the gears turning in her head just from her body language in the previous chapter. The questions she was likely asking herself and the future she was imagining. I think even now, if she could, she'd want Xiaoen to be with her and with her kids.

Obviously that's not in the cards, and realizing that someone else is the one who showed Xiaoen that there's another romantic path--that must have cemented things for her a bit. She thought she'd missed something or that Xiaoen had kept something from her and that, that could explain how her life has ended up this way but in reality there really wasn't an alternative future that she was left out of. That also must hurt to think about.

She's been asking herself "where did it go wrong, and what could have changed it?" She seems to have thought she had an answer and that turned into a dud, quickly.

last edited at Nov 27, 2023 8:17AM

Another fantastic chapter. Their relationship is great and filled with fight. I love the developing plot and lore around shuten-doji. It adds so much to the narrative and gives their relationship a natural impetus for advancement (making it easier to avoid typical tropes). Plus the other characters are very interesting and the pacing is smooth. Currently a favorite. Looking forward to the developing adventure.

last edited at Nov 26, 2023 3:47PM

She really got the hint and set the alarm to panic lol. Love them.

last edited at Nov 26, 2023 3:34PM

When it comes to media like manga or anime I expect to see the character's feelings on their faces, not have them narrated to me. The problem is that the anime failed to convey those thoughts properly, which I don't think is an indication that it would have been impossible to do so, only that the writing was rather subpar.

Agreed. The anime didn't utilize the benefits of its medium well at all. We lost the inner thoughts and got nothing to replace it because they were seemingly focused on highlighting everything else besides what makes the series itself. They really wanted to force it to be as moe and CGDCT as they could possibly get it.

If they're not going to feel the Otherside why bother even including the scenes of them going there, might as well cut it down even more to be a yuri about socially awkward college girls lol.

Yeah as I said above: they tried to, that's for sure lol

last edited at Nov 22, 2023 11:45AM

Aaaaaangst chapter. I do feel for Hirose. I get the impression she didn't really understand her feelings for Takamine until after Takamine had found Sakura (and maybe she still doesn't). I also appreciate that she isn't doing the classic love triangle move of constantly trying to sabotage the others; she's just content to angst away in her corner. Hopefully she can find a way towards happiness soon. I'm kind of hoping next chapter Sakura catches up to her with her umbrella and they have a heart-to-heart.

And Hinata with the A+ assist, inviting Sakura to the study session! Now I'm curious what they talk about over Line...

Yeah, I think that's exactly it, Hirose just never realized she liked Takamine and now she's in a world of pain because she waited too long to notice. It's refreshing that she's being somewhat mature about it, most author would have gone the easy angry drama route with it instead. Sakura is such a sweet girl though and she didn't do anything wrong, I guess it would be next to impossible to be really mad at her.

Agreed with what you've both said. Really enjoyed this chapter.

it's certainly a preferable pace to the anime, which roughly covers the first two light novel volumes by butchering them.

Indeed and mercilessly too. Really didn't understand the sleeve the material or just didn't care. Tried to force it to be what it's not, while stripping away what it is.

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 6:09PM

Ultimately, it seems that we agree that Shiho is
A) a little shit
and
B) solely responsible for all that mess we had to sit through and the only thing we disagree on is on orders of degree, for example if Shiho even deserves Aki or not. Which is totally fine with me.

I don't think I'd agree to those terms, exactly, but without combing over every chapter in order to understand where the divergence comes from, there's not much else to be said without becoming repetitive. I guess all things considered, it's not too far off anyway. It was an interesting discussion. So thanks for that.

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 2:54PM

And I'm sorry, I know you want to keep things short, but assertions without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

I said something here originally but it's not productive.

And Hima's desire of Shiho and Yori getting along was a big part of why she asked Shiho to do it, not only because she did not want to bring it up herself.

Hime explained her reasoning exactly, in the previous chapters. The band discussed how her "contract" was up and asked if she wanted to leave. She decided she wanted to stay, for sure, but worried about how Yori would feel if she did so. That was why she set the meeting up. Her desire to work with them was the central catalyst. Getting them together would make Yori more comfortable with her working with the band. It was a means to an end. She did not think of getting them together otherwise. In that moment she realized it would be better to have Shiho ask instead of herself, and she explained why this chapter. Even so I think this is getting too into the weeds. I don't share the opinion that this is an important detail either way.

Also, mostly Aki's desired ending? Is there a single thing we now know Siho wanted at the beginning that she did not get in this conclusion?

Shiho at the beginning did not want to rekindle her relationship with Aki. She wanted Aki to leave her alone. You can check the chapters yourself. Aki set up the meetings. Aki followed her. Aki stumbled into her. And so did Himari. Aki set up the battle. The whole arc was Shiho attempting to flee (both figuratively and literally) with Aki and Himari pulling her back in (both figuratively and literally).

Even Aki's final song was again meant to double down on this premise: Shiho threatening to leave for good, while Aki fights against the idea through her song. It was the push and pull of someone devolving into self harm (along with the collateral damage that comes with it) and someone else pulling her out of it. The ending benefits Shiho obviously but that's different from being what she wanted.

It seems like we've gotten the original desires of Aki and Shiho mixed up. I noticed someone else say this and I discussed it with them weeks ago as well. They realized that they'd forgotten earlier parts of the series; but maybe you do remember and still just disagree?

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 2:37PM

The series just ended with 42 official chapters. Looking forward to seeing it translated here.

Yeah it was great. Looking forward to going through it again here.

Shiho asking for Hima to stay as manager is not a selfless, but a selfish act. From my point of view, Shiho genuinely likes Hima and wants her as a band manager, and Hima did a good job as well. So Hima staying is a net positive for Shiho, meanig her asking Yori that she can stay is not selfless act for Shiho in the least. She gets something she wants out of it.

You're forgetting that Hima wants to be their manager. This is something Hima is requesting after Shiho and the group discussed it chapters ago. Hima desires this but was shy about asking Yori directly, so she asks Shiho to do so for her. I think we're getting away from the original response: the main point was that Shiho didn't suddenly and randomly ask for a new favor from Yori, while apologizing. This was the request from Hima.

I'd disagree with your idea of her not growing, I think we're leaving out a lot of what's happened these last few chapters that represents her changes in thinking. It's also worth mentioning that it was Aki who wanted to reconnect with Shiho for a majority of the run and it was Shiho who was rejecting Aki and wanting Aki to leave her alone, until Shiho grows and develops over time. Aki is the one who pursued this and pushed for it with Hima. Aki is the one who introduced the band battle. Shiho remained in the story, primarily because Aki wouldn't let her disappear like Shiho (thought she) wanted. This is mostly Aki's desired ending. There's more to be said but this is already going longer than I wanted.

Anyway Shiho would act differently now, if she did lose Aki again (though not perfectly). I'd also disagree with your analogy as it leaves out a lot of nuance and isn't a 1-to-1 with this situation but I don't want to continue the long responses. It's too much to unpack (which is why I didn't respond to that other poster's longer criticism from weeks ago that keeps being cited) and I also think we risk repeating ourselves. We'll have to agree to disagree or I'll at least keep things shorter.

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 10:40AM

That connects to the comment above yours—she’s a woman who doesn’t give off that submissive, respectful vibe needed to qualify as a “good,” or rather “appropriately acting,” person. I think other people do have positive feelings towards her—they just want her to “act normal.” They’ve all (felt like) they’ve had to bow to convention—why does she get away with not doing it?

Agreed. Yunduo is currently one of those who appreciates Xioaen. Can't help but be sad for Yunduo's situation, even more so as she watches Xiaoen play with her kids in that picturesque way. After the conversation about her marriage, divorce and children, I can only wonder what's going through her mind. Does she like the idea of Xiaoen being with her kids? Is that the life she actually wants now or wishes she had? She's very interesting with less screen time needed. Her body language and visual cues do a lot; and her words nearly always contain more meaning than what's directly said.

Also, the restrained frustration of Yundao when she's asking her dad hasn't she already done all the traditional female things in patriarchal culture (trying marriage, having kids, etc), sort of asking him if it's ok to actually do what she wants to do from now on and stop trying to hook her up with another guy, and her dad's silent confusion over it.

Yeah that was a great scene. Does a lot with little, which is what you want.

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 8:15AM

I'm full of shit. I'll reply again, since I woke up and checked back.

not enough character growth has happened to justifiy the time and chapters spent

As an overview for this discussion and as a response to this point: At the end of the day, that's fair, for you. You think the hole was deeper than I and (I think I can say, generally) most others do, so you think more has to be done to fill it up. That's always been the core of the issue and that has to do with literary analysis but goes beyond just that (for everyone). We'll have to agree to disagree.

of all, as you and others already have wrote, the artwork does most of the work of making Shiho seem remorseful, not the things she actually said and thought.

Calling it "artwork" is way too extra-textual. In the context of the story its best to describe that as "her body language," which is very important for communicating our actual feelings. It wasn't like the author just put sparkles everywhere, it was actual physical reactions from a character. Her body language, coupled with the words she says, makes it clear that she is sincere. It doesn't make sense to try and separate her body language and facial expressions from her words and to treat body language like it doesn't count or to qualify it by referring to it as "artwork". The author included both for a reason.

But Shiho accepting it and needing a vehicle in the first place shows she has not really grown out of the person she was before.

She's never going to be "perfect." I wasn't debating that, but even you have said that she's grown. None of the way she behaves here is how she would have a few weeks ago. She has grown. She wanted to avoid the conversation and hadn't yet thought to meet with Yori. Himari sped up that realization but once she was confronted with it, Shiho understood her error with Yori and sincerely apologized. That's a good summation of that chapter, in my opinion.

Fixation

Passive aggressive? Because of that word? Well I can't do anything about that, I guess. Just chock it up to communicating through text. I've seen worse and much more direct stuff come my way, here.

In that vein, Shiho is not offering Yori anything, but asking for something

By "Yori" do you mean to say Hima, here? If not, again, Shiho isn't offering anything to Yori. Are you arguing she should be? The "request" is Hima's and she's asking Shiho to make the request for her. Yori doesn't ask for anything either. Shiho promises to treat Yori better and Yori defuses the situation because she apparently didn't care that much anyway, after talking with Hima a few chapters ago.

And it is not like Shiho blew up ant Yori once and regretted it immediately afterwards, she was antagonistic for months.

I think my earlier response still stands here: Yes, it came once she was in a better headspace after reconciling with Aki. That does tend to happen. It's rare to apologize in the middle of an argument when you are not seeing things clearly. Most apologies come in retrospect, not really unique to Shiho. Also keep in mind that she wasn't just dealing with her feelings for Aki. She was also still haunted by the death of her friend and the band's self imposed burden. That seems to be getting lost here but the lasting effects of that was the largest catalyst during these events and repeatedly focused on.

Regarding the joke, I feel like the use of "cause" here shifts at least part of the blame to Yori.

Well, we disagree. "Cause" is simply an observation. It is a fact that Yori's being at the center of Aki's affection was a cause in this chain of causes and effects. It's observationally true that she is at the center of it. Just acknowledging that something is part of a process doesn't assign blame. It's descriptive.

last edited at Nov 20, 2023 7:57AM

She completely ignored yae's threat and asked her 16 year old CHILD TO MARRY HER?! and then she bitched on about how 'we'll have our obstacles to overcome', like shut up and stop sugar coating the fact that you're a straight up pedo ugh

Dude if you read up until the end, where were you expecting the story to go?? Like the whole age gap premise was there from chapter one. Were you just reading this to see if Kusanagi gets arrested or something lmao? This series also has never shied away from all the repercussions of being with a minor and Kusanagi did reject Kazuki's advances for most of the series.

Like could she have waited until Kazuki was 18 to actually start being in a relationship? Yeah (and that STILL wouldn't be acceptable irl due to grooming), but we all knew what this story was gonna be about from the get go so no point in getting angry about the outcome lol.

Those kinds of responses are always funny. 361 chapters in: "what, this is what I was reading?!"

last edited at Nov 19, 2023 10:41PM

I'll do one final long response and then bow out. I don't want to continue the train of these for too much longer.

What I think you missed is that she only says the first part about venting her frustrations. The second part about no reason for resentment anymore is actually a thought bubble, she does not say that out loud.

Both parts are thought bubbles. They use the same visual language that denotes thoughts (although small) and her mouth is deliberately closed in that panel. You just have to compare them to the actual speech bubbles directly below them. Regardless of that fact, neither of them invalidates the other, even if we pretend that one was said and the other thought. It is one continuous idea whether half spoken or not.

She does not think "I was wrong", but that there is no reason to hate Yori any longer.

No, she does not literally say "I was wrong," but everything else about her thoughts and mannerisms on the matter makes that clear. She says and thinks two key things: "As far as she’s (Yori's) concerned, it was more me venting my frustrations (out on her), than anything, the way things are now, there’s no reason to resent her" and "I’m sorry. To be honest with you, I got you wrapped up in my own selfish emotions, I’ll try not to act weirdly towards you from now on." Even ignoring all the visual cues and body language, if you can read those sentences and conclude that she is not taking at least some responsibility then, right there, we have the root of our disagreements in general.

If her agreeing with the meeting was out of her own recognition of guilt, why did Hima still have to call in her favor, essentially paying her, to get her to meet Yori?

This "favor" between them was a light thing that had no real weight behind it. What gave the favor weight was Shiho's feeling a bit guilty once Himari reminded her of the situation. She can also feel guilty and decide not to meet Yori. Those two things have nothing to do with one another. She is avoidant and did not want to have the meeting in order to avoid an uncomfortable conversation. As Himari explains the reasons for her request, Shiho recognizes the legitimacy of the request as she thinks about her culpability. She then decides to accept the request (the only thing she actually spoke), rather than deny it; because she recognizes that she is at some fault for getting "[Yori] wrapped up in [Shiho's] selfish emotions" and using Yori to "vent [her] frustrations." The "favor" is an easy excuse for her and just a vehicle. Either way, I don't share the fixation with the favor. She doesn't have to do things "perfectly" for what she does do to count.

Shiho should have told Hima...

Not getting into "shoulds"--is not really useful in my opinion. Every individual handles their issues differently and Shiho's pattern is that she is not straightforward and is evasive. She does not need to say the exact lines you want in order for what she says to carry the same meaning, for her. Most people are not direct in that way and will communicate indirectly whether through speech or body language. She is a tsundere type and is especially indirect, namely in these types of situations. There are more than enough thoughts, and verbal and body language cues to communicate her remorse.

But then, she still asks Yori for a favor.

Yes? That was the request from Himari. She asked Shiho to request this favor from Yori. That was the whole deal.

And even if Shiho's apology was 100% sincere, it only came after she got what she wanted, which is crucial as well.

Yes, it came once she was in a better headspace after reconciling with Aki. That does tend to happen. It's rare to apologize in the middle of an argument when you are not seeing things clearly. Most apologies come in retrospect, not really unique to Shiho.

Oh, almost forgot: Lastly, the joke seemed to me to be Yori being oblivious about being the cause, not that we should disagree with the text bubble. Given that within the story, both Aki and Yori blamed themselves for parts of this whole mess, I think my reading is more supported.

Yes, that was the joke. My response hasn't changed there. I'm not sure what your response changes there? She is oblivious (the joke) and is also "the cause" but that does not mean you are meant to treat her as the "culprit." It's a joke that she is at the center of everything without even realizing it.

last edited at Nov 19, 2023 10:34PM

Most of you guys are arguing and here i am just enjoying the manga peacefully

Right? Everyone's debating the good and the bad of Shiho's character on the plot, and I'm just enjoying Yori/Shiho awkwardly apologizing/clearing things up, Yori trusting Hima to keep being Shiho's band manager, Hima helping Shiho try to text Aki, and what seems to be the start of Shiho/Aki proper. Why argue anything? Just enjoy this relatively drama free chapter where people communicated and cleared the air with each other lol.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to a potential Shiho/Yori team up based on what Yori said during their conversation. Big turn of events when Shiho has to ask Yori for help/advice--especially musically. Plus next chapter comes out near Christmas. And it's mostly the same comments cut and paste every chapter, so that's whatever. Not the largest deal, anyway.

last edited at Nov 19, 2023 6:01PM

I’ll comment on this since you’ve repeated it a few times and I'm a bit confused by it, so maybe you could clarify.

That Shiho said "As things are now, there is no real reason to resent her" (so she still thinks her hate was justified back when Aki did not reciprocate her feelings) shows she is still as shitty as before.

In the full quote you're cutting off she says “As far as she’s (Yori's) concerned, it was more me venting my frustrations (out on her), than anything, the way things are now, there’s no reason to resent her." What she actually says to Himari is not a statement justifying her behavior. This is a statement acknowledging that, in the end, Yori did nothing wrong and it was only Shiho deflecting from her issues with Aki. Shiho is the one doing the action in that sentence, grammatically. She is assigning herself blame and agency. That whole brief scene before the meet-up with Yori was Shiho recognizing and feeling guilty for how she treated Yori, obviously in her own way.

In fact, that recognized culpability is the reason she agrees to Himari’s request at all. It’s only after she verbally reacts and reacts through facial expressions, in a way clearly expressing regret, that she then agrees to have the uncomfortable conversation with Yori. She didn’t just flippantly agree to the meeting, as you've suggested previously. She clearly thought about it, as Himari laid out the request.

Then in the meeting, Shiho says " I’m sorry. To be honest with you, I got wrapped up in my own selfish emotions, I’ll try not to act weirdly towards you from now on.” Here, again she continues the trend of acknowledging her behavior towards Yori. There's nothing in the scene that hints at insincerity, actually the opposite. Her facial expressions are typical manga-visual-language often used to communicate regret, sincerity and remorse.

Whatever your opinion of Shiho, I’m not sure how you could read those scenes and come away believing she thinks she did nothing wrong, has no regrets, didn't mean it, or only agreed to meet Yori because she was asked and nothing more. Without being asked she might have avoided the conversation because she has an avoidant personality, but that doesn't mean she's not sincere here.

Lastly, the "unknowingly the cause of all this" thing was obviously a tongue-in-cheek joke and played as such. She is the "cause" but not the culprit.

last edited at Nov 19, 2023 4:16PM