rusi posted:

I honestly really enjoy discussions about translations! But I feel like it's so easy to step on people's toes. Everyone has their own interpretations of words, especially if we include the sometimes wide array of interpretations among native speakers...

恋人？愛人？How do you translate those!?

Translation depends widely on context. But it's clear that "koibito" doesn't imply anything relationship wise. It's just "the person you're in love with". "Aijin" implies you're cheating on your official partner.

How is that hard to understand?

I am quite amazed about how quick Yuni's mom has caught on. The translation in the panel of p.18 or 188 raw, plus my own understanding are
Yuni's mom: "Your girlfriend did" (Kanojiuka?) Girlfriend?
Yuni: "......"(......) ......
Yuni "Nah, someone else"(Uun Chiu) Wrong
Yuni's mom "What was that pause just now?"(Nani ima no ma) What was that pause?
Yuni "Huh? I didn't..."(Ha? Betsu ni) Huh? Nothing.
Yuni's mom "Eh? Two timing?"(Aijin) Lover?
Yuni "Phrasing!" (iikata) Way to say it.

Must be intuition or personal experience, using both words girlfriend and lover in a conversation with her daughter, assuming that she has both. However she does not seem to imply Yuni is two timing (does something wrong).

You intuition is wrong and I'd appreciate it if you didn't invent your own stuff with your Google translate knowledge of Japanese and try to spread doubt or misinformation. You're not trying to translate manga I hope.

I was confused by your previous question about "lover", now I see why. You're using google translate or DeepL.

愛人 isn't a generic lover here. It's specifically in the meaning of mistress, or, if you want "the person I love sexually as opposed to the person I'm married to/in an official relationship with".

If she meant a "lover" it would be 恋人 (the one you love)

Here, I found a video that explains the difference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL0gvr2LOWk

Or here, an actual Japanese answering the question: https://hinative.com/questions/13485754 : 浮気相手 "Adulterous lover".

So, YES, she implies two-timing. Or her reaction, with the sparkling eye, doesn't makes sense.

And "chigau" doesn't only mean wrong, it means "different", so here it's a "no, different" (ie, not my girlfriend, someone else).

Are you Masina?

Why is it that translators always come across as total narcissists when talking to other people lol? You don't need to insult the other person's intelligence or accuse them of being some kind of fake news spreader.

you could just leave out all the narccy bull and still give all the same information.

inb4 bad attitudes and generated social apathy really lead to Ai generation

last edited at Feb 22, 2024 2:37AM

smirkingtyrant posted:

Why is it that translators always come across as total narcissists when talking to other people lol?

And why is it that some people who don't know the language and use google translate feel the need to "correct" someone who took the time to actually learn the language?

I'd be pissed off too.

You intuition is wrong and I'd appreciate it if you didn't invent your own stuff with your Google translate knowledge of Japanese and try to spread doubt or misinformation. You're not trying to translate manga I hope.

I was confused by your previous question about "lover", now I see why. You're using google translate or DeepL.

愛人 isn't a generic lover here. It's specifically in the meaning of mistress, or, if you want "the person I love sexually as opposed to the person I'm married to/in an official relationship with".

If she meant a "lover" it would be 恋人 (the one you love)

Here, I found a video that explains the difference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL0gvr2LOWk

Or here, an actual Japanese answering the question: https://hinative.com/questions/13485754 : 浮気相手 "Adulterous lover".

So, YES, she implies two-timing. Or her reaction, with the sparkling eye, doesn't makes sense.

And "chigau" doesn't only mean wrong, it means "different", so here it's a "no, different" (ie, not my girlfriend, someone else).

Are you Masina?

Why is it that translators always come across as total narcissists when talking to other people lol? You don't need to insult the other person's intelligence or accuse them of being some kind of fake news spreader.

you could just leave out all the narccy bull and still give all the same information.

inb4 bad attitudes and generated social apathy really lead to Ai generation

Could the translator have been nicer? Sure. But some sass doesn't bother me much as long as they're willing to discuss translation.

My view is:
Translator politely discussing translation > Translator rudely correcting others>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Translator not saying anything at all in discussion of translation.

Getting it right is FAR more important than being nice about it.
At the same time, we are on a yuri forum. We're "comrades in arms" over our shared love of yuri and in an ideal world we would treat each other in a way that reflects this.

Back to the chapter...
The failure of Yuni and Nanase's relationship is inevitable. After all the drama we've previously had, I expect their breakup will be low key and maybe mutual.
We only see Yuni's thoughts as she continues to see all the ways they're not compatible, but I'd bet Nanase can feel it too.

The contrast between Yuni and Fuuko's home life could not be more stark.
Fuuko lives in an affluent home with a family that gives her no love or emotional support while Yuni lives in a modest apartment where her mother showers her in love and support.
Clearly Yuni missing her cat is referencing how she misses Fuuko.
I think Fuuko recognizing the baby being adorable is her breaking free of the toxic way she views love and the beginning of learning how to love someone in a healthy way.

Translation depends widely on context. But it's clear that "koibito" doesn't imply anything relationship wise. It's just "the person you're in love with". "Aijin" implies you're cheating on your official partner.

Mind you, koibito is the person you're in love with—but also the person who likes you too, and the person you are having sexytime with. It's not kataomoi if that person already is your koibito.

Hirose Narumi posted:

Translation depends widely on context. But it's clear that "koibito" doesn't imply anything relationship wise. It's just "the person you're in love with". "Aijin" implies you're cheating on your official partner.

Mind you, koibito is the person you're in love with—but also the person who likes you too, and the person you are having sexytime with. It's not kataomoi if that person already is your koibito.

Anyway, the author didn't use 恋人 here. She used 愛人 which means the mom picked up on the fact there was a third party involved which wasn't the girlfriend and said "we don't need men".

Anyway, here, we have 3 households completely different.

Yuni's is a single working mother, who was probably dumped by the father of Yuni.
Nanase's is a normal family, probably with no financial problems as they have two large dogs, hence probably a house with garden.
Fuuko's is a more "traditional" family, where women are looked down on and she's constantly compared to her brothers.

I think Fuuko should go live with Yuni. I'm sure her mom will welcome her with open arms.

Nanase is well adjusted, but at the same time, she doesn't seem curious at all about Yuni's circumstances. It's in line with her insensitivity toward Yuni's need.

And when the mother talks about "someone who loves themselves first", maybe it points to Nanase.

Nanase has sensitivity issues.
Yuni has abandonment issues.
Fuuko has self-confidence issues

last edited at Feb 22, 2024 3:08PM

Why is it that translators always come across as total narcissists when talking to other people lol? You don't need to insult the other person's intelligence or accuse them of being some kind of fake news spreader.

you could just leave out all the narccy bull and still give all the same information.

inb4 bad attitudes and generated social apathy really lead to Ai generation

You'd take having an absolutely garbage machine translation over a human translator who dares to have opinions and feelings? Lol that's so cringe

I think Fuuko should go live with Yuni. I'm sure her mom will welcome her with open arms.

I love the way you think. <3

Okay so we finally know why yuni acts the way she does. And to be fair she's got plenty of reasons to feel abandoned and lonely

wait why was this chapter kind of awesome

Because we have character development and now know why Yuni is selfish (single mom related isolation and people pleasing) while we understand why Fuuko is so desperate (holy fuck her family is k-drama awful), making both characters much better

I was not discrediting the translator's work, in fact, I was relieved that my own reading directly from the raw matches what the translator's understanding. I worked quite a few years in the translation software business, so off all people I should know the problem of machine translation. Even in English, a "lover" can be considered a mistress depending on the context, especially if the person is male.
I simply cannot see how Yuni X Nanase can continue further. Maybe Yuki can be a catalyst again to destroy that relationship so that we will have Yuni X Fuuko (My "ship") instead. I cannot wait for the next issue (May/March) and I wonder what Sensei will come out with. She is very good at resolving and writing the love triangle.

I honestly really enjoy discussions about translations! But I feel like it's so easy to step on people's toes. Everyone has their own interpretations of words, especially if we include the sometimes wide array of interpretations among native speakers...

恋人？愛人？How do you translate those!?

(As a side note, my friend has been getting on my case for using the word "lover" in English as a gender-neutral term. I wish we had a good word for 恋人 that didn't imply anything heavy, like "partner" often does)

Wait is your friend saying "lover" is not gender neutral? I'm confused.

I think the objection that my friend has to the word "lover" in place of boyfriend or girlfriend is that it sounds like some kind of illicit affair. Which would be accurate for Yuni and Fuuko, as you point out, but not for most of the average situations where you would use the word 恋人 in Japanese. Just another failing of the English language...

Hirose Narumi posted:
I think Fuuko should go live with Yuni. I'm sure her mom will welcome her with open arms.

I like the way you think, that way, at least 2 people's problems get dealt with, Yuni being lonely, Fuuko having to deal with her toxic household, but then I guess Nanase wouldn't like that, as we see from her asking Yuni if she's thrown the matching earrings out or smh

You know what they say "mother knows best"

Yuni is so fucking stupid oh my god how can a single girl be so STUPID

Fellas don't be like yuni (you qualify if you have more than 2 braincells)

Moderator note: Do not use the r-slur

last edited at Mar 19, 2024 4:01AM by MrEngenious

Going to Fuuko will backfire so hard ohhhhh I love this let's go girls get worse

Oh? Yes! The reunion!! Can this possibly be Fuuko doing a 180°?! I wanna know what happens omg!!!

Comedy gold.

An absolute, complete, and degenerate litter chaser. That’s Yuni in a nutshell. I’m honestly thankful for that, would be done with this otherwise because Ms. Girlfriend is too perfect, straight-ish even.

For the next chapter I’m expecting nothing less than: Fuuko and Yuni having an ardent demonstration of their love in front of Fuuko’s mother. It has to happen. No buts. Or perhaps some.

I am wondering if Yuni has anything going on up there, or if she just chases after the first thing that comes to mind every day. Fuuko having a personality change and becoming generic girl in love (granted, still in love with someone else's girlfriend) would put quite a damper on the drama.

But really, I'm just waiting for author to toss poor Yuki a bone since Yuni will undoubtedly cheat again.

This feels like reading a Reddit thread

When your gf can't find you in a crowd within a short period of time you KNOW you gotta ditch her lmao

Dumb and dumber. That's Yuni and Ms. Girlfriend.

Why does Nanase act as if she suddenly has some early onset dementia? Yuni told her exactly where she was and was leaning against the wall literally by the entrance of the outlet...

That moeblob baby was TOO adorbs.

I am now a melted puddle of goo on the floor.

last edited at Mar 22, 2024 6:48PM