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Forum › Bloom Into You discussion

BugDevil

November 19, 2018 4:48AM

joined Aug 26, 2018

@BugDevil While I agree that the people who care enough will probably read the manga anyway, it's still frustrating that more and more anime are doomed to cover only a fraction of the original story… Anime and manga are different formats that offer different experiences, so people who enjoy anime more get the short end of the stick in those cases… Of course that's kind of inevitable when the original story is so long that you'd need 10 seasons of anime to adapt it fully, but in the case of YagaKimi where two seasons would probably suffice (after the manga is over, obviously), that would be a shame. Hopefully it has enough success for that.

But as you said, altering the story to have a conclusion rarely leads to good results, so it's a tough dilemma…

You are right of course. It's not like I want it to end prematurely. This conversation is entirely based on the idea that there won't be a season 2. If there is, no problems would exist. So I really hope for that too!

I'm setting aside the rest of this because what changes should or shouldn't be made and why is just a matter of preference and opinion and I can agree to disagree on all of that.

Oh how gracious of you.

You're either gonna have to cite sources on that 7/10 thing or admit you just pulled it straight out of your ass.

A typical 13 episode anime series costs from 1 to 4 million dollars. I base this on numerous comments I've seen from several creators, but here's a specific link to a specific quote saying 2 million is typical. Longer seasons are more expensive, i picked the 1-4 range because that's what Yagakimi almost certainly cost.

https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interest/2015-08-13/anime-insiders-share-how-much-producing-a-season-costs/.91536

Hell, just pay attention to the freaking credits of any anime series! You'll have dozens if not hundreds of people credited with the production, from animators and editors to composers and voice actors. These people work for salary or on contract, depending on the job, and an anime studio like Troyca produces at max of two series a year, meaning at least half their salary comes from a single series. Do the math. They'll cut corners where they can, but anime is still a large cooperative venture involving many employees. The amount of labor involved in producing even a low budget anime is nuts.

The 13 episode format has been standard in anime for years, and has often been used even in circumstances when there /was no manga/. It has nothing to do with "advertising the manga and gaining a larger audience for it", it's about limiting the exposure and expense and reducing the risk on titles that might not find a solid audience. 13 episodes is a smaller commitment than 26+, and is one of the options pursued by companies when they want to see if a product can fly. Smaller commitment means less expense which means less risk.

https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2016-09-26/.106891

Here's a pretty decent summary of how it came about, also discussing the process.

Manga publishers do not -hire- anime studios to produce anime as commercials. That is -laughable-. Anime studios approach manga publishers about properties they think would fill a niche in their programming. What's more, the studio fronts all the money of production and -pays- the manga company for the licensing rights. Every time. I challenge you to find one instance of an anime that was commissioned by the manga publisher. Find me one source. I'll wait.

It was just a rough estimate based on how many properties are advertisement, mostly for game, Light Novel and manga based anime. There are obviously cases of the studio approaching the publisher or original anime being made or some director who wants to revive an old franchise (Thank you David Pro for doing Jojo justice!). I wasn't actually basing it on any real numbers.

"Typical" is a pretty loose term, you know? Most anime productions are as cheap as possible. If you throw in all the high quality properties, no wonder you will end up at that 4 million average. We aren't talking about Attack on Titan levels of porudction value here (because the budget for those episodes makes my legs go weak).
I haven't even implied once that YagaKimi was cheaply made though. So don't put words into my mouth please.

No shit the 12-13 episode method is there to cut costs and play it safe. I didn't mean it was invented for advertising purposes, I meant that it's used for that a lot. Making one short season of a popular property to see if it's profitable is standard practice. The initiators are often not the studios though. I think we are fundamentally thinking of different things when using the word "hire". I didn't mean the publisher pays for the entire endeavor or something, I meant the publisher chooses the studio and makes the offer. Scouts work in both directions.

It's so common for publishers of games, LNs and manga to approach studios as its beneficial for both sides, but I am not even gonna bother. The anime works as an advertisment for the manga (whether that is the only reason or not to you) and that's pretty much a fact. This is way too much work for such a trite point. You already ignored almost everything I said, so my motivation is on the down low to actually work myself through all the production history research.

" They exist as promotion for the manga, nothing else." That's your words, exactly. If they want to profit on their own, then they aren't just promotion for the manga.

Producers choose manga or light novels based on their popularity because a popular series brings with it an automatic audience. Publishers do not choose anime producers, it's literally the other way around. When you said that remarkable 7/10 line earlier, it actually made me question my understanding, so I looked around, and just no. Every source I found confirms this is how it works. The production company decides what they want to make, then goes about trying to convince the manga publisher and the author to sign on and license the rights to them.

That depends on the author and the publisher. The more established a person's name, the more pull they have because the producers know that the author has clout with the fans. Also authors are more likely to retain the copyright on their work and characters compared to western comics. Authors usually agree every time because being chosen to have an anime made of your series is a huge honor and a big financial opportunity. They absolutely have a say, however, if they piss off their publisher, they could find themselves without one. But that isn't the point.

The point is the producers pick the series they want to adapt (or the original pitches they want to produce) and they approach the author through the publisher. In a lot of cases, these companies have existing relationships, either through past business dealings or through corperate connections. The details get complicated and case-by case, but in any event, the producers always intend to make their money back on the anime. The sales boost to the manga is a benefit to the manga publisher and the author, but isn't generally the concern of the anime producers (except in that it motivates them to agree to the deal)

Welp, I guess you missed the part where I said for the manga... as in the manga publisher uses it as an advertisment and nothing else. That the studio who makes it isn't doing it out of the goodness of their heart, but to make profit is plainly obvious...

Mangaka have very little influence on what's done with their work, don't kid yourself. The only ones who could have that kind of sway are titans like Eiichiro Oda or Masashi Kishimoto (or self-published people like Araki). Heck, Tite Kubo who was for a time one of the Big 3 Mangaka was completely screwed over and kicked down by his publisher and everyone involved. I wonder where he had any say in anything there?
Having an anime of your series done badly is not much of an honor and equals throwing away your integrity for money. And mangaka have to do that, because they don't earn much in the first place. This honor stuff annoys me, considering the conditions they are living in... they realistically just don't have the option to refuse.

PS: We are really far away from the actual topic now and the mods are gonna jump on us soon, so let's try to focus on YagaKimi here, shall we?

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