Forum › Be Careful, Onee-san (Serialization) discussion

joined Nov 12, 2014

I always kind of expect a cop out ending to series like this. There's just not a good way to resolve it. But I didn't expect it all to come crashing down so suddenly.

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Honeyview_hanekawa1
Daphie's
joined Feb 1, 2021

The one saving grace with this ending IMHO is that they are not slated to be separated for years before reuniting, they said they'd keep being close friends and get together and have fun, SO they'll have plenty of time to keep knowing each other, do some silly flirting, and they won't waste their life waiting for the other being alone and sad! Just like she said: "Be careful Onee-san!"

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joined Sep 20, 2022

Author: “I’m going to make an age gap that will fuck with the readers’ heads.”

Readers: “Wah! Our heads!”

And that's this week's installment of metard theatre. Thank you, metard.

Man I don't know what we would do without the metards to tell us that this is just fiction written by some author, and the characters aren't real.

joined Mar 13, 2020

Is 'metard' some fancy new slang?

Img_0215
joined Jul 29, 2017

Author: “I’m going to make an age gap that will fuck with the readers’ heads.”

Readers: “Wah! Our heads!”

And that's this week's installment of metard theatre. Thank you, metard.

Man I don't know what we would do without the metards to tell us that this is just fiction written by some author, and the characters _aren't real.

If you think that’s what that post said, you are as clueless as you always sound.

Daremo from Parts Unknown
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joined May 6, 2022

Is 'metard' some fancy new slang?

The metard is the guy who enjoys fiction the way Charles Babbage enjoyed music.

If you think that’s what that post said, you are as clueless as you always sound.

He most likely refers to your complete works rather than this bit of writing.

Freenbeckforever
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joined Oct 28, 2022

Hitomi and Azuma: no proper resolution
Tae and Mado: no proper resolution
Tae and Yuki: no proper resolution

Hitomi and Azuma fell through a plothole and it sucks. That's what annoys me the most. As for Mado-chan and Yuki-chan, welp, we could have used a few moments of Tae making things clear with 'em but I don't mind so much.

Even Minori and Coco have a healthier sexual life as they often engage in kissing and petting and all sorts of erotic games... and Coco is a second grader ffs!

And then the day came when somebody wrote in a forum that Minori-sensei's lustful sex games with a 7-year-old loli were healthy. XDD
No but really I get your point, lmao, it's unnerving that Tae and Mai didn't even kiss. It shows how much Mai was retconned : the Mai from the beginning of the manga, after hearing the "I luv u too" from Tae, would have taken Tae into her arms and kissed the living daylights out of her!

last edited at Jun 28, 2023 4:15PM

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

the Mai from the beginning of the manga, after hearing the "I luv u too" from Tae, would have taken Tae into her arms and kissed the living daylights out of her!

I really don't see that happening. Even when she was less concerned about the results of her actions, that would have been a step too far. A hug, yes. Maybe a kiss on the cheek. Possibly a very chaste one on the lips if she was in the right mindset, but the situation really wasn't suitable for that. But "kissing the living daylights out of her"? No way.

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

joined Jul 21, 2020

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

Marion Diabolito
Dynsaty%20scans%20avatar%20from%20twgokhs
joined Jan 5, 2015

the Mai from the beginning of the manga, after hearing the "I luv u too" from Tae, would have taken Tae into her arms and kissed the living daylights out of her!

I really don't see that happening. Even when she was less concerned about the results of her actions, that would have been a step too far. A hug, yes. Maybe a kiss on the cheek. Possibly a very chaste one on the lips if she was in the right mindset, but the situation really wasn't suitable for that. But "kissing the living daylights out of her"? No way.

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

I agree with all of the above. More practically, from a Japanese cultural then legal standpoint, when Mai turns 13, Tae can give her a kiss on her birthday. She can't make a habit of it or make out/snog. But they can't do "lewd acts" at all until Mai is 18. So we're talking a year-and-a-half until their first kiss. And then another 5 years before they can be fully together. By that point, women getting married should be commonplace. And Mai's mother will have had almost 7 years to get used to it to the degree she will.

I love this ending. I especially like that Tae-chan had a REAL choice to make at the end. It's not just loneliness or a damsel complex or arrested development or hormones making the decision. Her childhood friend is sweet and good and attractive and, like Mai, looked out for her. She has to face the fact that she loves Mai, and at least for now, can't honestly be together with anyone else.

Also, another huge bonus was that in the end, the one that decided things was Mai. First of all, Tae is in no position to do so, but secondly, this is very much in character with Mai, who tends to think about things for a long time. Much more so than Yuki or Hitomi. And, let's face it. She's naturally in charge and Tae is never happier than when Mai is leading.

I doubt I'll get my Asumi/Mai-chan happy ending in "Asumi-chan is interested in lesbian brothels," but at least Mai-tai is real! As for them kissing, this isn't Sakura Trick. The number of times Mai has held Tae in her arms is adding up. They don't need to kiss!

Finally, Re: Hitomi x Azuma - I was never, ever rooting for this. Azuma is more cringe than early Tomoko Kuroki. You know who would be ideal for Azuma? Mai's mother! Because she's already grown up but has the loli qualities Azuma looks for. I fail to see any shred of romance between the two. Azuma is creeping on her and she's tough enough that she doesn't care, but she never gives any sign of reciprocating. Compare that to Mai's nearly DAILY flirting with Tae.

Also, Yuzumori-san's Mimika wasn't a lolicon, and Tae-chan certainly isn't, but Azuma gives off the same vibes as Minori Yamada from "Onee-san is into elementary school girls." I see her as partly a gag character, so a real ship with her is simply uninteresting.

last edited at Jun 28, 2023 7:06PM

La duchesse de Pecquigny
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joined Jun 7, 2021

Hitomi and Azuma fell through a plothole and it sucks.

I feel you. :(

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

From a precocious seductive vamp who used her feminine wiles to drive Tae crazy to a 'Huh? What's love? Huh?' stock tot.

joined Jun 27, 2022

Hitomi and Azuma fell through a plothole and it sucks.

I feel you. :(

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

From a precocious seductive vamp who used her feminine wiles to drive Tae crazy to a 'Huh? What's love? Huh?' stock tot.

Can you call that precocious that she only unconsciously seduced tae because of her adult like Body? Don't forget she's a 10 year old kid supposedly, how would she know much about love?

But yeah, I feel like in the beginning the author just wanted to make a short gag series with slightly spicy situation's.
Once it got serialized it became more mainstream and harmless. Like the author didn't know how to stretch that concept in the long run, without getting dangerously in the wrong direction. The result was Mai acting more tame.

It was still an enjoyable read though.

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

Mai changing due to her experiences, whether we like it or not, whether we agree with it or not, does not make it a retcon. It does in no way invalidate the events of the early chapters. Do you even actually know what the word retcon means?

For that matter, I don't even see that much difference between the first chapters and the Mai from Christmas or the very last chapter, so it's beyond me why you would call her a completely different character...

last edited at Jun 29, 2023 6:36AM

Fetish%20notebook%20lsmol
joined May 20, 2013

They're no longer in a pool. Retcon!!!

herenowforever
Singeraigenerated
joined Feb 11, 2018

the Mai from the beginning of the manga, after hearing the "I luv u too" from Tae, would have taken Tae into her arms and kissed the living daylights out of her!

I really don't see that happening. Even when she was less concerned about the results of her actions, that would have been a step too far. A hug, yes. Maybe a kiss on the cheek. Possibly a very chaste one on the lips if she was in the right mindset, but the situation really wasn't suitable for that. But "kissing the living daylights out of her"? No way.

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

I agree with all of the above. More practically, from a Japanese cultural then legal standpoint, when Mai turns 13, Tae can give her a kiss on her birthday. She can't make a habit of it or make out/snog. But they can't do "lewd acts" at all until Mai is 18. So we're talking a year-and-a-half until their first kiss. And then another 5 years before they can be fully together. By that point, women getting married should be commonplace. And Mai's mother will have had almost 7 years to get used to it to the degree she will.

Speaking of that, age of consent law was changed in Japan couple weeks ago. It's now universal 16, across the board.

Also, grooming and seducing someone who is younger than 16 is now a crime, it didn't really used to be under federal law (local laws were a different issue).

Definition of rape was broadened, before it had to include physical forcing against a victim who openly messaged they do not want it. Rape conviction was hard to land, even in cases where context of the situation indicated it was one. Now Japanese law follows western interpretations more closely, putting more responsibility to anyone who is taking initiative.

Lot better than the ancient laws from 1907. Big reason why this happened was a bunch of horrible rape cases leading to acquittal of a clear-cut rapist because of technicalities, like panel "doubting that victim was actually trying to resist being raped by her father" and such. This caused a citizen movement in 2019, and now the legal battle finally bore fruit.

last edited at Jun 29, 2023 8:27AM

Screenshot_20231219-103652~2
joined Sep 10, 2022

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

Mai changing due to her experiences, whether we like it or not, whether we agree with it or not, does not make it a retcon. It does in no way invalidate the events of the early chapters. Do you even actually know what the word retcon means?

For that matter, I don't even see that much difference between the first chapters and the Mai from Christmas or the very last chapter, so it's beyond me why you would call her a completely different character...

Agreed. She's the same. Earlier chapters, she was always unaware of her effects. It was played for laughs and from the mind of Tae who interpreted everything romantically. Mai didn't know what she was doing until near the end. Definitely not a retcon or even a change, unless some people actually thought Mai was actively flirting earlier? That was the joke though. We see the exact moment when Mai finally realizes her feelings and actually decides to act on them. Before that it's not there and explains why she could be so carefree: she just didn't know what she was doing. Completely unintentional. We were following an unreliable narrator.

last edited at Jun 29, 2023 2:25PM

joined Jun 27, 2022

Speaking of that, age of consent law was changed in Japan couple weeks ago. It's now universal 16, across the board.

Also, grooming and seducing someone who is younger than 16 is now a crime, it didn't really used to be under federal law (local laws were a different issue).

Definition of rape was broadened, before it had to include physical forcing against a victim who openly messaged they do not want it. Rape conviction was hard to land, even in cases where context of the situation indicated it was one. Now Japanese law follows western interpretations more closely, putting more responsibility to anyone who is taking initiative.

Lot better than the ancient laws from 1907. Big reason why this happened was a bunch of horrible rape cases leading to acquittal of a clear-cut rapist because of technicalities, like panel "doubting that victim was actually trying to resist being raped by her father" and such. This caused a citizen movement in 2019, and now the legal battle finally bore fruit.

Wow that is great news, the idea that when a person is intoxicated or petrified by fear/intimidation and thus not resisting so it can't be raped is just downright disgusting. Sexual assault is such a taboo and shameful thing in Japan just a tiny fraction of victims actually report them.

joined Jul 21, 2020

I have also seen absolutely nothing in this series that would in any way constitute a retcon; nothing of what has happened has been in any way changed by the later chapters.

First chapters Mai is a completely different character from final arc Mai.

Mai changing due to her experiences, whether we like it or not, whether we agree with it or not, does not make it a retcon. It does in no way invalidate the events of the early chapters. Do you even actually know what the word retcon means?

Do you even actually know who you're talking to? It looks like, of the half a dozen people who refuted you, you've lost track of who's who and just lash at random.

This is what happens when you made your story into a tangled mess of retcons and you can't tell anymore what the feck you're writing.

A classic screwup. Happened a lot to Rob Liefeld, if memory serves me right.

Img_0215
joined Jul 29, 2017

Do you even actually know who you're talking to?

Needs moar supervillain voice.

It looks like, of the half a dozen people who refuted you, you've lost track of who's who and just lash at random.

“Disagreed” is not the same as “refuted.”

Screenshot_20231219-103652~2
joined Sep 10, 2022

Needs moar supervillain voice.

Add a maniacal laugh too.

“Disagreed” is not the same as “refuted.”

Agreed. "Refuted," because they know they're objectively "right;" so it's a refutation rather than normal discussion and disagreement. Unfortunate, because there wasn't even a real response to the other poster (or mine, I guess). Still interested in hearing a real explanation of how Mai's been retconned because I'm still genuinely confused by that idea. Either way discussion or disagreement isn't something to get ruffled about.

last edited at Jun 29, 2023 2:00PM

Dumshork
joined Mar 19, 2022

Darth Vader being Luke's father was a retcon. An author shifting how a character behaves as their series goes on to better tell their story is not. You don't have to like that they felt the need to do that, for whatever reason, but it does not change the context of the previous parts of the work. I, personally, was very unsatisfied with how Mai's character ended up losing her inexplicable adult-isms as the series progressed, but it does not constitute a retcon.

Ren%e2%80%99py_logo_6-13-6_200x307px
joined Jan 21, 2023

Once it got serialized it became more mainstream and harmless. Like the author didn't know how to stretch that concept in the long run, without getting dangerously in the wrong direction.

I think you're right and that's where the problem is.

The result was Mai acting more tame.

To put it lightly. She was one of those girls you so often find in manga who despite being under the age of puberty have already learned about love, sex and seduction, and will even pursue an adult. Someone wrote that the changes are because she developed as the story advanced, but that's not true: she counterdeveloped, she backtracked and she unlearned everything she knew.

It was still an enjoyable read though.

I agree. Weak ending aside, I liked this manga lots.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Hmm, can't say I agree. I don't think I ever felt that Mai was deliberately using her uncanny seductive charm at the start, or was even aware of it.
I'd chalk a lot of the reduction in that behavior up to her becoming at least partly aware of what she's doing, especially in the later progression. Though that might just be me retconning my headcanon.

last edited at Jun 29, 2023 2:55PM

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

Hmm, can't say I agree. I don't think I ever felt that Mai was deliberately using her uncanny seductive charm at the start, or was even aware of it.
I'd chalk a lot of the reduction in that behavior up to her becoming at least partly aware of what she's doing, especially in the later progression. Though that might just be me retconning my headcanon.

Agreed. It's always been pretty clear from everything else she's said and done that she had no idea how she was affecting Tae, both in the serialization and the original web series.

Ke_Zukulenzia
joined Jul 23, 2019

Hmm, can't say I agree. I don't think I ever felt that Mai was deliberately using her uncanny seductive charm at the start, or was even aware of it.
I'd chalk a lot of the reduction in that behavior up to her becoming at least partly aware of what she's doing, especially in the later progression. Though that might just be me retconning my headcanon.

As you say, it's about headcanons. It seems there're two groups who disagree on their interpretation of Mai's behavior. Well, there's no helping it, they'll have to agree to disagree. It's like with Haruka and Michiru, many people thought they were like sisters with no gay feelings at all, and if Haruka flirted with and seduced other girls they claimed it was just an innocent blunder because she was unaware of her effect on people. And they supported their take pointing that H&M never kissed or had sex on screen and that Haruka never took advantage of the girls who fell for her. Other people thought the opposite. The two views were irreconcilable and the two groups never came to an understanding. It's the same here. In the end, each one sticks to their idea and that's that.

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