In the NGL arc, a Chimera ant abducts two children and feeds them to the Chimera Queen alive.

Nice work on the “non-fantasy” example.

“My very narrow and very specific argument still holds because it only applies to this particular title. I will only accept evidence from no other titles, therefore, I cannot be disproven.”

In the NGL arc, a Chimera ant abducts two children and feeds them to the Chimera Queen alive.

Nice work on the “non-fantasy” example.

“My very narrow and very specific argument still holds because it only applies to this particular title. I will only accept evidence from no other titles, therefore, I cannot be disproven.”

Bullshit. I excluded fantasy because in that genre violence can have all kinds of variant meanings than in realism, like in the Bakemonogatari series, where the protagonist can get torn limb from limb and it’s funny because he’s a fucking vampire who regenerates faster than the enemy can injure him.

My issue is not moral, but artistic. The “comedy violence” tropes are a genre signal that the violence is notional and not to be taken seriously—everybody knows that, which is why the pious lectures about tropes are obtuse. But the Minami-abuse arcs send “realistic drama” genre signals—the basis of her character is that she’s a sweet, loving person with a history of being violently abused by people close to her.

When authors mix not just different but contradictory genre signals, the risk is what happens here—readers go “wtf—how are we supposed to take this?” The story sets up sympathy for Minami as the victim of unjustified violence, then shows Iori suddenly smacking her out of nowhere for being emotionally insecure, and that’s supposed to be funny. Good luck with that.

What's the point anyway? So if I say I know a DV manga that's both comedic and serious, you'll change your mind about this one, or what?

That's not how it typically works and frankly sounds like a waste of time all around.

That manga/anime/vn extensively work with tonal shifts should be known to anyone anyway. It's particularly masterfully done in any KEY story, but doesn't mean you don't also get stuff like MuvLuv - dork-about-in-highschool-oh-suddenly-alien-invasion-everyone's-dead. It's pretty common.

In the NGL arc, a Chimera ant abducts two children and feeds them to the Chimera Queen alive.

Nice work on the “non-fantasy” example.

“My very narrow and very specific argument still holds because it only applies to this particular title. I will only accept evidence from no other titles, therefore, I cannot be disproven.”

Bullshit. I excluded fantasy because in that genre violence can have all kinds of variant meanings than in realism, like in the Bakemonogatari series, where the protagonist can get torn limb from limb and it’s funny because he’s a fucking vampire who regenerates faster than the enemy can injure him.

My issue is not moral, but artistic. The “comedy violence” tropes are a genre signal that the violence is notional and not to be taken seriously—everybody knows that, which is why the pious lectures about tropes are obtuse. But the Minami-abuse arcs send “realistic drama” genre signals—the basis of her character is that she’s a sweet, loving person with a history of being violently abused by people close to her.

When authors mix not just different but contradictory genre signals, the risk is what happens here—readers go “wtf—how are we supposed to take this?” The story sets up sympathy for Minami as the victim of unjustified violence, then shows Iori suddenly smacking her out of nowhere for being emotionally insecure, and that’s supposed to be funny. Good luck with that.

So if you are arguing that this title is “non-fantasy”, please direct me to this place in Japan that is populated exclusively with beautiful, young, wide-eyed lesbians who never have PMS or menstruate. This ‘realistic drama’ in which a teenager with very large visible tattoos and piercings is not chastised by every person over 35 they encounter. Where two women spend the night having sex in a love hotel and wake up with nary a puffy eye or hair out of place.

The artist doesn’t dramatize any ugly people in this title. Perhaps in this ‘realistic drama’, ugly people have bags placed over their heads and are rounded up to be placed in holding pens so the beautiful people never have to see them or interact with them. If you have a gummy smile, or crooked teeth, or are slightly overweight you are banished from this “realistic drama”.

You are perfectly okay with this example of fantasy in this title. You are not okay with the fantasy violence because you are literally citing only the examples that support your argument. It’s confirmation bias, pure and simple.

In the NGL arc, a Chimera ant abducts two children and feeds them to the Chimera Queen alive.

Nice work on the “non-fantasy” example.

“My very narrow and very specific argument still holds because it only applies to this particular title. I will only accept evidence from no other titles, therefore, I cannot be disproven.”

Bullshit. I excluded fantasy because in that genre violence can have all kinds of variant meanings than in realism, like in the Bakemonogatari series, where the protagonist can get torn limb from limb and it’s funny because he’s a fucking vampire who regenerates faster than the enemy can injure him.

My issue is not moral, but artistic. The “comedy violence” tropes are a genre signal that the violence is notional and not to be taken seriously—everybody knows that, which is why the pious lectures about tropes are obtuse. But the Minami-abuse arcs send “realistic drama” genre signals—the basis of her character is that she’s a sweet, loving person with a history of being violently abused by people close to her.

When authors mix not just different but contradictory genre signals, the risk is what happens here—readers go “wtf—how are we supposed to take this?” The story sets up sympathy for Minami as the victim of unjustified violence, then shows Iori suddenly smacking her out of nowhere for being emotionally insecure, and that’s supposed to be funny. Good luck with that.

So if you are arguing that this title is “non-fantasy”, please direct me to this place in Japan that is populated exclusively with beautiful, young, wide-eyed lesbians who never have PMS or menstruate. This ‘realistic drama’ in which a teenager with very large visible tattoos and piercings is not chastised by every person over 35 they encounter. Where two women spend the night having sex in a love hotel and wake up with nary a puffy eye or hair out of place.

The artist doesn’t dramatize any ugly people in this title. Perhaps in this ‘realistic drama’, ugly people have bags placed over their heads and are rounded up to be placed in holding pens so the beautiful people never have to see them or interact with them. If you have a gummy smile, or crooked teeth, or are slightly overweight you are banished from this “realistic drama”.

You are perfectly okay with this example of fantasy in this title. You are not okay with the fantasy violence because you are literally citing only the examples that support your argument. It’s confirmation bias, pure and simple.

OK, I’m guessing you’re not that stupid as to think that this series meets any reasonable definition of “fantasy” as a genre, so all this has just been bluster to win an argument on the internet.

You “win”—you’re so awesome.

last edited at May 6, 2020 11:13AM

In the NGL arc, a Chimera ant abducts two children and feeds them to the Chimera Queen alive.

Nice work on the “non-fantasy” example.

“My very narrow and very specific argument still holds because it only applies to this particular title. I will only accept evidence from no other titles, therefore, I cannot be disproven.”

Bullshit. I excluded fantasy because in that genre violence can have all kinds of variant meanings than in realism, like in the Bakemonogatari series, where the protagonist can get torn limb from limb and it’s funny because he’s a fucking vampire who regenerates faster than the enemy can injure him.

My issue is not moral, but artistic. The “comedy violence” tropes are a genre signal that the violence is notional and not to be taken seriously—everybody knows that, which is why the pious lectures about tropes are obtuse. But the Minami-abuse arcs send “realistic drama” genre signals—the basis of her character is that she’s a sweet, loving person with a history of being violently abused by people close to her.

When authors mix not just different but contradictory genre signals, the risk is what happens here—readers go “wtf—how are we supposed to take this?” The story sets up sympathy for Minami as the victim of unjustified violence, then shows Iori suddenly smacking her out of nowhere for being emotionally insecure, and that’s supposed to be funny. Good luck with that.

So if you are arguing that this title is “non-fantasy”, please direct me to this place in Japan that is populated exclusively with beautiful, young, wide-eyed lesbians who never have PMS or menstruate. This ‘realistic drama’ in which a teenager with very large visible tattoos and piercings is not chastised by every person over 35 they encounter. Where two women spend the night having sex in a love hotel and wake up with nary a puffy eye or hair out of place.

The artist doesn’t dramatize any ugly people in this title. Perhaps in this ‘realistic drama’, ugly people have bags placed over their heads and are rounded up to be placed in holding pens so the beautiful people never have to see them or interact with them. If you have a gummy smile, or crooked teeth, or are slightly overweight you are banished from this “realistic drama”.

You are perfectly okay with this example of fantasy in this title. You are not okay with the fantasy violence because you are literally citing only the examples that support your argument. It’s confirmation bias, pure and simple.

OK, I’m guessing you’re not that stupid as to think that this series meets any reasonable definition of “fantasy” as a genre, so all this has just been bluster to win an argument on the internet.

You “win”—you’re so awesome.

And if you think that a story about exclusively beautiful young lesbians doesn’t have fantasy elements, you are just reinforcing your own disingenuousness. Get over yourself.

How much like Heke Mikanuji is ?

The issue can be summed up under the sentence "the author is not very good at handling tonal shifts." Mikanuji also is basically making up drama and new characters as she goes along. This was what, originally an online thing that can end at anytime, but then it got picked up to be serialized. Where you can longer play that fast and loose with plot. Got to have a direction of some sort. Except we don't know if it's heading for the cliff or somewhere sensible.

Shinohara: I like Heke

Her friend: Ah yes, the floor is made of floor

No mentioning of clay today Yurimitsu?

After THAT chapter, I took a break, and today I read all the new chapters but yeah, I kinda lost the ability to enjoy it or feel excited with any couple now, I like the mangaka but she's stuck with someone who seems to have problem with the concept of being nice or honest ... So yeah, this will be my last comment about this series so you won't see me arguing with people about why this is bad or good.

But I saw some comments and I actually laughed with the irony of some people xP anyway, enjoy

oof

Alcohol the world’s best truth serum Σ੧(❛□❛✿)

Those little not-Miqo'te are so cute.

Umm, bathroom handholding? O-kayyyy....

So Minami is not of drinking age, but is of sex age?

So Minami is not of drinking age, but is of sex age?

Drinking age in Japan is 20. Age of consent on the other hand is a bit more complex i believe. Pretty sure it's mentioned that she's about 18/19.

Iori you fool, don't you see this is your ticket to being a top? Use this to your advantage!

Hino will be so jealous...

Curious, are you guys still adding the filter, or did she start using it again. While reading this chapter, it just kinda popped in my head.

Ah, crying drunks....had to listen to a lot of them...

So Minami is not of drinking age, but is of sex age?

Age of consent in most of Europe and Asia is never more than 18 while legal drinking age is 21.

That was strangely wholesome considering it was about see the other peeing.

The issue can be summed up under the sentence "the author is not very good at handling tonal shifts." Mikanuji also is basically making up drama and new characters as she goes along. This was what, originally an online thing that can end at anytime, but then it got picked up to be serialized. Where you can longer play that fast and loose with plot. Got to have a direction of some sort. Except we don't know if it's heading for the cliff or somewhere sensible.

I think the issue is more succinctly summed up as “if you read subtext into a story where there is none and it diminishes your enjoyment of it, that is not a failing of the author”.

For example, if you read Moby Dick and focus on how Melville’s portrayal of the disabled reveals his ablist agenda and due to this tonedeafness you hate the story - well, that’s okay I guess.

Fusoroi has a lot of faults, but an ultra-realistic representation of human relationships it is not.

I took a break from reading this the moment it updated, came back, and am now happy again with the most recent chapters.

last edited at May 7, 2020 12:29PM