i don't know about "just a fetish" but that immoral bisexual women are a kink for her does seem to be why she draws so many comics about them. i understand wanting something more wholesome but i think you're barking up the wrong tree if you're seriously asking a porn artist to stop drawing porn comics about the thing they find sexiest and most fascinating in all the world. it'd be a lot more productive if you instead found someone else who drew the thing you wanted to see.

I never said she should stop doing what she likes. You missed my point entirely. My problem is not Kodama's fascination with Cheater Bisexuals. It's completely fine to portray a character however she wants(it's her manga after all). It's fine to have certain "kinks". But except some sensible people, most people in this thread are gonna be like "oMg bIsExUaL pEoPlE aRe nAsTy cHeAtErS". That's what bothers me. People read her manga and keep on spreading hate on other threads too. After all, all this biphobia in this site started because of NTR.

That being said, I DON'T HATE Kodama. So please don't categorize me in "haters". As I said, I definitely enjoy some of her art and some of her works. Just not this one.

That's all.

i meant that she's unlikely to stop doing what she likes most in favour of something she apparently has little to no artistic interest in, not that you're saying she should stop making comics at all. i don't think that's what you're saying. sorry for being unclear.

ultimately the responsibility for biphobia lies with those being biphobic. people who are mad about bisexual women would be mad about them regardless of how compelling and/or wholesome the story was.

To be fair, it's not about bisexuals being cheaters, it's about the thrill of cheating itself + and picking the other female main character over a guy, usually.
Maybe there are some, but I don't really recall her doing "cheating lesbians", but I'd say that the reason for that isn't because she thinks or wants to portray bisexuals as morally depraved. It's probs because she fetishises the sort of cheating that's "feelsgood". As in, most readers would probs feel bad if the character was cheating on a girlfriend/wife tbh. Generally, to make readers root for cheating/not feel too morally uncomfortable with it, the partner that's cheated on must be someone they disapprove of. They may be abusive, they may be a cheater themself, they may be negligent, etc. Something is put into place to justify why "cheating is okay and although it feels wrong, it feels good and it's okay in this case". In yuri manga though, often just having the partner being male is enough for those who have a bias/much prefer women to disregard relationship morality as a factor of that equation.
That's simply what she likes to write. Rather than a jab at bisexuals, I feel like it makes sense, for what she wants to write, for her characters to end up being bi.
She likes bad girls, she likes dysfunctional relationships, she prefers having guys being the one cheated on.

In the end, it's her cup of tea and you can read whatever you want despite knowing that you dislike the author's tastes, but it doesn't make her "objectively" bad or anything if your main criticism is basically that you personally don't like what she likes to write. There's obviously an audience for her work. To be upset when you're not part of that audience is kinda weird imo.

I never said she should stop doing what she likes. You missed my point entirely. My problem is not Kodama's fascination with Cheater Bisexuals. It's completely fine to portray a character however she wants(it's her manga after all). It's fine to have certain "kinks". But except some sensible people, most people in this thread are gonna be like "oMg bIsExUaL pEoPlE aRe nAsTy cHeAtErS". That's what bothers me. People read her manga and keep on spreading hate on other threads too. After all, all this biphobia in this site started because of NTR.

That being said, I DON'T HATE Kodama. So please don't categorize me in "haters". As I said, I definitely enjoy some of her art and some of her works. Just not this one.

To be honest those people are like that regardless if there's a manga about it or not. I can say most of us don't take manga for a new reality, the one who do are already mentally sick in the first place and are looking for an excuse to hate.
I think the general argument was that Kodama spreads biphobic, but honestly I doubt a manga can change a person mind so drastically. They already have preconceived notions about it.
That or they don't like any guys in manga like 4chan purity fags. They want their waifu to be Virgin Mary in order to be a golden lesbian.

last edited at Feb 24, 2019 6:15PM

To be honest those people are like that regardless if there's a manga about it or not. I can say most of us don't take manga for a new reality, the one who do are already mentally sick in the first place and are looking for an excuse to hate.
I think the general argument was that Kodama spreads biphobic, but honestly I doubt a manga can change a person mind so drastically. They already have preconceived notions about it.
That or they don't like any guys in manga like 4chan purity fags. They want their waifu to be Virgin Mary in order to be a golden lesbian.

I sort of agree. Even though her extensive use of that trope doesn't help, we can't put all that biphobia on Kodama Naoko's account. I also believe most of that comes from guys who read yuri and fantasize about girls' purity. That CozyCreature guy who made a scene at the beginning of this comment section is a prime example of that, he always complains at the slightest sign of bissexuality in a character. It sucks because I like being here because, among many things, it's a place of lgbt acceptance.

Hahaha it could be possible that this mangaka could do a good Yuri manga? Really? It could be possible? ALMOST ALL HER STORIES ARE BISEXUAL AS F#VK!!!! AND TOXIC AND SHIT!!!!
If she love so much the men, then do a het shoujo manga xd (i hate this author with my soul, since NTR, all her stories, except the fake marriage, are bad and crap)

At this point there's no reason to get your panties in a twist because of her work. It's just her style and what she likes to draw so you gotta accept that. She does have the potential to make sweeter stories (like Renai Manga), but again she prefers this stuff. If you hate her work so much, just look at the tags and move on. Not worth the stroke man.

I'm just sick of her stories, I give her a chance and ALWAYS I over disappointed... don't hide the truth, she's a bad mangaka, that's all, that's why a lot of Yuri fans hate her a lot. And always put shit bisexual stuff...but y'know what? I'm done with her. I preferred ignore everything from this women

Your opinion sucks and you should feel bad.

I don't care about it, more than opinion, it's the truth

Opinion = truth? What are you, a grade schooler?

No, i'm a mature men, and yeah, for me that's the truth.
If you don't like it, not my issue, i'm not toxic yuri fan, i'm just tried to judge what story is bad and what's not, and this like the others is bad...but like someone said before, ignore it and don't give her a chance if you don't like it

No, you are anything but mature and you should be utterly ashamed of the manner in which you are acting. It would have been at least excusable if you were a child.

About the only thing more asinine you could have done on a Dynasty forum would have been to have said, "ALMOST ALL HER STORIES ARE LESBIAN AS F#VK!!!! AND TOXIC AND SHIT!!!!" (Note the only word of yours I changed in that hypothetical quote was "BISEXUAL" to "LESBIAN.")

If you want to curse about and trash talk a story for being LGBT you really chose the wrong place to do it.

last edited at Feb 24, 2019 7:12PM

Still a better love story than netsuzou trap lol

Hahaha it could be possible that this mangaka could do a good Yuri manga? Really? It could be possible? ALMOST ALL HER STORIES ARE BISEXUAL AS F#VK!!!! AND TOXIC AND SHIT!!!!
If she love so much the men, then do a het shoujo manga xd (i hate this author with my soul, since NTR, all her stories, except the fake marriage, are bad and crap)

At this point there's no reason to get your panties in a twist because of her work. It's just her style and what she likes to draw so you gotta accept that. She does have the potential to make sweeter stories (like Renai Manga), but again she prefers this stuff. If you hate her work so much, just look at the tags and move on. Not worth the stroke man.

I'm just sick of her stories, I give her a chance and ALWAYS I over disappointed... don't hide the truth, she's a bad mangaka, that's all, that's why a lot of Yuri fans hate her a lot. And always put shit bisexual stuff...but y'know what? I'm done with her. I preferred ignore everything from this women

Your opinion sucks and you should feel bad.

I don't care about it, more than opinion, it's the truth

Opinion = truth? What are you, a grade schooler?

No, i'm a mature men, and yeah, for me that's the truth.
If you don't like it, not my issue, i'm not toxic yuri fan, i'm just tried to judge what story is bad and what's not, and this like the others is bad...but like someone said before, ignore it and don't give her a chance if you don't like it

No, you are anything but mature and you should be utterly ashamed of the manner in which you are acting. It would have been at least excusable if you were a child.

About the only thing more asinine you could have done on a Dynasty forum would have been to have said, "ALMOST ALL HER STORIES ARE LESBIAN AS F#VK!!!! AND TOXIC AND SHIT!!!!" (Note the only word of yours I changed in that hypothetical quote was "BISEXUAL" to "LESBIAN.")

If you want to curse about and trash talk a story for being LGBT you really chose the wrong place to do it.

How the fuck do people still willingly go into something they know they don't like or has a history of stuff they don't enjoy. After you stick the coin I'm the electrical socket you don't just do it again but this time with a car battery attached to your nipples.

i'm here for my rush of moral indecency

this is the yuri equivalent of liking salty liquorice.

I never said she should stop doing what she likes. You missed my point entirely. My problem is not Kodama's fascination with Cheater Bisexuals. It's completely fine to portray a character however she wants(it's her manga after all). It's fine to have certain "kinks". But except some sensible people, most people in this thread are gonna be like "oMg bIsExUaL pEoPlE aRe nAsTy cHeAtErS". That's what bothers me. People read her manga and keep on spreading hate on other threads too. After all, all this biphobia in this site started because of NTR.

That being said, I DON'T HATE Kodama. So please don't categorize me in "haters". As I said, I definitely enjoy some of her art and some of her works. Just not this one.

That's stupid, it's like saying all the hatred for America started because Trump was voted as president... in reality most of the world hated america before that and probably will continue to do so.
Getting butthurt because of a few pages of hentai/ecchi manga depicting something wrong sounds like a ridiculous waste of time, energy and emotion, whether its about gender identity, sexual preference, even race, I'm pretty sure people aren't reading/looking at this kind of stuff for facts (even though sometimes they hit pretty close to home, but I think its a personal view or perspective type thing when that's the case). Anyone with a brain knows these stories are fiction, so you can either angrily fap to this one manga of kodamas you hate or go elsewhere and read/masterbate over some fluffy, lovey-dovey yuri tentacle-monster lady genuinely falling in love with a tsundere futanari-catgirl and building a loving and trusting relationship with her until they make intense, hot, sweaty fuck-fuck or whatever MOST of the entire world finds as a weird sick fetish, I won't judge you for it, I promise (I'd be a hypocrite if I did).

last edited at Feb 25, 2019 1:59PM

Two things Naoko seems to love, big ole titties and shitty people

And this has both.

I feel sad. I mean, the fact that they will just be with people they don't have any feelings to...

look I know this ain't gunjo but hey let me dream

There's gotta be a fancy name for the knee between legs position.

There's gotta be a fancy name for the knee between legs position.

Well in high school we called that a cup check so let's call it that for now.

AHHHHHHH!!!!

Kodama Naoko! If I ever meet you I will make you eat a stale ham sandwich! How dare you toy with my heart time and time again!!!!!

I needed this comment. Thank you. Dude up top who thinks their opinion = truth is givin me a headache. Lets just feed her a stale ham sandwich and call it good

I like how Kodama's works here tend to be free double-shot entertainement; the manga itself and the shocking but inevitable MORAL PANIC REEEEEE in the comments. :3

To be fair, it's not about bisexuals being cheaters, it's about the thrill of cheating itself + and picking the other female main character over a guy, usually.
Maybe there are some, but I don't really recall her doing "cheating lesbians", but I'd say that the reason for that isn't because she thinks or wants to portray bisexuals as morally depraved. It's probs because she fetishises the sort of cheating that's "feelsgood". As in, most readers would probs feel bad if the character was cheating on a girlfriend/wife tbh. Generally, to make readers root for cheating/not feel too morally uncomfortable with it, the partner that's cheated on must be someone they disapprove of. They may be abusive, they may be a cheater themself, they may be negligent, etc. Something is put into place to justify why "cheating is okay and although it feels wrong, it feels good and it's okay in this case". In yuri manga though, often just having the partner being male is enough for those who have a bias/much prefer women to disregard relationship morality as a factor of that equation.
That's simply what she likes to write. Rather than a jab at bisexuals, I feel like it makes sense, for what she wants to write, for her characters to end up being bi.
She likes bad girls, she likes dysfunctional relationships, she prefers having guys being the one cheated on.

In the end, it's her cup of tea and you can read whatever you want despite knowing that you dislike the author's tastes, but it doesn't make her "objectively" bad or anything if your main criticism is basically that you personally don't like what she likes to write. There's obviously an audience for her work. To be upset when you're not part of that audience is kinda weird imo.

It's true. I didn't feel a lick of pity for either guy in Netsuzou.

Ah yes, another "Everything I don't like is bad!!!!"
If you just want fuwa fuwa pure heart yuri there's no lack of it on this site, just go somewhere else. No one's forcing you to read this. Kodama has a preference (/-_-/)

I love Kodama Naoko-sensei. Her "Moratorium" was the one who introduced me to Yuri. Without her, I'd only know crappy romance shoujo

This was delicious as sin, thank you, Kodama~ I was especially delighted by the school grill's priorities, some heavy philosophical stuff mentioned in passing --> "What does that mean...?" --> "Besides that, Shiori-san's boobs are huge... They're so pretty..."

As to all the hate in this thread...

It was blindingly obvious for a long time what Kodama's preferences are.

"I wanted her to be even more garbage."
"...my personal elements of moe."
"Pretty girl with long, wavy hair. / Yandere. / Big tits."
"Therefore, love-hate, soap opera drama...!"
"Be my slave." "Here, I'll r*pe you."
"I just love characters like Ririko, who are cute but have a naturally bad personality."

She can write light fluff, she just does not want to. The number of people that, time and time again, wander into her works somehow expecting Kodama to not be Kodama never ceases to amaze me. She likes soap opera (which is to say, crappy dorama), she likes hot grills with bad personalities, she likes cheating. If that is not your cup of tea, like, do not read her works, simple as that. Bonus points for each doujin being tagged with all the necessary tags. You have only your own idiocy to blame, dear haters.

And lmao at all the "objective truth" and "everyone hates her" crap, there is obviously an audience that appreciates her works, as demonstrated in this very thread, and, you know, by the fact she still produces such content after all these years. Granted, she caters to specific tastes, but those tastes do exist. Deal with it.

As for her spreading bi-hatred, here is the thing. On the surface, you seem to have a point. I am one of those people that get peeved at the usual portrayal of bi people in gay manga, as perpetual cheaters who usually leave their partner for the opposite sex. As a bi person myself, it does annoy me to no ends at times. But, and here is the point, I never got that feeling with Kodama's works. It could be because she deliberately makes her characters as garbage as possible, maybe it is because of something else, but I never got the "she is doing the bi people a disservice" feeling. Her works are exactly what she wants them to be, soap opera. Honestly, do you watch soap opera for its accurate and deep social commentary?

This is the best reply as far as I can see, but for the biphobia? I disagree. It doesn't really mean much, since I can't speak for everyone, but I am bisexual (and my boyfriend is polyamorous) and I don't see it in that way. I don't see it as being biphobic. The reason being Japanese culture at large, which isn't necessarily bad, just different from what we are used to. It's true that a lot of Japanese people marry out of convenience and not love, and to do what is expected of them for the sake of tradition and such, but will go on to have fulfilling romantic relationships in varying degrees of secrecy. This is doubly true for LGBT folk who still aren't exactly accepted in the same way as they are in the West, though this is improving, which even Kodama has acknowledged in some of her more recent work in which two women get married.

We don't really know much about the married character's situation in this specific oneshot, but it read that way to me, with Japanese culture in mind. Her husbando might even know already what her deal is, and might not even care provided she fulfills her expected societal duties. She could be 100% lesbian for all we know, but has her reasons for not being an activist by attempting to live true to that lifestyle in a country that still doesn't quite accept it.

I will say that I find some of the comments here (not the one I quoted, I agree with much of that reply) to be much more biphobic than anything I've read of Kodama's, especially since we're often only given a glimpse of context and intention. I don't think I've even seen one instance of a Kodama character outright stating what their sexuality is, unless I'm forgetting. So I'm reluctant to even call anyone in a oneshot like this bisexual to begin with - epecially given cultural context.

I feel sad. I mean, the fact that they will just be with people they don't have any feelings to...

look I know this ain't gunjo but hey let me dream

gunjo is like a trainwreck you can't stop looking at. you know it's gonna to make you feel awful but you can't tear your eyes away from it. at this point, I just want to see the conclusion. i'm in too deep to just stop

I feel sad. I mean, the fact that they will just be with people they don't have any feelings to...

look I know this ain't gunjo but hey let me dream

Such is real lyfe baby!!

I really don't know what is it in Kodama that attracts so much wank but I personally love her stories. They're different than the rest and leave a lasting impression on its audience, even if it's negative sometimes...

speaking of gunjo, that's another type of story i love

Well I don't hate Kodama like some people here seem to do. I enjoy her art and sex scenes. I don't care about the story as I know it's going to be trash anyway(doesn't mean she's a bad mangaka).

All I ask is why does she have to, as somebody above pointed out, encourage disgusting stereotypes about bi women? Can't she portray them as kind, loving people just ONCE? And please don't call it "just a fetish" or whatever. It might be a fetish to her, but all it does is to promote hate towards bisexual people. And people here are biphobic as hell as it is.

People here are man haters not biphobics, it's different, what they can't stand here is the mere mention of a man like in this story the mention of the husband, the same story with a "wife" instead of a husband would not get so much hate.

This is the best reply as far as I can see, but for the biphobia? I disagree.

Judging by the rest of your post, I have a strong impression you misread that part of my comment. I was actually saying I do not agree with the statement of Kodama's works being biphobic (or rather, propagating biphobic manga stereotypes).