Real talk though, this has been broken since before the midpoint, and I suspect the editor didn't like the yuri under/overtones so that's when the depression arc started. Ever since the manga weirdly split off from their fun on the island, it's been incredibly weird. This is blessedly going to end now. The depression arc threw me for such a huge loop. It still doesn't make any sense to me and one would likely have to go back to read and reread it to get it.

These were such good characters but I don't understand what the central conflict of this entire story was? One girl was lonely? While the other stopped talking to her all of a sudden because?

It's cool that people want to read in this ambiguous masterclass in undertone drama, guess I missed it. I don't really care for most of the replies on here, I just had to vent about how poorly this turned out after starting out so amazing. I hate that they pulled out the yuri roots and left nothing but two girls who kind of know/talk to each other sometimes when they're not busy.

But then Japan isn't very far along the LGBT stuff and they're probably worried about this selling in China. This manga got popular after all. So it was a story about loneliness and depression, so it's cool to write that story, but I feel sort of teased. I don't like being sold something that wasn't there.

I'm sure it'll make money for the editor's company and will only have the slightest of microscopic yuri undertones y'all can read into it. But it'll make that money I guess.

It's a crying shame to think of how this story got ripped to shreds though. I've spoken my truth for now. Hope last chapter somehow is not just, "Hey, let's get a coffee," and then they go their separate ways, which is basically how this was destined to end after the first quarter of the story.

It does feel like a big shift between the first few chapters and all the later stuff. Remember when the girls were flipping out over their cat island totally-not-a-date? Or when dad was totally setting his daughter up with an excuse to ask her friend out on a date to the festival?

This chapter feels like it's coming the closest to acknowledging things, sort of a mutual realization that they're into each other but the timing just isnt right. It doesn't feel very real to teenage emotions, but at least it's something.

Here's hoping that at least the mangaka gets to do a real yuri once this is over. Even if this one was frequently frustrating the good parts were sooo good

This manga was never meant to be yuri. Author and editor said that from the start. I don't know why anyone expected anything.

last edited at Feb 28, 2021 4:49AM

The earlier "hints" were all Koyuki freaking out over not knowing how to deal with having someone so close to her for the first time, i.e. the sudden hug, thinking their club activity was like a date and so on. Konatsu's behavior never changed. I won't blame anyone for having certain expectations, but saying that the story's development took a weird or sudden turn is just wrong. The story was always based on the Salamander short story, it was never going to be about a fluffy, drama-free relationship. The short story is about a pair of lonely and stubborn creatures who become trapped in a toxic and self-destructive companionship due to their inability to express their feelings. The fluffier earlier stuff in Nettaigyo reflects the time when the two haven't yet confronted the issues that would pop up from them becoming very close to each other. The drama that happens afterwards is all rooted in the author wanting to do a take on the short story where the characters are gradually able to face their issues and grow past them. I do suggest rereading the story in one go once it's over to see how everything flows. If anything I'd say the callbacks are too explicit and overdone with all the frog and salamander imagery showing up at every step of the evolving relationship and visual and discussed flashbacks even when they should already be obvious.

I'm satisfied with the whole story and its end. That was a bittersweet conclusion between the two of them.

Next chapter, Koyuki and Konatsu meet again in Tokyo a few years later and introduce each other to their respective girlfriends: the girl with the same uniform as Konatsu that Koyuki came across on the school trip, and the gloomy girl Konatsu met in class on the first day of senior year.

Real talk though, this has been broken since before the midpoint, and I suspect the editor didn't like the yuri under/overtones so that's when the depression arc started. Ever since the manga weirdly split off from their fun on the island, it's been incredibly weird. This is blessedly going to end now. The depression arc threw me for such a huge loop. It still doesn't make any sense to me and one would likely have to go back to read and reread it to get it.

These were such good characters but I don't understand what the central conflict of this entire story was? One girl was lonely? While the other stopped talking to her all of a sudden because?

It's cool that people want to read in this ambiguous masterclass in undertone drama, guess I missed it. I don't really care for most of the replies on here, I just had to vent about how poorly this turned out after starting out so amazing. I hate that they pulled out the yuri roots and left nothing but two girls who kind of know/talk to each other sometimes when they're not busy.

This is much the same way I feel about it as well. There did seem to be a large tonal shift somewhere in the middle of the story, and then after that I found the plot and character development very hard to track. I kept having to step back 2 or 3 chapters every time a new one came out, to get caught up on what tentative threads of story I was supposed to be watching evolve from chapter to chapter. The salamander and frog imagery was frustrating to have to keep tracking in that way, and I don't feel like it delivered a very meaningful metaphor in the end. I don't personally care if the story turns out Yuri or not. But I found it increasingly hard to suss out what Koyuki's problems were, or what I was supposed to be making of all her dizzy staring into space. There is a point in there, I think, where the subtlety of the story stopped being impressive and started becoming tiresome. At the end now I find it really grating. In the middle of the story somewhere––probably around the arc the previous poster is talking about––the narrative stopped having any forward momentum, and the manga became mostly characters staring at each other with embarrassed looks on their faces, hoping for minute reactions from other characters, and reading an absurd amount of meaning into those faint acknowledgements. Honestly? It just got boring, and harder to appreciate as the author struggled to keep the story precious and delicate, and paced at the same ploddingly "realistic" cadence. I'm still reading for the characters, and essentially trying to pay off my initial investment in the series, but I feel like the series has run very long now on not much steam left. And I think the relationship between the two lead characters has very little of its' early vigor remaining. I guess that's life, or something. But I would have liked for the later part of the story to have more interest in it, and for it to be clearer in its' plotting and easier to follow. Just a little didacticism would have gone a long way. When the author started committing precious page time to Koyuki's brother, I really started feeling the drag of this thing. It's definitely a book that felt, for me, at least, sharper earlier on, funnier and more lively, and then increasingly listless as it progressed. One thing I have to say I grew to hate was the repetitive chapter headings. Holy cow, was that a clear marker of a plodding pace, and the kind of listless sleepwalking the story did late in the game.

And while I really do not mind one way or another whether it's a yuri story, it certainly seemed to be leading towards one early on, and I'm inclined to believe the idea in the quoted post that there was the beginning of a yuri story, and it got removed, or it just never quite materialized. I realize the author and made these statements about always wanting to do it this way, or that way, but authors make those kind of statements all the time, papering over their own uncertainty––or sometimes outright failure to bring about what they intend––and making it seem like this is what they planned from the beginning. I'm no more inclined to believe an author's statement of intent than I am a reader's theory on how things went. Author's statements these days are pure public relations exercises lots of the time, and it sounds to me just as likely that the author had to assuage some frustrated fans. Unless the author stated before starting the series that it was never going to be yuri. But I didn't think that was what was said. Well, whatever. In the end I just didn't get much from the storytelling aesthetics of the second half of the narrative. I feel like the pace of Hana ni Arashi has accelerated to a brisker clip than this story did, and I don't see any noble point in keeping things so turgid and low-key in the later part of the story. And like another couple of commenters on here, I just don't find myself of the same mind as the readers who have found so much continued quality in the story. I don't want to say that it "wasn't for me," because the first half of the story was very much my bag. Maybe next chapter will wrap it all up in a way that retroactively changes everything for me. But I doubt that.

Screw it, I'm calling this confirmed. Don't fight me on this, I will cry.

I see no other way to see the letter, especially the last line. Doesn't get much more explicit for this series.

And then they never met each other again because the author is no homo.

Screw it, I'm calling this confirmed. Don't fight me on this, I will cry.

I see no other way to see the letter, especially the last line. Doesn't get much more explicit for this series.

You can't go saying "you're my frog" and "The moon is beautiful tonight" to a girl and then feint innocence xP

And then they never met each other again because the author is no homo.

Is she? https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/noshiro_curry_wo_mesiagare#22

Screw it, I'm calling this confirmed. Don't fight me on this, I will cry.

I see no other way to see the letter, especially the last line. Doesn't get much more explicit for this series.

You can't go saying "you're my frog" and "The moon is beautiful tonight" to a girl and then feint innocence xP

Couples saying "You're my frog/you're my salamander" counts as a common-law marriage in some jurisdictions.

Next chapter, Koyuki and Konatsu meet again in Tokyo a few years later and introduce each other to their respective girlfriends: the girl with the same uniform as Konatsu that Koyuki came across on the school trip, and the gloomy girl Konatsu met in class on the first day of senior year.

So full-on, double NTR ending? I almost want to see that.

Yes, the NTR part is a joke, but in a way that would be worse than one of them having a boyfriend, because now you'd know they could have been girlfriends, if they had just put in a wee bit of effort into putting it out clearly.

So that would then put the entire ending in an awkward position, because the series itself was kind of selling the "star-crossed lovers/friends" angle a lot, so how could these new girlfriends stand in the way of that in the end?

last edited at Feb 28, 2021 12:21PM

I just think it would be funny, obviously it would be like a slap in the face for the reader if it happened.

I actually visited this town when I was in Japan 2 years ago and man, is it a load of nothing. Not even quaint nothing, just nothing. I could maybe understand choosing it over Tokyo if there was a really cute senpai around, otherwise nah.

Next chapter, Koyuki and Konatsu meet again in Tokyo a few years later and introduce each other to their respective girlfriends: the girl with the same uniform as Konatsu that Koyuki came across on the school trip, and the gloomy girl Konatsu met in class on the first day of senior year.

Im no longer as invested in this as I was at the beginning so if they did this it would be a big lol for me and probably a big slap in the face to everyone else

Also the "youre my frog" line is so cringe, like oh my god you two. It's not even gay cringe because they mean it in some "beyond friendship but still definitely not girlfriends" kind of way

Why do I read this, I should really stop

Real talk though, this has been broken since before the midpoint, and I suspect the editor didn't like the yuri under/overtones so that's when the depression arc started. Ever since the manga weirdly split off from their fun on the island, it's been incredibly weird. This is blessedly going to end now. The depression arc threw me for such a huge loop. It still doesn't make any sense to me and one would likely have to go back to read and reread it to get it.

These were such good characters but I don't understand what the central conflict of this entire story was? One girl was lonely? While the other stopped talking to her all of a sudden because?

It's cool that people want to read in this ambiguous masterclass in undertone drama, guess I missed it. I don't really care for most of the replies on here, I just had to vent about how poorly this turned out after starting out so amazing. I hate that they pulled out the yuri roots and left nothing but two girls who kind of know/talk to each other sometimes when they're not busy.

This is much the same way I feel about it as well. There did seem to be a large tonal shift somewhere in the middle of the story, and then after that I found the plot and character development very hard to track. I kept having to step back 2 or 3 chapters every time a new one came out, to get caught up on what tentative threads of story I was supposed to be watching evolve from chapter to chapter. The salamander and frog imagery was frustrating to have to keep tracking in that way, and I don't feel like it delivered a very meaningful metaphor in the end. I don't personally care if the story turns out Yuri or not. But I found it increasingly hard to suss out what Koyuki's problems were, or what I was supposed to be making of all her dizzy staring into space. There is a point in there, I think, where the subtlety of the story stopped being impressive and started becoming tiresome. At the end now I find it really grating. In the middle of the story somewhere––probably around the arc the previous poster is talking about––the narrative stopped having any forward momentum, and the manga became mostly characters staring at each other with embarrassed looks on their faces, hoping for minute reactions from other characters, and reading an absurd amount of meaning into those faint acknowledgements. Honestly? It just got boring, and harder to appreciate as the author struggled to keep the story precious and delicate, and paced at the same ploddingly "realistic" cadence. I'm still reading for the characters, and essentially trying to pay off my initial investment in the series, but I feel like the series has run very long now on not much steam left. And I think the relationship between the two lead characters has very little of its' early vigor remaining. I guess that's life, or something. But I would have liked for the later part of the story to have more interest in it, and for it to be clearer in its' plotting and easier to follow. Just a little didacticism would have gone a long way. When the author started committing precious page time to Koyuki's brother, I really started feeling the drag of this thing. It's definitely a book that felt, for me, at least, sharper earlier on, funnier and more lively, and then increasingly listless as it progressed. One thing I have to say I grew to hate was the repetitive chapter headings. Holy cow, was that a clear marker of a plodding pace, and the kind of listless sleepwalking the story did late in the game.

And while I really do not mind one way or another whether it's a yuri story, it certainly seemed to be leading towards one early on, and I'm inclined to believe the idea in the quoted post that there was the beginning of a yuri story, and it got removed, or it just never quite materialized. I realize the author and made these statements about always wanting to do it this way, or that way, but authors make those kind of statements all the time, papering over their own uncertainty––or sometimes outright failure to bring about what they intend––and making it seem like this is what they planned from the beginning. I'm no more inclined to believe an author's statement of intent than I am a reader's theory on how things went. Author's statements these days are pure public relations exercises lots of the time, and it sounds to me just as likely that the author had to assuage some frustrated fans. Unless the author stated before starting the series that it was never going to be yuri. But I didn't think that was what was said. Well, whatever. In the end I just didn't get much from the storytelling aesthetics of the second half of the narrative. I feel like the pace of Hana ni Arashi has accelerated to a brisker clip than this story did, and I don't see any noble point in keeping things so turgid and low-key in the later part of the story. And like another couple of commenters on here, I just don't find myself of the same mind as the readers who have found so much continued quality in the story. I don't want to say that it "wasn't for me," because the first half of the story was very much my bag. Maybe next chapter will wrap it all up in a way that retroactively changes everything for me. But I doubt that.

I agree with everything being said here. This series lost me somewhere in the middle. It felt like reading a whole different story like the author just abruptly changed her mind and decided to aim for a different end.

This story was a hell of a ride. I’m going to miss it when it ends.

Ok, the story aside, is no body gonna talk about the drastic change/drop in quality this chapter?? Did I miss something? It doesn’t even look like the same artist drew this chapter.

This could be particularly jarring to me because I was recently reading the first few chapters of this manga, but it just looks alittle off

last edited at Feb 28, 2021 5:42PM

It's more that her artstyle has changed again in the past few chapters, you can see it in the previous chapter as well when Konatsu tears up at the café table. It looks off because it's happening right at the end, but the author even said on twitter that she put her all into drawing the last two chapters in particular.

Real talk though, this has been broken since before the midpoint, and I suspect the editor didn't like the yuri under/overtones so that's when the depression arc started. Ever since the manga weirdly split off from their fun on the island, it's been incredibly weird. This is blessedly going to end now. The depression arc threw me for such a huge loop. It still doesn't make any sense to me and one would likely have to go back to read and reread it to get it.

These were such good characters but I don't understand what the central conflict of this entire story was? One girl was lonely? While the other stopped talking to her all of a sudden because?

It's cool that people want to read in this ambiguous masterclass in undertone drama, guess I missed it. I don't really care for most of the replies on here, I just had to vent about how poorly this turned out after starting out so amazing. I hate that they pulled out the yuri roots and left nothing but two girls who kind of know/talk to each other sometimes when they're not busy.

This is much the same way I feel about it as well. There did seem to be a large tonal shift somewhere in the middle of the story, and then after that I found the plot and character development very hard to track. I kept having to step back 2 or 3 chapters every time a new one came out, to get caught up on what tentative threads of story I was supposed to be watching evolve from chapter to chapter. The salamander and frog imagery was frustrating to have to keep tracking in that way, and I don't feel like it delivered a very meaningful metaphor in the end. I don't personally care if the story turns out Yuri or not. But I found it increasingly hard to suss out what Koyuki's problems were, or what I was supposed to be making of all her dizzy staring into space. There is a point in there, I think, where the subtlety of the story stopped being impressive and started becoming tiresome. At the end now I find it really grating. In the middle of the story somewhere––probably around the arc the previous poster is talking about––the narrative stopped having any forward momentum, and the manga became mostly characters staring at each other with embarrassed looks on their faces, hoping for minute reactions from other characters, and reading an absurd amount of meaning into those faint acknowledgements. Honestly? It just got boring, and harder to appreciate as the author struggled to keep the story precious and delicate, and paced at the same ploddingly "realistic" cadence. I'm still reading for the characters, and essentially trying to pay off my initial investment in the series, but I feel like the series has run very long now on not much steam left. And I think the relationship between the two lead characters has very little of its' early vigor remaining. I guess that's life, or something. But I would have liked for the later part of the story to have more interest in it, and for it to be clearer in its' plotting and easier to follow. Just a little didacticism would have gone a long way. When the author started committing precious page time to Koyuki's brother, I really started feeling the drag of this thing. It's definitely a book that felt, for me, at least, sharper earlier on, funnier and more lively, and then increasingly listless as it progressed. One thing I have to say I grew to hate was the repetitive chapter headings. Holy cow, was that a clear marker of a plodding pace, and the kind of listless sleepwalking the story did late in the game.

And while I really do not mind one way or another whether it's a yuri story, it certainly seemed to be leading towards one early on, and I'm inclined to believe the idea in the quoted post that there was the beginning of a yuri story, and it got removed, or it just never quite materialized. I realize the author and made these statements about always wanting to do it this way, or that way, but authors make those kind of statements all the time, papering over their own uncertainty––or sometimes outright failure to bring about what they intend––and making it seem like this is what they planned from the beginning. I'm no more inclined to believe an author's statement of intent than I am a reader's theory on how things went. Author's statements these days are pure public relations exercises lots of the time, and it sounds to me just as likely that the author had to assuage some frustrated fans. Unless the author stated before starting the series that it was never going to be yuri. But I didn't think that was what was said. Well, whatever. In the end I just didn't get much from the storytelling aesthetics of the second half of the narrative. I feel like the pace of Hana ni Arashi has accelerated to a brisker clip than this story did, and I don't see any noble point in keeping things so turgid and low-key in the later part of the story. And like another couple of commenters on here, I just don't find myself of the same mind as the readers who have found so much continued quality in the story. I don't want to say that it "wasn't for me," because the first half of the story was very much my bag. Maybe next chapter will wrap it all up in a way that retroactively changes everything for me. But I doubt that.

I agree with everything being said here. This series lost me somewhere in the middle. It felt like reading a whole different story like the author just abruptly changed her mind and decided to aim for a different end.

Series being lowkey gay or subtext is fine but it surely does lose its way in the middle of the story.
Not sure what the manga even about now.

We technically just got a slice of life with a girl trying to get over her loneliness and over-exaggerated "Friendship".

Well, I don't remember the manga being about robots or aliens in the first volume? it's been about dealing with loneliness from the start, you didn't forget the tale of the frog and the salamander right? the core of the manga that keeps being mentioned each volume from the very start?

Is not that one day the characters woke up and decided to stop talking JUST BECAUSE or they just feel sad and jealous for no reason, there were several chapters talking about it, is really gross how you act pretending that didn't matter or that it was a random act. I think you were just mad at that infamous tweet taken out of context, it was probably around that time that you thought "this story is all over the place!" or something like that or you just skipped all the text looking for a kiss you thought you deserved to see. I'm sorry to inform you but is just that you didn't pay attention or you stopped caring after the tweet. that or just trying to make the manga look bad and incoherent by pretending ignorance, all you'll get is sympathy from the people who were also "betrayed" by the tweet.

I don't think the manga changed the theme, the goal or the characters, but because you weren't promised a wedding at the end, your judgement became unfair and your patience ran out.

last edited at Feb 28, 2021 10:08PM

It's more that her artstyle has changed again in the past few chapters, you can see it in the previous chapter as well when Konatsu tears up at the café table. It looks off because it's happening right at the end, but the author even said on twitter that she put her all into drawing the last two chapters in particular.

ah, thanks for clearing that up. i personally prefer the old style, i thought it was so cute.. but as long as she is giving it her all its all good.

idc what anyone has to say this was such a beatuifull story from beginning to end, i guess saying the whole salamander and frog thing out loud wasn´t really necesary, it was pretty clear that they both undertood each other at that point but you know what if enjoying such a beautifull pay off makes me cringe so be it

This manga was never meant to be yuri. Author and editor said that from the start. I don't know why anyone expected anything.

That's what we're told, but it just doesn't jive with what we're presented with. The manga, when taken at face value, starts out as a fragile love story between two awkward teenagers, and either the author did not consciously do this and tried to weasel her way of out this by changing direction, or she got told off by her editor to cut it out in order not to hurt sales. Of course this could also have been a deliberate decision from the start, which would make it even worse.

It's a shame how this charming tale of teenage love gets dropped half-way and veers off into a vague narrative about depression because one girl feels lonely because she doesn't see the other as much anymore, or whatever that nonsense was supposed to be. Unfortunately this type of development is not uncommon in Japanese media, which seems to be fascinated by same-sex romance but can't seem to get over the hurdle of institutionalized homophobia.

last edited at Mar 2, 2021 5:35AM