There's one thing in this development that bothers me.

Kirigaya is guilt-ridden. We know that. We know because the omniscient narrator told us. The omniscient narrator explained Kirigaya's feelings in detail, and even revealed to us flashes of her thoughts and mental images. That's why we know for sure that she is sincerely remorseful and repentant and apologetic and shit.

But it is only us, the readers, who hear the voice of the omniscient narrator. Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info. All they know is that Kirigaya is bawling and saying she's sorry. And that's the oldest trick in the bully's book. Every bully in the world knows that, when the time comes to pay the piper, when karmic retribution rears its ugly head, the right strategy is to cry a river, pretend to be repentant and beg for forgiveness. It's a good, time-tested method to save the bullies from having to bear the consequences of their actions. In fact, this chapter just gave us a fine example: Kirigaya demonstrated exactly how the method works.

This is what bothers me. The MCs have no way of telling whether Kirigaya is sincere or just a dirty little hypocrite who's performing the script every bully knows to follow in these cases. Unlike us, they cannot read the exposition dished up by the omniscient narrator. And yet they forgive her, just like that, and even want to be friends. The idea that it might be a trick doesn't even cross their minds. Fiction or not, they should know better than to trust so easily someone like Kirigaya.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Kirigaya is terrified of the idea of being hated by Nikaidou, remember? The only reason she didn't already suffer the (from her PoV) absolute worst-case scenario of being utterly shunned by the latter is because Tadokoro is the only hope that descended in this world that is an absolute existence and the cutest and most precious angel.

She'd have to be suicidally stupid to try anything that risks annulling that stay of emotional execution.

last edited at Apr 22, 2019 3:04PM

Lol... I don't even know how to react to this anymore. Fuck that bully bitch can we move on already

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Kirigaya is terrified of the idea of being hated by Nikaidou, remember? The only reason she didn't already suffer the (from her PoV) absolute worst-case scenario of being utterly shunned by the latter is because Tadokoro is the only hope that descended in this world that is an absolute existence and the cutest and most precious angel.

She'd have to be suicidally stupid to try anything that risks annulling that stay of emotional execution.

But she won't. We know she won't try anything because the omniscient narrator said so. Remember? It's canon: her repentance is sincere.

You guys, discussing what will happen if she breaks her promise is a waste of time. What will happen? Will she get a beating this time? Or will she cry a little and be forgiven again at Tadokoro's request? It's pointless talk cause it won't happen: Kirigaya already saw the light and was redeemed. We know it as canon fact.

My point is that, unlike us, the MCs have no way of knowing. They can't read minds or hear the Word of God. (Superwoman jokes aside, the way they interacted during their flirting-but-not-yet-dating period makes it obvious.) I'm okay with Nikaidou taking back her declaration of despise and agreeing to "not hate" Kirigaya (cause Tadokoro would be sad otherwise, so she has no choice) but... befriending Kirigaya?? That's completely unnecessary and going way too far.

My point is that, unlike us, the MCs have no way of knowing. They can't read minds or hear the Word of God. (Superwoman jokes aside, the way they interacted during their flirting-but-not-yet-dating period makes it obvious.) I'm okay with Nikaidou taking back her declaration of despise and agreeing to "not hate" Kirigaya (cause Tadokoro would be sad otherwise, so she has no choice) but... befriending Kirigaya?? That's completely unnecessary and going way too far.

You seem to be underestimating the scope of Nikaidou's superpowers. More to the point, aside from hypothetical reprobacy being terminally stupid of her as already discussed since the Big N already knows what's up, Kiri already proved herself a very poor liar who's singularly unlikely to be capable of convincingly faking that level of emotional distress.

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

Probably safe to assume that as far as Nikaidou is concerned Kiri is for now "on probation" and will be kept an eye on until her bona fides have been proven beyond reasonable doubt though.

Probably safe to assume that as far as Nikaidou is concerned Kiri is for now "on probation" and will be kept an eye on until her bona fides have been proven beyond reasonable doubt though.

As evidenced by Nikaidou specifically telling Kirigaya that this is her last chance.

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

You mean those couldn't fly?! My life has been a lie... ;_;

This discussion sure has taken a turn for the weird.

I won't speak about fictional characters, but, concerning real-life youngsters and children (a subject I have professional knowledge about) I must say something. The number of little George Washingtons who couldn't tell a convincing lie to save their lives is incredibly low. Most kids know how to tell a lie in a plausible and persuasive way. Whether they will or will not is another matter, but they do have the skill. As for the ability to fake crying and feign remorse, it's very common as well, especially among children with a stern religious upbringing, who learn those skills (which are, for them, well-nigh survival skills) very early in life. The idea that it takes a sociopathic master liar to tell a convincing lie to a trained adult (a teacher, a priest, a psychologist) simply isn't true. These worthies, in real life, are fooled all the time by the fibs of teenagers and children. It's a dangerous fallacy (especially if your job is to deal with kids) to have such confidence in your power of discernment as to believe that no little brat will ever be able to trick you with a well made-up story.

Again, this is about the real world, mkay? And doesn't apply in any way or manner to the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl. Clear enough, I hope?

This story went from sweet sugar to dark sour chocolate real fast, kinda of silly going towards this direction

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

Could you clarify what your argument is and what the argument you're responding to is?

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

Could you clarify what your argument is and what the argument you're responding to is?

I’ve said it clearly as I can already, but I’ll try again. There has been a fair amount of discussion as to what “should” or “should not” happen to Kirigaya or what Tadokoro and Nikaidou’s attitude toward her and her supposed reformation “should” be, all in relation to people’s real-life experience with/attitudes towards bullies.

If people want to use this story as the occasion to express their opinions about bullies and how to deal with them in real life, they certainly have the right to do so. I am saying that in the context of the story, much of that discussion is essentially irrelevant to the story and to probable future events in the story.

EDIT: A story that White Rose characterizes quite well above:

the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl.

last edited at Apr 22, 2019 8:35PM

I’ve said it clearly as I can already, but I’ll try again. There has been a fair amount of discussion as to what “should” or “should not” happen to Kirigaya or what Tadokoro and Nikaidou’s attitude toward her and her supposed reformation “should” be, all in relation to people’s real-life experience with/attitudes towards bullies.

If people want to use this story as the occasion to express their opinions about bullies and how to deal with them in real life, they certainly have the right to do so. I am saying that in the context of the story, much of that discussion is essentially irrelevant to the story and to probable future events in the story.

EDIT: A story that White Rose characterizes quite well above:

the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl.

I agree with your (and White Rose's) take on what the story is. However I don't think commenters sharing their personal feelings on bullies, or their emotional reaction to the bully character in the story, indicates that they're genre-blind, or that they're not understanding the manga properly.

I agree with your (and White Rose's) take on what the story is. However I don't think commenters sharing their personal feelings on bullies, or their emotional reaction to the bully character in the story, indicates that they're genre-blind, or that they're not understanding the manga properly.

In some cases it might not.

As I said, readers are free to use the story as an occasion to hold forth on any topic the story raises.

From useless lesbians to not so useless

This thread got cancer real fast

I'm imagining this author drawing this, thinking, "and then this super hot girl comes in and saves me and you fall to your knees and sob, you fucking bitch! Oh, but I'll forgive you, because I know I'm better than you."

This bullying arc, as satisfying as it was to read, was just... a little excessive. I get the impression that someone had some issues in high school, and drawing this manga is a form of therapy.

I myself get the impression that someone had read a lot of attenuated manga plots and decided, “Fuck that—here’s how things ought to go . . . .”

I'm imagining this author drawing this, thinking, "and then this super hot girl comes in and saves me and you fall to your knees and sob, you fucking bitch! Oh, but I'll forgive you, because I know I'm better than you."

This bullying arc, as satisfying as it was to read, was just... a little excessive. I get the impression that someone had some issues in high school, and drawing this manga is a form of therapy.

Don't take it the wrong way, but that was a really pointless comment.

You could say pretty much the same thing of every book, comic, manga, movie, cartoon or tv show where (to quote Nene) there are:

A cute, sweet, helpless heroine everybody likes. A villain with a heart black as pitch who torments her. A hero [...] who arrives just in time to save the damsel and mete out punishment to the miscreant.

By my guesstimate, that's more than 80% of the fictional works out there. You could say of each and every one of these works that they are just self-insertion fantasies, and that the author, if he's a boy, identifies himself with the hero, or, if a she's a girl, identifies herself with the damsel in distress. You could say it of all of them, and it would be equally pointless, because it has zero importance from a literary point of view.

Heck, you could say the same thing of every romantic story where there are no evil villains or violent conflict, only a plain, unremarkable MC and his/her love interest, who is a highly desirable person and who, somewhat unrealistically, falls head over heels for the MC. How many yuri manga in this reader fit that description? Would you call all of them masturbatory fantasies of an author who identifies herself with the plain Jane?

We should judge a work by its literary or entertainment values, not waste time in speculations about whether the authors picture themselves as this or that character and use the story as therapy or jerkoff material.

last edited at Apr 25, 2019 4:17PM

I myself get the impression that someone had read a lot of attenuated manga plots and decided, “Fuck that—here’s how things ought to go . . . .”

Seriously, this reads like a fix-fic of every melodramatic and convoluted yuri manga combined and I love it.

Someone clearly doesn't get how the relationship between Tadokoro and Nikaidou works.

this ISNT a matter of "works" nikaido is indeed head over heels for tadokoro that doesn't mean she's a FREAKING ZOMBIE who must obey all her every needs! for once she could have shown a little more attitude instead of immediatly following tadokoro! plus this isn't about their relationship the fact that nikaido doesn't forgive the bully has NOTHING to do with it. even if nikaido still despise the bully and not forgive her it's obvious tadokoro would still love her anyway and she knows it. it would have been her choice and tadokoro would have accept that as long as nikaido doesn't hurt the bully badly.

But Nikaidou wasn't the one who got bullied, Tadokoro was the one who got bullied. And when she can forgive her Bully, how could Nikaidou not forgive her? She wasn't the victim.

Be still, my beating heart.