Forum › Yuzumori-san discussion
'weeps in a corner somewhere'
Hot damn, adult Mimika is easy on the eyes.
I took another look at most of the story today, and I almost felt like doing a precise page count of how often Mimika was being being blown away by Yuzumori, attempting to keep her feelings in check this side of criminality, or generally trying to keep her sanity somewhat intact in the face of the unbridled force of the universe that is Yuzumori.
It’s a lot, I’ll tell you that.
Excuse me... I-I have to go.... sniff
uuuuu... T_T
My comment had nothing to do with what the point of romance stories is. I was praising how the character's love was presented.
You literally just contradicted yourself. Romance stories are about presenting the characters love. Here we have little enough to just tag it as subtext instead of yuri.
That may be what you personally enjoy in romance, but ultimately the genre is about showing romantic love. How intimately the story delves into the characters' private moments is at the author's total discretion. For instance it's very common to leave the characters' having sex up to the reader's imagination.
It's not romantic love if there is no sexual acts. It would instead be platonic love by definition.
I mean if that's what you got out of the ending it's fine to interpret it that way. I think their love is on the right track personally. Even though Yuzumori is growing and changing in looks and personality over time, Mimika still loves her. That counts for more than any kiss.
No, it doesn't since it leaves too many questions that the reader is forced to interpret and make up their own stories, which is not the point of reading a story written by someone else. What do you think a plothole is?
It's not romantic love if there is no sexual acts. It would instead be platonic love by definition.
What.
It's not romantic love if there is no sexual acts. It would instead be platonic love by definition.
What.
dont you know? it doesnt count as yuri if the characters dont do some hardcore tribbing for 40 pages.
My comment had nothing to do with what the point of romance stories is. I was praising how the character's love was presented.
You literally just contradicted yourself. Romance stories are about presenting the characters love. Here we have little enough to just tag it as subtext instead of yuri.
That may be what you personally enjoy in romance, but ultimately the genre is about showing romantic love. How intimately the story delves into the characters' private moments is at the author's total discretion. For instance it's very common to leave the characters' having sex up to the reader's imagination.
It's not romantic love if there is no sexual acts. It would instead be platonic love by definition.
I mean if that's what you got out of the ending it's fine to interpret it that way. I think their love is on the right track personally. Even though Yuzumori is growing and changing in looks and personality over time, Mimika still loves her. That counts for more than any kiss.
No, it doesn't since it leaves too many questions that the reader is forced to interpret and make up their own stories, which is not the point of reading a story written by someone else. What do you think a plothole is?
Well, everyone is entitled to their own opinion about what defines "romance" and how it has to be portrayed, which ultimately is left to the author's sensibility, but you make it sound like "romantic love" necessarily implies explicit sexual acts. Personally, that's what I'd define as "sensual love" which, I'm sure you know, is not only different from "platonic love", but also from love as it represented in "erotica" or "pornography" narrative.
See how two characters go from not knowing each other (or being friends) to confessing each other's feelings is romance and what defines a love story (Yuzumori-san fits this definition perfectly). Any further physical manifestation of love and sexual desire is only functional to the story if the author thinks it so. (and this comes from somebody who wanted them kissing every chapter)
Also, I'm sure themusicman500 knows what a plothole is, which is different from a story that leaves an open ending.
last edited at Mar 27, 2018 4:46AM
“Platonic love” does NOT mean “no sex”: it means “no lust or sexual desire.” Mimika spends the entire story trying to control her desire to physically express her love (and sometimes only barely succeeding); Yuzumori is all for it herself, but she accepts that they’re both too young for that aspect of their romantic relationship at the moment and they agree to stay in love and wait until they’re legal.
“Platonic love” is about transcending (and therefore eliminating) physical desire; being a couple while restraining your physical desire until an appropriate time or stage of life is called “love.”
Ah que bonito final :''v
It's not romantic love if there is no sexual acts. It would instead be platonic love by definition.
What.
dont you know? it doesnt count as yuri if the characters dont do some hardcore tribbing for 40 pages.
Comment on your own stories, Mira!!!
This was a wonderful story. Yuri version beats the heck out of Kodomo no Jikan, whether it gets an anime or not!!
#glaresateveryonedefiantly
last edited at Mar 27, 2018 7:56PM
Merriam-Webster tells me the definition of "platonic love" is
1: love conceived by Plato as ascending from passion for the individual to contemplation of the universal and ideal
2: a close relationship between two persons in which sexual desire is nonexistent or has been suppressed or sublimated
#1 obviously isn't relevant here; as for #2, the relevant definition for "sublimation" would be to divert the expression of (an instinctual desire or impulse) from its unacceptable form to one that is considered more socially or culturally acceptable (the Wikipedia article adds "unconsciously" to that)... yeah, I don't think Mimika really does any of that. Depending on your definitions I suppose her very conscious refusal to act on her sexual desires would count for the "suppression" part though so fair enough.
Throwing "romantic" at M-W - there's no specific definition for "romantic love" in it apparently - nets me a link to "romance" and from there to "love affair" (a romantic attachment or episode between lovers) and the following relevant lines:
5b : marked by expressions of love or affection
c : conducive to or suitable for lovemaking
...while FWIW Wikipedia article on "romantic love" includes:
Anthropologist Charles Lindholm defined love to be "...an intense attraction that involves the idealization of the other, within an erotic context, with expectation of enduring sometime into the future."
Well that rather sounds like our lovebirds here if you ask me.
Significantly, not one of the various definitions discussed in the article includes sexual acts as some manner of requirement for romantic love; indeed the early historical iteration of the concept, Medieval courtly love, at least formally held that they basically had no business in the whole affair in the first place. (People being people it ought to be safe to assume any number of high ladies and gallant knights rather transgressed on the "purity of heart and mind" of the ideal theory behind closed doors but that's neither here nor there.)
last edited at Mar 27, 2018 8:51PM
I know I contributed to it myself, but we really don’t need a lot of laborious definitions here—Mimika and Yuzumori spend most of two chapters (29 & 30) sitting in the middle of the street confessing their love and skinshipping just short of tongue kissing and genital penetration (i.e., what would be in this context criminal behavior). Then later:
Mimika to Yuzumori: “I want to be with you forever.”
Yuzumori to Mimika: “Wait for me.”
Mimika to Yuzumori (silently): “Yet each time we meet, I fall in love with you all over again.”
I have no shared frame of reference to have a rational conversation with anyone who calls that “subtext.”
(After all, once you’ve passionately nibbled someone’s nose, there’s no going back to being “just friends.”)
I know I contributed to it myself, but we really don’t need a lot of laborious definitions here—Mimika and Yuzumori spend most of two chapters (29 & 30) sitting in the middle of the street confessing their love and skinshipping just short of tongue kissing and genital penetration (i.e., what would be in this context criminal behavior). Then later:
Mimika to Yuzumori: “I want to be with you forever.”
Yuzumori to Mimika: “Wait for me.”
Mimika to Yuzumori (silently): “Yet each time we meet, I fall in love with you all over again.”I have no shared frame of reference to have a rational conversation with anyone who calls that “subtext.”
(After all, once you’ve passionately nibbled someone’s nose, there’s no going back to being “just friends.”)
Who needs marriage proposals when you can tie the knot via nose nibbling? Also I agree with you.
I'm really uncertain how people are calling this subtext when both characters acknowledged their love for each other, they're only waiting till Yuzumori is old enough to kiss and so fourth. That said I'd really like an epilogue with them like 10 years in the future and a kiss. Maybe a kiss at a marriage ceremony, but I might be getting greedy.
I'm really uncertain how people are calling this subtext when both characters acknowledged their love for each other, they're only waiting till Yuzumori is old enough to kiss and so fourth. That said I'd really like an epilogue with them like 10 years in the future and a kiss. Maybe a kiss at a marriage ceremony, but I might be getting greedy.
Exactly one person called this subtext, and I really hope they weren't being sincere.
I'm really uncertain how people are calling this subtext when both characters acknowledged their love for each other, they're only waiting till Yuzumori is old enough to kiss and so fourth. That said I'd really like an epilogue with them like 10 years in the future and a kiss. Maybe a kiss at a marriage ceremony, but I might be getting greedy.
Exactly one person called this subtext, and I really hope they weren't being sincere.
Ah I only read through some of the more recent comments and I saw others were talking about the series being labeled as subtext, so I thought it was a big topic and debate. That's what I get for not reading through a few pages of comments first, my apologies.
Still I also hope they weren't being sincere.
I'm really uncertain how people are calling this subtext when both characters acknowledged their love for each other, they're only waiting till Yuzumori is old enough to kiss and so fourth. That said I'd really like an epilogue with them like 10 years in the future and a kiss. Maybe a kiss at a marriage ceremony, but I might be getting greedy.
Exactly one person called this subtext, and I really hope they weren't being sincere.
Sincerity on the internet is very hard to judge, and if I’ve been trolled I can only say, “Well played,” but that one person did seem to be very sincerely miffed that the story did not meet certain personal criteria for romance, yuri, and narrative closure.
It’s true that Mimika’s libido has been locked and loaded from the very beginning, but I don’t think even Chekhov himself would need to actually see the trigger get pulled to be satisfied that it’s eventually going to go off, offstage, at an appropriate time and place.
Sincerity on the internet is very hard to judge, and if I’ve been trolled I can only say, “Well played,” but that one person did seem to be very sincerely miffed that the story did not meet certain personal criteria for romance, yuri, and narrative closure.
It’s true that Mimika’s libido has been locked and loaded from the very beginning, but I don’t think even Chekhov himself would need to actually see the trigger get pulled to be satisfied that it’s eventually going to go off, offstage, at an appropriate time and place.
I think the user in question got banned not too long ago for trolling too much, and now opts for a more balanced mix of trolling and sincere commentary.
last edited at Mar 28, 2018 1:45AM
I think the user in question got banned not too long ago for trolling too much, and now opts for a more balanced mix of trolling and sincere commentary.
One thing I like about the Dynasty forum is that although heated squabbles, sometimes silly ones, do erupt from time to time, for the most part people seem to actually want to have real discussions rather than simply staging opinion-having domination contests.
So trolls do tend to stand out, usually because of an implausible mixture of supposed appreciation for a series coupled with a bitter and sustained attack on some specific aspect of the series, as in “I used to really like this series but I feel completely betrayed now that some thing that was obviously going to happen actually happened.”
“Platonic love” does NOT mean “no sex”: it means “no lust or sexual desire.” Mimika spends the entire story trying to control her desire to physically express her love (and sometimes only barely succeeding); Yuzumori is all for it herself, but she accepts that they’re both too young for that aspect of their romantic relationship at the moment and they agree to stay in love and wait until they’re legal.
“Platonic love” is about transcending (and therefore eliminating) physical desire; being a couple while restraining your physical desire until an appropriate time or stage of life is called “love.”
Yuzumori is all in for it now as a child that hasn't gone through puberty. From what we have been shown we dont know if her puppy love for Mimika survives with her getting older. They keep asking the same question whether or not Mamika will still love Yuzumori as she grows older. Buy they never ask once if Yuzumori will still love Mamika.
The whole point of not allowing adults to sleep with children is because children are incapable of giving consent. Their brains are literally not developed enough by society's standards to make a sound decision. Now we will never know if Yuzumori developed to a point of realizing that her infatuation with Mamika was love or not. The 6 year gap was too little and with no sign, a kiss perhaps, to show that their feelings are still the same there remains a open ending/plothole.
Maybe the author should have spent more time building their relationship, and given herself more room to work with with the ending instead of wasting it on 15 chapters of elementary school drama.
The 6 year gap was too little and with no sign, a kiss perhaps, to show that their feelings are still the same there remains a open ending/plothole.
I agree, as I think we all would, that if the timeskip had been longer we would know more about the characters' future relationship--that's true by definition. But the ending we have is no more a "plothole" than any other narrative ending--whatever point at which the story stopped, we wouldn't know what might happen after it. As far as both of the characters know, what they are feeling now (and have been feeling for some time by the end of the story) is love for one another, and they plan to be together in the future.
The story shows that Yuzumori's feelings are actually more thought-out and based on real shared experiences than Mimika's, which begin as a sudden overwhelming physical attraction--if anyone, Mimika (who has literally been portrayed as a small dog several times) is the one with the "puppy love."
The feelings of either one may in fact change as the two grow older. Prince Charming and Snow White may be run over by a runaway carriage after their story ends. Failing to show either one does not constitute a plothole.
so theres gonna be a time skip?
so theres gonna be a time skip?
There's already been a time skip. Yuzumori enters middle-school at the end.
And this manga is over.
@Blastaar it is a plothole in the sense that love surviving with age is a big theme of this series but it only asks it for one of the participants and not the other. It makes it a point that even though Mamika is a pedophile she will still love Yuzumori even if she becomes an adult. She will miss the little girl but will still be happy to be with the grown up version. But the plot completely forgets to ask the same about Yuzumori and a time skip could have at least helped resolve it.