I'll make this quick. Please excuse my disgustingly personal and subjective contribution.

My first love was (is?) a girl I met three years ago. In my case I'm both Fleur and the bride of this story: Fleur for obvious reasons and the bride because, alike her, I am completely restricted from even mentioning the prospect of loving a woman. Even so, I did with this one girl, and after 2 years she managed to pick up on it—struggle included—and I decided it'd be better to just let her know directly. Her reply was that she had felt the same for a long while and asked what I'd wanna do about it. I'm not allowed to (and I don't wanna discuss why I refuse to rise an opposition) so I just dodged the question and kept it as that. We spoke of it again and it was all pretty good; I was beyond this world with that confession. Now, the reason I'd be like Fleur is because exactly two days after all that she got herself a boyfriend, completely ignoring what we'd said. It was like getting slapped with a spiked glove placed on and honestly...I was really angry, because I was the first she looked for to give the news, and she was so, so happy. I felt horrible.

In a sense I think what Elle did was much better to swallow than what this girl did.
Had she told me AFTER getting her boyfriend I'm pretty sure I would have settled with the fact that "it's all good and done," and there was nothing to do there for myself. But she told me before, without a single hint of what was to come only two days later. To this day she insists I hold such a place in her thoughts as her boyfriend does, but all it does is make me wonder whyyyy she had to claim it was mutual in the first place, and why I refuse to let her go. I guess it's kinda like seeing Elle drag Fleur along to her wedding stuff fully aware of how she feels about her; this girl does the same, only she adds that extra topping of "I love you" every now and then.

Elle probably shouldn't have kissed Fleur, but it's kind of a relief for her as well. The groom got the worst end of the stick, duh, but as for the girls, I think it was an okay way to patch things up. Elle got it out of her chest and goes on her married life, and Fleur is left with the gratification that Elle was aware, that it was returned, and learns the reason why nothing did or could have ever come out of them as a couple. Elle married and if her reason wasn't enough to hold Fleur down from trying then what more than a wedding? That's the epitome of NOPE. The only option left is to move on for both parties.

P.S. This wasn't short at all.

last edited at Jun 6, 2015 11:01PM

yaaa..... after reading the comments I think I'll stay away from this one.

I thought Yuri had grown beyond this old typical bullshit of i love you but must marry because my family wants me to. I find the whole thing pathetic and a waste of time.

Family/obligation getting in the way of true love is as old as love stories themselves.

I donno how i feel about this. At first I thought that it would be just a good bitter-sweet story but that it ended on such a weird note. I like the art and most of the story but I think there is no need to drag the goodbye that much.

I'll make this quick. Please excuse my disgustingly personal and subjective contribution.

My first love was (is?) a girl I met three years ago. In my case I'm both Fleur and the bride of this story: Fleur for obvious reasons and the bride because, alike her, I am completely restricted from even mentioning the prospect of loving a woman. Even so, I did with this one girl, and after 2 years she managed to pick up on it—struggle included—and I decided it'd be better to just let her know directly. Her reply was that she had felt the same for a long while and asked what I'd wanna do about it. I'm not allowed to (and I don't wanna discuss why I refuse to rise an opposition) so I just dodged the question and kept it as that. We spoke of it again and it was all pretty good; I was beyond this world with that confession. Now, the reason I'd be like Fleur is because exactly two days after all that she got herself a boyfriend, completely ignoring what we'd said. It was like getting slapped with a spiked glove placed on and honestly...I was really angry, because I was the first she looked for to give the news, and she was so, so happy. I felt horrible.

In a sense I think what Elle did was much better to swallow than what this girl did.
Had she told me AFTER getting her boyfriend I'm pretty sure I would have settled with the fact that "it's all good and done," and there was nothing to do there for myself. But she told me before, without a single hint of what was to come only two days later. To this day she insists I hold such a place in her thoughts as her boyfriend does, but all it does is make me wonder whyyyy she had to claim it was mutual in the first place, and why I refuse to let her go. I guess it's kinda like seeing Elle drag Fleur along to her wedding stuff fully aware of how she feels about her; this girl does the same, only she adds that extra topping of "I love you" every now and then.

Elle probably shouldn't have kissed Fleur, but it's kind of a relief for her as well. The groom got the worst end of the stick, duh, but as for the girls, I think it was an okay way to patch things up. Elle got it out of her chest and goes on her married life, and Fleur is left with the gratification that Elle was aware, that it was returned, and learns the reason why nothing did or could have ever come out of them as a couple. Elle married and if her reason wasn't enough to hold Fleur down from trying then what more than a wedding? That's the epitome of NOPE. The only option left is to move on for both parties.

P.S. This wasn't short at all.

Sorry to hear this. I agree w you, what Elle did to Fleur is to be honest w her best friend & to let her know reality doesn't necessarily end up in "happy endings", but pls move on.

Ratana Satis I am impressed. It was every bit as depressing as I thought when those tags showed up, but I liked the art and the dialogue.
A bit cruel some might say but I think it gets straight to the point, no feelings left unvoiced or ignored and definitely a good ending knowing that Fleur is finally released from the hidden emotions and is ready to move on (or so I hope). All the best to Ratana Satis' lovely art.

After thinking about it for awhile, I have come to this conclusion. Elle was lying to Fleur, her family, her husband, and even herself.

She lied to Fleur by ignoring her feelings even though they were mutual and then confessing after it was it was impossible.

She lied to her family and husband by deceiving them into thinking she was committed to marriage and loved them, only to cheat with Fleur. She says she was doing it because of her family yet she still confesses and kisses Fleur after she was married.

She also lied to herself by thinking this was the right thing to do. In doing all of this she hasn't once been honest with anyone. Going behind her family and husband's backs, crushing Fleur at the time she was most vulnerable, she did absolutely nothing right.

Fleur just so much looks like Mayuri here... Heaven forbid this kinda thing happen to her and Suou somewhere in future, though. I wish Mayuri'd return at least in Winter part of the game, or I'll boycott Innocent Grey.

Sorry, a bit of FLOWERS-related rant there, noone really is at fault that MC reminds me of my waifu this much.

Btw, Fleur--->Flowers
is there a possibility that this visual novel is also known in Thailand or am I just seeing things?

Personally I don't think there's any premeditated cruelty on Elle's part. What I believe is that she didn't plan to do this, but rather upon seeing Fleur's pain at the ceremony and the fact that she clearly hasn't been able to let go decided to take advantage of the circumstance of Fleur being alone to try to make a clean break. She wasn't necessarily successful because she was too honest about her own feelings, but it does end with a mutual agreement to move on from those feelings and a wish for Fleur's happiness with someone else, both of which Fleur seems to accept.

A good decision on Elle's part? Probably not. There were probably lots of better approaches. But this is a very human one, and the story doesn't pretend Fleur is without flaws.

Yeah. I think if we put ourselves in Elle's shoes the right decision becomes far less clear, even in hindsight.

Btw, Fleur--->Flowers
is there a possibility that this visual novel is also known in Thailand or am I just seeing things?

I don't know how famous this visual novel in Thailand, but it might be known in yuri lover community.
BTW in the original work Fleur's name read "Fuse". Don't know the meaning of it thou, might be some kind of circuit thing.

long ago in her Facebook (fb.Ratana Satis) She said she want to write drama story... It's bridesmaid. so sad but It's very sweet

I'm just going to pretend that Fleur became Elle's mistress. Now we have a somewhat happier ending :)

I'm from the same country as the author, and I can actually see the possibility that my relationship may ended up like this story. I surely hope not, but it doesn't help that my gf's family is extremely conservative and we're both the first generation that speak fluent English. Sigh. My gf and I are working hard to build a new life in another country so we could fulfil our parents' expectations, yet have a space that we can be who we truly are.

In my opinion, I feel like Western viewed their children as individuals. The moving out of home at age 18, the emphasis on being independent at a young age. Whereas in Thailand parents view their children as their obligations (no negative connotation intended). The extents that many Thai parents go above and beyond to provide for their kids imply many unspoken expectations for their children to reciprocate.

It's a little unfortunate that some people simplify these life struggles that many LGBT people face as a "boring, overused plot." Perhaps there is some truths as to why these tropes and plots are still popular today, it is still relevant in certain cultures.

It's a little unfortunate that some people simplify these life struggles that many LGBT people face as a "boring, overused plot." Perhaps there is some truths as to why these tropes and plots are still popular today, it is still relevant in certain cultures.

I was thinking about it and my main complain about using those tropes/plots is exactly because they are still relevant. That is why when I read yuri I don't want to see it, because I have enough of it in real life. There is no point to throw it into a fiction too.

I don't mind when some yuri bases its plot around it or make a more realistic take, but because about 90% of them is doing it, it became boring and overused, even if it is exactly how it is in real life. People want to read something light and positive to take their minds from sad reality.

When you make shoujo, you can make tons of different plots, but most yuri feels like they always have to go same mandatory routine. I/we can't confess my/our love cos we are both girls. Then we have to worry about society accepting us. Then there is a high chance that we will be forced to break up because of that. And even if not, there is still a big chance one of us will still make a decision to break up "because it is for the best". See how limiting those tropes are? Sure, you can mix them into the story, but for once don't make them the biggest part of the plot.

For some time now, I'm thinking about different plots for a mangas, and I come to certain realization. Whenever I start thinking about story, I have to make a decision. Do I want realistic take on world or not? If I go with the later, then it is ultra simple. No questioning by main characters "if it's right for 2 girls to be together?". No drama from trying to find their way of existing in prejudiced society. I can just jump right into the plot and write whatever I want. If I want to go with realistic world, I have to take into account what both characters think about same sex couple. How other people reacts. It often slows down plot a lot and take focus from things I actually wanted to show, because I have to take extra time in order to solve "same sex couple is bad" issue first.

I get it that you sometimes want to read something realistic, that take this problems seriously or if you are person that normally isn't affected by them, so you want to experience it to some degree, but there is way too less yuri that actually goes other way and try to show us something knew. This is exactly the reason in a thread I created some time ago, people had hard time giving me manga that actually shows some other problems for lesbian couple than "people don't like it". Shoujo mangas can have all different problems and scenarios, but yuri is always hold back by "we are same sex couple, that is our gimmick".

last edited at Jun 19, 2015 12:26PM

It's a little unfortunate that some people simplify these life struggles that many LGBT people face as a "boring, overused plot." Perhaps there is some truths as to why these tropes and plots are still popular today, it is still relevant in certain cultures.

I was thinking about it and my main complain about using those tropes/plots is exactly because they are still relevant. That is why when I read yuri I don't want to see it, because I have enough of it in real life. There is no point to throw it into a fiction too.

Well, to be fair there's one reason. Possibly the most important one.

Stories are about conflict. They can be all sorts of things, from trying to stop (or cause) the end of the world, down to leaving the milk out overnight and having to regretfully pour it out. What we see here is a conflict that would be easily recognizable in the culture it was created, by the people most likely to be reading it. Which is to say, not us westerners.

It's interesting how I was reading a blog post just the other day about reluctance some writers have to throw conflict in front of their characters, because they're your babies and how can you happily make their lives harder? But if you don't, you end up with a pretty flat story. I can identify though, as a reader. I don't want my babies to get hurt. But it's what a story needs, so what can you do?

I don't mind when some yuri bases its plot around it or make a more realistic take, but because about 90% of them is doing it, it became boring and overused, even if it is exactly how it is in real life. People want to read something light and positive to take their minds from sad reality.

Probably overselling that 90% a teensy bit. If anything, I'd say 90% of yuri is wish fulfilment with little in the way of serious opposition. And yeah, people want to read light and positive stories, but a diet of nothing but popcorn isn't going to give you good nutrition. Sometimes you need to read something with a bit of substance for good literary health. As Jefferson Airplane said, feed your head!

Well, to be fair there's one reason. Possibly the most important one.

Stories are about conflict. They can be all sorts of things, from trying to stop (or cause) the end of the world, down to leaving the milk out overnight and having to regretfully pour it out. What we see here is a conflict that would be easily recognizable in the culture it was created, by the people most likely to be reading it. Which is to say, not us westerners.

That is more or less my point. I'm not against creating conflict, but no one said the conflict (almost) always has to be this issue. Just because it's common issue for them, doesn't mean it has to be common issue in mangas. Also. In my country, maybe not as much as in Japan, but this is pretty much still a big issue, so I get it, even if I'm "westerner" so to speak.

It's interesting how I was reading a blog post just the other day about reluctance some writers have to throw conflict in front of their characters, because they're your babies and how can you happily make their lives harder? But if you don't, you end up with a pretty flat story. I can identify though, as a reader. I don't want my babies to get hurt. But it's what a story needs, so what can you do?

I thought I explained my point well, but maybe I wasn't clear. After reading fair amount of yuri series and oneshots (at least available to me) I got the feeling in most cases, the conflict etc. is drawn from those social issues, and there is far too little stories focusing on different problems/aspects of dating person of same sex. We have a lot stories focused on how it is wrong and you have to hid it. Where are stories like: "me and my girlfriend has different taste in clothes so we argue a lot" or "we argue who should kiss first" or "who should be on top". These are just examples I came up with just now. Not every single story has to revolt around "us being rejected". Can I get some real couple stuff?

Probably overselling that 90% a teensy bit. If anything, I'd say 90% of yuri is wish fulfilment with little in the way of serious opposition.

Yea. That 90% is completely my personal feeling. I don't deny there are a lot of mangas (especially oneshots) who ignores those issues and just focus on fluffy feelings, but compare to them, amount of those stories that don't, feel like crushing majority.

And yeah, people want to read light and positive stories, but a diet of nothing but popcorn isn't going to give you good nutrition. Sometimes you need to read something with a bit of substance for good literary health. As Jefferson Airplane said, feed your head!

I didn't want to dwell into this, since my last post was getting way too long, but I know about it. My friend said it well: "When not everything in your life goes well, you want to read something positive, but sometimes when everything is great and you feel way too happy, you want to read something negative to balance it out." The problem is when you can find negative stories easily, but finding positive ones is hard and takes extra time. I read my share of sad ones, I want some happy now T__T

Sigh, it's really frustrating me, since I already read most of better yuri, and can't find anything new to get immersed into ;/

I guess I have to wait for same sex relationship stigma disappear, before I'll get bigger variety in yuri.

(BTW. don't mind me, I love writing long posts about my opinions, even if no one cares xD")

:(

I have to say that I really hate that kind of people who hides their true feelings just for "dissapoint" anyone... the only one you need to fear to dissapoint is to yourself...

:(
agh

last edited at Aug 16, 2015 2:36PM

I think the bride is a hitch and selfish if she really loved her friend she would have fought harder for their love, but I guess she didn't love her truelly like she said. The friend should find herself a girlfriend and the bride that she can do better and find a better person and love.

ct299415

I think the bride is a hitch and selfish if she really loved her friend she would have fought harder for their love, but I guess she didn't love her truelly like she said. The friend should find herself a girlfriend and the bride that she can do better and find a better person and love.

Or as people have said repeatedly throughout the thread she did it for strong cultural reasons. Whether you agree with that culture or not is a different matter altogether but that doesn't make what she said a lie.

So sad.... hope the girl finds somebody better

I thought Yuri had grown beyond this old typical bullshit of i love you but must marry because my family wants me to. I find the whole thing pathetic and a waste of time.

Yeah, maybe once the culture these stories come from abandons pressure and attitudes like this it might happen. Easy to say as a western fan, where we don't usually have such concerns.

U guys are lucky to have no concerns in the wast .... Culture rule's are a major a bitch , it controls ur life u have NO chose but to act straight ... , u do what society tell u to do .... Ugh Story of ma life... it's a sad fact that some of us have to deal with bullshit like this everyday (T ^ T)

I thought Yuri had grown beyond this old typical bullshit of i love you but must marry because my family wants me to. I find the whole thing pathetic and a waste of time.

Yeah, maybe once the culture these stories come from abandons pressure and attitudes like this it might happen. Easy to say as a western fan, where we don't usually have such concerns.

U guys are lucky to have no concerns in the wast .... Culture rule's are a major a bitch , it controls ur life u have NO chose but to act straight ... , u do what society tell u to do .... Ugh Story of ma life... it's a sad fact that some of us have to deal with bullshit like this everyday (T ^ T)

imho, nonsense! cultures change and it is both you and the people around you that help shape and change cultures. all that said, i understand that sometimes you must do what you must do to be safe, but I hope you never forget nor lose the person you are by hiding behind a mask.

but I hope you never forget nor lose the person you are by hiding behind a mask.

I cried a little bit.