Let's see

All Citrus Cliche's
Cliche #1: All girls school

Is easier to count how many series don't happen on an All Girls School. So is hardly a strike against Citrus.

Cliche #2: Love Triangles ( lots of them )

Lots of them? The only actual Love triangle in the series was that of Vice Prez/Mei/Yuzu and that one was solved a long time ago. Sarah's arc wasn't a proper love triangle because she didn't knew Yuzu was pinning for Mei and as soon as she knew, she step aside.

Cliche #3: Arranged boyfriend

And it was solved in the chapter that was introduced with no bigger impact on the story

Cliche #4: Senpai

See point one

Cliche #5: IM NOT READY FOR SEX YET !

Is more like "She's throwing away her first time too easy.I want it to be something special"

Cliche #6: I read yuri manga...within a yuri manga, BUT ITS NOT LIKE IM GAY OR ANYTHING !

Yuzu has never been concerned by that. Until the latest chapter that is.

Cliche #7: Hmm, where have I seen this art style before ?

How the hell is that a cliche?

I think it's still popular because it was quite good in the beggning and now people keep on reading it anyway. But definitely not that hype it had 2 years ago.

Huh, I honestly like the latest chapters way more than the pre-hook-up ones. And I don't think I'm the only one.

Lots of them? The only actual Love triangle in the series was that of Vice Prez/Mei/Yuzu and that one was solved a long time ago. Sarah's arc wasn't a proper love triangle because she didn't knew Yuzu was pinning for Mei and as soon as she knew, she step aside.

Don't forget Matsuri. :þ Although I sure would like to forget her.

Also, what do people mean by "mainstream"? That word confuses me when it comes to such a niche category as Yuri − and especially a niche magazine like Yuri-hime… It's like calling a music "mainstream vegetarian progressive grindcore".

last edited at Sep 28, 2016 8:25AM

Oh I didn't forget about Matsuri but she was just trying to stir some shit up for the kicks and very quickly she settled down for the threesome option.

Don't forget Matsuri. :þ Although I sure would like to forget her.

Matsuri x Harumin ftw!

Ngl tho there were a lot of "rivals" (Momokino, Matsuri, Sara), for both Yuzu and Mei but I didn't mind, just cus it's a cliche doesn't make it bad :O I quite enjoyed Matsuri's arc
Besides, in Lily Love, you have Ploy and Ice, that's still 2, and if you, SF, like it, that's fine too. Idc about LL, you dont care about Citrus, that's fine, but it's just plain being in denial if you shit on Citrus for x things, and praise LL, but like, they're the same cliches? What I've come to understand is that we both respectably prefer one series' execution of those plot points better than the other, which is ofc, fine

Lyendith, even if yuri is not as popular of a genre, it can still have stuff that are like, popular within its own fandom ofc. "Mainstream yuri" sounds like an oxymore but like, even within something niche, within the fandom, there can be more overrated things

in Lily Love, you have Ploy and Ice, that's still 2, and if you, SF, like it, that's fine too. Idc about LL, you dont care about Citrus, that's fine, but it's just plain being in denial if you shit on Citrus for x things, and praise LL, but like, they're the same cliches? What I've come to understand is that we both respectably prefer one series' execution of those plot points better than the other, which is ofc, fine

Yes, I think Lily Love's plot/drama/etc was better executed then Citrus's. But that doesn't make me "In denial", But keep believing that Faust, But who knows, YOU may be the one thats in denial :P.

last edited at Sep 28, 2016 8:30PM

One is a shoddy soap opera, and the other is a shoddy by-the-numbers romance.
Both of the compared mangas are bad.

I win.

^ YOUR THE BEST, AROUND, NOTHING EVER GONNA BRING YA DOWN ! :D

No, I know Citrus is low key trash, I just think (in my opinion) that LL is straight up high key trash, and worse, it's really boring. I think you're in denial because you honestly think LL's "plot" is good. There's no real plot tbh. They get together early on, and everything that happens after is legit "Donut, are you sure tho"

No, I know Citrus is low key trash, I just think (in my opinion) that LL is straight up high key trash, and worse, it's really boring. I think you're in denial because you honestly think LL's "plot" is good. There's no real plot tbh. They get together early on, and everything that happens after is legit "Donut, are you sure tho"

THIS. I actually like "Citrus", and enjoy it immensely, but it has some rather glaring flaws, that have been brought up so many times already, there is no point in listing them yet again. My personal favourite is the constant barrage of new characters.
"Lily Love", on the other hand, was simply 'meh'. Could not hold my interest. (I would rather read FF, and that shit absolutely enrages me.)

last edited at Sep 28, 2016 8:24PM

Damn, how can people dare to compare this shit with GF. I can agree that yeah, GF is overrrated, but that doesn't mean it's bad. It's a good story. LL and Citrus are the same trash though. Both have terribly forced drama. Citrus doesn't have characters, just antagonists that are used to break Yuzu and Mei apart and at the end of the day make them closer. The teacher, the gramps, the dad, the girl with the huge eyebrows, Matsuri, the sisters, Harumi's sister , the student council election and now Yuzu's homophobic friends. It repeats the same formula "introduce a character, make them cause some shit, resolve the problem , forget about the character". It was tolerable maybe until chapter 8, then Matsuri and the sisters made me realise that crappy formula. I dropped it many chapters ago, I still find reviews in facebook though.
LL has Ploy, Ploy's ex boyfriend , the father , the trip to another country... anyways, I find both series poorly written and boring for other reasons as well. Objectively speaking, they really lack quality.
However, people are free to like whatever they want. If they love this series or LL, let them be. Yuri series are so limited people sometimes stick to what they have or know. I still remember when I liked Strawberry Panic years ago lol. The only thing that enrages me is the fact that Citrus has a big fandom, while other amazing yuri mangas are totally unknown by most people.

last edited at Oct 2, 2016 3:03AM

Well, that's why I buy the volumes; in the hope that it will encourage publishers to import less well known but better yuri series.

What is this Ghost chapter?

Well, that "ghost chapter" was hilarious anyway. Mei: "I'll cherish it"... yeah right...

Yuri is all the same you guys... literally every story is similiar.

Edit: That's why I'm getting tired of it.

last edited at Oct 2, 2016 2:03PM

melevas posted:

Yuri is all the same you guys... literally every story is similiar.

Edit: That's why I'm getting tired of it.

The biggest issue with yuri is that they recycle the same settings. School girls have been done to death, and while there are occasionally some nice twists within the school girl genre.. it's not enough to make up for the fact that school girl still reigns supreme in yuri. Especially when you consider that a lot of the yuri we get is one-shots.. doing a story in a school setting is quick and easy. It takes more work to make something unique and interesting like sci-fi, or fantasy..

The last few yuri anime released have been school girl as well, but some had good appeals. Yuri Kuma took a fantasy setting about bears, and Akuma No Riddle was about girls trying to kill each other. If people wanna do more school girl yuri, we need more interesting stuff like that. (I'm also not counting valkyrie drive mermaid. i didn't watch it because it looked like a male-gaze fanservice nightmare)

We need more adult yuri, college yuri, fantasy yuri.. anything that isn't just school girls. It's heart-breaking looking at amazing yuri series like Flower Flower, which had gorgeous art and enjoyable characters with an interesting story that was slowly building up.. only for it to never get finished. But we get an endless supply of school girl yuri. School girl series are the mcdonalds of yuri... cheap and easy.. we need more quality food.

School settings are a staple of manga and anime in general, but since yuri is such a small niche we notice it a lot more, I think. Of course for yuri, once you get out of a school environment it becomes really hard to figleaf it as Class S any more.

Not disagreeing on the need for a lot more variety and taking the gay girl characters more seriously though.

The biggest issue with yuri is that they recycle the same settings. School girls have been done to death, and while there are occasionally some nice twists within the school girl genre.. it's not enough to make up for the fact that school girl still reigns supreme in yuri. Especially when you consider that a lot of the yuri we get is one-shots.. doing a story in a school setting is quick and easy. It takes more work to make something unique and interesting like sci-fi, or fantasy..

The last few yuri anime released have been school girl as well, but some had good appeals. Yuri Kuma took a fantasy setting about bears, and Akuma No Riddle was about girls trying to kill each other. If people wanna do more school girl yuri, we need more interesting stuff like that. (I'm also not counting valkyrie drive mermaid. i didn't watch it because it looked like a male-gaze fanservice nightmare)

We need more adult yuri, college yuri, fantasy yuri.. anything that isn't just school girls. It's heart-breaking looking at amazing yuri series like Flower Flower, which had gorgeous art and enjoyable characters with an interesting story that was slowly building up.. only for it to never get finished. But we get an endless supply of school girl yuri. School girl series are the mcdonalds of yuri... cheap and easy.. we need more quality food.

I think the biggest problem with the genre, what makes it rather weak, Is the recycling of the plotlines, and not its settings. Yuri is kinda of a subgenre of romance, BUT yuri sticks to even less of the typical pitholes of romance you can find in the usual Het stuff.

Making them college/adult settings really doesn't change much other than the context, general plotlines remain the same every single time.

Its always tension/drama with a third wheel/love triangle/or someone trying to stop them, and other than that there is the gay drama we've seen over and over and over. Read one yuri, and you've basically read every yuri ever.

that aside, I also don't see a lot of the writing to be any good... but well, thats kinda the case with every manga/anime and not just yuri tho...

last edited at Oct 2, 2016 4:09PM

The biggest issue with yuri is that they recycle the same settings. School girls have been done to death, and while there are occasionally some nice twists within the school girl genre.. it's not enough to make up for the fact that school girl still reigns supreme in yuri. Especially when you consider that a lot of the yuri we get is one-shots.. doing a story in a school setting is quick and easy. It takes more work to make something unique and interesting like sci-fi, or fantasy..

The last few yuri anime released have been school girl as well, but some had good appeals. Yuri Kuma took a fantasy setting about bears, and Akuma No Riddle was about girls trying to kill each other. If people wanna do more school girl yuri, we need more interesting stuff like that. (I'm also not counting valkyrie drive mermaid. i didn't watch it because it looked like a male-gaze fanservice nightmare)

We need more adult yuri, college yuri, fantasy yuri.. anything that isn't just school girls. It's heart-breaking looking at amazing yuri series like Flower Flower, which had gorgeous art and enjoyable characters with an interesting story that was slowly building up.. only for it to never get finished. But we get an endless supply of school girl yuri. School girl series are the mcdonalds of yuri... cheap and easy.. we need more quality food.

I think the biggest problem with the genre, what makes it rather weak, Is the recycling of the plotlines, and not its settings. Yuri is kinda of a subgenre of romance, BUT yuri sticks to even less of the typical pitholes of romance you can find in the usual Het stuff.

Making them college/adult settings really doesn't change much other than the context, general plotlines remain the same every single time.

Its always tension/drama with a third wheel/love triangle/or someone trying to stop them, and other than that there is the gay drama we've seen over and over and over. Read one yuri, and you've basically read every yuri ever.

that aside, I also don't see a lot of the writing to be any good... but well, thats kinda the case with every manga/anime and not just yuri tho...

True but lately the writing has felt even less genuine for yuri stories, that's why Hibike Euphonium blew up so much even though it's bait. If we had more stories like that with fleshed out characters that feel real and relatable narrative, we'd have things to actually look forward to.

that's why Hibike Euphonium blew up so much even though it's bait. If we had more stories like that with fleshed out characters that feel real and relatable narrative, we'd have things to actually look forward to.

Hibike Euphonium is just shitty bait that dicks us over. It doesn't even work as subtext because it leads us to believe that they might get together, but they don't. Subtext is stuff like "Love live" and "A room for two". Subtext is when the characters are very close friends.

last edited at Oct 2, 2016 4:40PM

that's why Hibike Euphonium blew up so much even though it's bait. If we had more stories like that with fleshed out characters that feel real and relatable narrative, we'd have things to actually look forward to.

Hibike Euphonium is just shitty bait that dicks us over. It doesn't even work as subtext because it leads us to believe that they might get together, but they don't. Subtext is stuff like "Love live" and "A room for two". Subtext is when the characters are very close friends.

I never said it's subtext. It's their relationship in general that I'm talking about.

Recycling settings and/or stories is something that is present on every form of media regardless the genre. For me, what makes a story standout is the sum of its parts: the characterization, the dynamics, the setting, the plot, the art/acting/voice acting, animation and more.

Of course it would be nice to have authors willing to take risks and try new things but at the same time I won't hold up against them if they're trying to find a place in an increasingly difficult market, making a manga is a job after all.

That said, I don't know why people continues to rag on Citrus as if Saburota would've lied to them about the nature of this series. From page one it was clear what kind of story was this meant to be and if you don't like it then, why continue to waste effort and getting upset about it now?

I'm also not counting valkyrie drive mermaid. i didn't watch it because it looked like a male-gaze fanservice nightmare

I honestly find pretty contradictory the way you claim to want more yuri that goes beyond the regular norms of the genre when you're so quick to dismiss something that did exactly that simply because it didn't fit your preconceptions about what an innovative yuri had to be.

VDM is not perfect by any means but is pretty earnest on what it is and what it wants to do and does't shy away from the yuri elements, making it a pretty memorable experience whether your liked it or not.

Anyways, the ghost chapter was a great read. I will never get tired of Mei deadpanning all of Yuzu's antics.

is this series still ongoing? Haven't seen any update for ages.

I will never get tired of Mei deadpanning all of Yuzu's antics.

Huh, were completely different people. Mei deadpanning all of Yuzu's antics got old. VERY QUICKLY. But eh, Thats just my Opinion.

last edited at Oct 2, 2016 5:27PM