I have no earthly idea what a Yuriten is, but that's some fine art.
Yuu reaaaally loves Touko's hair. and so do I

I was struck by the continuation of the "Yuu's physical affection can only be shown unbeknownst to the object thereof" trope.

Here's hoping we get a change in that dynamic sooner rather than later.

The poster for this year's Yuriten, courtesy of Nakatani-sensei. =]

yuriten

Please tell me that those two on the upper part of that picture are the MC's voice actresses...

last edited at Mar 17, 2019 3:24PM by Nezchan

@BugDevil Yuriten is a yearly yuri exposition created in 2016.

^ Doesn't seem like it.

^ Doesn't seem like it.

Damn >.<

Here's hoping we get a change in that dynamic sooner rather than later.

We're at the turning point friend.

@BugDevil Yuriten is a yearly yuri exposition created in 2016.

Sounds like Valhalla.

Damn >.<

Why are you still using spoiler bars? You do know that it doesn't change anything, right?

Here's hoping we get a change in that dynamic sooner rather than later.

We're at the turning point friend.

@BugDevil Yuriten is a yearly yuri exposition created in 2016.

Sounds like Valhalla.

Damn >.<

Why are you still using spoiler bars? You do know that it doesn't change anything, right?

Eh... I know I had some reason to use them, but since I just recently woke up, I can't remember the reason...

I'm not sure if I would even be mad if one of them got into a traffic accident in their hurry. Fingers crossed for a happy ending regardless.

last edited at Mar 20, 2019 5:07PM

I'm not sure if I would even be mad if one of them got into a traffic accident in their hurry. Fingers crossed for a happy ending regardless.

Regarding the ending you don't have to worry, author confirmed it in one of the interviews.

Remind me, which day of April is chapter 40 (I know it's somewhere in the latter half, I just don't know exactly).

27th; you can check it yourself, the date is on the last page of the latest chapter.

27th;

Thank you

you can check it yourself, the date is on the last page of the latest chapter.

Ah, really? I forgot that... or I even maybe failed to notice it in the first place.

Heavensrun posted:

But seriously, my goal is just to understand the work and see if I can figure out where it's going to go in the future.

I meant more that without even realizing it, you might be wasting time analyzing something that isn't even accurate. I do understand that it's implausible to expect everyone to be able to just read original, so average reader pretty much have no other option than just trusting translation is more or less accurate. There's nothing wrong with theory crafting etc. It's just when people seriously argue about tenses, specific wording or other stuff like that, without even knowing how close to original it is, when you realize how silly it can get. Especially when you learn something was mistranslated.

Interesting. I don't have the raws, so this is speculation based on what I know about Japanese, but I suspect they just got the subject association mixed up on the first sentence ("why did I say that", as opposed to "why did she say that"). which gives a different implied meaning to the accusation of unfairness. In the former, Touko's being unfair because she cornered Yuu in a lie, in the latter, Touko is being unfair because she -is- lying, so "You liar" is a fair translation in that context. The first mistake begets the second. TLDR: It's probably an honest mistake.

That's interesting take on it, but sadly it's very explicit. Touko never uses phrase "I don't mind". So when on last page the phrase is said "なんで　構わないなんて言っちゃったんだろう", "(I) wonder　why did (I) say something like "(I) don't mind"?", it's very clear it's referring to what Yuu was saying. Also "chau" is form meaning doing something accidentally, so she's referring to how she said it without really thinking it through. If it really was just a genuine mistake, it would still be bad, but at least I could understand it. As it stands, it really just feel like trying to write something that translator thought sounded better than what was actually said. Instead of Yuu getting annoyed that Touko is putting her in unfair situation, it comes off as her seeing through Touko's facade and getting annoyed at her for just not being honest with herself, which changes their entire relationship and Yuu's perception of Touko. It's exactly the thing I talked above, with how you could base your entire interpretation of work and understanding of characters on that line, without realizing it's nowhere near close to what was actually said and doesn't reflect on actual work at all. Also people pointed out how phrase "it's unfair" is very important and is said often by both Yuu and Sayaka, so removing it, removes that connection. And as I said before, from what I glanced over just in this dialogue alone, I noticed few more questionable choices.

The Seven Seas English translation is pretty close to the one on the website here, so I'm guessing this is some other release. is it also in English?

It's our polish translation. I translated it to english, so we can have this conversation.

Not that I think you were that serious with that line

I wasn't. It was Bleach reference. I was wondering if anyone will get it.

I want to throttle your entire school faculty.

It wasn't just my school though. That's how our entire system of education works. "Polish" lessons boil down to reading classic books, poetry etc. and learning how to analyze them. On surface it doesn't seem that bad. Learning different themes, motives, influences and such and then trying to apply that knowledge to look for it in different texts and analyze them. The issue is the reason it's that way. At the end of high school, after you already graduated, everyone in entire country takes universal "tests of maturity" supposedly showing that you gained enough knowledge to become a adult. When you apply to university, scores on those tests are what dictates whatever you'll get in or not. Your grades from high school are secondary. Some universities do have their own entrance exams, but those maturity tests still matter. Because Polish is mandatory (along with math), no matter which degree you pick, it's always taken into account, so it's in your best interest to do well.

There are two parts. Reading with comprehension and either you have 1 text to analyze or 2 to compare along with some kind of thesis which you need to base your essay around. Of course since those exams are supposed to objectively value your knowledge, they need a reliable way to judge your performance. That's why when people from ministry of eduction or whoever does it, sit down to make those tests, they make a "key" based on which they judge your work. You get points for following elements they included in it, so you can't just write whatever but need to aim to fit specifically into what they considered important. So in order to get a good score, you have to analyze it exactly the way they analyzed it and expect you to analyze it.

We have similar final tests for elementary and middle school, but they're taken much less seriously. For elementary they're pretty much a formality, since you're guarantee to get into middle school in your area and score for middle school doesn't really matter, since you're admitted to high school mostly based on your grades. Both had a reading with comprehension portion and write a short story/essay portion. I'm not sure how exactly they were checking it, since we were never taught to follow any key or anything like that. I basically wrote what came to mind and passed it with almost perfect score. And that is how it should work, since the point of it (I thought) was to express yourself and present your take on it. Things changed once we got into high school. It kinda already was case before, but because there's really nothing to do in Polish lessons, entire 3 years we just spend preparing for final exams. So all our tests were just reading with comprehension and testing our knowledge about books we were required to read. Every now and then we would write trial versions of maturity test. During third year, that was basically all we did. And through all those 3 years, our teacher was determinate to teach us exactly how to write according to key and what to look for, because examiners will judge us solely based on that. That's why I said our school system burnt me for poetry and any analysis. Because all we were ever taught is that there's only 1 right way to analyze it and we had to get it right.

As a funny side story, of course we also use our books and famous poetry. Some of author's of those are still alive. They actually had 3 of them doing those tests and 2 out of them failed, while 1 passed barely. To make it even worse, one of those who failed was analyzing his own essay and he supposedly "got it wrong".

As a funny side story, of course we also use our books and famous poetry. Some of author's of those are still alive. They actually had 3 of them doing those tests and 2 out of them failed, while 1 passed barely. To make it even worse, one of those who failed was analyzing his own essay and he supposedly "got it wrong".

Those 3 guys:
Excuse me, what the fuck?

last edited at Mar 22, 2019 1:05PM

I'd just like to point out the fact that chapter 24, page 26, it'd rather be "It's time to change." than "It's time to change trains.". Consider it a pun or not, even in the anime, Koito is telling Nanami directly "It's time to change" without awakening her.
Maybe it has already been pointed out, but I didn't read every single comment :)

Btw, very good manga <3

last edited at Mar 30, 2019 12:07PM

I'd just like to point out the fact that chapter 24, page 26, it'd rather be "It's time to change." than "It's time to change trains.". Consider it a pun or not, even in the anime, Koito is telling Nanami directly "It's time to change" without awakening her.
Maybe it has already been pointed out, but I didn't read every single comment :)

Interesting. I didn't know that

Btw, very good manga <3

The best, IMO.

It wasn't just my school though. That's how our entire system of education works. "Polish" lessons boil down to reading classic books, poetry etc. and learning how to analyze them. On surface it doesn't seem that bad. Learning different themes, motives, influences and such and then trying to apply that knowledge to look for it in different texts and analyze them. The issue is the reason it's that way. At the end of high school, after you already graduated, everyone in entire country takes universal "tests of maturity" supposedly showing that you gained enough knowledge to become a adult. When you apply to university, scores on those tests are what dictates whatever you'll get in or not. Your grades from high school are secondary. Some universities do have their own entrance exams, but those maturity tests still matter. Because Polish is mandatory (along with math), no matter which degree you pick, it's always taken into account, so it's in your best interest to do well.

There are two parts. Reading with comprehension and either you have 1 text to analyze or 2 to compare along with some kind of thesis which you need to base your essay around. Of course since those exams are supposed to objectively value your knowledge, they need a reliable way to judge your performance. That's why when people from ministry of eduction or whoever does it, sit down to make those tests, they make a "key" based on which they judge your work. You get points for following elements they included in it, so you can't just write whatever but need to aim to fit specifically into what they considered important. So in order to get a good score, you have to analyze it exactly the way they analyzed it and expect you to analyze it.

We have similar final tests for elementary and middle school, but they're taken much less seriously. For elementary they're pretty much a formality, since you're guarantee to get into middle school in your area and score for middle school doesn't really matter, since you're admitted to high school mostly based on your grades. Both had a reading with comprehension portion and write a short story/essay portion. I'm not sure how exactly they were checking it, since we were never taught to follow any key or anything like that. I basically wrote what came to mind and passed it with almost perfect score. And that is how it should work, since the point of it (I thought) was to express yourself and present your take on it. Things changed once we got into high school. It kinda already was case before, but because there's really nothing to do in Polish lessons, entire 3 years we just spend preparing for final exams. So all our tests were just reading with comprehension and testing our knowledge about books we were required to read. Every now and then we would write trial versions of maturity test. During third year, that was basically all we did. And through all those 3 years, our teacher was determinate to teach us exactly how to write according to key and what to look for, because examiners will judge us solely based on that. That's why I said our school system burnt me for poetry and any analysis. Because all we were ever taught is that there's only 1 right way to analyze it and we had to get it right.

As a funny side story, of course we also use our books and famous poetry. Some of author's of those are still alive. They actually had 3 of them doing those tests and 2 out of them failed, while 1 passed barely. To make it even worse, one of those who failed was analyzing his own essay and he supposedly "got it wrong".

Good Lord. I have Asperger's, so having to analyse stuff like "the author's intent" would have ruined me in school. I've learned how to read people better after living the sweet sweet adult life for a while, but back in my school days, ugh, I can't even imagine.

“Authorial intention” is one of the most vexed questions in literary interpretation, and most of what can be known about such intentions needs to be inferred from other contexts anyway.

It also doesn’t help that one of the most complete explanations we have in English of how a writer composed a major literary work and exactly what they were thinking at each step of the process is by Edgar Allan Poe, who would have us believe that at one point the title character of “The Raven” could have been a parrot.

At which point many readers say, “Uhhh, OK . . . if you say say so,” while backing carefully away.

“Authorial intention” is one of the most vexed questions in literary interpretation, and most of what can be known about such intentions needs to be inferred from other contexts anyway.

It also doesn’t help that one of the most complete explanations we have in English of how a writer composed a major literary work and exactly what they were thinking at each step of the process is by Edgar Allan Poe, who would have us believe that at one point the title character of “The Raven” could have been a parrot.

At which point many readers say, “Uhhh, OK . . . if you say say so,” while backing carefully away.

Having written stories myself, I can entirely believe this anecdote.

“Authorial intention” is one of the most vexed questions in literary interpretation, and most of what can be known about such intentions needs to be inferred from other contexts anyway.

It also doesn’t help that one of the most complete explanations we have in English of how a writer composed a major literary work and exactly what they were thinking at each step of the process is by Edgar Allan Poe, who would have us believe that at one point the title character of “The Raven” could have been a parrot.

At which point many readers say, “Uhhh, OK . . . if you say say so,” while backing carefully away.

Having written stories myself, I can entirely believe this anecdote.

“Quoth the parrot, ‘ . . . ‘ Um, OK, what does the parrot quoth? Needs to be something witchy that goes with a “beautiful dead woman” theme . . . ‘Polly want a lover,’ maybe? Nah, meter’s all wrong. And it needs to be a drab parrot, not too colorful . . . Hey, that’s it—a mynah bird!
‘Quoth the mynah . . .’ Then change “Lenore” to “Dinah”? Ugh, I could use a pick-me-up . . . now where’d I put that laudanum?”

Drive the Polish literature teachers batty, that would. Lol

“Authorial intention” is one of the most vexed questions in literary interpretation, and most of what can be known about such intentions needs to be inferred from other contexts anyway.

It also doesn’t help that one of the most complete explanations we have in English of how a writer composed a major literary work and exactly what they were thinking at each step of the process is by Edgar Allan Poe, who would have us believe that at one point the title character of “The Raven” could have been a parrot.

At which point many readers say, “Uhhh, OK . . . if you say say so,” while backing carefully away.

Having written stories myself, I can entirely believe this anecdote.

“Quoth the parrot, ‘ . . . ‘ Um, OK, what does the parrot quoth? Needs to be something witchy that goes with a “beautiful dead woman” theme . . . ‘Polly want a lover,’ maybe? Nah, meter’s all wrong. And it needs to be a drab parrot, not too colorful . . . Hey, that’s it—a mynah bird!
‘Quoth the mynah . . .’ Then change “Lenore” to “Dinah”? Ugh, I could use a pick-me-up . . . now where’d I put that laudanum?”

Drive the Polish literature teachers batty, that would. Lol

Eh, the idea of the original idea barely resembling the final strikes pretty close to home, I think. You have an initial idea, and sometimes that can be pretty awful, and then you stick with it and it kinda turns into something.

Eh, the idea of the original idea barely resembling the final strikes pretty close to home, I think. You have an initial idea, and sometimes that can be pretty awful, and then you stick with it and it kinda turns into something.

Well, sure—in the The Lord of the Rings, the character of Strider was originally a hobbit in wooden shoes named Trotter. But the point for our purposes here is that authorial intention can be pretty elusive even when the author is willing to say (which they notoriously rarely are), and sometimes the author is only marginally more qualified to interpret their own work than anybody else.

last edited at Mar 30, 2019 11:37PM

Eh, the idea of the original idea barely resembling the final strikes pretty close to home, I think. You have an initial idea, and sometimes that can be pretty awful, and then you stick with it and it kinda turns into something.

Well, sure—in the The Lord of the Rings, the character of Strider was originally a hobbit in wooden shoes named Trotter. But the point for our purposes here is that authorial intention can be pretty elusive even when the author is willing to say (which they notoriously rarely are), and sometimes the author is only marginally more qualified to interpret their own work than anybody else.

Yeah, I get that. Plus, sometimes in more complex works the author may set up perfectly valid symbolism without really being aware of it themselves. Or alternatively, do it on purpose but forget to bring up those nuances when speaking about them later on. There's stuff that's perfectly clear and natural when you're in the zone that you might not spare much thought to when you're out of that writer's trance and thus can't really communicate it in interviews and such.

To think I'd be the one to tell others to go to Dynasty Café one day... To say it's mindblowing would be a gross understatement, given that, more often than not, when I saw people telling other people to go to Dynasty Café, the "other people" in question was me.
Yet, here we are. This conversation, while technically related to YagaKimi, seems to me to be related to literature, literary analysis and literary criticism in general, which, I think, means it should go to Dynasty Café instead (?).
Trust me, the irony and hypocrisy of this post was evident to me from the very beginning, but I did it anyways...

last edited at Mar 31, 2019 9:59AM

Eh, the idea of the original idea barely resembling the final strikes pretty close to home, I think. You have an initial idea, and sometimes that can be pretty awful, and then you stick with it and it kinda turns into something.

Well, sure—in the The Lord of the Rings, the character of Strider was originally a hobbit in wooden shoes named Trotter. But the point for our purposes here is that authorial intention can be pretty elusive even when the author is willing to say (which they notoriously rarely are), and sometimes the author is only marginally more qualified to interpret their own work than anybody else.

Exactly right. Sometimes the artist has no idea what his/her art means. Art is not created by formula no matter how hard Hollywood tries.

These are very interesting characters. The MC’s male friend is a fresh type of asexual character who’s a keen observer of romance and people in general. His perspective of others is interesting as well, it feels like he’s part of the audience for this manga. The MC is also very different from your typical yuri heroine set, and everyone here feels and talks like actual human beings. I can see why this gets so much love.