chapter 7：bought her a smartphone and let her find a part-time job as her wish. Knowing there's no possibility she would get hired. By doing this, Aya will acknowledge she can't live without her now.)

Except Aya now has a part-time job.

This whole post seems to be a lot of (at best) weakly justified inferences about Koto’s motivations.

I don't feel like are reading the same manga...

I'm glad we can have some serious discussions of this.

I think Koto just had a strong PTSD because of Aya's disappearance and has difficulties whenever she cannot control the situation.

Agreed. That's why she gives me the impression that she would do whatever it takes to control it.

Yet, she has never hinder Aya in any way. She lodge her, pay for her expenses and don't ask much in return. She does have issues to be addressed for sure, and she does have a problem expressing herself. I bet that she was so closed off for many years, that even Aya's reappearance was not enough to trigger her coming out of her shell. And it's totally logic in a way. Aya disappeared magically, why wouldn't she disappeared again the same way?

Maby saying her manipulator is too harsh.
Koto just like using some trick to got what her wants.
I hope it wouldn't be rude if l ask you this two question :
1.Do you think Koto know how Erika feels about her?
2.Would Koto let Aya go for her own good?

Same goes for Erika. Her internal dialogue is quite harsh, but regardless of what she is thinking, her actions speaks for herself and she is giving good advice and helping Aya. I do think when cares about her, but she is conflicted about the fact that Koto can't let her go. Her jealousy is probably triggering those bad though, but in all honesty, she is being a good friends and is doing more good than what her internal dialogue is suggesting.

I don't ever consider Erika is a bad person, not even once. If anything, she is the one who has the kindest spirit out of the three. She sincerely sees Aya as a friend. So that's the main reason why she also tortured by her "selfish" thought imo.

I'm not saying those characters are perfects, far from that. But I feel like the story is more about Erika and Koto resolving their personal issues, rather than it is about Aya finding her way. She is honestly doing fine and is the more adult of the three...

Tbh I wouldn't be interested at the beginning if those characters are perfect…

But I feel like the story is more about Erika and Koto resolving their personal issues, rather than it is about Aya finding her way. She is honestly doing fine and is the more adult of the three...

I don't know if I would call Aya "more adult" than Erika, but she's certainly been doing better coping with her problems than Koto with her issues.

Except Aya now has a part-time job.

That just proves things are not going well as
Koto's plan.

This whole post seems to be a lot of (at best) weakly justified inferences about Koto’s motivations.

Right, you just choose to forget she fucking pull a long face after Aya got a job interview invited by Kumagaya in chapter 7.
Do you think Koto wouldn't "suggest" Aya to quit the job？

last edited at Mar 12, 2024 11:12AM

Except Aya now has a part-time job.

That just proves things are not going well as
Koto's plan.

This assumes that Koto actually has a plan for Aya to fail, an assertion for which you have presented zero evidence except for a very ambiguous, almost blank expression on this page:

https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/how_to_break_a_triangle_ch07#22

This whole post seems to be a lot of (at best) weakly justified inferences about Koto’s motivations.

Right, you just choose to forget she fucking pull a long face after Aya got a job interview invited by Kumagaya in chapter 7.

That alleged "long face" could just as well be a reaction to Aya using the phrase "another kid around my age," which makes Koto worried about the distance between the two of them.

Do you think Koto wouldn't "suggest" Aya to quit the job?

I don't know what Koto would or wouldn't do about that--I'm not a mind-reader or a fortune teller.

Do you think Koto wouldn't "suggest" Aya to quit the job?

I don't know what Koto would or wouldn't do about that--I'm not a mind-reader or a fortune teller.

It's not like I hate your opinions just because you disagreed with me.
The next chapter might reveal this. Whether my assumption is right or wrong, we'll see.

Do you think Koto wouldn't "suggest" Aya to quit the job?

I don't know what Koto would or wouldn't do about that--I'm not a mind-reader or a fortune teller.

It's not like I hate your opinions just because you disagreed with me.
The next chapter might reveal this. Whether my assumption is right or wrong, we'll see.

I'm mostly talking about the use of evidence. So far we have been shown almost nothing of Koto's interior present-day thoughts, in contrast to both Aya and Erika, where we're given substantial sequences of what they're thinking and feeling about the overall situation. (The extensive thoughts that appear as captions rather than in thought balloons are especially important for understanding those characters and their current state of mind and motivations. But we get very little of that from Koto's POV.)

Sure, there may be some potentially problematic issues for the future that we can infer from Koto's speech and actions--her inability to move on from initially losing Aya, her neediness in the present, etc. But the argument was that Koto is a "yandere manipulator" (or trickster) who has now suddenly changed from when Aya first returned, and I simply don't see any evidence for that.

last edited at Mar 12, 2024 1:08PM

Right, you just choose to forget she fucking pull a long face after Aya got a job interview invited by Kumagaya in chapter 7.
Do you think Koto wouldn't "suggest" Aya to quit the job？

Well, she definitely suggested that she shouldn't try to get that job (and acted like she was jealous of Kumagaya and Aya's newfound closeness). I'd say it's a safe bet to say that she will try, in the future, to make her quit... especially when she finds that there's a super dishy tsundere boy working with her, and he has an interest in her!

We keep discovering new things about the mcs every chapter. I'd never had suspected that Erika's place was a messy pigsty. And I certainly wasn't expecting Aya to be a clean freak who just can't let a messy room alone and won't stop until she has made it spotless. Koto is the only one with no surprises, she's a one-track-minded person whose whole life revolves (and has done so for the past 7 years) around Aya. And I'm kinda starting to agree with those who think it's, like, a li'l bit cringe.

she definitely suggested that she shouldn't try to get that job

Is it good for a 14 year old to go to work?

rainbow8 posted:

she definitely suggested that she shouldn't try to get that job

Is it good for a 14 year old to go to work?

Koto has just PTSD from previous Aya's disappearance.

Koto isn't Aya's mother. It's obvious that she doesn't want to be a burden to Koto so she insisted on finding a job, to contribute.

Especially since in the latest chapter, she states that being alone at home feels stifling. It's not healthy either to stay cooped up in the room of a college student all day.

Imagine being a 14yo with no family or friends. She'd end up homeless or in some prostitution ring.

She probably needs to resume her education, but I suppose it's not that easy.

last edited at Mar 12, 2024 4:55PM

I kinda can’t wait to see what Erika is going to do next Tanabata.

Oh my god, I hadn't considered this. She's a dangerous one lol

I kinda can’t wait to see what Erika is going to do next Tanabata.

Oh my god, I hadn't considered this.

You really need to ask?

She's going to look for Orihime and Hikoboshi and kick their asses.

I lol'ed at Aya who tries to act all adult like, and even asks Erika for lessons on how to seduce a romantic partner into having sex... and then it turns out that even a hug is too much for her.

And that hug was like, barely a hug in my book.

If Koto had said "Now that we have confirmed our feelings, let's have some French kisses and sixty-nines and tribbing!" I think Aya would have nosebleeded a geyser and died.

There are a few authors out there who would totally draw a woman of twenty-something and a kid of fourteen having French kisses and sixty-nines and tribbing. They would be very happy to draw it. In extreme detail!

But Kabocha ain't one of them. Her thing is aaaaaangst, not underage explicit sex.

Maby saying her manipulator is too harsh.
Koto just like using some trick to got what her wants.
I hope it wouldn't be rude if l ask you this two question :
1.Do you think Koto know how Erika feels about her?
2.Would Koto let Aya go for her own good?

1. I don't think she does. I think the reason we are not hearing her internal thoughts is that she doesn't have much internal dialogue because of her trauma. That's also why I think she is not manipulative, she acts more instinctively, and she is getting hurt easily because she doesn't understand her own insecurities. I don't think she is a control freak as well. You can be afraid of losing control while still not being manipulative or a control freak. So far, nothing have shown that she have bad motive, that she is manipulative or anything. Koto is reactive, she doesn't plan anything, nor she is thinking too much. She just reacts to thing happening to her, she is passive.

2. Why would she let her go? She needs to resolve her trauma, not let her go. I don't think it would be for Aya's own good. I'm not saying the relationship will works out, but Aya being dumped right now would be devastating to her. Their relationship is not healthy because of Koto's trauma, but she is still providing for her, and they are definitively trying to make it work, even if they are awkward.

I'm mostly talking about the use of evidence. So far we have been shown almost nothing of Koto's interior present-day thoughts, in contrast to both Aya and Erika, where we're given substantial sequences of what they're thinking and feeling about the overall situation. (The extensive thoughts that appear as captions rather than in thought balloons are especially important for understanding those characters and their current state of mind and motivations. But we get very little of that from Koto's POV.)

Sure, there may be some potentially problematic issues for the future that we can infer from Koto's speech and actions--her inability to move on from initially losing Aya, her neediness in the present, etc. But the argument was that Koto is a "yandere manipulator" (or trickster) who has now suddenly changed from when Aya first returned, and I simply don't see any evidence for that.

Well, l think l already gave some "evidence". Looks like l have to explain further so you could understand why l see her this way.

Chapter 3 :
She choosed to stay at hometown while continually refused to see Aya. That's really weird enough to lead me to think if she's waiting something to happen.
She even took some days off from college for this. In chapter 5, her friends asked her whether her business at home be settled.

Chapter 4 :
While Koto can just bring her home without saying those horrible words. Likes she's saying goodbye and breaking up with a kid who literally has no one left except her and Erika. If I was in Aya's situation, I would fucking panic and cry on the spot.
It turns out that was just an act to make Aya confess to her.
How can't that not be manipulative?
Even before holding her hands, Koto felt the need to say "you were so keen on ignoring my first confession".
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU is my first thought. After reading chapter 8.5, things get more clear. Koto just also wanted to get some revenge for Aya refusing to respond her first confession SEVEN YEARS AGO.

Chapter 7 :
You can't buy a smart phone for a teenager just for her to find a part-time job and then tell her to quit after she really found one. It shows you actually don't want her to work but for some reasons you still acted like you support her decision.
So if Koto does persuade Aya to resign the next chapter, like "you don't have to force yourself to work" etc.
My assumption would be proved.

1. I don't think she does. I think the reason we are not hearing her internal thoughts is that she doesn't have much internal dialogue because of her trauma. That's also why I think she is not manipulative, she acts more instinctively, and she is getting hurt easily because she doesn't understand her own insecurities. I don't think she is a control freak as well. You can be afraid of losing control while still not being manipulative or a control freak. So far, nothing have shown that she have bad motive, that she is manipulative or anything. Koto is reactive, she doesn't plan anything, nor she is thinking too much. She just reacts to thing happening to her, she is passive.
   

Glad to know you have put so much credit on her while I'm on the total opposite.
It makes discussion more interesting now.
I do believe she's not as oblivious as her looks like.
In fact, the page 14 & 15 of chapter 8 makes me more convinced that Koto really knows how Erika feels.
And about being a control freak or not, you can see my opinions from my previous post.

1. Why would she let her go? She needs to resolve her trauma, not let her go. I don't think it would be for Aya's own good. I'm not saying the relationship will works out, but Aya being dumped right now would be devastating to her. Their relationship is not healthy because of Koto's trauma, but she is still providing for her, and they are definitively trying to make it work, even if they are awkward.

It just a hypothetical question.
If Aya can make a living in the future and find herself not like Koto anymore. Do you think Koto would let her go?
(I don't know why your answer 2 continues to show number 1 after l checked and edited several times. Please don't mind)

last edited at Mar 12, 2024 10:05PM

I'm mostly talking about the use of evidence. So far we have been shown almost nothing of Koto's interior present-day thoughts, in contrast to both Aya and Erika, where we're given substantial sequences of what they're thinking and feeling about the overall situation. (The extensive thoughts that appear as captions rather than in thought balloons are especially important for understanding those characters and their current state of mind and motivations. But we get very little of that from Koto's POV.)

Sure, there may be some potentially problematic issues for the future that we can infer from Koto's speech and actions--her inability to move on from initially losing Aya, her neediness in the present, etc. But the argument was that Koto is a "yandere manipulator" (or trickster) who has now suddenly changed from when Aya first returned, and I simply don't see any evidence for that.

Well, l think l already gave some "evidence". Looks like l have to explain further so you could understand why l see her this way.

Chapter 3 :
She choosed to stay at hometown while continually refused to see Aya. That's really weird enough to lead me to think if she's waiting something to happen.
She even took some days off from college for this. In chapter 5, her friends asked her whether her business at home be settled.

Chapter 4 :
While Koto can just bring her home without saying those horrible words. Likes she's saying goodbye and breaking up with a kid who literally has no one left except her and Erika. If I was in Aya's situation, I would fucking panic and cry on the spot.
It turns out that was just an act to make Aya confess to her.
How can't that not be manipulative?
Even before holding her hands, Koto felt the need to say "you were so keen on ignoring my first confession".
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU is my first thought. After reading chapter 8.5, things get more clear. Koto just also wanted to get some revenge for Aya refusing to respond her first confession SEVEN YEARS AGO.

Chapter 7 :
You can't buy a smart phone for a teenager just for her to find a part-time job and then tell her to quit after she really found one. It shows you actually don't want her to work but for some reasons you still acted like you support her decision.
So if Koto does persuade Aya to resign the next chapter, like "you don't have to force yourself to work" etc.
My assumption would be proved.

As I suggested, your powers of mind-reading are obviously far superior to mine.

And Koto saying, “I’m not so sure you need to commit so fast” is not even close to being the same as Koto “telling her to quit her job.” Whatever happens in future chapters, a distorted reading like that is the opposite of anything even remotely resembling “evidence.”

And Koto saying, “I’m not so sure you need to commit so fast” is not even close to being the same as Koto “telling her to quit her job.” Whatever happens in future chapters, a distorted reading like that is the opposite of anything even remotely resembling “evidence.”

What are you talking about？
She just got a job interview not already got that job. It would be fucking ridiculous if Koto tell her to quit in that chapter.

Edited：Maybe my reply confused you because I marked it as chapter 7 evidence. But I really did write "tell her to quit after she REALLY FOUND ONE". So it's obvious l think it would happened in next chapter. I do my best to explain it to you. It's not really my fault if you still can't get the point.

last edited at Mar 12, 2024 10:33PM

There are a few authors out there who would totally draw a woman of twenty-something and a kid of fourteen having French kisses and sixty-nines and tribbing. They would be very happy to draw it. In extreme detail!

But Kabocha ain't one of them. Her thing is aaaaaangst, not underage explicit sex.

Haha you're so correct! You sure got that right.
In fact the angst so far is nothing next to the angst that is (probably) coming. I've already got a box of hankies ready just for that.

1. Why would she let her go? She needs to resolve her trauma, not let her go. I don't think it would be for Aya's own good. I'm not saying the relationship will works out, but Aya being dumped right now would be devastating to her. Their relationship is not healthy because of Koto's trauma, but she is still providing for her, and they are definitively trying to make it work, even if they are awkward.

It just a hypothetical question.
If Aya can make a living in the future and find herself not like Koto anymore. Do you think Koto would let her go?
(I don't know why your answer 2 continues to show number 1 after l checked and edited several times. Please don't mind)

We do indeed have a very different vision of Koto. It sure is interesting to see the story unfold week by week and trying to guess where this is going.

To answer your question, I don't see her forcing her to stay for sure, but I can imagine her breaking down if Aya had to leave/wanted to leave. I honestly don't see her as manipulative, or with bad intention. I just see her as an empty shell and being super dull.

I honestly think Koto doesn't know Erika's feelings. If she does, she would probably react in some way or another. Like we all know she's a deep one when it comes to real feelings (but is clumsy in expressing it) especially when it comes from her only best friend.

I wouldn't say Koto is trying to manipulate Erika. The reason why she asked Erika out in previous chapter just show how broken she was after Aya's disappearance, even after years passed by. She tried to fill in the hole with anyone who confessed to her but nevertheless it's all in vain. While asking Erika out was probably her last resort of trying, still in hope that it would turn out different than the rest of her previous exes. How is it different? It's because Koto feel safe to tell Erika anything, without hiding her feelings at all. Surely her exes doesn't know Koto that well but Erika does, and Koto must have known this too. Just not about Erika's actual feelings.

I do actually wonder about Erika's condition after finding out Aya accepted Koto's confession during middle school. How she felt, how she coped up and all. I believe her (mysterious) conversation with Aya in Tanabata day must have a serious impact for the story, if we ever find out in the future chapter that is.

To answer your question, I don't see her forcing her to stay for sure, but I can imagine her breaking down if Aya had to leave/wanted to leave. I honestly don't see her as manipulative, or with bad intention. I just see her as an empty shell and being super dull.

I respect your opinions.
However, I also can't convince myself that she is as innocent as you said.
I can't just pretend chapter 4 doesn't exist.
What Koto did towards a 14yo kid is really horrible. That's the main reason why I have a second thought about Koto's every behavior.

I really do hope their relationship would work out. But I am really afraid Aya would got a broken heart at the end of the road.

To answer your question, I don't see her forcing her to stay for sure, but I can imagine her breaking down if Aya had to leave/wanted to leave. I honestly don't see her as manipulative, or with bad intention. I just see her as an empty shell and being super dull.

I respect your opinions.
However, I also can't convince myself that she is as innocent as you said.
I can't just pretend chapter 4 doesn't exist.
What Koto did towards a 14yo kid is really horrible. That's the main reason why I have a second thought about Koto's every behavior.

You keep saying this, but can you please spell out exactly what Koto said that was so horrible?

If it was the business about being sure Aya loved the present-day Koto, you seem to be putting an extremely nasty reading on those statements that are potentially plausible, but at this point by no means the only way to understand what Koto meant.

last edited at Mar 13, 2024 7:54PM

You keep saying this, but can you please spell out exactly what Koto said that was so horrible?

I just re-read Chapter 4, and it seems fine -- until the very last pages. "I just knew she would respond this way" and looking at a script. Really does make it seem like Koto was being deliberately manipulative of Aya's feelings.

You keep saying this, but can you please spell out exactly what Koto said that was so horrible?

I just re-read Chapter 4, and it seems fine -- until the very last pages. "I just knew she would respond this way" and looking at a script. Really does make it seem like Koto was being deliberately manipulative of Aya's feelings.

I agree that the script is a puzzling detail, and an anomalous one—I can’t think of anything else in the story that is depicted as being a purely symbolic scene, neither a flashback nor a specific memory. Koto’s not just reading from a script either—she’s standing on a stage in a spotlight.

I think that goes back to the scene in Chapter 1 where Aya mischievously says, “I’d like to play a part, Koto. In the script you’ll write.”

Many comments here not unreasonably see Aya as being merely fragile and vulnerable (which she is in the present), but at the time of her disappearance she was definitely in the one-up position in relation to both Koto and Erika (as the object of Koto’s affection and as the block to Erika’s feelings for Koto). And Koto (also not unreasonably) is trying to negotiate feeling like the one in charge while also reverting to being a suitor for Aya’s love.