Forum › How to Break a Triangle discussion
She lacks empathy. She notices Aya hides her pain behind a smile, but she doesn't really care and immediately thinks about how to exploit the opportunity. She comes off as calculative and cold, even though she's racked with guilt. She admits to herself that the breakup made her happy.
It's like the fact that Aya is a 14 year old without any family, who's struggling to survive after losing everything is totally abstract to her. It's like she never considered Aya as a friend, even in middle school. Only as an obstacle she can finally push aside and forget.
Not just Aya, I think the same could be applied to Koto too, Erika's love toward Koto is kind of weird. The idea of Aya coming back to give Koto false hope, then leave her again is incredibly cruel to Koto. Yet why would Erika want that to happen? Because to her, Koto's - the girl she supposed to love - well being is not as important as herself having her damn chance. I feel like to Erika, it's not about Koto, but herself and her chance to win Koto over.
I get that being selfish is very human or reality etc, but it's still bad and Erika feeling guilty about it is not undeserved at all.
If there's anything l would criticize this manga is Kabocha loves Aya too much, which seriously impact the balance of the love triangle story. Despite truly loving Koto, Aya is willing to let her go if it's for Koto's well being. She knows it's not right to keep Koto stuck in the past, even though that Koto would undoubtedly "love" her forever. In Erika's case, she also wants Koto to move forward but for another personal selfish reason. In brief, she wouldn't give two shits if Koto could just fall in love with her.
As a reader, l love Aya the most and don't actually care about Erika, but I don't really like the comparison. Just like defeating a villain who is cartoonishly bad and stupid is fucking boring. Not to mention Erika is also one of the protagonist. My beloved Aya deserves a better rival than this.
last edited at Nov 12, 2024 5:10PM
That's why people calling Aya the real MC and it's kinda true, not officialy but still... so not a suprise. It's her story and most importantly it's not just a simple love manga but a lot of complicated things are goin on besides that. Would be hard to care about the love triangle when it's Erika -> Koto <-> Aya.
Not to mention Erika is also one of the protagonist. My beloved Aya deserves a better rival than this.
Just curious, but what do you think about Koto then? If you think Aya deserves a better rival than Erika, do you think Aya deserves a girlfriend like Koto? I mean at this point, not in several previous chapters, where we don't have as much information about her character.
Would be hard to care about the love triangle when it's Erika -> Koto <-> Aya.
I feel like it's not what really going on here, when there's a lot of people rooting for Erika over Aya. They dislike Koto, but would love to see Erika dating Koto anyways, and I can't see any reason behind that other than wanting Erika to "win" against Aya.
last edited at Nov 13, 2024 2:58AM
I don't want Erika to date Koto, I think all three should just be friends and find somebody new without the childhood baggage to pursue romantically.
At some level I understand the “horse race” way of reading romance manga, but it’s just not the primary way I think about reading stories—I’m mostly interested in what the author is doing with the pieces of the narrative and how they’re doing it. In this case, I think it’s fascinating how the strange premise, especially the 7-year gap with characters at this age (these ages), sets up so many unusual emotional complications.
Sure, as imaginary people, Aya is the “best” of the lot—brave, forward-thinking, trying to do the best with the bizarre cards she’s been dealt—while Koto and Erika are both stuck living in the past in different ways and not doing too well at it. But it’s hard for me to see the characters as the equivalent of sports teams, where I’m “rooting” for one over the other.
Every few months, I'm stopping by one of the library in Tokyo with the largest yuri selection to buy some of the latest yuri release, and I was gladly surprised that the first volume of the manga was out in a physical release! I completely miss any announcement about it, but I remember Kabocha mentioning that a physical release would only happens if the ebook had decent sales, so I'm really happy for her!
The first volume has a few exclusive extra pages at the end. The ebook version as well, but the extra pages of the ebook are not in the physical release and the one in the physical release are not in the ebook version.
Support the author if you can!
last edited at Nov 21, 2024 8:35AM
somehow SPOILER ALERT! Don't read it.
As I noticed, I was right on the spot with my theory. ( the team "against" Erika too) Go check what I wrote 2 weeks ago, if you're curious about the oncoming happenings. LOL... I unconsciously spoiled it with my theory.
last edited at Dec 3, 2024 11:48AM
somehow SPOILER ALERT! Don't read it.
As I noticed, I was right on the spot with my theory. ( the team "against" Erika too) Go check what I wrote 2 weeks ago, if you're curious about the oncoming happenings. LOL... I unconsciously spoiled it with my theory.
You just delayed the next chapter for a month.
Would be nice if you know, there was a way to hide text in case you want to spoil.
@Blastaar
Sure, as imaginary people, Aya is the “best” of the lot—brave, forward-thinking, trying to do the best with the bizarre cards she’s been dealt—while Koto and Erika are both stuck living in the past in different ways and not doing too well at it. But it’s hard for me to see the characters as the equivalent of sports teams, where I’m “rooting” for one over the other.
I haven't read all the comments (forgive me forum, I find it annoying when people ignore comments to respond), but I think it's pretty clear Aya can be this way because she is the only one who wasn't traumatized by her disappearance.
Koto is obvious. Erika has essentially been hanging onto her guilt and punishing herself by not allowing herself to even attempt dating someone else. She knows she ruined Koto and therefore can never feel she deserves anyone else herself (though obviously it's not really her fault because she didn't know she has magic tanabata powers). Koto instead tried to move forward, but never could completely due to the way Aya suddenly disappeared with no explanation.
For Aya much of her past was a burden, so it being gone is a relief. In that sense, her situation is the best one, despite all the problems. To some extent, I think the actual dynamic is more like she's running from her past, ie the abandonment, slowly dying grandparents, etc. She desperately wants to move forward and become an adult who can take care of herself, which technically she already is, legally.
Some speculation, the tanabata magic requires pairs, but it doesn't make sense that would be Koto's that makes Aya disapear. I think it could be that Aya's wish aligned with Erika's. Hers was for Aya to disappear and then reappear, whereas for Aya she wanted to escape to her future and find the different place she was looking for, where she could love someone without fear in a way she couldn't as a middle schooler.
Also re "horse race," I think people wanting some character to "win" comes from identifying with the character to some extent, so they take on that character's desires. Or they imagine themselves as that character and then think about who they would want to be with, which some people are doing with Aya and thinking they'd rather be with someone who can relate to them in a healthy way.
Personally I identify more with Koto so I'd like for her to end up with Aya somehow, but the main thing thematically is for them to fully accept their pasts, ie not rejecting or fleeing from it, and therefore fully be part of their present. The tri-friendship ending where they pursue other people romantically would make the most sense currently, but it could really go any way as long as that happens.
last edited at Dec 5, 2024 3:49PM
It's so suffering being Koto.
Imagine if you were in her shoes:
You fell so hard for a girl that you weren't be satisfied anymore to just stay friends. You confessed to her one day afternoon when walked home with her. She was confused and shocked then trying to avoid the subject so desperately. You knew immediately the girl didn't feel the same way. You cried all day night in your bedroom considering giving up. However, all the efforts and decisions faded away when you saw her smiling at you like always when you went to school next day. You found you still hopelessly loved her with all your heart. If she tells you to jump, you would happily die for her without any contempt. She was treating you like the confession never happened and playing dumb whenever you implied you still like her. But somehow she gave you the impression that she had been moved by your confession. And she's glad you are the one who always tried to find her.
Two months had passed since you confessed to her. She was so popular that you sometimes would witness her being confessed when you managed to find her. Though she had refused all of them, that's no assurance she wouldn't want a relationship one day. Plus the look she had when she's looking somewhere like she didn't really belong here. To think she might be taken away from you, you couldn't hold you back anymore. You went straight to her and confessed again. She doubted whether you had thought it through since it would be the second time you confessed. You leaned forward and kissed her on the lips to show your seriousness. But after doing so, you couldn't look her in the eyes in fear of facing another refuse. After a long time of silence between you two, she gently touched your hair and said she would go out with you. That day was crazy. She even told you she also looked forward to the Tanabata festival which the lovers swear eternal love to each other. You took a small run on your way home even though you always hated running. You just couldn't help it. Why this all feel so good to be true. The girl of your dreams actually loves you back. If it was a dream, you would never want to wake up.
But something you would never know… Your another childhood up to no good friend who secretly in love with you for god knows how long times ago can't take it normally and go lash out at the girl you loved even though this coward never dares telling anyone how she feels about you.
The Tanabata day finally came, the first time you thought yourself enjoy waiting. But she never came. That's not even the worst, the girl had vanished from the earth like she never exist. She might have been dead or merely run away from home. Either way, it's so pathetic if you kept waiting for her to come back. You had tried nearly anything you could do to move on by dating a bunch of people but it turned out you always craved for her more. Your heart couldn't let go. After the last try being turning down by your childhood friend, you gave up. She will always be the love of your life even with the fact she had gone.
Time flows without mercy. It have been been seven years since the day turning your life into hell. She showed up out of the blue looking exactly the same as she was back then. It couldn't…but it happened. Just like she had been spirited away all those years. Things got really easy due to your life experience being far more greater than a teenager. You used a little trick to let the girl confess to you. You took her in after resuming your relationship.
Since this time she is the one asking you to be together, she wouldn't want to go anywhere, right? Oh, she still has that lonely looks sometimes, does she still chooses to drift away regardless? You are so scared. She is so adorable and fascinating. There's no guarantee she will keep loving you while you already knew you would never stop loving her even if you want. You can't even claim the girl as your girlfriend in front of anyone cause they would call you a pedo then dialing 911 right on the spot. (To think some audience who know the whole story would do exact the same thing lol) You want to kiss her, want to do lover things with her. At least it would alleviate your anxiety. But you know you can't because she hasn't grown up both in body and mind. She is a 14 yo child while you are an adult. You have to wait at least 2 years.
Even without any help, she still managed to find a part time job and tried to catch up on you by studying hard. She always like that, moving forward too fast to notice you had been left behind. Like it wasn't bad enough, your childhood friend recommended her to a play audition. She said she wanted to have a try and got that role, unsurprisingly. You couldn't even hide your disappointment before her anymore. She asked you what's wrong with an innocent smile. You thought it's time to tell her your feelings and fears. However, she couldn't take it well to the idea of just staying by your side and ran away. You called your childhood friend to calm her down since you know there's only limited places she can go.
You had been sleeping on her pillow since then, knowing she wouldn't come home so easily. However, not before long you found she's smiling at you on the bed you shared with her, asking you why you take a nap in the evening. You were so happy she came back that you gave her a big hug. Then apologize to her that you shouldn't treat her like a kid. She said she wants to know what happened in that seven years without her. Of course, how could you tell her you dated a bunch of people after she was gone just to fill the loneliness. You will never want her to know this side of you. Then she told you the relationship needed to end since you have changed. She loves you but there's still things needed to be done. You couldn't bear to see her cry, couldn't really force or do anything to hurt her. She dumped you and leave you alone in your apartment. You felt really sick but all you can do is expect she somehow chang her mind and come home. She can't live with your childhood friend forever, after all.
Two days had passed since she left. The bell rang as you predicted. You sprinted to open the door only to be faced with your childhood friend. Yeah. You remember now you had told her that you are not feeling ok when she called you. You don't want to be alone so you let her in. You think your childhood friend is the only one in this world who can truly understand you. However, she was letting the girl you love move out from her home and scolded you for being too fixated on the ideal that only exist seven years ago.
Can Koto become more miserable? God. Please just let her be with Aya in the end.
Also, Erika go to hell. l hate you with all my heart.
Yeah, so Koto can lock up Aya in a room, steal all of Aya's future, and never get over her fears and recover.
Will there ever be a day when people stop acting like there are "evil" or "good" characters in this work, as opposed to characters with their own desires that may conflict with the others'?
None of the advice Erika gave was bad and Koto needed that wake-up call. Until she gets over her fear, she'll never be able to have anything with Aya or anyone, something the manga has literally shown us with all of her failed dating attempts. It would require vulnerability, to be open, to change, and Koto is clearly not willing to. She wants to live forever in the past, with the Aya from then, and for that she must keep her caged and unable to move forward when she's a teen in a delicate situation. She doesn't want an equal but an ideal.
Everyone has conflicting feelings at some point in life, and sometimes your "selfish" desires can be good for others, and this is the case for Erika's wish for Koto to get over the past, a wish she's constantly beating herself over because she cares about her friends and understands that in this situation not everyone is going to win. I too thought at some point Erika was hiding something, but more than anything she just hates herself.
And what guarantees that the spiriting away wasn't the result of Aya's own actions and desires, and Erika is merely blaming herself thinking it was her fault because of the possible argument they had on that fated day? "If not here, where is it?", from the start Aya seemed to want to get away from something, gazing at something far away. She wouldn't recite that section for no reason, there's more to her we haven't seen yet. What was she so dissatisfied about? I see a desire for freedom in her, wanting to be independent, to find her own place to belong... Or just not to be there at all.
With how the story is going, it's safer to assume the title is literal and none of them are going to be remaining in that triangle, it's never going to work out and this is about how it's going to fall apart completely. All they're doing is destroying themselves by remaining together.
last edited at Dec 11, 2024 6:56AM
Will there ever be a day when people stop acting like there are "evil" or "good" characters in this work, as opposed to characters with their own desires that may conflict with the others'?
Evidence so far strongly suggests “No.”
Yeah, so Koto can lock up Aya in a room, steal all of Aya's future, and never get over her fears and recover.
I wish. But can you please stop acting like Koto had already locked Aya up?
And what guarantees that the spiriting away wasn't the result of Aya's own actions and desires, and Erika is merely blaming herself thinking it was her fault because of the possible argument they had on that fated day?
Come on. Do you seriously think the girl like Aya would ever join the fight lol. To think we have already seen how Aya would react when she feels angry (chapter 12). This must be Erika hysterically screaming at Aya kind of argument. Like "It's your fault thay my crush doesn't love me back". Maybe she also begged Aya to break up with Koto. How mature. Oh, l forget she's only 14 yo back then LOL. But still, she only goddamn cared about her own feelings. If she truly loves Koto, she would want Koto to be happy.
And l can be sure now if Erika didn't fight Aya that day, Aya wouldn't disappear. The hint is just so obvious.
Interesting to have a cute slice of life domestic happiness extra at the end of a volume where the couple in question broke up on rather serious terms. It gives this otherwise happy little story a haunting feeling, presumably this is one of them looking back on her memories with sadness.
last edited at Dec 14, 2024 11:34AM
While I somewhat hesitate to re-start Erika Argument #1000, to be clear, when I say Erika intentionally framed her advice to encourage Aya and Koto to break up, I meant things like this. "How about you give it a second thought? Do you truly love the present Koto?" She is saying that Aya only loved the 14-year-old Koto, that she doesn't know the 21-year-old Koto and so cannot love her.
And you know, she's right about that! Aya and Koto's relationship was unhealthy for a number of reasons so I can't say she was "wrong" to subtly encourage Aya to break up with her. But that's what she did, and this volume extra is important because it demonstrates the cost of the breakup. As many issues as Aya and Koto had, there was genuine love and care there too. Something valuable was lost, Erika's two best friends are hurting greatly, and all she can think of is "finally, now's my chance to date Koto/beat Aya." And people here wonder why she's a controversial character lol. Self-hatred is far from her only issue, though as I've argued before I think her self-hatred has actually become a self-fulfilling prophecy and caused her to become a worse person in reality.
To be clear though, I don't hate Erika or even Koto. While I think rosetammy25's post above is...a bit biased...they're not necessarily wrong either. Aya's disappearance was a giant trauma for Koto at a young age and it's not at all surprising she hasn't gotten over it. I do agree somewhat when Genevieve says the biggest issue with the manga is that Koto and Erika are far more flawed than Aya is, but Eukene also makes a great point that this is mainly because Aya is the only one not traumatized by her disappearance. That said, the fact that she is able to be this self-assured and motivated at age 14 is very remarkable. But that is also, perhaps, the point; Aya is remarkable, which is why both Koto and Erika view her as more of an ideal than a person, which is the major cause of all this drama to begin with.
Anyway, really good volume extra that serves as an important counter-weight to the breakdown of Aya and Koto's relationship that we saw in the rest of the volume. Thanks a lot for the translation!
Koto and Aya very obviously could never have worked out without them dealing with the gap between their past memories and their present relationship. Thus the only possible scenario where Erika WOULDN'T say "Do you truly love the present Koto?" is one where she's dumb and giving bad advice. Therefore there's not really any motive you can legitimately read into that line imo. Any friend knowledgeable about the situation would have said the exact same thing to Aya.
Koto and Aya very obviously could never have worked out without them dealing with the gap between their past memories and their present relationship. Thus the only possible scenario where Erika WOULDN'T say "Do you truly love the present Koto?" is one where she's dumb and giving bad advice. Therefore there's not really any motive you can legitimately read into that line imo. Any friend knowledgeable about the situation would have said the exact same thing to Aya.
You got the point. Any friend without an ulterior motive would have said the exact same thing to Aya the day she came back or started dating Koto.
And l have to point out Koto herself had noticed that fact at the beginning. She acknowledges well she's not the girl Aya agreed to date anymore. So she planned a whole scenario forcing Aya to choose between her or being left behind. Quite interesting dynamic in chapter 15 when Aya requested to know what actually happened in Koto's past seven years without her, Koto was acting like this:
"You don't need to know."
"You said it, didn't you? That the present you loves the present me."
Tbh, I'm pretty fond of Koto. I know she's afraid Aya couldn't love the person what she has become. Aya's words here is kinda bullshit to her since she had already tried seven years to fall in love with others. Koto knows better than anyone else that you would never be able to force yourself to romantically love someone even if you want to. However, her manipulating a 14 yo is not something l can turn my back on.
Well, Erika allowing everything to happen is because in her mind Koto is far more important than Aya. She needs them to get back together at least once and can't break up too early or Koto wouldn't change. In brief, She used Aya like a fucking tool to heal Koto.
One thing to be clear, Aya has her own flaws. I will never like a perfectly innocent angel character.
@Genevieve
I can see Gabinomicon doesn't want to reply cause she actually knows Erika is suck as a human being and a friend. She couldn't admit her favorite character is such a scum.
To those Erika's defenders, let me ask you a question: Would you go lash out at your best friend if he/she starts dating your crush? Blaming them it's their fault that your crush doesn't love you back?
For the life of me, l would never do such a loser move towards anyone, let alone my best friend. I know Erika was only 14 yo back then. But so was Koto and Aya. They would never do that to Erika.
Poor Aya, still see this selfish snake as someone she can rely on.
Poor Koto, still believe in this selfish snake as her best friend.
And l hope Erika can just die painfully at the end of the manga.
last edited at Dec 16, 2024 4:35AM
@Genevieve
I can see Gabinomicon doesn't want to reply cause he actually knows Erika is suck as a human being and a friend. He couldn't admit his favorite character is such a scum.To those Erika's defenders, let me ask you a question: Would you go lash out at your best friend if he/she starts dating your crush? Blaming them it's their fault that your crush doesn't love you back?
For the life of me, l would never do such a loser move towards anyone, let alone my best friend. I know Erika was only 14 yo back then. But so was Koto and Aya. They would never do that to Erika.Poor Aya, still see this selfish snake as someone she can rely on.
Poor Koto, still believe in this selfish snake as her best friend.And l hope Erika can just die painfully at the end of the manga.
I'm a woman and simply didn't have anything to say earlier. You're weird.
I'm a woman and simply didn't have anything to say earlier. You're weird.
Sorry. I edited my article.
I don't like being rude, but you seem to be acting like this is some sort of shipping war and treat possibilities as things that definitely happened, so we're not really talking about the same work at all!
Calling Erika hysterical is on par with the men on this forum calling women bitches, so I did not want to engage further. A shame to be misunderstood like this because I like and relate to Koto and her struggles with obsession, so it bothered me a lot to see people vilifying her for things that came from being traumatized. In this kind of situation Erika's advice is really all that can said about her struggles, because the root of the problem is her obsession with Aya, leading to fear and actions that are harming everyone involved. So until that is broken apart, it won't work out.
Also I somehow completely forgot about this, but for me it only indicates there was something up with Aya way before she even met the two, a habit of going away from everyone, so I'm more inclined to believe she herself was the main cause.
We simply don't know what they talked about before her disappearance yet. Aya could have gotten emotional, bursting from all the things she kept inside, and that possible argument brought forth those worries, an emotional peak making her wish for something she shouldn't have. She wasn't the perfect, self-assured girl they thought she was, but really a struggling teen hiding those struggles. A sore spot could have been touched, and that broke down the dam.
Kumagaya could have easily sensed something else that prompted her to ask this question other than Aya's weirdly young appearance and circumstances similar to Takuma's. Something much more personal to Aya, and I wouldn't find it weird if it turns out that it was Kumagaya herself who was spirited away.
I don't even particularly care for Erika, I just changed my mind about her and am not invested on a ship to the point I start to distort everything on the text to fit what I want out of it. Koto and Erika are both characters who struggle with letting go of things, but one just so happens to be interested in the one that remained and to be aiming at the almost impossible possibility that Koto would somehow heal and be able to love others.
The characters I like the most are Aya and Kumagaya. So really I don't have anything on stakes.
There is no reason for me to defend only the interest of specific characters as good and to define the other's as evil. Or more like, I don't feel as I am defending anyone in particular, but merely working out my own thoughts on why I think they're doing this and that, and why it's not really evil.
And personally, I'd love a bittersweet or outright tragic ending for this work. I like pain.
When it comes to the “how would you feel if . . .?” judgmental hypotheticals, I think that all the readers who have had their crush, or their crush’s crush, disappear for seven years during middle school then reappear physically unchanged and with no memory of the intervening timespan probably are the best people to address such questions.
Or those who have been spirited away themselves, of course.
It's quite funny how in this manga, some people are very passionate about making some of its characters look like terrible people (to the point of saying they should have a painful death), while the author clearly didn't wrote any of those characters as inherently bad. But in "My girlfriend is not here today", people are defending with passion characters that have been written to be terrible people.
I know those two manga have very little in common, but it just makes me chuckle to think about that paradox.