Forum › Crescent Moon and Doughnuts discussion
In most countries homosexuality is neither accepted nor legal. Considering how heteronormative most societies are, how rarely the topic comes up in real life or fiction and that being open about it can often give you more troubles than it's worth, so you might live your entire life never encountering it, not realizing you're gay and instead assuming there's something wrong with you doesn't sound that unresonable.
Although typically one would also be attracted to women, whether one realizes it or not, so that is something set-ups like this completely ignore. No matter how heteronormative or whatever society is, hormones are hormones. So an unaware lesbian woman never having felt any attraction to another woman in over 20 years is at the very least unlikely. That person still can feel like they are broken or wrong, but many yuri stories act like the woman in question never even felt anything for either sex until that fateful moment.
It makes more sense depending on how low one's sex drive is of course. But typically they start feeling it hard the moment the realization strikes like some kind of limiter is being released. The magic of yuri manga lol
In most countries homosexuality is neither accepted nor legal. Considering how heteronormative most societies are, how rarely the topic comes up in real life or fiction and that being open about it can often give you more troubles than it's worth, so you might live your entire life never encountering it, not realizing you're gay and instead assuming there's something wrong with you doesn't sound that unresonable.
Although typically one would also be attracted to women, whether one realizes it or not, so that is something set-ups like this completely ignore. No matter how heteronormative or whatever society is, hormones are hormones. So an unaware lesbian woman never having felt any attraction to another woman in over 20 years is at the very least unlikely. That person still can feel like they are broken or wrong, but many yuri stories act like the woman in question never even felt anything for either sex until that fateful moment.
It makes more sense depending on how low one's sex drive is of course. But typically they start feeling it hard the moment the realization strikes like some kind of limiter is being released. The magic of yuri manga lol
The article posted upthread about a person who realized she was gay because of Kitty Pryde explains a lot in that regard, and also explains a lot of tropes... Definitely I can now see how a woman in particular could fool themselves in that way. Super friendship, right, like Nanoha and Fate! That totally has nothing to do with not being straight!
The article posted upthread about a person who realized she was gay because of Kitty Pryde explains a lot in that regard, and also explains a lot of tropes... Definitely I can now see how a woman in particular could fool themselves in that way. Super friendship, right, like Nanoha and Fate! That totally has nothing to do with not being straight!
Oh I am fully aware of the methods by which one can justify this attraction as something unromantic, but at the very least something like it should happen. The very fact that the thought comes up (perhaps repeatedly) and that a justification needs to be produced is already what I am talking about.
If you take the protagonist from this particular story for example, she doesn't seem to have any such overly close relationships. Her self-loathing might be an extra barrier as she doesn't seem to want to show any of her true self to those around in fear of not appearing normal. Heck, maybe part of not feeling normal was that she got overly close to other girls in school, who knows?
So an unaware lesbian woman never having felt any attraction to another woman in over 20 years is at the very least unlikely.
It's actually not as implausible as you think. Obviously we don't know her entire life, so it's hard to explain everything, but for once she might simply never fallen in love with other woman or encounter her type. Odds are small, but it can happen. And considering what we know about mc, as in she spend her entire life listening about love stories, dating and how having partner and not being alone is the most important thing in life (something I can relate to wholeheartedly, as someone who don't consider being in relationship the be all and end all of life, while being constantly told so) and constantly trying to date guys and hook up with pretty much anybody, I'd say she didn't really spend too much time looking at girls or bonding with her friends (since all they ever talked about was love). And again, since the thought of being attracted to girls never occurred to her, she might never noticed that she felt any lvl of attraction to one or even if she did, she might not realized what it was or just missed it. Definitely not case for her, but if someone takes longer to feel attraction/bond with someone, they could also never feel attraction, if they never tried to be closer with other girls. So it might sound like a extreme case, but given the right circumstances I really don't think, her never experiencing any attraction is that far-fetched.
I like Yuri, no surprise there, but while the typical girl meet girl story is great, I like it more when there is the social pressure throw into the mix.
It makes it more realistic and relatable, specially when it comes from a country as strict as Japan.
I mean, how many stories have to either make men horrible beings or down right delete them to make the stories less stressful for the protagonists? I don't mind them but it makes me feel like love between same sex people is something out of fantasy instead of, you know, A PART OF REALITY!
So this story, starting right out the bat with a main character who feels wrong with herself just for not fitting into the social norm, is a lot more interesting than the 100th story about yet another school full of girls with no men in sight.
So yeah, I thank Yuri in general, but I would forever be more thankful towards realistic stories than utopian dreams.
I mean, how many stories have to either make men horrible beings or down right delete them to make the stories less stressful for the protagonists? I don't mind them but it makes me feel like love between same sex people is something out of fantasy instead of, you know, A PART OF REALITY!
I agree. I prefer when men are present and nice, but girls still choose girls over them. Also while having some social pressure can help in making story feel more realistic and adding something for characters to worry about, I also like stories that don't make that big deal out of it and simply treat homosexuality as something normal and existing next to all the het people. It makes it feel like part of normal life rather than something unique or out of ordinary. It helps to normalize it and maybe one day it'll become our reality.
last edited at Jan 8, 2020 2:04PM
So an unaware lesbian woman never having felt any attraction to another woman in over 20 years is at the very least unlikely.
It's actually not as implausible as you think. Obviously we don't know her entire life, so it's hard to explain everything, but for once she might simply never fallen in love with other woman or encounter her type. Odds are small, but it can happen. And considering what we know about mc, as in she spend her entire life listening about love stories, dating and how having partner and not being alone is the most important thing in life (something I can relate to wholeheartedly, as someone who don't consider being in relationship the be all and end all of life, while being constantly told so) and constantly trying to date guys and hook up with pretty much anybody, I'd say she didn't really spend too much time looking at girls or bonding with her friends (since all they ever talked about was love). And again, since the thought of being attracted to girls never occurred to her, she might never noticed that she felt any lvl of attraction to one or even if she did, she might not realized what it was or just missed it. Definitely not case for her, but if someone takes longer to feel attraction/bond with someone, they could also never feel attraction, if they never tried to be closer with other girls. So it might sound like a extreme case, but given the right circumstances I really don't think, her never experiencing any attraction is that far-fetched.
idk why ppl would think it's implausible for someone to go into their 20's without realizing it. the hetero norm is shoved down your throat so strongly as we grow up, that when you find yourself not reacting to guys the way everyone else does you start thinking it's something wrong with yourself, before considering other possibilities. i know exactly where this character is coming from. while i never hated myself, i definitely felt i was different. if you're not physically close to other females, it's easy to not recognize your reactions to those you do come close to, especially if you're strike zone is not in your peer group. for me it's older women, so my sisters' friends XD but i did not recognize it because i did not normally hang out with them, and i didn't even know it could be a thing. and then when i was old enough to start working, the idea of being "that way" was ruined for me by the way a 7th grade teacher was totally shit on when a RUMOR was started that she was lesbian. but also at the time there was a guy i knew liked me, and i confused being flattered that he liked me as me also liking him, making me push the thought of being "that way" further from my thoughts. plus the other girl was married lol.
people blessed with the right surroundings, events, and people around them will certainly figure things out earlier, but not everyone is that lucky.
edit: and another thing that makes it harder for girls: porn is such a shamed and tabboo thing for younger girls to see/look at, so it's not even like many until their 20's that have really seen a lot of other naked women. boys have it much easier in that regard lol. like oh damn i'm getting way more turned on by the dude in this porno than the girl, maybe i'm actually gay.
last edited at Jan 8, 2020 3:46PM
if you're not physically close to other females, it's easy to not recognize your reactions to those you do come close to, especially if you're strike zone is not in your peer group.
people blessed with the right surroundings, events, and people around them will certainly figure things out earlier, but not everyone is that lucky.
edit: and another thing that makes it harder for girls: porn is such a shamed and tabboo thing for younger girls to see/look at, so it's not even like many until their 20's that have really seen a lot of other naked women. boys have it much easier in that regard lol. like oh damn i'm getting way more turned on by the dude in this porno than the girl, maybe i'm actually gay.
I won't downplay your personal experience, I never denied it is possible. It should be mentioned though that you don't need to have someone from your strike zone among your peers to feel attraction. Just watching media with beautiful women in them can have just the same effect. I mean, someone posted an example of someone figuring it out from comics after all.
Porn is not really necessary to reach that conclusion, but I think it's a weird stereotype that girls these days don't watch porn. You know that porn is also a taboo among boys? Adults always try to keep it from all younger people. It doesn't work for either sex. Not with the internet so readily available to most countries these days. And seeing other naked women is actually not very uncommon in Asian countries, so even if porn is highly regulated, there are still lots of opportunities.
I guess what I am getting at is that my original statement still stands: It's unlikely to never experience an episode of attraction until the 20s. Not impossible, not even super rare, but unlikely. At least in this day and age.
edit: And that doesn't mean one figures out what that attraction means or that you are a lesbian.
last edited at Jan 8, 2020 3:58PM
HNNNNNNNNNG Chapter 2 when
I think it's a weird stereotype that girls these days don't watch porn. You know that porn is also a taboo among boys? Adults always try to keep it from all younger people.
True, but it's more while children and teens in general are usually forbidden from looking at porn, girls are expected to never see porn, talking openly about sex and in general be innocent, pure, little angles their entire life. There's no such stigma for boys to talk or even think about sex. In fact boys, of any age, using naughty words, saying dirty jokes and sexually harassing someone is seen as boys being boys, while girls doing the same thing is considered unladylike.
I think it's a weird stereotype that girls these days don't watch porn. You know that porn is also a taboo among boys? Adults always try to keep it from all younger people.
True, but it's more while children and teens in general are usually forbidden from looking at porn, girls are expected to never see porn, talking openly about sex and in general be innocent, pure, little angles their entire life. There's no such stigma for boys to talk or even think about sex. In fact boys, of any age, using naughty words, saying dirty jokes and sexually harassing someone is seen as boys being boys, while girls doing the same thing is considered unladylike.
And who expects that? Because most places I've been or seen have no such rules. It may be the conservative opinion and especially a religious rule, but among first world countries it is nearly expected that girls have seen porn. There is even this trend in recent years of couples watching porn together (don't ask me why).
I get your sentiment about men being more crude and won't deny it. I have seen that too. But anyone underage gets reprimanded or blocked from dealing with anything pornographic as far as society is concerned (not that it has ever stopped anyone).
Some religions have very strong opinions on porn and will punish people for that and I have no doubt that in those places boys are more likely to risk it than girls, but overall it's become pretty standard. Statistics on the matter exist and even if we assume that a majority of women does not answer truthfully, the already existing percentage proves that a huge amount of women worldwide do in fact watch porn. Incidentally... the most popular type of porn among women is lesbian porn, regardless of sexuality lol
I live in conservative religious country and we're supposedly first world one.
I live in conservative religious country and we're supposedly first world one.
Welp, there aren't awfully many like that. I should probably remember that countries are not monolithic though. Murica for example has the bible belt of religious looneys and regressive rednecks, so I'd expect that kind of outdated thinking there. Similarily southern Germany or central Spain are also known to be overly conservative. I somehow doubt this stuff is common anywhere in France though (lol)
Whatever sign you put on a country, religion is luckily slowly dying in the West and conservatism shifts at a snail's pace as it always had. 100 years ago conservatives thought women shouldn't vote (well so did the liberals but whatever). So eventually they will get hung up on something new and think women watching porn is normal. Maybe.
Wow none of this really relates to the manga anymore, does it? Uh... something something donut holes are the best part.
I don't think porn is the strongest indicator for someone's sexuality though. At least for women in general. If you've never had a crush on a girl (even if you're not straight) you can still watch lesbian porn and think nothing of it.
Like yeah, a good amount of straight women says they watch lesbian porn and even like it more than straight porn.
I on the other hand never liked lesbian porn, and I'm not straight. I only like it when I see it drawn, like in yuri mangas.
I assume most of these cases where they realize it later in their lives, had already felt some type of attraction, but were able to brush it off as admiration, or even a "girl crush", because it wasn't that intense. Also the term "girl crush" on itself can help with the denial part too. Like if you have a crush on a girl, it's just a "girl crush" and doesn't count against one's straightness because it's not an actual crush. (what the term implies)
last edited at Jan 8, 2020 8:13PM
I don't think porn is the strongest indicator for someone's sexuality though. At least for women in general. If you've never had a crush on a girl (even if you're not straight) you can still watch lesbian porn and think nothing of it.
Well, I did mention that I think porn is not a necessary thing to figure it out, but I guess I could have broadened it to "it's not a real indicator either".
Like yeah, a good amount of straight women says they watch lesbian porn and even like it more than straight porn.
I on the other hand never liked lesbian porn, and I'm not straight. I only like it when I see it drawn, like in yuri mangas.
This is actually also a common thing, because the lesbian porn actresses are often faking it or putting on a show of what straight men think lesbian sex is like. Real lesbians can tell the details (like those godawful long fake nails. Ouch) are not adding up, so it turns them off. Of course there is no right way to have sex, so I don't particularly think they are always faking it, but whatever. Point is your opinion is not uncommon.
Though I have yet to talk to lesbians who enjoy watching gay(male) porn, so this whole intersecting stuff is hard to gauge for me.
Donuts are good because you put your fingers in and then you eat it.
Well, I did mention that I think porn is not a necessary thing to figure it out, but I guess I could have broadened it to "it's not a real indicator either".
Long story short, if they never had a strong crush on a girl or fallen in love, it is quite possible they never thought of themselves as gay. Just that they had an issue with liking guys.
And as we see here, the mc will finally realize it because she will fall in love
Donuts are good because you put your fingers in and then you eat it.
That’s just like . . . um . . .
Oh.
Donuts are good because you put your fingers in and then you eat it.
That’s just like . . . um . . .
Oh.
Sooo, it's only a matter of time before some one over the tops this, so am just gonna do it
Too soon?
Donuts are good because you put your fingers in and then you eat it.
That’s just like . . . um . . .
Oh.
Sooo, it's only a matter of time before some one over the tops this, so am just gonna do it
Too soon?
OMg I forgot that manga... And her name is Donut! that's way too appropriate lo/
Satō-Senpai: "Doughnuts are good because they have a hole"
Me: *rolls eyes in pączki*
I feel weird reading this, like, it makes me feel sorry for both MC and myself irl. I think just like her. Except I am unable to even make friends irl.
last edited at Jan 8, 2020 10:29PM
I thought the same xD
Are you hailing from the land of poles as well?
Donuts are good because you put your fingers in and then you eat it.
That’s just like . . . um . . .
Oh.
Sooo, it's only a matter of time before some one over the tops this, so am just gonna do it
Too soon?
Not ... about donuts? 0///0
Actually this has been a pretty interesting discussion. After only one chapter. And someone was saying adult yuri doest get much attention.
Though some might disagree, many signs point towards the fact that the MC is indeed, very much do, gay. In this essay I will
Very interesting! I wouldn't have been disappointed if it ended there. Here's to hoping it only goes uphill from here!