Comment section does not disappoint. XDDD

Ok, for all of those who are blaming nene and doesn't like how she is treating amane and seriously think amane is the victim and hasn't done anything wrong, try reading again from ch 1, but this time, picture amane as male.
would you still think that the way she (he if you really get in the part) is acting is okay?

Ok, for all of those who are blaming nene and doesn't like how she is treating amane and seriously think amane is the victim and hasn't done anything wrong, try reading again from ch 1, but this time, picture amane as male.
would you still think that the way she (he if you really get in the part) is acting is okay?

Yes. The gender card is useless here. Amane doesn't do anything to Nene. While yes, she is clingy, she doesn't overstep any lines. Being unable to move on from a relationship is always bad, regardless of gender, but Amane didn't do anything worse than what Nene did (yet).

I mean if we flip the gender bias card, how about you replace Nene with a guy during her aggressive flirting/date with Kou? To a yuri community that argument will always make things look worse.

Ok, for all of those who are blaming nene and doesn't like how she is treating amane and seriously think amane is the victim and hasn't done anything wrong, try reading again from ch 1, but this time, picture amane as male.
would you still think that the way she (he if you really get in the part) is acting is okay?

Yes. The gender card is useless here. Amane doesn't do anything to Nene. While yes, she is clingy, she doesn't overstep any lines. Being unable to move on from a relationship is always bad, regardless of gender, but Amane didn't do anything worse than what Nene did (yet).

I mean if we flip the gender bias card, how about you replace Nene with a guy during her aggressive flirting/date with Kou? To a yuri community that argument will always make things look worse.

Ok, you're right, let's keep the sex of the person aside. I think excessive clinging, ask for a kiss and trying to pull an "i still love you" to your ex to make them feel bad so they get back together with you is way more aggresive than hugging and hand holding someone when all the people imply knows that you're single and clearly don't want to get back with your ex.

I know nene is not a saint, but no matter what you have done, who you are or what relationship you had with the other party, no means no and amane should have stop with her advances at the first negative, im sure that if kou rejected the hug and hand holding at the moment, nene would back off, sure, feel bad, but still putting kou's feelings first than her's. My point is, there's no victims here and they shouldn't be no martyrs, amane doesn't have the right to be on that title

last edited at Jun 9, 2019 4:31PM

Ok, you're right, let's keep the sex of the person aside. I think excessive clinging, ask for a kiss and trying to pull an "i still love you" to your ex to make them feel bad so they get back together with you is way more aggresive than hugging and hand holding someone when all the people imply knows that you're single and clearly don't want to get back with your ex.

I know nene is not a saint, but no matter what you have done, who you are or what relationship you had with the other party, no means no and amane should have stop with her advances at the first negative, im sure that if kou rejected the hug and hand holding at the moment, nene would back off, sure, feel bad, but still putting kou's feeling first than her's. My point is, there's no victims here and they shouldn't be no martyrs, amane doesn't have the right to be on that title

Amane does however back off whenever Nene makes clear she is against it. Even that devious line of "You can kiss me, but I will hate you forever"... that is so manipulative. Nene does act exceptionally cruel or erratic at times and I think Amane worries for her.

That doesn't necessarily excuse her obsession, but compared to senpai who enjoys her suffering and is potentially responsible for a lot of it and compared to Nene who is throwing herself at Kou who is clearly extremely uncomfortable with the whole situation, I'd say Amane is still more of a good person. A victim to senpai, certainly that too.

Now martyrdom is completely out of place and I have yet to see anyone claim that.

last edited at Jun 9, 2019 4:36PM

It’s just not fucking okay to make advances on an ex who: not only broke off the relationship, but has consistently rejected your prodding, asking leading questions, and inconsiderate confessions.

I don’t think Amane recognizes what she’s doing as harassment, but intention doesn’t absolve her of responsibility. Especially after Nene agreed to stay friends because she knew it would soften the blow for Amane. She’s just been exploiting that trust selfishly.

I hope Amane finds a healthier relationship than what she’s immersed in, yes, but right now she’s doing all of the hanging-on.

JazzLafayette posted:

I hope Amane finds a healthier relationship than what she’s immersed in, yes, but right now she’s doing all of the hanging-on.

It'd kinda help to know what went wrong and why. It's far more difficult to just let go when you don't know why things ended the way they did. Even more so when it's seemingly completely out of the blue and things seemed to just change overnight.

It’s just not fucking okay to make advances on an ex who: not only broke off the relationship, but has consistently rejected your prodding, asking leading questions, and inconsiderate confessions.

I don’t think Amane recognizes what she’s doing as harassment, but intention doesn’t absolve her of responsibility. Especially after Nene agreed to stay friends because she knew it would soften the blow for Amane. She’s just been exploiting that trust selfishly.

I hope Amane finds a healthier relationship than what she’s immersed in, yes, but right now she’s doing all of the hanging-on.

We don’t know why Nene agreed to stay friends, just as there is ambiguity about why she broke up with Amane in the first place.

There’s no evidence in the text of any “trust” on the part of Nene that Amane is supposedly “exploiting.”

It’s just not fucking okay to make advances on an ex who: not only broke off the relationship, but has consistently rejected your prodding, asking leading questions, and inconsiderate confessions.

I don’t think Amane recognizes what she’s doing as harassment, but intention doesn’t absolve her of responsibility. Especially after Nene agreed to stay friends because she knew it would soften the blow for Amane. She’s just been exploiting that trust selfishly.

I hope Amane finds a healthier relationship than what she’s immersed in, yes, but right now she’s doing all of the hanging-on.

We don’t know why Nene agreed to stay friends, just as there is ambiguity about why she broke up with Amane in the first place.

There’s no evidence in the text of any “trust” on the part of Nene that Amane is supposedly “exploiting.”

She’s clearly upset whenever Amane tries to make things romantic, no? It doesn’t seem like she had any idea ahead of the break-up that Amane would make the request, either, or that she had any real intention of exploiting the friendship.

At the moment it reads like “I’d like to continue getting along with you like you asked, but you’re making it incredibly difficult.”

^ Applying the term “exploiting” or “harassment” to what Amane is doing seems quite extreme. She was clearly blind-sided by the breakup, as Nene must have known she would be, and was desperate to keep some kind of connection. Nene seems almost as anxious to keep a connection with Amane herself, albeit a connection that she insists be non-romantic.

All this moralizing about Amane’s behavior ignores or handwaves away the multiplying open questions about Nene’s motivations which are presently central to the story.

If people would disapprove of a person acting like Amane does in real life, fine, deplore away to your heart’s content. Meanwhile, the story itself is building a rather creepy complex around the themes of “cuteness,” physical appearance, “friendship,” and emotional manipulation, one that involves all the characters to varying degrees, but with the breakup of the Nene-Amane relationship at the heart of it.

Contrariwise, not only is Nene herself giving some pretty mixed signals but the way she keeps flipping between relative niceness and wanton emotional cruelty is disturbingly (and probably intentionally) close to classic patterns of abusive relationships...
Whatever Amane's faults in this context she's certainly the one behaving very meaningfully less objectively wrong.

Just caught up on the and holy shit nene is such a cunt i'm dying.

Contrariwise, not only is Nene herself giving some pretty mixed signals but the way she keeps flipping between relative niceness and wanton emotional cruelty is disturbingly (and probably intentionally) close to classic patterns of abusive relationships...
Whatever Amane's faults in this context she's certainly the one behaving very meaningfully less objectively wrong.

What are these mixed signals you are talking about? Nothing in Nene's behavior points to her still liking Amane.

Contrariwise, not only is Nene herself giving some pretty mixed signals but the way she keeps flipping between relative niceness and wanton emotional cruelty is disturbingly (and probably intentionally) close to classic patterns of abusive relationships...
Whatever Amane's faults in this context she's certainly the one behaving very meaningfully less objectively wrong.

What are these mixed signals you are talking about? Nothing in Nene's behavior points to her still liking Amane.

You’re conflating “being nice to” and “liking” (in the romantic sense).

Nene (mostly) treats Amane like a long-time friend. We actually don’t see Amane and Nene together in all that many present-tense scenes, and in the photo session in chapter 1 and the beach frolicking in chapter 2 Nene is either actually having fun being with Amane (and Kou), or she’s completely faking it. Other scenes begin with the two of them together as if they are normal best friends.

And, yes, instead of straightforwardly telling Amane that she won’t kiss her because she doesn’t feel that way about her anymore but saying she will kiss her and then hate her forever, that is unnecessary cruelty.

Contrariwise, not only is Nene herself giving some pretty mixed signals but the way she keeps flipping between relative niceness and wanton emotional cruelty is disturbingly (and probably intentionally) close to classic patterns of abusive relationships...
Whatever Amane's faults in this context she's certainly the one behaving very meaningfully less objectively wrong.

What are these mixed signals you are talking about? Nothing in Nene's behavior points to her still liking Amane.

You’re conflating “being nice to” and “liking” (in the romantic sense).

Nene (mostly) treats Amane like a long-time friend. We actually don’t see Amane and Nene together in all that many present-tense scenes, and in the photo session in chapter 1 and the beach frolicking in chapter 2 Nene is either actually having fun being with Amane (and Kou), or she’s completely faking it. Other scenes begin with the two of them together as if they are normal best friends.

And, yes, instead of straightforwardly telling Amane that she won’t kiss her because she doesn’t feel that way about her anymore but saying she will kiss her and then hate her forever, that is unnecessary cruelty.

To me, the kiss scene reflect how sick and tired is nene of amane's behaivour, she has said no before and she doesn't take it seriously, the need of amane's skinship is no better than the urge of a molester on a train troupe we often see in mangas. Is like asking if you can touch fire, you can, but of course, you will get burn, is the same, you can pull an unwanted sexual advance, but that person will not like it because is UNWANTED, leading to a bad feeling that is conditioned to the person who did the action.

last edited at Jun 10, 2019 6:16PM

I always forget that readers tend to immediately divide into camps by making moral judgments as if the characters were real people; hence the constant references to what it would be like in daily life if people were to act the way the characters act in the story.

So what could be readings of the actual story as a whole as it has been presented to us so far becomes gossip about imaginary people who exist only in cryptic fragments. Amane is a molester. Nene is a saint pushed to her limits by a former lover she cares nothing about anymore.

Knock yourselves out.

Reading this story is like scratching yourself while having a sunburn. It hurts to do it after a while, but you continue to do it cuz it feels kinda nice too. Also, yeah, what Camera girl is doint is not cool, specially when the Gyaru told her about her feelings for Mei 2.0

Mei 2.0 LMAOoOOO

You made my day sir

Wow, I made a mistake looking at these comments. Do people really think Kou is being insensitive when Nene is the one coming on to her? Stop pretending Nene has no agency; the story's done enough of that for a lifetime already.

I'll bet Nene broke up with Amane because of that bullshit about her being cuter when she doesn't smile.

Exactly, Kou is just a naive girl growing feelings for her. But like you said, Nene is the one making these advances. Plus Nene is also broken up with Amane already and have been for a long time, so she has the right to go for whoever else she wants. Kou is not being insensitive at all because it is not cheating to begin with lmao. Senpai is the truly fucked up one for being a witch.

Character discussions aside, this is really fun, this are the kind of arguments that you can enjoy

To me, the kiss scene reflect how sick and tired is nene of amane's behaivour, she has said no before and she doesn't take it seriously, the need of amane's skinship is no better than the urge of a molester on a train troupe we often see in mangas. Is like asking if you can touch fire, you can, but of course, you will get burn, is the same, you can pull an unwanted sexual advance, but that person will not like it because is UNWANTED, leading to a bad feeling that is conditioned to the person who did the action.

As you managed to frustrate Blastaar into giving up, let me take over.
That kiss scene was far from okay. Like Blasaar said, Nene had zero reason to act that way. Just saying no is enough, but instead she chose to be cruel...
Comparing Amane's skinship to molesting is just pure dishonesty. These are not sexual advances. When Nene rejects her, Amane backs off. When she wanted to kiss her she asked Nene first. You really have no idea what molestation or sexual harrassment actually are, do you?

Exactly, Kou is just a naive girl growing feelings for her. But like you said, Nene is the one making these advances. Plus Nene is also broken up with Amane already and have been for a long time, so she has the right to go for whoever else she wants. Kou is not being insensitive at all because it is not cheating to begin with lmao.

It's not about not having the choice to form new relationships... it's the fact that Kou is clearly uncomfortable with the whole situation and Nene is being really pushy. Kou is really complacent about the situation without actually trying to figure things out too. That's the real issue with her.
Nene isn't cheating on anyone and nobody said that.

Comparing Amane's skinship to molesting is just pure dishonesty. These are not sexual advances. When Nene rejects her, Amane backs off. When she wanted to kiss her she asked Nene first. You really have no idea what molestation or sexual harrassment actually are, do you?

That’s a super corny shot to take and just reminds me of every person I’ve ever heard ask “Okay, but did he touch you?” Like, from all that we’ve seen Nene has clearly and definitively made herself unavailable romantically to Amane. Asking your ex for cute makeouts is maybe okay once your relationship is on VERY SOLID ground, and even then if they say “nah” you leave it alone. Amane just. doesn’t. stop.

Nene doesn’t have to be a saint to have her boundaries respected. She doesn’t even have to be nice or decent.

You see, BugDevil, this is not a fictional story about characters, all of whom have psychological struggles of various kinds, some of the underlying reasons for which readers as yet have little or no solid information.

It’s a Human Resources training exercise depicting a variety of potentially problematic real-life scenarios to help you determine appropriate and inappropriate interpersonal behavior.

Expert counselors are standing by should you have any questions.

I see everybody coming up with theories of what might happen or what has already happened in the past. Before making anymore assumptions and deciding whether you like the character or not, we should really wait until we see Amane's and Nene's backstory. Why they dated and what could've been reasons of them breaking up.

The only reason Amane (to me) seems pushy is because Nene has offered no closure to her and she doesn't understand how to repair their relationship or just move on. Amane strongly believed in their relationship and gave herself to Nene completely, only for one day the girl she loves turns around and says 'we're done' without giving warning or purpose, so now Amane's left in a state of limbo. She doesn't know why they're no longer together and can't bring her self to simply walk away.

Nene seems to be going for Kou without regard to either Kou's nor Amane's feelings. She seems pretty aggressive (to me) in trying win Kou and disregard whatever relationship she once had with Amane. She seems to be a very self centered character that wants the attention of those around her. She doesn't actually seem to be all that different a character from Hayama. They each want their own happines (every one should) but without real care to those around them.