My god you like to ruin everything with all your SJW bickering.

Literally not seeing how anything in this argument could be described as "SJW" even by the loosest definitions of the term.

Petty vindictiveness and unhealthy levels of projection, sure.

My reply was based off your previous comments. This was just your most recent one.

yeah AND in my previous comment i never suggested ANYTHING murderous toward this character OR real people. i just said she didn't got what she deserved witch was nikaido despise her and not forgiving her. there was never anything suggesting she must die. just she didn't deserve any form of kindness from tadokoro or nikaido. and yes i REALLY don't understand HOW tadokoro could forgive her. on that you're right i don't understand forgiveness.

I don’t know if you’ve ever been to therapy or have considered it, but you should look into some sort of professional help if you’re this bothered by a light-hearted comedy. There’s definitely something deep there, and this is coming from someone who was bullied from elementary school well into high school. It could turn into something even more serious.

last edited at Apr 21, 2019 2:36PM

As far as Nikaidou is concerned, if the person isn't causing problems for Tadokoro they're simply not worth her attention at all.

Well... That is most likely not entirely true. Sure, she's letting Kirigaya off the hook because Tadokoro decided to forgive her, but as we saw in the first chapter, even before Nikaidou really got interested in Tadokoro, she was already very much against not only active bullying, but also just bad-mouthing someone behind their back.

REDflame23 and ypassionnate, both of you take it someplace else. This isn't the venue for it.

possible "Love Triangle" tag? XD

how overwhelming is the yuri power...

Tadokoro is too pure for this filthy world.

There's one thing in this development that bothers me.

Kirigaya is guilt-ridden. We know that. We know because the omniscient narrator told us. The omniscient narrator explained Kirigaya's feelings in detail, and even revealed to us flashes of her thoughts and mental images. That's why we know for sure that she is sincerely remorseful and repentant and apologetic and shit.

But it is only us, the readers, who hear the voice of the omniscient narrator. Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info. All they know is that Kirigaya is bawling and saying she's sorry. And that's the oldest trick in the bully's book. Every bully in the world knows that, when the time comes to pay the piper, when karmic retribution rears its ugly head, the right strategy is to cry a river, pretend to be repentant and beg for forgiveness. It's a good, time-tested method to save the bullies from having to bear the consequences of their actions. In fact, this chapter just gave us a fine example: Kirigaya demonstrated exactly how the method works.

This is what bothers me. The MCs have no way of telling whether Kirigaya is sincere or just a dirty little hypocrite who's performing the script every bully knows to follow in these cases. Unlike us, they cannot read the exposition dished up by the omniscient narrator. And yet they forgive her, just like that, and even want to be friends. The idea that it might be a trick doesn't even cross their minds. Fiction or not, they should know better than to trust so easily someone like Kirigaya.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Kirigaya is terrified of the idea of being hated by Nikaidou, remember? The only reason she didn't already suffer the (from her PoV) absolute worst-case scenario of being utterly shunned by the latter is because Tadokoro is the only hope that descended in this world that is an absolute existence and the cutest and most precious angel.

She'd have to be suicidally stupid to try anything that risks annulling that stay of emotional execution.

last edited at Apr 22, 2019 3:04PM

Lol... I don't even know how to react to this anymore. Fuck that bully bitch can we move on already

Nikaidou and Tadokoro don't have access to that info.

I think you're underestimating Nikaidou.

For sure. If Kirigaya actually is faking her repentance, that poses a threat not to Tadokoro, Nikaidou, or to their relationship, but to her own continued survival.

That's what we thought before, when Nikaidou caught Kirigaya bullying Tadokoro. "She's dead!" "She's history!" "RIP Kirigaya!" "Goodbye, bitch, nobody will miss you!"

Look what happened.

Kirigaya is terrified of the idea of being hated by Nikaidou, remember? The only reason she didn't already suffer the (from her PoV) absolute worst-case scenario of being utterly shunned by the latter is because Tadokoro is the only hope that descended in this world that is an absolute existence and the cutest and most precious angel.

She'd have to be suicidally stupid to try anything that risks annulling that stay of emotional execution.

But she won't. We know she won't try anything because the omniscient narrator said so. Remember? It's canon: her repentance is sincere.

You guys, discussing what will happen if she breaks her promise is a waste of time. What will happen? Will she get a beating this time? Or will she cry a little and be forgiven again at Tadokoro's request? It's pointless talk cause it won't happen: Kirigaya already saw the light and was redeemed. We know it as canon fact.

My point is that, unlike us, the MCs have no way of knowing. They can't read minds or hear the Word of God. (Superwoman jokes aside, the way they interacted during their flirting-but-not-yet-dating period makes it obvious.) I'm okay with Nikaidou taking back her declaration of despise and agreeing to "not hate" Kirigaya (cause Tadokoro would be sad otherwise, so she has no choice) but... befriending Kirigaya?? That's completely unnecessary and going way too far.

My point is that, unlike us, the MCs have no way of knowing. They can't read minds or hear the Word of God. (Superwoman jokes aside, the way they interacted during their flirting-but-not-yet-dating period makes it obvious.) I'm okay with Nikaidou taking back her declaration of despise and agreeing to "not hate" Kirigaya (cause Tadokoro would be sad otherwise, so she has no choice) but... befriending Kirigaya?? That's completely unnecessary and going way too far.

You seem to be underestimating the scope of Nikaidou's superpowers. More to the point, aside from hypothetical reprobacy being terminally stupid of her as already discussed since the Big N already knows what's up, Kiri already proved herself a very poor liar who's singularly unlikely to be capable of convincingly faking that level of emotional distress.

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

Probably safe to assume that as far as Nikaidou is concerned Kiri is for now "on probation" and will be kept an eye on until her bona fides have been proven beyond reasonable doubt though.

Probably safe to assume that as far as Nikaidou is concerned Kiri is for now "on probation" and will be kept an eye on until her bona fides have been proven beyond reasonable doubt though.

As evidenced by Nikaidou specifically telling Kirigaya that this is her last chance.

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

You mean those couldn't fly?! My life has been a lie... ;_;

This discussion sure has taken a turn for the weird.

I won't speak about fictional characters, but, concerning real-life youngsters and children (a subject I have professional knowledge about) I must say something. The number of little George Washingtons who couldn't tell a convincing lie to save their lives is incredibly low. Most kids know how to tell a lie in a plausible and persuasive way. Whether they will or will not is another matter, but they do have the skill. As for the ability to fake crying and feign remorse, it's very common as well, especially among children with a stern religious upbringing, who learn those skills (which are, for them, well-nigh survival skills) very early in life. The idea that it takes a sociopathic master liar to tell a convincing lie to a trained adult (a teacher, a priest, a psychologist) simply isn't true. These worthies, in real life, are fooled all the time by the fibs of teenagers and children. It's a dangerous fallacy (especially if your job is to deal with kids) to have such confidence in your power of discernment as to believe that no little brat will ever be able to trick you with a well made-up story.

Again, this is about the real world, mkay? And doesn't apply in any way or manner to the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl. Clear enough, I hope?

This story went from sweet sugar to dark sour chocolate real fast, kinda of silly going towards this direction

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

Could you clarify what your argument is and what the argument you're responding to is?

Seriously where do you people keep pulling this bizarre idea that petty schoolyard bullies are magically all sociopathic master liars who could bullshit their way through a psych evaluation, and why?

As has been previously suggested, we seem to have some examples of Commenter Genre Blindness--this just isn't the kind of story where a person like Kirigaya could cause a serious problem of any kind, full stop.

We recall that in the forum initially there was some uncertainty about exactly what the genre of this story was and how "realistic" it was supposed to be (there was some fairly detailed explication of the physics of thrown baseballs, if I recall correctly).

I think it's safe to say that at this point Nikaidou has displayed a preternatural ability to deal with any problem that may come along. Parsing out the ethics/justice of dealing with real-life bullies is like arguing about the nuances of 1940s warship construction in regard to Space Battleship Yamato.

Could you clarify what your argument is and what the argument you're responding to is?

I’ve said it clearly as I can already, but I’ll try again. There has been a fair amount of discussion as to what “should” or “should not” happen to Kirigaya or what Tadokoro and Nikaidou’s attitude toward her and her supposed reformation “should” be, all in relation to people’s real-life experience with/attitudes towards bullies.

If people want to use this story as the occasion to express their opinions about bullies and how to deal with them in real life, they certainly have the right to do so. I am saying that in the context of the story, much of that discussion is essentially irrelevant to the story and to probable future events in the story.

EDIT: A story that White Rose characterizes quite well above:

the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl.

last edited at Apr 22, 2019 8:35PM

I’ve said it clearly as I can already, but I’ll try again. There has been a fair amount of discussion as to what “should” or “should not” happen to Kirigaya or what Tadokoro and Nikaidou’s attitude toward her and her supposed reformation “should” be, all in relation to people’s real-life experience with/attitudes towards bullies.

If people want to use this story as the occasion to express their opinions about bullies and how to deal with them in real life, they certainly have the right to do so. I am saying that in the context of the story, much of that discussion is essentially irrelevant to the story and to probable future events in the story.

EDIT: A story that White Rose characterizes quite well above:

the fantastic universe of Super Nikaidou the woman of steel and her adorable sidekick Tadokoro the angel girl.

I agree with your (and White Rose's) take on what the story is. However I don't think commenters sharing their personal feelings on bullies, or their emotional reaction to the bully character in the story, indicates that they're genre-blind, or that they're not understanding the manga properly.

I agree with your (and White Rose's) take on what the story is. However I don't think commenters sharing their personal feelings on bullies, or their emotional reaction to the bully character in the story, indicates that they're genre-blind, or that they're not understanding the manga properly.

In some cases it might not.

As I said, readers are free to use the story as an occasion to hold forth on any topic the story raises.

From useless lesbians to not so useless

This thread got cancer real fast