I really dont want to bring the discussion down or anything but the recent chapters have honestly kinda cemented this series as true queerbait status to me.

Like more and more in this series I'm seeing a lot of implied gay but no following through ever, just implications because that sells copies and its far worse than I've seen in any series that isnt sound euphonium so its really sticking out to me and starting to affect my enjoyment of the series immensely.

I'd actually argue its worse than sound euphonium because they actually acknowledge these as crushes and/or homosexual attraction but never do anything with it at all, just continue to tease and tease and tease.

I don't think you understand what queerbaiting is then. Having crushes but never following through is not queerbaiting. You don't call a series that has a boy liking a girl but never actually going out "relationship baiting". Queerbaiting is straight people acting gay to attract a certain demographic. Hibike is queerbaiting, Love Lab is queerbaiting. Yuru Yuri and Maid Dragon are not queerbaiting despite the lesbians never actually getting in a romantic relationship with each other.

Rin is not straight, she's just a gay girl who is having trouble confessing her feelings for her best friend. It's simply part of the story and a frequent source of comedy.

Too lazy to read the other comments, so for now I'll just say that reading New Game listening to Lastation theme is really good.

I really dont want to bring the discussion down or anything but the recent chapters have honestly kinda cemented this series as true queerbait status to me.

Like more and more in this series I'm seeing a lot of implied gay but no following through ever, just implications because that sells copies and its far worse than I've seen in any series that isnt sound euphonium so its really sticking out to me and starting to affect my enjoyment of the series immensely.

I'd actually argue its worse than sound euphonium because they actually acknowledge these as crushes and/or homosexual attraction but never do anything with it at all, just continue to tease and tease and tease.

I don't think you understand what queerbaiting is then. Having crushes but never following through is not queerbaiting. You don't call a series that has a boy liking a girl but never actually going out "relationship baiting". Queerbaiting is straight people acting gay to attract a certain demographic. Hibike is queerbaiting, Love Lab is queerbaiting. Yuru Yuri and Maid Dragon are not queerbaiting despite the lesbians never actually getting in a romantic relationship with each other.

Rin is not straight, she's just a gay girl who is having trouble confessing her feelings for her best friend. It's simply part of the story and a frequent source of comedy.

Thank you. People use queerbaiting as a complaint for any series that involves lgbt but isn't 100% explicit and its really annoying. Not everything needs to be 100% out in the open.

People seem to complain about same thing over and over for a while now. This community seem to get more serious stuff recently and I sort of lazy to read it.

BTW this chapter I think at least 3 more ship is possible now in NewGame!

Jeez, can't think "straight"? Well she sure is straightforward about it at least!

Rainbows think straighter than Momo? ( ͡¬ ͜ʖ ͡¬)

Romance isn't even one of the genres for the series. It's all secondary stuff for extra character development.

It's like reading a hot-blooded battle manga and complaining it doesn't have enough comedic gag elements.

Romance isn't even one of the genres for the series. It's all secondary stuff for extra character development.

It's like reading a hot-blooded battle manga and complaining it doesn't have enough comedic gag elements.

Yeah I totally agreed with that.

Aoba is such a sinful senpai, raising all kinds of flags.

Aoba is such a sinful senpai, raising all kinds of flags.

Even in seniority she is senpai. But with age she never actually become anyone senpai yet, Poor girl. XD

Hifumi also raising a bunch recently after season 2 aired.

At some point when your "roommate" and you do "breast massages" in the nude, the answer requiring the fewest assumptions is that the gaydar says the power level is over 9000 is this reference still relevant are you entertained yet

Romance isn't even one of the genres for the series. It's all secondary stuff for extra character development.

It's like reading a hot-blooded battle manga and complaining it doesn't have enough comedic gag elements.

Yeah I totally agreed with that.

I've noticed a certain segment of users seem to have extremely narrow tastes and loudly complain about anything that doesn't fit those. They seem to only want to read a single genre, with stories that follow a single pattern of plot developments and characters that fit into a single set of archetypes.

Which I guess is fine if people want to read essentially the exact same thing over and over again, but I don't think they really have any place complaining about things which aren't that.

And with that in mind, it's much easier to ignore them.

This manga isn't a romance and it's not required to have romantic relationships in it, but I see how the treatment of the "subtext" could be frustrating, even if it is ostensibly there for comedic purposes. Definitely some teasing going on IMO no matter how you slice it, even if it's not really queerbait.

Which I guess is fine if people want to read essentially the exact same thing over and over again, but I don't think they really have any place complaining about things which aren't that.

And with that in mind, it's much easier to ignore them.

People have complained about unresolved gay subtext for ages now, it doesn't mean they want to read the same story over and over, just that they feel the relationships in the story aren't being treated entirely respectfully (YMMV on the RIn and Kou dynamic).

That Momo girl has some interesting "assets" as it were

This manga isn't a romance and it's not required to have romantic relationships in it, but I see how the treatment of the "subtext" could be frustrating, even if it is ostensibly there for comedic purposes. Definitely some teasing going on IMO no matter how you slice it, even if it's not really queerbait.

Which I guess is fine if people want to read essentially the exact same thing over and over again, but I don't think they really have any place complaining about things which aren't that.

And with that in mind, it's much easier to ignore them.

People have complained about unresolved gay subtext for ages now, it doesn't mean they want to read the same story over and over, just that they feel the relationships in the story aren't being treated entirely respectfully (YMMV on the RIn and Kou dynamic).

Cant really respond to everyone so I'll just respond to this as it better conveys what I was trying to get across.

It's incredibly frustrating being a lesbian and seeing so many queer relationships being just jokes or constantly teased and then never done anything with at all, im not asking for everything to be sakura trick but I would just like for once one of these series to actually have the brass to have it be more than just a crush because otherwise its honestly starting to feel like my sexuality is just being exploited for some quick cash.

This manga isn't a romance and it's not required to have romantic relationships in it, but I see how the treatment of the "subtext" could be frustrating, even if it is ostensibly there for comedic purposes. Definitely some teasing going on IMO no matter how you slice it, even if it's not really queerbait.

Which I guess is fine if people want to read essentially the exact same thing over and over again, but I don't think they really have any place complaining about things which aren't that.

And with that in mind, it's much easier to ignore them.

People have complained about unresolved gay subtext for ages now, it doesn't mean they want to read the same story over and over, just that they feel the relationships in the story aren't being treated entirely respectfully (YMMV on the RIn and Kou dynamic).

Cant really respond to everyone so I'll just respond to this as it better conveys what I was trying to get across.

It's incredibly frustrating being a lesbian and seeing so many queer relationships being just jokes or constantly teased and then never done anything with at all, im not asking for everything to be sakura trick but I would just like for once one of these series to actually have the brass to have it be more than just a crush because otherwise its honestly starting to feel like my sexuality is just being exploited for some quick cash.

So you get mad every time there is a gay crush? That just sounds unreasonable. You say that you don't want everything to be like Sakura Trick but when it isn't you get frustrated? And what other series are you talking about? There are quite a few series that do take the crushes beyond subtext and some that don't, just like how some series keep het crushes just that instead of going beyond with an actual relationship. Hell, most harem garbage doesn't end with an actual relationship between MC and any of the girls.

Also, in many "romance" manga, the actual romance is the end-game, that will only get "real" at the very end of the manga, so everything before that point is just flirting, subtle or not. So yeah, that's not even relevant to the yuri genre, just that most authors seems unable to figure out how to keep their book going after they actually start dating.

This manga isn't a romance and it's not required to have romantic relationships in it, but I see how the treatment of the "subtext" could be frustrating, even if it is ostensibly there for comedic purposes. Definitely some teasing going on IMO no matter how you slice it, even if it's not really queerbait.

Which I guess is fine if people want to read essentially the exact same thing over and over again, but I don't think they really have any place complaining about things which aren't that.

And with that in mind, it's much easier to ignore them.

People have complained about unresolved gay subtext for ages now, it doesn't mean they want to read the same story over and over, just that they feel the relationships in the story aren't being treated entirely respectfully (YMMV on the RIn and Kou dynamic).

Cant really respond to everyone so I'll just respond to this as it better conveys what I was trying to get across.

It's incredibly frustrating being a lesbian and seeing so many queer relationships being just jokes or constantly teased and then never done anything with at all, im not asking for everything to be sakura trick but I would just like for once one of these series to actually have the brass to have it be more than just a crush because otherwise its honestly starting to feel like my sexuality is just being exploited for some quick cash.

So you get mad every time there is a gay crush? That just sounds unreasonable. You say that you don't want everything to be like Sakura Trick but when it isn't you get frustrated? And what other series are you talking about? There are quite a few series that do take the crushes beyond subtext and some that don't, just like how some series keep het crushes just that instead of going beyond with an actual relationship. Hell, most harem garbage doesn't end with an actual relationship between MC and any of the girls.

You do realise theres a middle ground between kissing every single waking moment and "oh look at this homosexual crush we'll joke about but never actually go through with lol" right?
Also the comparison lacks merit because on the whole you'll generally find that most of the het crushes in manga eventually happen even if its just in the epilogue, homosexual relationships rarely if ever have this luxury, they just remain jokes and shipping fuel forever.

The harem comparison is straight up not applicable because harems exist to self insert the main character into a situation with a ton of guys/girls all vying for them so the audience member can pick their best girl/boy while also not alienating any of the audience that might come from one actually picking a definitive character to pair with, most harem manga literally just exists as a quick way to get popular and most of it is utter trash.

And no I do not get mad at every gay crush that doesnt go anywhere, I get frustrated when it becomes a trend of which it has certainly become, not nearly as bad as the good ol' bury your gays but it is starting to feel exploitive, specially since I just got off talking to my girlfriend about a bunch of kyoani shows and remembering just how many of those bait the living shit out of the audience.

Finally for this series specifically its honestly just boring writing that EVERY relationship in this series can be summed as "gay moments sometimes, never followed up on" ugh this is why K-on is one of the only CGDCT series I can honestly say was actually good and not just enjoyable (till the movie anyway which is something I personally despise)

Also, in many "romance" manga, the actual romance is the end-game, that will only get "real" at the very end of the manga, so everything before that point is just flirting, subtle or not. So yeah, that's not even relevant to the yuri genre, just that most authors seems unable to figure out how to keep their book going after they actually start dating.

And this is what I consider a lack of creative effort on the part of a lot of authors, its why I tend towards manga that do not do this and instead just focus on the relationship now that its happened and how it affects the characters involved.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 6:58AM

Aoba is such a sinful senpai, raising all kinds of flags.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 7:13AM

You do realise theres a middle ground between kissing every single waking moment and "oh look at this homosexual crush we'll joke about but never actually go through with lol" right?

Well seeing as how Sakura trick is no sex and no actual relationship between the main two girls other than their daily kisses there isn't much room in between those two.

Also the comparison lacks merit because on the whole you'll generally find that most of the het crushes in manga eventually happen even if its just in the epilogue, homosexual relationships rarely if ever have this luxury, they just remain jokes and shipping fuel forever.

That's just simply not true. A lot of het crushes go completely unrequited. Mathematically most crushes in harem shit goes no where. Gay relationships are no different. Some progress and some don't. You are acting like none of them progress, which is just not true.

The harem comparison is straight up not applicable because harems exist to self insert the main character into a situation with a ton of guys/girls all vying for them so the audience member can pick their best girl/boy while also not alienating any of the audience that might come from one actually picking a definitive character to pair with, most harem manga literally just exists as a quick way to get popular and most of it is utter trash.

So you are saying that harem manga is literally just het baiting? Nothing but tease with no actual end game relationship? How is it not applicable?

And no I do not get mad at every gay crush that doesnt go anywhere, I get frustrated when it becomes a trend of which it has certainly become, not nearly as bad as the good ol' bury your gays but it is starting to feel exploitive, specially since I just got off talking to my girlfriend about a bunch of kyoani shows and remembering just how many of those bait the living shit out of the audience.

Now that just doesn't make sense. If you are mad that gay crushes has become a trend then how you are you not getting mad at every time it happens? Also, you are just wrong in general. Izetta, Flip Flappers and the currently airing Princess Principal are all recent shows that progress beyond just subtextual crushes. It sounds like you want slice of life shows like New Game and GochiUsa to go from sitcom to romcom and that isn't going to happen. They have their genres and they are going to stick to them.

And the whole KyoAni thing is way overblown. What shows have they done that are queerbait except for Hibike?

Finally for this series specifically its honestly just boring writing that EVERY relationship in this series can be summed as "gay moments sometimes, never followed up on" ugh this is why K-on is one of the only CGDCT series I can honestly say was actually good and not just enjoyable (till the movie anyway which is something I personally despise)

Except Kou and Aoba's sempai/kohai relationship that is purely professional. Aoba has a purely professional relationship with almost every character, so your claim that "every" relationship is queerbaiting just seems bizarre. Every character has about 1 gay-heavy relationship with another character while their others are purely friendship/co-workers. And funny that your favorite CGDCT is k-on despite just saying how much Kyoani queerbaits.

People have complained about unresolved gay subtext for ages now, it doesn't mean they want to read the same story over and over, just that they feel the relationships in the story aren't being treated entirely respectfully (YMMV on the RIn and Kou dynamic).

I want to be fair to people, but I've seen people drop series and complain about them for absurdly general reasons, such as the simple existence of male characters or explicitly straight characters or the fact that a series has no romantic element at all. (Not even unresolved subtext; I mean series that have essentially no subtext at all without reading way too deep in to things.)

Which is a bit more than just whining about unresolved subtext. It's demanding that every series be a serious romance containing exclusively homosexual women.

And honestly, after seeing how specific some of the complaints can get, it starts getting difficult to take many of them seriously.

For instance, I recall there being complaints when NG introduced Hana-chan in the spinoff. A male character who you could not make less threatening if you tried. Who was on-screen for all of two pages. Exclusively in the bonus material.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 2:46PM

Aoba is such a sinful senpai, raising all kinds of flags.

Big Fat Thumbs Up! XD

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 10:06PM

I don't know if Sakura Trick is the best example of a non-subtext anime considering... those idiots ain't even in a relationship 'cause "THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT LOVE IS." Same goes for Flip Flappers, Izetta, and Princess Principal since the couples in all these anime still remain subtext to the end... I only did watch FliFla though, so I might be wrong about the other two. I mean, you'd have to be fucking blind, deaf, and willfully ignorant to not notice that Cocona and Papika are in a 'ship, and the director did come out and say "yes, they're dating," but, still, I'd have liked a kiss at the end or something. At least PriPri (hey, I wonder if anyone actually calls it that) is still ongoing so, who knows, perhaps they'll have a legitimate kiss after they saw how successful FliFla was? (I hope it was successful anyway, I dunno if it actually was).

You know, this is completely unrelated to the topic, I've always appreciated Kuzu no Honkai and Kiss Him Not Me for their fairly respectful portrayals of lesbians. Yeah, the lesbian character in KnH doesn't get the girl and I don't expect the lesbian in Kiss Him Not Me to get the girl either, but their love is both treated as legitimate affection as opposed to just schoolgirl puppy love or whatever... which is exactly the same as New Game, ain't it? Well, at least they actually act on their affection and, in the case of KnH's lesbian, actually have some fun (more like miserable but yeah) sexy times with their crush (the one thing that bothered me about KnH was that Hanabi said she was a virgin after she had sex with Ecchan... I guess she's going by the 'penis in vagina' definition of virginity, but, still, HOW THE FUCK IS FINGERING NOT SEX. Ecchan's creep cousin also bothered me a bit, but there's no indication that she reciprocates his love so FUCK YOU DUDE).

And the whole KyoAni thing is way overblown. What shows have they done that are queerbait except for Hibike?

I guess you could count Kobayashi-san as queerbait from a certain POV (I don't but some do). I hear Tamako Market had some queerbaiting, but I haven't watched it, so I wouldn't know... I did hear that it has a trans character too, so that's cool. I haven't watched Haruhi Suzumiya, but she's apparently bi and sexually harasses that redhead all the time? Seems like standard shitty CGDCT antics, but I dunno if that's accurate. I felt a bit... queerbaited by K-On, but that's probably 'cause I watched it just 'cause I liked the ships and I wanted to see more of it (Mugi is great though, definitely). Apparently, that Chunnibyou thing has those two chicks... what are their names, uh, Shinkai and Dekibo? Then there's Lucky Star and Kagami and Konata, but that's probably a bit overblown (I haven't watched that either, by the way). I think Free has some queerbait too, but I'm not qutie sure about that one. And, of course, HIBIKE. So, yeah, that's... like 9 out of 23, a bit more than 1/3 of their works... of course, this is all debatable especially considering I only watched 2 out of 9 of those things, but still, it seems like their reputation for queerbaiting is well-earned.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 1:36PM

You can start comparing New Game to Euphonium when Aoba starts going out with a boy she previously barely spoke to, Hifumi starts pining after Eagle Jump's much older male CEO, they both stop talking to each other, and the Mangaka gives some interviews talking about how Aoba and Hifumi were "closer than romance" and then extolling the romantic virtues of Generic Childhood Friend #40

Same goes for Flip Flappers

We're talking about a show in which the two female leads repeatedly declare their love for each other and ultimately defeat the protaganist's evil, disapproving mother with the power of their love, complete with armored wedding dresses, right?

I mean they don't kiss, sure, but I'd say that probably has more to do with the writers not wanting to have a couple of 13 year olds get too physical with eachother, and if you need an on-screen kiss to count a romance as "real" then you're going to find that a whole lot of straight romance fails to meet that bar just as well.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 1:43PM

You can start comparing New Game to Euphonium when Aoba starts going out with a boy she previously barely spoke to, Hifumi starts pining after Eagle Jump's much older male CEO, they both stop talking to each other, and the Mangaka gives some interviews talking about how Aoba and Hifumi were "closer than romance" and then extolling the romantic virtues of Generic Childhood Friend #40

God damn it, this thread is really just making me hate Hibike even more. We can only hope that never happens in New Game... good thing there are zero important male characters and almost no male characters at all. The only ones that I can remember off the top of my head are Yun's younger brother, Soujirou, and that gay dude (Hana-chan apparently), but, you know, one's like six, one's gay, and one's a freaking hedgehog, so I'm not really too concerned there... Surely, they wouldn't ever canonize Yun x Yun's brother and Hifumi x Soujirou, right? SURELY? I always hear that shows queerbait 'cause they want to avoid the controversy that often comes up over including gay peeps, so SURELY THEY WOULDN'T CANONIZE PEDOPHILIC INCEST AND BESTIALITY, RIGHT?

Same goes for Flip Flappers

We're talking about a show in which the two female leads repeatedly declare their love for each other and ultimately defeat the protaganist's evil, disapproving mother with the power of their love, complete with armored wedding dresses, right?

I mean they don't kiss, sure, but I'd say that probably has more to do with the writers not wanting to have a couple of 13 year olds get too physical with eachother, and if you need an on-screen kiss to count a romance as "real" then you're going to find that a whole lot of straight romance fails to meet that bar just as well.

I had actually forgotten about that whole armored wedding dress scene, so thanks for reminding me... The Class-S parody episode and the episode with all those different versions of Papika (I'm sure glad that those apparently male versions were actually female too, that was cool) which ended in succubus Papika lying on the bed in a locked room with Cocona were pretty blatant too, huh... I would say they should at least say "I love you," but Papika must've said that like 10 times per episode. I don't think Cocona ever said it though, so THERE, I'M RIGHT. But, seriously, the BDSM mistress or whatever she was and that Yayaka-focused episode were pretty damn blatant too, so... yeah, I can admit that I was wrong here. That said, I'm not asking for 13-year olds to get too physical with one another, and, hell, I doubt they'd even care anyway considering how they were sexualized so often... it's sad, I was planning on recommending this to friends 'cause it didn't have any fanservice, but then came Episode 3 with its BDSM themes, the many shower scenes, the mecha ass shot or whatever, and that fucking blue-haired girl, whatever her name was. The BDSM thing was fairly important to the plot, I hear the mecha ass shot's a parody of Code Geass, and there's some speculation that the blue-haired girl was just a red herring (still doesn't explain why her clothes are so skimpy but whatever), so I can concede that they're at least somewhat necessary, but those shower scenes were all unnecessary... I don't think it's a big deal, I'm just wondering why it was even included... okay, whatever, I'm getting off topic. Yeah, I don't want 13-year olds getting physical either, but I don't see any problems with a light kiss on the lips or whatever. It'd be nice if it happened, it's still okay that it didn't, but, yeah, it would've been a nice way to further solidify their relationship.

I don't think PriPri and Izetta had any combat scenes in matching wedding dresses, so there's that much... I guess I'm right about those two, at least? (we'll have to see what's in store for PriPri though).

Edit: This is completely random, but I've always thought that Yuri Kuma Arashi and FliFla were a bit similar in that they're both lesbian coming-of-age stories disguised under several layers of utter insanity. I'd say YKA was more subtle while FliFla was... not, but I liked FliFla more in the end, if only because of the pretty animation as opposed to YKA's meh animation.

last edited at Aug 12, 2017 10:23PM

I don't recall Haruhi showing any sort of romantic interest in girls outside of enjoying teasing the one girl. Which can't really be called romantic.

Lucky Star was a product (and embodiment) of the moe culture at the time and was pretty clearly never really meant to be serious in that aspect.

Tamako had one character say a single ambiguous line. You'd need some actual development on the point before you could seriously call it anything.

K-ON was... well, I don't really remember anything actually going very far into even the realm of subtext outside of Mugi looking at everything with yuri-goggles. But it's been years since I watched it.

I honestly don't recall there being the slightest yuri aspect in chuunibyou. Though I didn't really like it so I never watched the second season.