Forum › A Kiss And A White Lily discussion

Copy90_90_zpscf246422
joined Sep 18, 2014

The art got me confused this time. I was under the impression that Aika was significantly older than Hane and this in turn, made me wonder why she was at the school with Hane and not working.

Yeah, I thought so too. But apparently, they're only a few years apart. Maybe because Aika has that mature air around her?

Vegitab%20profile%20pic%20smoll%20tumblr
joined Sep 21, 2014

What?
Man, we gotta start from there?
Well sorry about the screenshots and links, but I don't think you'd take my word for it without referencing to the actual pages.

They weren't friends, they didn't even know each other's name.


The name part isn't super relevant to whether there is friendship or not tho
that's just like, your personal standard, man

They just talked about the cat pictures, that's not friendship

Tbh you can just talk about cats (or whatever topic) with someone and still be friends with them. Maybe not close friends, but still friends.
Except that it isn't the case here, Hiruma would confide in her about her worries too.

and is not absolutely anything to suddenly turn into a "I cant live without you" relationship.

Yeah I agree, that's debatable x)

Nina shows absolutely zero sign of actually being romantically attracted to Hiruma up until her ridiculous confession, only jealousy and dislike.

Well yeah? They never really spoke irl, and Nina only knew of Hiruma as the other girl Amane is showing interest in. It's not exactly far fetched to antagonise whom you're jealous of.
And finding out that Hiruma is her friend online put a strain on that too, and makes it difficult to [continue] acting chummy with her (online), since she resents her for her relationship with Amane. That's just Nina in denial and restraining herself tho, from cognitive dissonance. She likes Hiruma online, but there's no way she could behave that way around her irl, giving the situation. Can't forget Hiruma empathising with her and comforting her.
Lke I said, Nina was conflicted. Hiruma irl is a rival, but also turns out to be her friend online, whom Nina does care about.

The arc doesn't even clarify whether or not Hiruma reciprocates Nina's feelings.

Yeah it's not directly stated, but she gets pretty excited and pensive about her. I mean, she only heavily blushes and looks at her like that.
Hiruma is clearly super fond of Nina, and cares a lot about her and how she feels, going out of her way to reach out to her

I mean, I have defended some mediocre stories before after they get some hate but I can't come up with anything positive to say about that arc. It's just felt like Canno is just going down the list and couldn't figure out how to do a proper poly relationship, so just threw it together and called it a day.

Yeah sure, I'm just replying because you're nitpicking surprising parts of it haha
Like, fine by me if you don't think the relationships are built up well enough to be convincing, but if you start arguing that it's so because it "magically" happened, when it clearly didn't, and then argue that they "weren't friends", when they clearly were (and have stated it themselves), that's just kinda awkward tbh :s

Dark_Tzitzimine
Roar%20small
joined Dec 18, 2013

Yeah, I thought so too. But apparently, they're only a few years apart. Maybe because Aika has that mature air around her?

Is not only mature air, she outright acts like the stereotypical twenty something OL and she also looks older than the rest of the girls.

Capture
joined Dec 12, 2016

It's not a personal standard, it's just a fact. How can they be close friends if they don't even know each other's names? That just sounds sad.

So they did talk a little bit more than just cats even though that's how they started. But she confides in her like anyone who confides in Yahoo answers or /r/askreddit. Nothing really all that personal about the situation she is in. She doesn't talk to her like she would talk to an actual friend who would know more about the people involved.

Well yeah? They never really spoke irl, and Nina only knew of Hiruma as the other girl Amane is showing interest in. It's not exactly far fetched to antagonise whom you're jealous of.
And finding out that Hiruma is her friend online put a strain on that too, and makes it difficult to [continue] acting chummy with her (online), since she resents her for her relationship with Amane. That's just Nina in denial and restraining herself tho, from cognitive dissonance. She likes Hiruma online, but there's no way she could behave that way around her irl, giving the situation. Can't forget Hiruma empathising with her and comforting her.
Lke I said, Nina was conflicted. Hiruma irl is a rival, but also turns out to be her friend online, whom Nina does care about.

And absolutely none of it is portrayed romantically, therefore making the whole situation bizarre and hard to understand how it progressed from one to the other. Even the idea that their online friendship was special is hard to accept. Again, didn't even know that much about each other. Didn't know their names or where they lived or where they went to school. I got to know more about someone I played a game of CS with better than these two knew each other. No personal information exchanged between them and yet they are precious friends? That makes no sense.

Yeah it's not directly stated, but she gets pretty excited and pensive about her. I mean, she only heavily blushes and looks at her like that.
Hiruma is clearly super fond of Nina, and cares a lot about her and how she feels, going out of her way to reach out to her

There is still nothing there that indicates any actual romance between the two. She reached out to a cat photographer that she liked and that was it. She's a nice person who cares how people feel but there's nothing indicating that she treats Nina more special than anyone else.

Like, fine by me if you don't think the relationships are built up well enough to be convincing, but if you start arguing that it's so because it "magically" happened, when it clearly didn't, and then argue that they "weren't friends", when they clearly were (and have stated it themselves), that's just kinda awkward tbh :s

Except it did magically happen with no build up. The "romance" just sprung up out of nowhere. There was no talks of liking or being in love, it went from internet "friends" to love rivals to "I can't live without you" with nothing transitioning in between. It's jarring, unbelievable, and makes the whole relationship seem fickle. Not to mention that this whole polyamory starts because on girl just asks out every cute girl she meets, for an actual polyamory relationship that's just a time bomb.

Vegitab%20profile%20pic%20smoll%20tumblr
joined Sep 21, 2014

Wow. Really, a lot of the things you state about friendship are just personal opinions. You really can't impose your own standards, claim them to be actual facts, expect everyone to follow them and claim everything else to be bullshit and don't make sense. If it's hard to believe just because you can't relate, that's your own problem.

She doesn't talk to her like she would talk to an actual friend who would know more about the people involved.

An actual friend necessarily would know of whatever people are involved in whatever worries you're having? Lol? Is that another fact? Actual friends have to personally know all your other actual friends too? Unless it's a fact that any person only has one group of friends, not really.

And absolutely none of it is portrayed romantically, therefore making the whole situation bizarre and hard to
understand how it progressed from one to the other.

Your mileage may vary. Agree to disagree, if it was that hard for you to perceive anything at all

Even the idea that their online friendship was special is hard to accept.

cough personal standards and opinion cough. Kinda really hard to actually reply you, when a lot of these are statements are basically starting with IN MY OPINION, THEREFORE IT IS.

There is still nothing there that indicates any actual romance between the two.

Cus nothing had happened yet lmao
It happened with Nina acknowledged how she felt and made a move

She reached out to a cat photographer that she liked and that was it.

It sure is, if you blatantly ignore everything that showed what their relationship was like
I mean, that sounds like a really lazy way to dismiss any relationships ever, really. "Person A reached out to someone they wanted to get to know better and that was it". Yeah, if you cut everything out, that is indeed pretty much it.

She's a nice person who cares how people feel but there's nothing indicating that she treats Nina more special than anyone else.

Aside from how we actually don't see her treat other people that same way?
Hiruma apparently looks like a loner without friends too, I'm sure that if she acted super chummy and caring when vividly interacting with the rest of her classmates, they wouldn't have gotten the impression that she liked to be alone if she's trying so hard for everyone else as well.

Except it did magically happen with no build up.

And a sandwich is really just two or more slices of bread being an extremely underwhelming meal if you somehow ignore absolutely everything in between the slices too.
A buildup you find bad =/= no build up =/= a buildup you don't find believable

The "romance" just sprung up out of nowhere.

If you disregard any of their interactions, yeah.
I mean, Ayaka was kind and encouraging to Yurine in the beginning, and Yurine hella latched onto her. Ayaka said she'd beat her, and then Yurine forced a few kisses.
Izumi and Chiharu spent idk how many mornings together, hanging out. Izumi eventually grew insistent on helping Chiharu mend her relationship with her senpai, and after a big gesture, we got some signs that they were warming up to each other and got closer.
It's fictional romance, it really isn't uncommon for a character to perceive another under a romantic light after an important gesture or event/trigger of some kind, one that means a lot to them. For Nina, that gesture would be their talk under the rain. And it's not like Hiruma wasn't kind to her in their previous exchanges either.

There was no talks of liking or being in love, it went from internet "friends" to love rivals to "I can't live without you" with nothing transitioning in between.

Tbf, there are no need for such talks to acknowledge/realise how someone feels. Or is this also a fact?
For instance, we've yet to hear Ayaka admit to anyone nor herself whatever she may feel towards Yurine, but it sure as hell isn't hatred. Somehow, without such talks, it's almost like readers can make observations and understand what's going on from reactions, expressions, their behaviour, context and their interactions.
"I can't live without you" is Nina realising she needed Hiruma, because she fulfills a separate emotional need that Amane doesn't. Surprisingly, whether it's romantic or not, it's like different people have different relationships with one another. And in this case, it just so happens that her emotional attachment to Hiruma became romantic as well.
Finding it sufficient to decide whether or not it's believeable is one thing, stating that there are no transitions is another.

But sure, if you personally don't think anything that happened counted for much, that's fine. You can't just state your opinions like indisputable facts.
You can argue that it was done poorly, but you can't say that it wasn't done at all, just because you personally chose to dismiss anything that doesn't fit personal standards you try to pass off as universal facts
Your values and beliefs are your own. Even if they are common, they aren't absolute.
There's something kinda different about saying that "it's hard to form a trustworthy, close emotional connection with someone if you don't know what they look like", and "it's hard if they aren't considerate of your feelings but expect you to respect theirs", for example.
Inb4 you go "except everything I said is absolute, they aren't opinions, they are facts"

last edited at Aug 14, 2017 5:02AM

Capture%20sakukallen
joined Apr 17, 2015

Well as for Izumi and Chiharu, their second arc came like, four volumes later. (In fact, after the first arc, you only find out they started dating through a phonecall in the extra of v2, it was like bam, here you go). Volume 6 is still sorta recent, dunno if the 3TP couple would get more material later, or if that's pretty much it. I mean, until a second arc happened, we couldn't have known that Izumi and Chiharu were gonna get more development

Precisely, the fact that ChihaIzu was only officialised in a quick extra called for further development of how it happened and how each of them would live with it (although there was the Drama CD 2 I guess, but I assume not a lot of people bought it). With AmaNinaRyou it seemed pretty… final? I mean, we could have a piece of them later on, like Sawa and Itsuki in this chapter, but I don't really see a whole arc. Ah well, it's Canno, she does whatever she wants, so who knows. X)

Yeaah she got influenced by her peers, thought she had to grow up and stop relying on Aika as soon as she could. Now that she know she doesn't have to though, she can sorta find a balance for her feelings and be more honest about how she feels, what she feels insecure about. But yeah Aika is definitely part of her comfort zone.

I guess 'balance' is the right word, yeah. Relying on her less doesn't mean she has to completely cut her ties with her…

Is not only mature air, she outright acts like the stereotypical twenty something OL and she also looks older than the rest of the girls.

I'd assume that's because she's also an aunt and has to act the part somewhat (plus having a part-time job). I thought she was in college at first, but 18-ish years old doesn't seem too farfetched, especially for an anime Japanese school. cough She's pretty damn well-endowed too. cough

(udpdated chart… not that there was much to update)

last edited at Aug 14, 2017 6:30AM

IridescentBisexual
Catradora
joined Nov 23, 2016

the style of itsuki's hair in this chapter bothers me a bit (a lot)

last edited at Aug 14, 2017 7:04AM

IridescentBisexual
Catradora
joined Nov 23, 2016

but I'm happy her and Sawa appeared

Copy90_90_zpscf246422
joined Sep 18, 2014

@Lyendith
I'm still not convinced that Aika and Hane has a wholesome aunt/niece/sisters relationship, at least from Aika's side.

themusicman500
Screen%20shot%202017-07-13%20at%2010.17.07%20pm
joined Jan 18, 2016

@Lyendith
I'm still not convinced that Aika and Hane has a wholesome aunt/niece/sisters relationship, at least from Aika's side.

Aika is in love with Haine, that can't really be disputed. Whether she has the desire to kiss and/or have sex with her is what's kept ambiguous here.

2641afdd-9dc4-4327-a1c3-a5b558c33522
joined Mar 12, 2014

the style of itsuki's hair in this chapter bothers me a bit (a lot)

right right, im glad it wasn't just me

im still waiting for the moment the aunt jumps the niece and then the niece is all wait what, thats what you meant by soulmate???

Yuu
joined Mar 28, 2015

Looks like a pretty wholesome family relationship.

0asm1
joined Oct 28, 2013

im still waiting for the moment the aunt jumps the niece and then the niece is all wait what, thats what you meant by soulmate???

I'd like to see the niece jumps the aunt first tho, haha

Capture
joined Dec 12, 2016

Wow. Really, a lot of the things you state about friendship are just personal opinions. You really can't impose your own standards, claim them to be actual facts, expect everyone to follow them and claim everything else to be bullshit and don't make sense. If it's hard to believe just because you can't relate, that's your own problem.

Please, I would love to know how you can have a close friend that you don't even know their name. How the hell can they be close if you literally know nothing about them? That's not a personal opinion, that's just a fact. If they know nothing about them then they can't be close.

An actual friend necessarily would know of whatever people are involved in whatever worries you're having? Lol? Is that another fact? Actual friends have to personally know all your other actual friends too? Unless it's a fact that any person only has one group of friends, not really.

Yes they would, if not then it's no different than asking a stranger for advice.

Your mileage may vary. Agree to disagree, if it was that hard for you to perceive anything at all

What a cop out, fact is that there wasn't any romance between the two. Literally just online "friends" then love rivals and no feelings portrayed between the two of them that would be considered romantic by any measure.

cough personal standards and opinion cough. Kinda really hard to actually reply you, when a lot of these are statements are basically starting with IN MY OPINION, THEREFORE IT IS.

If you can't defend it with your own opinion then what's the point in starting the argument? How do you see their online friendship as special?

Cus nothing had happened yet lmao
It happened with Nina acknowledged how she felt and made a move

Nothing happened at all throughout the whole story, and why her "move" makes no sense.

It sure is, if you blatantly ignore everything that showed what their relationship was like
I mean, that sounds like a really lazy way to dismiss any relationships ever, really. "Person A reached out to someone they wanted to get to know better and that was it". Yeah, if you cut everything out, that is indeed pretty much it.

What am I cutting out? That's literally how they explain how they started contacting each other. Liked her cat pictures > talked to her.

Aside from how we actually don't see her treat other people that same way?
Hiruma apparently looks like a loner without friends too, I'm sure that if she acted super chummy and caring when vividly interacting with the rest of her classmates, they wouldn't have gotten the impression that she liked to be alone if she's trying so hard for everyone else as well.

She literally says in that panel that she has other friends in different classes. How did you miss that? And the person who has the impression that she liked being alone is literally the person we are talking about who she doesn't treat special.

And a sandwich is really just two or more slices of bread being an extremely underwhelming meal if you somehow ignore absolutely everything in between the slices too.
A buildup you find bad =/= no build up =/= a buildup you don't find believable

Bad build up is no build up. A foundation made up of shit is both not a good foundation and couldn't be justified as one.

I mean, Ayaka was kind and encouraging to Yurine in the beginning, and Yurine hella latched onto her. Ayaka said she'd beat her, and then Yurine forced a few kisses.
Izumi and Chiharu spent idk how many mornings together, hanging out. Izumi eventually grew insistent on helping Chiharu mend her relationship with her senpai, and after a big gesture, we got some signs that they were warming up to each other and got closer.
It's fictional romance, it really isn't uncommon for a character to perceive another under a romantic light after an important gesture or event/trigger of some kind, one that means a lot to them. For Nina, that gesture would be their talk under the rain. And it's not like Hiruma wasn't kind to her in their previous exchanges either.

Oh, you mean the Ayaka and Yurine romance that is literally spanning across the whole series and hasn't reached it's romantic conclusion yet? Might want to not use that one as an example. Izumi and Chiharu literally happened in an extra. It wasn't even deemed good enough by Canno to give it its own volume.

The talk under the rain which resulting in absolutely nothing romantic. Not even an inner monologue about how they are growing attracted to each other.

Tbf, there are no need for such talks to acknowledge/realise how someone feels. Or is this also a fact?
For instance, we've yet to hear Ayaka admit to anyone nor herself whatever she may feel towards Yurine, but it sure as hell isn't hatred. Somehow, without such talks, it's almost like readers can make observations and understand what's going on from reactions, expressions, their behaviour, context and their interactions.
"I can't live without you" is Nina realising she needed Hiruma, because she fulfills a separate emotional need that Amane doesn't. Surprisingly, whether it's romantic or not, it's like different people have different relationships with one another. And in this case, it just so happens that her emotional attachment to Hiruma became romantic as well.
Finding it sufficient to decide whether or not it's believeable is one thing, stating that there are no transitions is another.

No it's not "another". If it's not sufficient to be believable then why the hell would I say there was a transition at all? If it's not good enough to be a transition then I will state as such and will continue to. It's garbage writing, plain and simple. Their interactions are not romantic, Hiruma provides absolutely nothing to show she even reciprocates Nina's bipolar feelings.

But sure, if you personally don't think anything that happened counted for much, that's fine. You can't just state your opinions like indisputable facts.
You can argue that it was done poorly, but you can't say that it wasn't done at all, just because you personally chose to dismiss anything that doesn't fit personal standards you try to pass off as universal facts
Your values and beliefs are your own. Even if they are common, they aren't absolute.
There's something kinda different about saying that "it's hard to form a trustworthy, close emotional connection with someone if you don't know what they look like", and "it's hard if they aren't considerate of your feelings but expect you to respect theirs", for example.
Inb4 you go "except everything I said is absolute, they aren't opinions, they are facts"

Again, I can say it wasn't done at all because it wasn't. it's nice how hypocritical you are stating that I can't claim my opinions as facts but have to problem claiming your own as facts. Is it not your opinion that there was a transition, that there was romantic chemistry? You clearly said that I can't say these things didn't exist but only that they were done poorly. That's your opinion, drink your own kool aid for once. Your opinion that there was actual transition from love rival to romance can just be as wrong as mine stating that there was none.

And this doesn't even cover how ridiculous Amane acts. Can't wait for the follow up when Amane goes skirt chasing for more girls to add to her harem. I'm sure Nina will just fall in love with every single one and Hiruma will just sit there was a smile on her face accepting everything and not having an opinion of her own.

last edited at Aug 17, 2017 8:45AM

Img_0215
joined Jul 29, 2017

Wow, you guys seem really close. :-)

Vegitab%20profile%20pic%20smoll%20tumblr
joined Sep 21, 2014

Please, I would love to know how you can have a close friend that you don't even know their name. How the hell can they be close if you literally know nothing about them? That's not a personal opinion, that's just a fact. If they know nothing about them then they can't be close.

Christ, you associated two unrelated things and made a bullshit jump there.
If you don't know their name <=> you can't be close friends
If you don't know anything about them <=> you can't be close friends

Wtf, you legit went "an apple isn't a fruit because a rock isn't a fruit".
You're implying that not knowing their name means you don't know anything else about them.
You're comparing something you're personally generalising af to something true and trying to pass off the first statement true as well, wth

Yes they would, if not then it's no different than asking a stranger for advice.

Yes, in terms of personal involvement, but that's not the point? You ask them cus you trust them lmao. You want to ask them because THEY ARE an actual friend, because you value their thoughts and ppl tend feel comfortable with those they confide in lol?
Besides, what happens when you repeatedly confide in someone? You grow closer. They get to know you.
And tbf, Hiruma actually couldn't have asked her other "actual friends" because they are in other classes and have no involvement with what's going on with Amane and Nina either. Rip that her other friends aren't actual friends by your standards either

What a cop out, fact is that there wasn't any romance between the two. Literally just online "friends" then love rivals and no feelings portrayed between the two of them that would be considered romantic by any measure.

That there is very much indeed a fact. Or at least imposed like one, tho it's basically your opinion lmao. Idgaf about your opinions, I'm here cus you're claiming them to be facts. I argue about your so claimed "factuality" with what I saw that disproves it, and provide it to you. If you dismiss it, there really isn't anything else to add. If Nina referring to Hiruma as her "precious friend" is something you'd dismiss, then shit. Because really, what good is proof is you'll just pretend you didn't see it?
The moment you admit it's an opinion, I'm good. I'm fine with your opinion. The moment you do, it doesn't mean that "nothing happened", it just means that that's how you saw it. And that idc about, there's nothing else to be said.

If you can't defend it with your own opinion then what's the point in starting the argument? How do you see their online friendship as special?

Yeah but you hardly defended your opinion at all. You claimed your pov to be factual, or based it on what you claim to be "facts". If isn't based on anything legit then it's pretty much meaningless.
You say it's bull cus nothing shows it. I don't care that you think it's bull, I just disagree with "nothing happened", and showed you exactly what happens. I already shared and referred to the pages that contradict "they're not friends"/"nothing happens", showing Hiruma happy to think about her friend, showing her talk to her about her problems and feelings. You dismissed it. Because that's your opinion...?
You say there's nothing romantic.
I show you romantic tension between them and you say it isn't good enough. Well ight. It's clearly meant to be so, but if in your opinion it isn't then that also ends there, idc about debating your opinions.
If you state there's an absence and I show you examples, well if you dismiss them, there's nothing I can add, it just ends there.
I'm not responsible for your denial. If I show you examples and they're not convincing enough for your opnions, well that ends there, we'll just move on to the next unsolved thing.

Nothing happened at all throughout the whole story, and why her "move" makes no sense.

Refer to previous screenshots and links for examples of relationship development. That's how I'm showing you that things happened. I literally can't do anything about you dismissing everything and still state that nothing happened.

I mean, that sounds like a really lazy way to dismiss any relationships ever, really. "Person A reached out to someone they wanted to get to know better and that was it". Yeah, if you cut everything out, that is indeed pretty much it.

What am I cutting out? That's literally how they explain how they started contacting each other. Liked her cat pictures > talked to her.

That is indeed how they met, but you stated it as if that's all there was, as if they never progressed further than that, and that's what I'm commenting on.
You skipped that they did get to know each other better and are "precious friends" now. And that's quoting one of the involved characters. You're legit blowing off what a character states.
That is kinda what "that was it" means, you know. I've shown you that it wasn't just "it". I've done my part.

Aside from how we actually don't see her treat other people that same way?
Hiruma apparently looks like a loner without friends too, I'm sure that if she acted super chummy and caring when vividly interacting with the rest of her classmates, they wouldn't have gotten the impression that she liked to be alone if she's trying so hard for everyone else as well.

She literally says in that panel that she has other friends in different classes. How did you miss that? And the person who has the impression that she liked being alone is literally the person we are talking about who she doesn't treat special.

Yeah. Friends in others classes. I'm talking about her actual classmates? How did you miss that lmao
Clearly, by not having other friends in her class, and not hanging with her classmates, is how she gives off the impression of being a loner. That impression isn't just from Nina lmao, Hiruma clearly says "people apparently think that [...]", how did you miss that? Man, if you're gonna misread pages that are actually linked to you... Ight, being a loner is an impression Hiruma is aware people have of her. Nina's comment isn't anything new, or an impression only she has.
If Hiruma tried that hard for anyone else, she would easily be trying just as hard to reach out to her classmates, and would at least interact with them more frequently. If she had, there would be no reason for them think she gives off that impression. But she didn't. She doesn't jump and act friendly with just anyone else. If she did, you'd think that she'd just make new friends in class.
And ofc, she didn't treat Nina specially at the time because she didn't know she was her online friend. After she finds out? All over her. This isn't an opinion. This is from observing what happens.
You're trying to support your opinion that they weren't close because the way she treated Nina wasn't necessarily special, because she might treat everyone the same.
Except we don't see that. If she did, we'd see it. You're really just saying "maybe she treated everyone that way", so in your opinion, it's not a good enough example.
But yo, if she did, she'd have friends that's for sure. If she reached out to ppl, she wouldn't be "the loner".
And that isn't an opinion. That's what we see and are told.

It's fictional romance, it really isn't uncommon for a character to perceive another under a romantic light after an important gesture or event/trigger of some kind, one that means a lot to them. For Nina, that gesture would be their talk under the rain. And it's not like Hiruma wasn't kind to her in their previous exchanges either.

Oh, you mean the Ayaka and Yurine romance that is literally spanning across the whole series and hasn't reached it's romantic conclusion yet? Might want to not use that one as an example. Izumi and Chiharu literally happened in an extra. It wasn't even deemed good enough by Canno to give it its own volume.

Maybe I'm referring to these couples cus they're in this series, which I'm assuming you've somewhat read and minimally understood. And it's still legit a trope lmao. That those examples' arcs aren't over or good enough arcs for you doesn't disprove my point. It doesn't change that characters grow closer from stuff like that. A bunch of the first encounters or the "romantic turning point" of romance series are pretty simple and are easily used as justification for the attraction.

Hiruma reached out to Nina when she was at her most vulnerable, and held her when she felt the most lonely, the least understood and hurt, that's her turning point.
And tbf, no couple has an entire volume, so it really doesn't mean anything. Lol, name one volume with all chapters focused on one pairing.

The talk under the rain which resulting in absolutely nothing romantic. Not even an inner monologue about how they are growing attracted to each other.

https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/a_kiss_and_a_white_lily_ch29#24
And ofc, this:

You really can't say that I'm not least backing this up lmao. You stated another fact, I'm showing you what disproves it. If this doesn't sound like there are romantic undertones, well ight. It's clearly meant to indicate that she felt a romantic attraction to Hiruma, but fine, your mileage may vary.
And tbf. You said they weren't close friends. I show you legit quotes and you still said you didn't believe it.
???
Even if they stated more explicitly that they had feelings for each other, you wouldn't have believed it either tbh

Finding it sufficient to decide whether or not it's believeable is one thing, stating that there are no transitions is another.

No it's not "another". If it's not sufficient to be believable then why the hell would I say there was a transition at all?
If it's not good enough to be a transition then I will state as such and will continue to. It's garbage writing, plain and simple. Their interactions are not romantic, Hiruma provides absolutely nothing to show she even reciprocates Nina's bipolar feelings.

Yeah but that's an opinion that you're wording like a fact, a fact you don't back up. You just prove countless times that you've forgotten what happened, misread or blown it off.
You can't say a transition you don't find believable isn't a transition. You're acknowledging that it is one, you just don't like it. That's your problem, and it's inaccurate when you phrase it like that. That's why I won't bother with it, because that's not a fact, that's your opinion, and idc, its yours man
"Not romantic, [...] provides nothing"
Yeah I'm not gonna bother relinking stuff tbh. Too bad if you don't think it is.

Inb4 you go "except everything I said is absolute, they aren't opinions, they are facts"

Again, I can say it wasn't done at all because it wasn't.

Oh look, another opinion disguised as a fact. Let me try.
It was. I can also say "it was done", "because it was".
Hm, that doesn't quite feel like it holds much weight. Weird.
Anyways, since you always stated it as a fact, I just have to show you the times it was "done", and I have. How you take it isn't of my concern tbh.

it's nice how hypocritical you are stating that I can't claim my opinions as facts but have to problem claiming your own as facts. Is it not your opinion that there was a transition, that there was romantic chemistry?

Ye it's easier, I have no problem to state they were friends because oh wait links all the pages that show they were. Oh shit, maybe I'm not pulling an opinion out of thin air. Maybe it's actually based on something. Who knows. Maybe it's actually a fact that they are friends.
I referred to examples and showed you the actual pages like, a good couple of times tbh

You clearly said that I can't say these things didn't exist but only that they were done poorly. That's your opinion, drink your own kool aid for once. Your opinion that there was actual transition from love rival to romance can just be as wrong as mine stating that there was none.

Lol, opinions
You shared your opinion based on an inaccurate description of the series, neglecting multiple development points, stating it's terrible because you're choosing to ignore all those things.
I legit replied to say that they were indeed friends, and you were like no they're not. That's not even an opinion to be made tbh, it's legit what their relationship was in the beginning. Excluding everything else we've talked about, them being friends is at least the most obvious +plus canonically stated information. But nah, you don'f accept it
Very clear difference between "i dont think their friendship was convincing" and "their friendship wasn't convincing so they aren't friends"
I wasn't even here to argue about a difference in "opinions", it legit doesn't matter how differently we think. I'm here cus you went and stated that it's badly written because nothing happened. That's not even an opinion, you're literally stating that.
And hey, I'm arguing my side of whether your facts are true or not with examples and quotes yo. "They were friends cus look, all these pages where they each state that they're friends". Not an opinion, it's just what's depicted. And you're just repeating that if you dunno their name, address and school, you can't say you know them at all, that there was nothing romantic, no attraction. You're trying to counter what's text with your opinion. You just continuously misread, state fallacies as fact and brush the actual pages off.

Bad build up is no build up. A foundation made up of shit is both not a good foundation and couldn't be justified as one.

A low presence, or a debatably poor one, isn't an absence.
You're saying nothing happened.
I defend that, showing you what happened.
And then you just reveal by "nothing happened", you meant that you didn't think it was good enough so won't acknowledge it happened at all, in your opinion.
Well okay. If from reading this whole arc, you felt like nothing happened and don't see how anything lead to later relationship development, well no wonder it didn't make sense to you.
And that's the end of it tbh.

last edited at Aug 17, 2017 11:07PM

Screen%20shot%202017-07-13%20at%2010.17.07%20pm
joined Jan 18, 2016

Yo Cannibal, I often agree with the comments you post on this site, but you've really got to consider that other people have different values and different frames of reference than you. At times you dismiss other peoples' takes on the manga they're reading out of hand, even when they explain with evidence how they arrived at their interpretation. And you assume the author is either incompetent or doesn't have an intention they're trying to convey, which I don't recommend. Try to consider where the author is coming from, even if their writing doesn't quite work for you.

Ran-lossy
joined Mar 22, 2015

So Canno's poly couple is rushed and doesn't quite make sense at times...well, I can't blame her. It was a tough sell. All the poly couples I know are nowhere like the one she wrote into it, and frankly at this point I doubt any couple like the one Canno wrote even exists (she's very idealistic), but she tried!

I'd just take it as her biting off more than she could chew, not in her expertise, etc. Missing the mark is a part of growing and learning. It only really hurts if she were to continue writing something that caused a significant dip in ratings long term.

Best written thing I have seen similar to a poly is in Otoyomegatari one of the women asks her husband to marry her best friend as his 2nd wife so they can be together all the time (was getting some major gay vibes there but I guess the author didn't wanna get into that for historical accuracy). The writing is, what I would consider (maybe not everyone), miles away superior and it was still a difficult sell and I much preferred the other couples/women's stories. (If anyone is curious Otoyomegatari is written with the same story structure as this except it is het and set in 19th century Central Asia).

Capture%20sakukallen
joined Apr 17, 2015

Chap 35 preview.

Back to AyaYuri.

Meme%203093
joined Jan 19, 2015

^YAY!

Nozomi
joined May 11, 2017

I can believe it never occurred to me that there could be Yuri threesomes (hiruma, amane, yuunagi). I ship it.

Nozomi
joined May 11, 2017

Possible incest tag on chapter 34? Only time will tell.

Still very good. This is setting up to be an all time favorite close to Sasameki Koto or Girl Friends.

last edited at Aug 26, 2017 5:11PM

Capture%20sakukallen
joined Apr 17, 2015

Volume 7 cover!

Volume 7

I like it better than the volume 6 one, though Aika's face is a bit weird…

Also, chap 35's Little Theater, as a little apetizer (no spoilers, it's completely unrelated to the chapter).

Christmas Eve

Miyuki A real Christmas meal…
Two single girls having dinner together.
Are you really fine with that?

All our friends from college are having dates with their boyfriends.
It's kinda depressing.

Miho Is it really?
I'm honestly having the time of my life just dining with you.
The feeling's not mutual?

Miyuki …I won't lie, I'm actually having a blast too.
Miho Ahaha! All's well then! Let's enjoy ourselves!
Miyuki Dunno… Is this really alright…?

Miyuki 24 years old. Single.
Miho 25 years old. Single.

(I like how Canno's tweets are like "Yes, I'm doing a Christmas chapter in August, what of it?" XD)

last edited at Sep 7, 2017 9:48PM

Copy90_90_zpscf246422
joined Sep 18, 2014

Aika looks weird with the uniform.

Minimalist-cio
joined Sep 19, 2017

Why is every single girl in this girl gay?

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