Was that copied verbatim from the young republicans' rant on why gay pride needs to be ended or was that just a happy accident?

Wow, you're really good at beating that strawman. I make no difference between homo or heterosexual in this situation. I don't stop anyone from being a slut or a manwhore and I don't shame them either. You are just full of it.
Anyone can be proud of anything, but that is not reality and never will be. Perhaps promiscuity will be normalized one day alongside polygamy and whatever else, but the consequences of that lifestyle exist right now and that's a fact.

Those aren't even closely related to each other none the less this, but neither of those are things to be ashamed of either or not proud of so long as it's not toxic. "Emo kids" too, that's some LUG style nonsense.
This all reads like those cunty "what do they have to be proud of, why can't there be straight pride" trashspews, go fuck yourself and your essentialism.

These things (junkfood enthusiasm and emo cutters) are related in so far that they have averse consequences on your life and you can easily avoid them. It's your lifestyle choice unlike a sexuality or something you were born with. So please, go away with your false equivalencies and appeals to outrage culture. You can't turn this on me.

The way (some) people here manage to jump headfirst into stuffy Victorian moralism without even noticing never ceases to amaze, disappoint and amuse me in equal measure.

Morals were never a factor as far as I'm concerned. Aside from manipulating and hurting people of course, like Miyuki does.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 2:38PM

The way (some) people here manage to jump headfirst into stuffy Victorian moralism without even noticing never ceases to amaze, disappoint and amuse me in equal measure.

Morals were never a factor as far as I'm concerned.

You sure spend a lot of words condemning her "slutty" habits for that. Nevermind now parroting about verbatim the usual checklist Moral Guardian types tend to level against nigh any sexual behaviour outside whatever particular narrow stripe they find to be acceptable; I'm slightly disappointed at the lack of "think of the children!" there to be honest.

Now Miyuki's conduct towards Asuka can certainly disagreed with already on basis of the latter's age and not at all helped by the former's position as a surrogate big sister of sorts, but this and that are two quite separate matters.

Aside from manipulating and hurting people of course, like Miyuki does.

I suppose the former would be guilty as charged already by the default that "seduction" certainly falls under the rubric of interpersonal manipulation; the latter would be rather debatable and require citing what you think implies she's intentionally doing so just for starters.

Where is the person who asked for the author to write reptile lady harem yuri? I'd rather read more about that than read about posts shaming people for their sexual history.

Sleeping around always ends badly. Always. It's just a statistical inevitability.

[Citation needed] methinks.

Whether its a sexual disease, a bad partner who does something violent or whatever else you can think of.

The track record of more monogamous behaviour is pretty lousy in that regard too so this seems like an awfully weak argument to make...

Announcing it to everyone and getting a reputation for it ruins your social life in the long run too.

Last I checked she didn't do the former and as for the latter, well, sexually active girls catch that stigma awfully easy anyway; surely it won't be necessary to read out the stud/slut double standard to you? Though I'm wondering if you're quite aware that you're actively contributing to sustaining the latter here...

Was that copied verbatim from the young republicans' rant on why gay pride needs to be ended or was that just a happy accident?

Wow, you're really good at beating that strawman. I make no difference between homo or heterosexual in this situation. I don't stop anyone from being a slut or a manwhore and I don't shame them either. You are just full of it.

A "strawman" argument is attacking a viewpoint not espoused by the person making the initial argument. Comparing the similarities in your argument with another group's bullshit a strawman is not. I addressed the points you directly made, come up with a better retort. Saying someone shouldn't be proud is shaming them even if it is not to their face. The point is that your viewpoint is as stuck up as the anti-gay movement in the 90s and that recycling the exact arguments they had then does not lend credence to it.

Anyone can be proud of anything, but that is not reality and never will be. Perhaps promiscuity will be normalized one day alongside polygamy and whatever else, but the consequences of that lifestyle exist right now and that's a fact.

The idea that someone shoudln't be proud of something because there are social consequences is bullshit. That is the whole fucking point of pride, the courage it takes to stand up to essentialism and bullshit and be proud despite it. That in spite of the same tired fearmongering you stand up and say that this is your lifestyle and you're not changing it for blowhards.

Those aren't even closely related to each other none the less this, but neither of those are things to be ashamed of either or not proud of so long as it's not toxic. "Emo kids" too, that's some LUG style nonsense.
This all reads like those cunty "what do they have to be proud of, why can't there be straight pride" trashspews, go fuck yourself and your essentialism.

These things (junkfood enthusiasm and emo cutters) are related in so far that they have averse consequences on your life and you can easily avoid them. It's your lifestyle choice unlike a sexuality or something you were born with.

First off cutting and eating disorders can very much be caused mental issues someone is born with, even promiscuity can be part of someone's sex addiction which as most addiction is not something someone can control. More importantly there is no false equivalency here, the line about homosexuality being a negative "lifestyle choice" with consequences like AIDS has always been a big assault on homosexuals. Beyond just being gay the idea of the "homosexual lifestyle" being something people should not be proud of is a huge issue. Even if these were all choices none of them are things that someone should be ashamed of anymore than anyone else. Why should someone be proud to have a stable single relationship? Or be proud of being vegan? Or of being good at videogames? Certainly all choices, many with destructive side effects, but saying any of these should not give someone pride so long as they don't view them toxically would be very insulting.

So please, go away with your false equivalencies and appeals to outrage culture. You can't turn this on me.

I have never heard someone use the term "outrage culture" who wasn't just trying to excuse being a cunt. The idea that someone's lifestyle is shameful because you disagree with it, worse because it socially unacceptable, is incredibly toxic. "False equivalencies" only works if they're, you know, false. Simply because the subject is different does not make it unfit, that is the whole point of equivalency. You actually brought up STDs and domestic violence being the result of someone's lifestyle (which saying that about DV is so very far beyond the pale it is physically revolting but I digress), this is so literally close to the Regan era talking points on "homosexual lifestyles" that being any closer would get you a hotel stay with a chimpanzee.

You sure spend a lot of words condemning her "slutty" habits for that. Nevermind now parroting about verbatim the usual checklist Moral Guardian types tend to level against nigh any sexual behaviour outside whatever particular narrow stripe they find to be acceptable; I'm slightly disappointed at the lack of "think of the children!" there to be honest.

Did I condemn anything other than abuse? No.
Smoking is absolutely without a single possible shred of deniability bad for your health, yet (at least right now) everyone is allowed to smoke. It's your choice to harm yourself as long as you don't involve others.

Someone who was up their ass about morality would say that it should be forbidden or a crime or whatever. Your silly accusations simply completely miss the point. It actually sounds more like you two are preaching to me about how much I should support that lifestyle.

Aside from manipulating and hurting people of course, like Miyuki does.

I suppose the former would be guilty as charged already by the default that "seduction" certainly falls under the rubric of interpersonal manipulation; the latter would be rather debatable and require citing what you think implies she's intentionally doing so just for starters.

Leading someone on (knowingly) causes emotional distress and pain. Psychological abuse is not any less problematic than physical. I think the recent chapters made it fairly obvious that Miyuki isn't an idiot. She is completely aware of what she is doing and that people like Asuka will get the wrong idea or be hurt by her actions.
Taking advantage of a vulnerable person is abuse by most standards.

---

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:14PM

Did I condemn anything other than abuse? No.
Smoking is absolutely without a single possible shred of deniability bad for your health, yet (at least right now) everyone is allowed to smoke. It's your choice to harm yourself as long as you don't involve others.

Hoo boy, and you said I was making false equivalencies. To compare actually inherently physically harmful deathsticks to someone having an alternate style relationship that could, possibly, be harmful when combined with other already harmful things like violence and not communicating about diseases isn't as much a leap as a rocket liftoff.

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

How is it that essentialist body controlling cunts always make themselves out to be the victim? Of "outrage" or "cancel" culture or people being mean to them on the internet or what have you. You come and insinuate that a whole group of people are somehow less worthy and suddenly it's their and others' fault that you get called out for it. Especially in a place like this where people are already weary and trained against that kind of shit.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:24PM

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

So I'm guessing I'll never be seeing any kind of citation to back up that blatantly spurious statistical claim you pulled out of your ass then.

Did I condemn anything other than abuse? No.
Smoking is absolutely without a single possible shred of deniability bad for your health, yet (at least right now) everyone is allowed to smoke. It's your choice to harm yourself as long as you don't involve others.

Hoo boy, and you said I was making false equivalencies. To compare actually inherently physically harmful deathsticks to someone having an alternate style relationship that could, possibly, be harmful when combined with other already harmful things like violence and not communicating about diseases isn't as much a leap as a rocket liftoff.

It was an example of how even something absolutely bad can still be up to choice. I was giving this example to point out what actual moralizing is.
You really suck at this lol

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

So I'm guessing I'll never be seeing any kind of citation to back up that blatantly spurious statistical claim you pulled out of your ass then.

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it. The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

How is it that essentialist body controlling cunts always make themselves out to be the victim? Of "outrage" or "cancel" culture or people being mean to them on the internet or what have you. You come and insinuate that a whole group of people are somehow less worthy and suddenly it's their and others' fault that you get called out for it. Especially in a place like this where people are already weary and trained against that kind of shit.

I'm done with the topic, because I don't fancy getting banned again for going off-topic for several pages.
I could argue this stupid topic for days with you and you would never actually achieve anything, because you are fundamentally misguided about the entire situation.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:26PM

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

So I'm guessing I'll never be seeing any kind of citation to back up that blatantly spurious statistical claim you pulled out of your ass then.

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it.

Nice backtracking but okay.

The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

...the one where you stretch the meaning of "psychological abuse" until it screams?

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:30PM

Did I condemn anything other than abuse? No.
Smoking is absolutely without a single possible shred of deniability bad for your health, yet (at least right now) everyone is allowed to smoke. It's your choice to harm yourself as long as you don't involve others.

Hoo boy, and you said I was making false equivalencies. To compare actually inherently physically harmful deathsticks to someone having an alternate style relationship that could, possibly, be harmful when combined with other already harmful things like violence and not communicating about diseases isn't as much a leap as a rocket liftoff.

It was an example of how even something absolutely bad can still be up to choice. I was giving this example to point out what actual moralizing is.
You really suck at this lol

Weird how suddenly context doesn't matter when it comes to your shitty equivalencies. It's very much a comparison you were making to the subject at hand and I don't buy that you didn't mean it that way.

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

So I'm guessing I'll never be seeing any kind of citation to back up that blatantly spurious statistical claim you pulled out of your ass then.

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it. The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

Yet you came back to it to respond. Weird how "I'm done with this" to you people always seems to mean "shut up, I win even though I was losing!" and never leads to you actually walking away from your insulting nonsense.

How is it that essentialist body controlling cunts always make themselves out to be the victim? Of "outrage" or "cancel" culture or people being mean to them on the internet or what have you. You come and insinuate that a whole group of people are somehow less worthy and suddenly it's their and others' fault that you get called out for it. Especially in a place like this where people are already weary and trained against that kind of shit.

I'm done with the topic, because I don't fancy getting banned again for going off-topic for several pages.
I could argue this stupid topic for days with you and you would never actually achieve anything, because you are fundamentally misguided about the entire situation.

So done that you came back to insult me and play victim after vomiting prudish bullshit. "Misguided" again with the bullshit about life choices coming from being immature. This kind of line is exactly that tired old "it's a phase" thinking that just doesn't fly.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:35PM

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it.

Nice backtracking but okay.

I wonder why you never got banned for your smarmy detestable attitude. How am I backtracking for having the common sense not to let this escalate? If you are bored enough we can take this to a spam thread.

The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

...the one where you stretch the meaning of "emotional abuse" until it screams?

If the general opinion of emotional and psychological abuse is a stretch to you sure. You are just gonna pretend that your opinion is right without any evidence and accuse me of not giving evidence as usual though.

Weird how suddenly context doesn't matter when it comes to your shitty equivalencies. It's very much a comparison you were making to the subject at hand and I don't buy that you didn't mean it that way.

That is what happens if you ignore the paragraph below that. Buy what you want, I am not gonna convince someone who already decided nothing I will say is what I mean lol

Yet you came back to it to respond. Weird how "I'm done with this" to you people always seems to mean "shut up, I win even though I was losing!" and never leads to you actually walking away from your insulting nonsense.

Uh no... you are the only one who cares about winning. All this projecting is really disturbing. You are mixing other arguments you had with the current situation.
I just don't want to get banned for having this pointless discussion. Alright, if literally everything, even just trying to explain the situation is somehow twisted into a negative by you, I'll just not respond to you anymore. What a piece of work you are.

So done that you came back to insult me and play victim after vomiting prudish bullshit. "Misguided" again with the bullshit about life choices coming from being immature. This kind of line is exactly that tired old "it's a phase" thinking that just doesn't fly.

Again proving that you don't get what I'm saying and just making assumptions with your biased view. The misguided part is not about promiscuity, it's about what my argument is or why I don't think continuing this has any merit.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:45PM

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it.

Nice backtracking but okay.

I wonder why you never got banned for your smarmy detestable attitude. How am I backtracking for having the common sense not to let this escalate? If you are bored enough we can take this to a spam thread.

The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

...the one where you stretch the meaning of "emotional abuse" until it screams?

If the general opinion of emotional and psychological abuse is a stretch to you sure. You are just gonna pretend that your opinion is right without any evidence and accuse me of not giving evidence as usual though.

Weird how suddenly context doesn't matter when it comes to your shitty equivalencies. It's very much a comparison you were making to the subject at hand and I don't buy that you didn't mean it that way.

That is what happens if you ignore the paragraph below that. Buy what you want, I am gonna convince someone who already decided nothing I will say is what I mean lol

The paragraph below doesn't at all levy the comparison. But I guess you can say "the card says moops" until the cows come home and never take accountability for your words by never having a defined position except in implication.

Yet you came back to it to respond. Weird how "I'm done with this" to you people always seems to mean "shut up, I win even though I was losing!" and never leads to you actually walking away from your insulting nonsense.

Uh no... you are the only one who cares about winning. All this projecting is really disturbing. You are mixing other arguments you had with the current situation.

"I know you are but what am I" - the height of rebuttal. I am comparing your behavior to that of other petulant asses who refuse to engage when it is clear they can't "win". There is no nuance to this defense against "outrage culture".

I just don't want to get banned for having this pointless discussion. Alright, if literally everything, even just trying to explain the situation is somehow twisted into a negative by you, I'll just not respond to you anymore. What a piece of work you are.

Sounding very " done " with it right now. Coming back to insult yet more and having no citation or explanation about how any of this is harmful beyond tired essentialist bullshit.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 5:58PM

Did I condemn anything other than abuse? No.

Yes, you did. Remember, this is where all this back and forth started (emphasis mine):

Miyuki is a slut. nothing more, nothing less. No need to argue with me here.

Are you actually trying to play the slut-shaming card in the current year.

It's certainly nothing to be proud of, especially when she exploits people.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 3:49PM

BugDevil posted:

The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

...the one where you stretch the meaning of "emotional abuse" until it screams?

If the general opinion of emotional and psychological abuse is a stretch to you sure. You are just gonna pretend that your opinion is right without any evidence and accuse me of not giving evidence as usual though.

It's funny coming from you after you stated something as fact, without giving evidence to support it. If it's a fact, then surly you could simply link to study or whatever proving it. The fact you specifically replied to random asking about it, to just say you're not going to since you're done, after already saying you're done, instead, you know, just linking the damn study, really gives the impression you pretty much don't have any proof for it and it's just your opinion. Doubly so that you even get angry about being accused of saying something without proof as usual, implying you never give source to your "facts". Is it possible, that they're simply... your opinions, which you treat as facts, but can't actually back up with anything? I expected more from you.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 5:50PM

You all kinda lost me but i feel like usual it's getting to a bash show on BD.

If the general opinion of emotional and psychological abuse is a stretch to you sure. You are just gonna pretend that your opinion is right without any evidence and accuse me of not giving evidence as usual though.

It's funny coming from you after you stated something as fact, without giving evidence to support it. If it's a fact, then surly you could simply link to study or whatever proving it. The fact you specifically replied to random asking about it, to just say you're not going to since you're done, after already saying you're done, instead, you know, just linking the damn study, really gives the impression you pretty much don't have any proof for it and it's just your opinion. Doubly so that you even get angry about being accused of saying something without proof as usual, implying you never give source to your "facts". Is it possible, that they're simply... your opinions, which you treat as facts, but can't actually back up with anything? I expected more from you.

What? I never claimed that I had any studies on emotional abuse ready to throw at his face. I am saying that he always says his opinion is right and then asks the other party to provide evidence for something. He has never once actually backed any of his claims up. He always just says the equivalent of "No you are wrong because I say so" in a smarmy way.
In this particular context I just said that generally the opinion is that manipulating someone and knowingly playing with their feelings is emotional abuse. Miyuki does this intentionally, as we can clearly see in the last few chapters. She is aware that Asuka thought she was serious about the relationship, but Miyuki still played around with other people and got hickeys. She went into this thing just to play with an emotionally vulnerable younger girl. Sexual acts under false pretenses with a girl too young to be able to be sexually independant yet.

So tell me, is that not abuse? Are you saying she was not aware?

You all kinda lost me but i feel like usual it's getting to a bash show on BD.

Nah, I said I would stop talking about the off-topic stuff and they weren't happy about it. It's damned if you do and damned if you dont around here lol

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 6:52PM

BugDevil posted:

What? I never claimed that I had any studies on emotional abuse ready to throw at his face.

Except we weren't talking about emotional abuse but your statement about promiscuity being inherently bad for your health.

BugDevil posted:

Sleeping around always ends badly. Always. It's just a statistical inevitability.

Either show me stats or admit, it's just your biased opinion.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 7:43PM

BugDevil posted:

What? I never claimed that I had any studies on emotional abuse ready to throw at his face.

Except we weren't talking about emotional abuse but your statement about promiscuity being inherently bad for your health.

No. That has nothing to do with the thing you quoted. That is off-topic.
We were talking about Miyuki.

BugDevil posted:

Sleeping around always ends badly. Always. It's just a statistical inevitability.

Either show me stats or admit, it's just your biased opinion.

It was hyperbole. Statistically speaking the more random people you sleep with the higher the probability is (and it's not just about health, stop adding modifiers). It's simple math. I won't go out of my way to get you studies on this crap after all the nonsense that was thrown at me already.
Why exactly are you tryng so hard to restart this convo? I won't be responding to any more of it in this thread and that's final.

EDIT: I have a feeling a lot of people don't really understand what the terms "morals", "condemning" and "choice" really mean in this context. All of this seems to be based mostly on communication issues rather than anything else.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 7:54PM

BugDevil posted:

BugDevil posted:

What? I never claimed that I had any studies on emotional abuse ready to throw at his face.

Except we weren't talking about emotional abuse but your statement about promiscuity being inherently bad for your health.

No. That has nothing to do with the thing you quoted. That is off-topic.
We were talking about Miyuki.

"It's funny coming from you after you stated something as fact, without giving evidence to support it."

That something was: "Sleeping around always ends badly. Always. It's just a statistical inevitability."

Which you then constantly argued as true.

And here: "The fact you specifically replied to random asking about it, to just say you're not going to since you're done" I was referring to this:

BugDevil posted:

EDIT: Jeez. I am done with the slut topic now. You two are insufferable.

So I'm guessing I'll never be seeing any kind of citation to back up that blatantly spurious statistical claim you pulled out of your ass then.

LIker I said, I'm done with this topic. This isn't the right thread for it. The Miyuki thing however I can talk about.

You could easily say you have no studies on it. I wonder why you didn't.

(and it's not just about health, stop adding modifiers)

I didn't think there was any difference between "for you" and "for your health", I just thought it sounded better, but since you insist, it actually makes it easier for me.

It was hyperbole. Statistically speaking the more random people you sleep with the higher the probability is. It's simple math.

Anything can end up badly for you the more you do it. The more you do it the more there is chance for something to go wrong. It's true for everything. But it ignores every other possible factor. In other words, this statement is utterly meaningless unless you can back it up with something. And you can't, hence it's just your opinion. Also just because you can calculate probability for something, it doesn't mean it will happen. It's more likely to happen, but that's about it.

Also you complain I added word health? Be happy I ignored you saying that "it's nothing to be proud of", "It's just an unhinged way of life", "These things (junkfood enthusiasm and emo cutters) are related in so far that they have averse consequences on your life" and the cherry on the top "the consequences of that lifestyle exist right now and that's a fact". I'm sure all of those are "statistical inevitabilites" as well and not just your opinions you try to push as facts.

I won't go out of my way to get you studies on this crap after all the nonsense that was thrown at me already.

You brought it on yourself in the first place.

Why exactly are you tryng so hard to restart this convo? I won't be responding to any more of it in this thread and that's final.

I'm allergic to hypocrisy.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 8:34PM

BugDevil posted:

Sleeping around always ends badly. Always. It's just a statistical inevitability.

Either show me stats or admit, it's just your biased opinion.

It was hyperbole. Statistically speaking the more random people you sleep with the higher the probability is (and it's not just about health, stop adding modifiers). It's simple math. I won't go out of my way to get you studies on this crap after all the nonsense that was thrown at me already.

"Statistically speaking" requires statistics. If you don't have a single fact to back up something as insulting as this bullshit fuck off with it. The fact that people were impolite with you does not excuse you from the consequences of vomiting bigoted garbage without anything to back it up. This is the same kind of evasionist nonsense that comes up when asshats start vomiting off about "racial IQ differences" but run off without a single study cited because they got called racist. If it's such a real problem that is inherent to the base group it should be trivial to find studies implying causal relation.

Why exactly are you tryng so hard to restart this convo? I won't be responding to any more of it in this thread and that's final.

You don't get to shirk the blame just because you throw your hands up and say "I'm done with this conversation now". You brought it up and kept responding to it with more and more terrible bigotry. There is no reason for anyone to listen to your wishes to have the last word on this.

EDIT: I have a feeling a lot of people don't really understand what the terms "morals", "condemning" and "choice" really mean in this context. All of this seems to be based mostly on communication issues rather than anything else.

Thank you, Humpty Dumpty, but those words have specific meanings and saying someone shouldn't be proud of their lifestyle, or that their lifestyle is "unhinged", because you don't agree with it is condemning them; stating your beliefs as absolute fact and a baseline of what people should draw their pride from is morals; I have no fucking idea how you're twisting the idea of choice but if it's to separate homosexuality from the other "lifestyle choices" you brought up than that is absolutely a perversion of the term too.

after all the nonsense that was thrown at me already.
You said that a lifestyle you disagree with was "unhinged". Nonsense that was thrown at you? Must have been tax season because you're the fucking emperor of nonsense. The heir apparent of the nonsense kingdom to go on about how harmful and fucking "unhinged" other people's relationship choices are without a fucking scrap of evidence to back it up.

last edited at Oct 3, 2019 8:36PM

You all know you have no obligation whatsoever to continue this off topic discussion here ? We have a topic especially made for that in case you don't remember.

Okay I'll just address this since it caught my ireeye enough for me to do some looking around about it (and get distracted into a bit of a Wiki Walk but I don't consider that a minus):

If the general opinion of emotional and psychological abuse is a stretch to you sure. You are just gonna pretend that your opinion is right without any evidence and accuse me of not giving evidence as usual though.

In very simple terms - what "general opinion"? Because A) there isn't one and B) what little consensus there now exists, Miyuki's actions do not match.

You could certainly accuse her of things like exploiting her informal "position of trust" as Asuka's mentor and old-established reliable big sister figure (eg. see the phone convo with the entirely unsuspecting Ayako) and the whole bit about trying to get into the younger girl's panties is all kinds of deeply morally questionable, but that's a whole another matter.

You could certainly accuse her of things like exploiting her informal "position of trust" as Asuka's mentor and old-established reliable big sister figure (eg. see the phone convo with the entirely unsuspecting Ayako)

In the context of this story, Miyuki certainly does set off all sorts of alarm bells, but if we’re going to grant Asuka herself any degree of agency, the above is about the worst she can be accused of (so far).

Asuka willingly participates in the “practice/training sessions” (she wonders at her own lack of resistance) and goes to Miyuki’s place voluntarily, and even acquiesces in the “fantasy incest” gambit until it’s clear it’s not working for her.

While there’s a certain degree of “taking advantage” going on, Miyuki’s actually preternaturally sensitive to Asuka’s emotional state and to her reactions. In fact, we might summarize Miyuki’s moves as:

• “When I met you again you seemed lonely.”
• “You look like you might want to have sex with a girl.”
• “I see—you actually want to have sex with your mom.”
• “OK, we can pretend I’m your mom.”
• “No good, huh?”

To be sure, I’m not excusing Miyuki’s actions here—like the rest of us, I’m anxious to leave this disturbing situation behind us and get back to some wholesome mother/daughter incest.

Oh sure, the only reason Miyuki's advances were getting any traction in the first place is Asuka's interested - apprehensively and not specifically in her, but in principle and (seen from the outside) to learn more about her budding sexuality.

Leaving the older girl's malfunctioning moral compass aside she'd likely never even had made her initial advances in the first place if she didn't intuit a high likelihood of some level of reciprocal interest.

I just skipped those ruminations as they didn't directly pertain to BD's bogus claims concerning psychological/emotional abuse and the refuting thereof.