Don't apologise, ciega! It's a very interesting and I think relevant topic, so thanks a lot for bringing it up! (If anybody wants to stop clogging up this thread, can we transfer to another instead of halting the discussion?)
Isn't the school setting for yuri a cultural thing? I remember I read somewhere that shoujo ai is normally accepted as part of the girl's adolescence, experimenting with their love, feelings, and deep friendship bonds. But it's expected that a girl eventually grows up and comes to terms with her sexuality.
Many have commented on this already, but there's too much of depicting yuri as Class S, "testing the waters" in a relationship that "doesn't count" because it's not with a man, and this issue is even worse when it comes to girls' schools, because then there is often the sense that one side is supposed to be a male substitute. One particular exception I can remember off the top of my head is "Hanjuku Joshi", where the senpai actually accuses the protagonists' relationship being of that nature because they're not in a co-ed school, so that was more refreshing. And as spacepowers mentioned, Takemiya Jin is able to sidestep this problem by depicting characters who are definitely gay rather than experimenting or seeking a male replacement, which is much appreciated.
Workplace can be another improvement...
Heartily agreed! I cheer every time I see a yuri work with the OL tag... Which is not all that common.
...if the author wants the series to be animated, i.e. go toward the mainstream direction, it must involve adolescent girls. [...] So unless there's a major cultural shift in Japan about homosexuality, I'm afraid we are stuck with the school setting.
And therein lies my argument against the ending of yuri-exclusive publications such as Yuri-hime. If it runs in a magazine aimed at a more mainstream audience, then such 'deviancy' - already not entirely condoned by the audience for yuri - will be seen as even more distasteful and is unlikely to gain realistic and respectful representation. And regards Kanbaru, I heard that although she's apparently a lesbian, she still gets attention from Araragi and shows attraction to him, and that her "lesbianism" is really just intended as a male turn-on? I don't read or watch the Monogatari series so I don't know, but I was under the impression that Kanbaru was decidedly not a properly-treated queer character.
What I would however prefer to see instead is that yuri wouldn't limit itself into a special genre, but rather become yet another kind of relationship in your everyday genres. [...] ...why not go further than that? The story could be way deeper. [...] There are many hardships that gay people have to fight not because they're gay, but because they're people. And I find it annoying that practically each and every story deals with gay hardships but ignores the rest as if they don't exist.
While I certainly understand where you're coming from - it's boring to see the same old cliches of gayngst and unrequited love etc. being recycled over and over again without anything new added to the mix - I'd also like to point out a few things.
1. You might have noticed that there aren't that many yuri works which have become a long series; an overwhelming amount are one-shots or end within two volumes. There isn't much space to work with; showing a character's growing understanding and acceptance of their sexuality (which, I must admit, is rarely dealt with in a proper fashion - it's usually a case of "well I like this person and she's a girl") can easily take up all the narrative, let alone adding other problems. And LGBT-specific tropes can become tiresome, to be sure, but to exclude them in favour of focusing on other issues is usually unrealistic as well, especially if you're taking it from the growing-up angle. It wouldn't be so much of an issue if both sides were already assured of their sexuality, in which case they could just get on with their business, but that's not often the case.
2. Variety is important, but to do so at the expense of depicting stories that focus on characters' sexuality and relationships has the potential danger of relegating the LGBT elements to a side-show. When I was exploring my own sexuality a few years ago - I'm a lesbian as well - the fact that there was a whole genre focused on the romantic/relationship aspect of arguably queer females really helped a lot - here was a ton of stories where I could relate to the characters and their problems. I wouldn't want to restrict others from having the same help I did.
3. You actually mentioned this yourself, but Japan's stance of homosexuality isn't changing any time soon, and as ciega said, this is all about parity. At this point, I'd prioritise series focused on (adult) LGBT characters and their relationships over other genres featuring incidental LGBT elements. Only when the yuri industry has expanded properly would I turn my sights on other genres. That's not to say I wouldn't welcome them at all - obviously it's possible to have more SoL with a little yuri while having the same influx of good old romantic yuri - it's just that it's not one of my main focus right now. Not that I can do anything about it except buy manga to support the artists, really. :P
- Good, deep series are difficult to find in all genres, and yuri is no exception. We've already got a couple of gems - Utena and Noir (debatable according to some) - and I'm grateful for that.
I'm patiently waiting for a good story writer to finally deconstruct yuri and give the genre a birth in a new light. :)
I'm hoping that Yuri Kuma Arashi will be able to do something of the sort! LGBT issues in manga/anime tend to revolve around an internal struggle about characters accepting their own - often one-target, frustratingly enough - sexuality but not so often about external struggles, which is saddening because homophobia is still a very real and relevant issue in conservative Japan. I'm excited to see if it'll be able to tackle those issues and so draw more attention to the importance of not only gay people accepting themselves, but also of society accepting gay people.
Finally, back on topic: I'm not hoping Stretch will turn into a full blown yuri romantic drama, but rather that Ran will come out as a bona-fide lesbian after all the hints dropped about her sexuality, and that she and Keiko will eventually move into a romantic relationship - but not one terribly different from the current one - perhaps excepting occasional instances of intimacy that go beyond friendship. But honestly, right now, I'm less excited about the yuri than about Ran potentially being a lesbian. It's thrilling to see a character whose sexuality is not disclosed at first be depicted in such a way to bring it into question, and to see that being treated in a positive and respectful manner (though of course we have no solid proof).
...Sorry for such a long post.
