Also rereading this section, I wonder what Ayako meant by this. She is blaming herself for Asuka falling in love with her. https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/1_x_ch06#22 I just assumed it was because she was pampering her as a kid

In this section here, https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/1_x_ch08#10 I'm wondering what the "You know what of yours" meant. It sounds like Akira is saying that Ayako is a player and Asuka genetically inherited from her so she is unable to deny Asuka's seducing skills. By Akira saying that they are close, sounds like they were sex friends with no feelings involved. Ayako's response to that is blushing and silent quote and in addition tothe next page where Akira asks if she was serious. Might be far fetched but I think the husband found out about their relationship and got into an accident after? I'm not sure how that is connected to Ayako blaming herself for Asuka's feelings for her

I think this is possible. We already know Akira has a thing for Ayako afterall. At the very least I wouldn't be surprised if something happened between Ayako and Akira at some point.

You don't freaking imply a child abuse for NOTHING.

My point was rather that Taiyaki may not even have meant to imply abuse. I didn't see it as the most obvious interpretation (though I can see how it is a possible interpretation), and at least a couple of others have said they didn't either.

It is important to remember that Taiyaki is writing in Japan for a Japanese audience. As I have mentioned previously, implication is very culture/context dependent.

In the West in recent years child sexual abuse (CSA) has been almost constantly in the media in a long series of headline grabbing scandals, enquiries, highly publicised "pedo busts", and political rallying cries to "think of the children". In psychology there is something called the availability heuristic - when we are trying to make sense of something our minds jump first to scenarios/framing that comes most easily. In the west at the moment CSA is the "go to" idea for childhood emotional trauma.

I can't claim to be familiar with the current Japanese culture in any comprehensive way, but I've been watching NHK news bulletins regularly for a few years now, and I get the impression that it is much less in the public consciousness there. The most recent big child abuse scandal I can remember was about physical abuse, not sexual. It might not even have occurred to Taiyaki that people would take it that way (or at least that they would be so sure about it). Even thought the underlying human experience is the same, their cultural attitude to sex, sexual assault and emotional trauma differ from Western culture in complex ways. Oddly enough despite Japan's extremely low murder rate, their national news has more coverage of murders than my country does.

I'm not against stories exploring CSA, I think it is a serious issue that can and should be explored in art. My mother was sexually abused as a child, it is an issue I am very much aware of, I'm just not (yet?) sure it is what is being depicted here.

My take is that it is more about Ayako's history with strong emotion than about any past event in particular.

For Ayako, emotions and actions haven't generally gone together. In the past she has been overwhelmed with emotion she didn't understand, and couldn't act on, but this time she does understand what it is ("Asuka is mine"), and she could act on it, though she thinks that she shouldn't. Entirely unexplored territory.

Out of affection and desire (and more than a little possessiveness and jealousy) she can't stop thinking about what Miyuki might have done with Asuka, and when Asuka pushes past her attempt to avoid things, she is overcome with the desire to experience some of those things herself (even though it scares her), hence the tongue.
Ayako's previous "slips" have been subconscious, and about intimacy and comfort, not sexual desire. Asuka has had years to get used to the idea of "wanting" her mother sexually (and had the "safety net" of thinking it could never happen), for Ayako the reciprocal desire, or any powerful desire, is brand new and terrifyingly possible.

Her mother is lost and confused, it may be Asuka's turn to be the grown up.

My take is that it is more about Ayako's history with strong emotion than about any past event in particular.

For Ayako, emotions and actions haven't generally gone together. In the past she has been overwhelmed with emotion she didn't understand, and couldn't act on, but this time she does understand what it is ("Asuka is mine"), and she could act on it, though she thinks that she shouldn't. Entirely unexplored territory.

Out of affection and desire (and more than a little possessiveness and jealousy) she can't stop thinking about what Miyuki might have done with Asuka, and when Asuka pushes past her attempt to avoid things, she is overcome with the desire to experience some of those things herself (even though it scares her), hence the tongue.
Ayako's previous "slips" have been subconscious, and about intimacy and comfort, not sexual desire. Asuka has had years to get used to the idea of "wanting" her mother sexually (and had the "safety net" of thinking it could never happen), for Ayako the reciprocal desire, or any powerful desire, is brand new and terrifyingly possible.

Her mother is lost and confused, it may be Asuka's turn to be the grown up.

I can see this!

I really try to stay out of the prediction business on these matters, but I do note that the main previous example like this, Asuka’s encounters with Miyuki, suggested something rather more extreme in the flashback hints than actually occurred when we saw the whole story. That’s what I’m hoping we have here.

I’ve always been fine with an eventual Asuka/Ayako hookup and have been fascinated about how the author was going to get there, but I really don’t want Ayako’s willingness to be sexually intimate with her daughter turn out to be a function of psychological trauma because of childhood sexual abuse.

What I want is for Taiyaki to support the thesis, “Given the right circumstances, mother/daughter incest can be a good thing,” by showing us those circumstances.

But que sera sera.

Yes!!!! Yes!!! Yes!!! This: "What I want is for Taiyaki to support the thesis, “Given the right circumstances, mother/daughter incest can be a good thing,” by showing us those circumstances."

Is everything!

On one hand, Ayako being abused at a young age would account for her personality. Her detachment to everything and mostly everyone would make sense but on the other, well it’s just painful and so devastating.

On the other, even if Ayako didn’t go through something so terribly traumatic, if she’s just naturally aloof, I’d accept it too because to each their own.

Though it’s beautifully poetic that the one she falls for is a part of her. Her other half is literally half of her...

There’s already that unbreakable bond between them.

Damn... Taiyaki is a genius either way.

Right now, Ayako and Asuka are fragile, one trying to decipher these new emotions while the other is trying so hard not to smother her mother with her desires. I can’t wait to see how they reach the middle ground.

Why do I get the feeling that Ayako was abused by a family member?

What I want is for Taiyaki to support the thesis, “Given the right circumstances, mother/daughter incest can be a good thing,” by showing us those circumstances.

Agree, that is what makes this series special. She has done a good job so far - particularly managing to make Asuka a massive mothercon, but without making her helplessly dependent or immature (also she isn't entirely isolated/inexperienced, she chose Ayako over alternatives). Taiyaki has also avoided toxic clingy parent tropes for Ayako - as much as she likes having Asuka around, she doesn't sabotage or infantilise Asuka & her first impulse was concern early on when she thought Asuka might be regressing.

Asuka really never thought Ayako would feel the same way.

Honey, you've got a big storm coming.

What I want is for Taiyaki to support the thesis, “Given the right circumstances, mother/daughter incest can be a good thing,” by showing us those circumstances.

Agree, that is what makes this series special. She has done a good job so far - particularly managing to make Asuka a massive mothercon, but without making her helplessly dependent or immature (also she isn't entirely isolated/inexperienced, she chose Ayako over alternatives). Taiyaki has also avoided toxic clingy parent tropes for Ayako - as much as she likes having Asuka around, she doesn't sabotage or infantilise Asuka & her first impulse was concern early on when she thought Asuka might be regressing.

That's when Asuka confessed to her and she realized her daughter's feelings, right?

There's a moment (that comes in the timeline a while before Asuka's confession) that illustrates even better (imho) Ayako's change... it's the scene where she muses that recently Asuka looks different... strangely cute... oh of course she was always cute... but recently she looks a different kind of cute... what could it be, hmm... then her coworker walks by and comments "oh your bento is so cute, it looks delicious, I totally want to eat it, yum yum" and Ayako spits her drink because she comes to a big epiphany: that's more or less how she sees Asuka now! :)))

There's a moment (that comes in the timeline a while before Asuka's confession) that illustrates even better (imho) Ayako's change... it's the scene where she muses that recently Asuka looks different... strangely cute... oh of course she was always cute... but recently she looks a different kind of cute... what could it be, hmm... then her coworker walks by and comments "oh your bento is so cute, it looks delicious, I totally want to eat it, yum yum" and Ayako spits her drink because she comes to a big epiphany: that's more or less how she sees Asuka now! :)))

She wants to eat her daughter's......bento

Will there be a chapter before the year ends?

Will there be a chapter before the year ends?

Taiyaki wrote that she is planning to release second half of ch 15 before it but it's not a guarantee....

shes still more mom than lover

Will there be a chapter before the year ends?

Taiyaki wrote that she is planning to release second half of ch 15 before it but it's not a guarantee....

https://twitter.com/tiyk66/status/1209799701488291840

RIP...

That's when Asuka confessed to her and she realized her daughter's feelings, right?

I was actually referring to when Asuka wheedled her way into sharing her mother's bed the first time (at least, first time for high school). Ayako was worried that Asuka was being too clingy, though she did a 180 when given a scare about them growing apart as Asuka grows up.

As for the "delicious" bento incident - we know from having seen Asuka's pov that she was massively (and fairly obviously) "worked up" at the time, getting a sexual vibe off her in the circumstances could have been purely objective. It speaks volumes for Ayako's innocence that it never even occurred to her that Asuka was turned on, let alone that she was the cause.

After the confession - she first tried to convince herself it was a prank, then when Asuka confirmed it, she held together long enough to be supportive. But after Asuka was in bed with the fever we saw that she was actually pretty freaked out. They managed to avoid talking about it until they ended up in bed together again. Even the kissing "compromise" seemed like an attempt to bury it and normalise things - she was taken aback by Asuka's enthusiasm & intensity, and subtly punished her by not waking her up, then was flustered by the smooth "goodbye kiss" the next morning.

I'd point to the kissing as where Ayako's feelings started changing, since after that is where she seems to start surprising herself (eg spontaneously kissing Asuka for comfort after Akira leaves).

After the confession - she first tried to convince herself it was a prank, then when Asuka confirmed it, she held together long enough to be supportive. But after Asuka was in bed with the fever we saw that she was actually pretty freaked out. They managed to avoid talking about it until they ended up in bed together again. Even the kissing "compromise" seemed like an attempt to bury it and normalise things - she was taken aback by Asuka's enthusiasm & intensity, and subtly punished her by not waking her up, then was flustered by the smooth "goodbye kiss" the next morning.

Oh, nice analysis! You have a good eye for noticing those subtle details.

This manga make me have a different look of tag incest :))

will there be an update soon? it feels like ages

will there be an update soon? it feels like ages

From twitter and pixiv it looks like Taiyaki hasn't released any more of ch15 yet. I don't think she has given any specific dates either (my Japanese is iffy, and tweets tend to defy Google Translate). I have a dim memory she tweeted something about 'next year' late in December.

Taiyaki just announced she's updating tomorrow on Twitter. ❤️

Taiyaki just announced she's updating tomorrow on Twitter. ❤️

Wonderful news! <3
Now all we need is sum scanlators who'll drop everything rl to work fast on this, lol

may have the silliest question but, how do you post pictures on here? Or gifs?

may have the silliest question but, how do you post pictures on here? Or gifs?

There's a tutorial for that.

chapter raws are out and I can't wait for the translation