Forum › Philosophia discussion

A2bcf11834a1918b3f09b4219b2a099f_r
joined Aug 16, 2014

Funny how people think saying "sorry" really excuses everything.

ChocolateCakeLover
Gigi7
joined Feb 4, 2015

Cake,I did say sorry in advance, and I didn't mean you btw. I was talking about "hurr this manga is crap and a waste of time and Shuninta a shit" anon

Yeah, sorry, it says something about my mentality when I jump straight to defensive mode when I hear an insult to intelligence, ha.

Can't help but think though, that as this is a story, people judging it as such is still valid though. Just because a character is more of a concept than, say, a character, doesn't mean it's unfair for people to take it as such in this format.

Funny how people think saying "sorry" really excuses everything.

In England, it's most children's first word, so it's meaning is kind of devalued here.

last edited at Jun 1, 2015 7:01PM

Nezchan Moderator
Meiling%20bun%20150px
joined Jun 28, 2012

I've gotta agree with the above, that "mentally handicapped" comment was over the line, AI YO. Not cool.

Mono_a_2kmc
joined Jul 1, 2014

Well... I was so in love in the beginning, and so disappointed in the end. Amano-sensei ruined a good story... unfair. :(

Vivid%20strike!%20-%2001
joined Apr 1, 2013

oh god why??? but at least she got replacement

Little Bits Of Mini
Josuke
joined Nov 8, 2013

Ah gotta love tragic stories especially Yuri ones.

Yuu
joined Mar 28, 2015

Philosophical concepts or not, a lot of people, including me, felt let down by the ending. Because the romance turns into a tragedy without warning in the last chapter. It goes from "am I in love?" to "I'm in love but now she's leaving, then she's a dead pimp". hmmm wut? Ending was utterly uninteresting.

joined Aug 11, 2014

I dunno, I'm all about reading into stuff way deeper than is reasonably justifiable, and trying to set this story in my head against a philosophically metaphorical context feels... I don't know, it doesn't have much traction for me. Part of that is definitely a result of my personal lack of enthusiasm for these kinds of philosophical musings, but more than that, I feel like explicitly casting one character as a specific metaphor for this or that is an incredibly weak way to explore or relate anything. If you're deconstructing the tug-of-war between love and reason, then you can do that far more flexibly and convincingly through theming and motifs. Like, you can talk about complex issues from multiple angles and in various contexts, with real, tangible struggles relating to larger, more essential conflicts of human existence, or you can... literally name a character "love" and have her general character arc vaguely parallel an abstract philosophical theory of how love relates to other stuff.

Like, okay, Tomo represents the concept of reason, and its weaknesses are reflected in the story of the monkey king and her failure to meaningfully challenge this ambiguous something that is greater than herself. Great. The quirks inherent to limited human rationality is also represented by the symbol of human reasoning sleeping with her stepmother? While the distant greater "something" passively accepts it because he just wants a trophy wife? Later, the manifestation of wisdom coolly rebuffs love's tentative attempt to connect on a deeper level, agonisingly distancing herself despite longing for that contact, and was saving up money to fund her suicide vacation by selling women to other women? I'm 100% certain that there is, in fact, a workable reference in that behaviour to some established philosophical musings that I'm not aware of, but if I can't even derive even the POSSIBILITY of a metaphor from it, then I feel like the symbolism is at least somewhat poorly rendered. If you have to be intimately familiar with the entire narrative arc of the concept before you can even parse the metaphor, then how is the metaphor actually useful? What are you even exploring with it?

And yeah, this was one of the issues I had with Feelings Endurance, too. You could, if you referred to the characters versus seven sins breakdown chart, sorta maybe kinda see how each character basically more or less fit their archetype, if you squinted a bit. But the list the author personally wrote and published was indistinguishable from any other random person's post-hoc stab at categorisation, and was actually less compellingly argued than some who had ostensibly gotten the matchups wrong. They're supposed to embody this or that, but what you actually get in the end isn't much more insightful than a ten-minute personality quiz. So sure, if you want to tell me that Amano Shuuninta writes with these complicated philosophical metaphors in mind, I'll accept that, it makes sense. If you want to say she does that WELL, then I'm going to need a looooooot more convincing.

Random Reader
2656
joined Nov 30, 2011

AI YO

So, I am deeply impressed by the audience at this site, and not in a good way. 85% or so of the people who've commented on this manga seem shallow at best, mentally handicapped at worst.

Really, was this necessary? The criticism leveled at this story is very well deserved, especially after riding in on the heels of Feelings of Endurance (haha nice one Gale) and the debacle that one was.

I can't compute how the vast majority can percieve stories from this author on such a primitive surface level, disregarding Shuninta's tendency to be metaphorical, especially when it comes to writing characters. This is at least second work in the row, where her heroines are not as much of actual people, as they represent abstract concepts. She even spoonfed the meanings of their names in the afterword, though I found it unnecessary since to me it was clear from the get-go: the title is Philos+Sophia, where Philos is Ai (love) and Sophia is Tomo (wisdom/reason).

Also, just because an author tries to tackle certain concepts doesn't excuse writing a bad story (not just Amano, but this goes for other authors as well). If the execution is not very well done I could care less about what concepts the author is going for.

Dark_Tzitzimine
67763073_p3
joined Dec 18, 2013

Shuinta could learn a thing or two from Grant Morrison or Alan Moore

Sungji
joined Mar 23, 2011

I'm crying so hard, like... really. -why don't they say it's "drama" at the beginning? I tend to avoid it cuz it makes me cry so much. I shouldnt've read this.

Sungji
joined Mar 23, 2011

Philosophical concepts or not, a lot of people, including me, felt let down by the ending. Because the romance turns into a tragedy without warning in the last chapter. It goes from "am I in love?" to "I'm in love but now she's leaving, then she's a dead pimp". hmmm wut? Ending was utterly uninteresting.

agreed

joined Jun 13, 2014

So Tomo died? And that's her younger sister at the end

joined Jun 13, 2014

?

C8-h7dlw0aetesm
joined Jun 14, 2015

I was really impressed by the series. While I normally don't think much of the stories of Amano Shuninta's works, I was flabbergasted by the depth this story offered. I always really like her artwork and the creative way she tackles certain things other stories typically do the same rigmaroll with. I got emotional with the ending. I'm not spoiling anything, but it's sad. I was really sleep deprived when I read it, but I usually am when reading all Yuri so I didn't think much of that fact. Plus, you usually don't see many mangas tackle dark subjects as unangstily as this does. It knows it's covering some heavy shit, but it doesn't dwell on it and get all drama town overexplaining why you should be thinking about it. I don't know how Amano could top it. Probably by doing something totally the opposite. Like maybe a really funny 4-koma or something that would challenge another side of her talents. Who knows. I haven't read her unfinished series (I'm kind of weird and don't do that in general), but maybe she's going in the right direction. I hope I don't sound like an idiot once I double check mangaupdates. ALSO: keep in mind it takes a lot for me to dislike an ending. I'm not the kind of person who gets pissed off if an ending doesn't satisfy every last thing the series set up or the pacing (not saying any of you in particular are, just generalizing here). I thought the ending was sudden because life is sudden. Tomo makes it clear that Ai doesn't know her like she thinks she knows her. She purposely doesn't let Ai get too deep into her life because she knows who she really is. This was set up in a way that it would be okay for things not to go as planned. Pacing wise it was awkward because Tomo is an awkward person. We as the readers are supposed to feel uneasy. Now I understand this type of pacing doesn't click for some people. It's rather annoying to look at something as meticulously as I look at things, so you're better off not convincing yourself to like something when you don't want to. I write a lot, so I look at mangas more like literature than visual media. I think books should portray all shitty aspects and fucking awesome aspects of life. People should act like people, not idealistically for one specific demographic, race, creed, gender, or whatever. Waffling aside, I'm just a non-conformist over-analyzer who takes pride in looking at things in ways the author probably didn't give a second thought about.

last edited at Jul 8, 2015 7:05PM

Hinageshi_icon
joined Jul 20, 2013

Well shit. Really didn't expect to flat out cry at this manga's ending...but that's what happened. Then I read the bonus chapter and felt a little better. I call B.S. on the younger sister thing, that's Tomo! I swear it! She faked her death and everything is okay now.

Vegitab%20profile%20pic%20smoll%20tumblr
joined Sep 21, 2014

This is good, I liked it. Not everything have to be happy.
I guess Tomo was forever out of her reach, and is now definitely so.

joined Sep 2, 2015

I call B.S. on the younger sister thing, that's Tomo! I swear it! She faked her death and everything is okay now.

--- Spoilers Please dont read if you havnt read the manga (I suggest you do if you havn't its a awesome hour read) ----
Well tbh you could actually be right, which in my current mindset I'm agreeing with so I don't cry ._.

Does anybody remember her mom saying something along the lines of " I wish we could of lived happily just the four of us " (Mom, Dad, Tomo, Little BROTHER) And + the "little sister" ( if that wasn't Tomo ) was at least a near adult and would of had to been a sister of the Tomo to even look like that so why didn't she live with her Tomo...?

Also the "little sister" has the same glasses, same outfit that Tomo wore earlier in the manga and put her hands in her pockets the same way......

Finally Tomo said "Don't wait for me" that means she planned on coming back.... (+Her body was never found)

Anyways past my blabbing I really feel like that was actually Tomo and the author is just playing with the readers who don't pay enough attention. ( Hopefully ._. )

last edited at Sep 2, 2015 9:39PM

joined Apr 26, 2014

Well. . .that was a good read. .more please

Whimp
joined Oct 31, 2014

My heart is seriously not built for this kind of turmoil ;-;

joined Sep 14, 2015

Wow I'm REALLY enjoying this. Didn't realize how sick of the whole moe then comedy then more moe then more comedy then fluff then sex then fluff I was til I started reading this gem. Interesting characters. Absolutely love the character design too. I'll be sure to read the rest of the mangaka's work wen I'm done

joined Sep 14, 2015

Waaaaaah!!! hic but.. But.. hic waaaaaaah!!! Q_Q

Shitsurakuen3avatar
joined Jul 29, 2014

Well this took a dark turn. Love to see it continue even further.

158e73e9-b1f7-46d9-8892-2ce9a7030375
joined Jun 16, 2015

I'm not crying

joined Dec 3, 2013

Overall, loved it.

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