Jesus fucking Christ. I can't believe I made myself read through this forum out of curiosity of people's opinion. It's not the discussion itself that I hate (I actually love it that people here are as appalled with the premise as I am), but just reading anything about that manga makes me feel absolutely awful for hours at the very least. I took one look at the premise/pitch then immediately took out my ten-foot pole and began quickly distancing myself away. Saying it's "pretty fucked up" is so much of an understatement for me that it almost feels inaccurate to say that. The only silver lining that I got out of this is that it feels pretty heartwarming to see that I'm not the only one feeling this way towards this kind of premise in any kind of work.

And the whole thing with lesbians being looked down on in Japan, aren't they treating the topic better (relatively) nowadays? There was that whole union certificate thing being given by some wards (Just 3 from what I remember, but oh well, baby steps) in Japan to same sex couples. I feel like that is way more progressive compared to their neighboring countries in this particular aspect. That's pretty sad compared to the west, but I'll take what I can get.

last edited at May 29, 2016 8:29AM

Chapter 11 RAW

last edited at May 29, 2016 8:33AM

Chapter 11 RAW

He reverted to being a boy it seems.

Never saw that coming...

Chapter 11 RAW

He reverted to being a boy it seems.

Never saw that coming...

Uh-huh, glad I still kept that ten-foot pole in place; not that I was giving this manga any chance anyway.

last edited at May 29, 2016 10:07AM

I wonder why his clothes didn't disappear this time?

Just read the translation of the final chapter. Avoid that series like the plague. I mean it.

The ending is so rushed that it was probably axed brutally. And rightly so. It sucks so much that it created a blackhole.

I have no words... I thought about ranting about this ending, but I could only feel pitchblack anger, so I'll refrain.

May this mangaka burn in hell.

last edited at May 30, 2016 8:01AM

Just read the translation of the final chapter. Avoid that series like the plague. I mean it.

The ending is so rushed that it was probably axed brutally. And rightly so. It sucks so much that it created a blackhole.

I have no words... I thought about ranting about this ending, but I could only feel pitchblack anger, so I'll refrain.

May this mangaka burn in hell.

Please let me hear the rant, I dont want to read this shit but I also want to know what was so bad about the ending.

I can guess - it ends with the guy reverting back to a guy, and the girl getting together with him. Bonus points if she renounces her lesbianism in the end, too.

Norainhere posted:

I can guess - it ends with the guy reverting back to a guy, and the girl getting together with him. Bonus points if she renounces her lesbianism in the end, too.

The mangaka wrote only shoujo so far for a reason.

According to the end, she was never a lesbian.

She just suffered from some androphobia that can be cured one day.

She dumps the other girl who was seriously in love with her, to chase after him.

The main anguish of the guy turned girl is that she might hook up with another guy once cured

And girls are fragile little things powerless in front of rapists and only men in men's body can protect them.

And there's more bullshit all the way to the final image.

I've never read a piece so sexist and dismissive of lesbianism.

And oh yeah he turns back and they'll probably have lots of little baby traps.

last edited at May 30, 2016 1:22PM

Good thing that I never pick this up. Sounds horrible.
In fact reminds me of that manga where the Mom sends her lesbian daughter to crossdress in the boys only school, with obvious and stupid results.

The ending is so rushed that it was probably axed brutally. And rightly so. It sucks so much that it created a blackhole.

Yep. It was axed. Author said it on twitter that this was planed from the start of this year. Kek.
https://twitter.com/jin_mocoyama/status/716816692223934464

last edited at May 30, 2016 11:24AM

Good thing that I never pick this up. Sounds horrible.
In fact reminds me of that manga where the Mom sends her lesbian daughter to crossdress in the boys only school, with obvious and stupid results.

I read that one. It was nasty. This one is worse.

last edited at May 30, 2016 11:48AM

Good thing that I never pick this up. Sounds horrible.
In fact reminds me of that manga where the Mom sends her lesbian daughter to crossdress in the boys only school, with obvious and stupid results.

I read that one. It was nasty. This one is worse.

Even worse? Woah... that's quite a feat. A sad feat, but a feat nonetheless.

According to the end, she was never a lesbian.

She just suffered from some androphobia that can be cured one day.

She dumps the other girl who was seriously in love with her, to chase after him.

The main anguish of the guy turned girl is that she might hook up with another guy once cured

And girls are fragile little things powerless in front of rapists and only men in men's body can protect them.

And there's more bullshit all the way to the final image.

I've never read a piece so sexist and dismissive of lesbianism.

And oh yeah he turns back and they'll probably have lots of little baby traps.

I mean, to be fair, I saw this coming a mile away. That description of the ending is pretty much on-point with what I thought they'll end it with; probably because I already despised this manga without even reading it in the first place, so I just had to think of the most demeaning ending I could think of to get to the same conclusion.

You have my sympathy though, thank you for powering through that and reporting to us what happened.

Maybe the mangaka made this carnage out of spite because their series was cancelled.

Reading the last chapter was an ordeal in itself. I wanted to punch something.

last edited at May 31, 2016 12:34PM

The ending is so rushed that it was probably axed brutally. And rightly so. It sucks so much that it created a blackhole.

^^^^^^^^

According to the end, she was never a lesbian.

She just suffered from some androphobia that can be cured one day.

She dumps the other girl who was seriously in love with her, to chase after him.

The main anguish of the guy turned girl is that she might hook up with another guy once cured

And girls are fragile little things powerless in front of rapists and only men in men's body can protect them.

And there's more bullshit all the way to the final image.

I've never read a piece so sexist and dismissive of lesbianism.

And oh yeah he turns back and they'll probably have lots of little baby traps.

(╯ಠ▃ಠ)╯︵ ┻━┻
Yep.

what a waste of a title...

rincewind posted:

Good thing that I never pick this up. Sounds horrible.
In fact reminds me of that manga where the Mom sends her lesbian daughter to crossdress in the boys only school, with obvious and stupid results.

I read that one. It was nasty. This one is worse.

Even worse? Woah... that's quite a feat. A sad feat, but a feat nonetheless.

Eh, I don't know, I think the other is worse, it was cancelled too, but unlike the west readers that had more problem with it being homophobic, japanese readers had problems with it because it was misogynist, if japanese readers found it misogynist it just shows how bad it is, this one I think it was cancelled because the plot was forced and stupid, the trap was not even much sympathetic at all, this one at least from the beginning we knew she had "trauma" because of boys, the other one no, the girl was lesbian, had girlfriend, and the story tried to show that it was her fault the girls saw her as a substitute for guys, it was outright a story about a mother trying to "cure" her lesbian daughter, and the mangaka tried from start to show the mother was right, of couse I'm not saying this one is better, I just don't think it is as bad as the other one.

But honestly, I thought that just maybe we could have yuri ending, but was pretty sure to end in het, it was promoted as a supposed lesbian falling for a trap after all, not published in yuri magazine, not to mention one important detail, anyone here remember any non-yuri manga with a protagonist, main character, side character, any character at all, that was a man-hating lesbian, who ended with another girl? All mangas I can remember they were never a lesbian at all, it was always a straight girl with some kind of trauma or just irrational dislike of guys, three examples that I can remember is Working, Inu x Boku SS and one recent manga that I can't remember the name but got an anime, the mc best friend was in love with her, obviously later we find she had "trauma" and she end up with a guy, oh yeah, and she says that one of the reasons she loves the mc is because she's liker her brother, who she also loved... Really, when I see a man-hating lesbian in manga I already expect to end in het.

But really, anyone remember any with man-hating lesbian that is really a lesbian? I'm asking cause I'm curious if any exist. : /

There are characters who really don't care for men, although they aren't really men-hater. I think that if you'll end up using the androphobia plot device, there's usually a reason for that. Lesbian can think "men? Bleh" . But there's usually no reason to hate them. They don't need to think Much about them for that.

Talking about anime, of course, where usually they aren't bothered if they don't have some sort of relationship with men.

When I saw that there's a girl who is afraid of men in Love Live Sunshine I wondered why. She probably won't even Interact with guys for that to be more than an empty trait.

Wtv
Just not caring or "men? Bleh" is okay, that is normal I guess, there is some really lesbians characters like that in some mangas, but when they show outright hate or contempt even with guys that are cool and are not interested in them, we pretty much always find they either have androphobia or just some stupid reason to hate man, though sometimes the reason for the androphobia itself is stupid, and so they're "lesbian" because they hate man, if they really call themselves lesbian, because a lot of those characters have interest only in one girl in particular and don't care about anyone else, which just shows even more how she's just how she was never really lesbian, I don't think I ever saw one case like that where they had a good reason to hate man, it always end up as cheap plot device for easy drama and make the story longer.

As for Love Live Sunshine, taking in account how the original Love Live they pretty much never interacted with guys, chances is that Ruby Kurosawa problems with man will be basically an informed flaw, unless she interact with guys from the other girls families.