What's the difference between the terms "transgender" and "transsexual"? I tried looking it up but I figured I might as well ask here for people's input.

Transsexual is getting more and more outdated. It doesn't really have anything to do with sexuality after all, and it's a heavily "medicalised" term. Transgender is usually the prefered choice these days, or simply "trans". But do respect those who choose to use whichever they want to use to describe themselves. Do note that transgender isn't verbable, you can't be transgendered, same way you can't be talled.

Also it's not a noun, so you can't be "a transgender". Trans man, trans woman, trans person, etc.

It is interesting how quickly it gained prominence over "transsexual" though. Less than 10 years ago, it wasn't in fashion at all. "Transgender" does have a nicer sound to it though, I like how it feels to say.

That reminds me, just saw this a few days ago.

last edited at Nov 27, 2015 8:13PM

Ok, thank you for your answers.

What's the difference between the terms "transgender" and "transsexual"? I tried looking it up but I figured I might as well ask here for people's input.

Throwing Wikipedia into the fray...

"Transgender people experience a mismatch between their gender identity or gender expression and their assigned sex.[1][2][3] Transgender is also an umbrella term because, in addition to including trans men and trans women whose binary gender identity is the opposite of their assigned sex (and who are sometimes specifically termed transsexual if they desire medical assistance to transition), it may include genderqueer people (whose identities are not exclusively masculine or feminine, but may, for example, be bigender, pangender or agender).[2][4][5] Other definitions include third-gender people as transgender or conceptualize transgender people as a third gender,[6][7] and infrequently the term is defined very broadly to include cross-dressers.[8]"

Basically transgender is an umbrella term, while transsexual represents a specific subset. This is not to say that people who are transsexual may not prefer the classification as transgender individuals, but the reverse is also sometimes true. Coincidentally most of the trans* people I know tend to prefer transgender as the term these days, regardless of their transition status.

What's the difference between the terms "transgender" and "transsexual"? I tried looking it up but I figured I might as well ask here for people's input.

Throwing Wikipedia into the fray...

"Transgender people experience a mismatch between their gender identity or gender expression and their assigned sex.[1][2][3] Transgender is also an umbrella term because, in addition to including trans men and trans women whose binary gender identity is the opposite of their assigned sex (and who are sometimes specifically termed transsexual if they desire medical assistance to transition), it may include genderqueer people (whose identities are not exclusively masculine or feminine, but may, for example, be bigender, pangender or agender).[2][4][5] Other definitions include third-gender people as transgender or conceptualize transgender people as a third gender,[6][7] and infrequently the term is defined very broadly to include cross-dressers.[8]"

Basically transgender is an umbrella term, while transsexual represents a specific subset. This is not to say that people who are transsexual may not prefer the classification as transgender individuals, but the reverse is also sometimes true. Coincidentally most of the trans* people I know tend to prefer transgender as the term these days, regardless of their transition status.

Well, I take Wikipedia in a case like this about as seriously as Argumentum ad dictionarium, which is to say not terribly useful and lagging behind common usage.

It's important to note that being trans in the public eye in many ways is a relatively recent phenomenon, and the language concerning it is very much in flux as one might expect. Wikipedia adapts faster than the Oxford Standard, but even so it's kind of backward dictating use based on what's in there, rather than it catching up and reflecting English As She Is Spoke.

last edited at Nov 27, 2015 10:12PM

I recall for instance trans women who insisted that the only proper term was "transsexual" and that "transgender' was demeaning because it lumped them in with drag queens and heterosexual crossdressers, who had very different issues. At that time, you barely even heard of concepts like genderqueer or agender, and that wasn't even that long ago.

Simply put, it'll take a while for the language surrounding the issue(s) to calm down, but I'd say the first couple of replies more or less reflect the current "state of the art", if you will.

I recall for instance trans women who insisted that the only proper term was "transsexual" and that "transgender' was demeaning because it lumped them in with drag queens and heterosexual crossdressers, who had very different issues. At that time, you barely even heard of concepts like genderqueer or agender, and that wasn't even that long ago.

Simply put, it'll take a while for the language surrounding the issue(s) to calm down, but I'd say the first couple of replies more or less reflect the current "state of the art", if you will.

True enough. :) I was trying to refer to said change, from insisting on the term "transsexual" to the more inclusive "transgender", in the last part of my text. This does indeed differ somewhat from the rather formalised Wikipedia definition, but based on personal observation, I see a similar shift amongst impacted friends (admittedly a small sample size, but still). In the end I always found it best to simply, and respectfully, ask people involved how they prefer to refer to themselves.

jtt

how they prefer to refer to themselves.

He or she. There are no trans people.

last edited at Nov 27, 2015 11:29PM

True enough. :) I was trying to refer to said change, from insisting on the term "transsexual" to the more inclusive "transgender", in the last part of my text. This does indeed differ somewhat from the rather formalised Wikipedia definition, but based on personal observation, I see a similar shift amongst impacted friends (admittedly a small sample size, but still). In the end I always found it best to simply, and respectfully, ask people involved how they prefer to refer to themselves.

Indeed. When it comes right down to it, they're the experts on who they are. And that matters, given how complex the idea of gender has become over the past couple of decades.

jtt

how they prefer to refer to themselves.

He or she. There are no trans people.

how they prefer to refer to themselves

Nevri, I have an acquaintance who is a transgender male. He prefers the term trans man. And he would take serious offence to "there are no trans people" statement. While there certainly are those who prefer just man, or woman, that is not true for the entire group. I have not actually asked him why he insists on that term, but my theory is that many trans people, sadly, go through a lot of anguish, not only because of their inner turmoil, but, even more reprehensible, because of society that lacks acceptance. So, in a way, the word transgender, and similar terms, accord them a measure of acknowledgment of the hardships they went through.

I must stress out that this is purely a personal speculation of mine, as I said, I did not actually ask him why he insists on that expression. I apologise if I unknowingly offended anyone, it was not my intention to do so.

last edited at Nov 29, 2015 6:45AM

jtt

how they prefer to refer to themselves.

He or she. There are no trans people.

I have a friend who identify as "non-op DFAB genderqueer, gyne-skoliosexual, and pan-romantic."

Ie, neither male or female. Dunno how they want to be called though...

jtt

how they prefer to refer to themselves.

He or she. There are no trans people.

how they prefer to refer to themselves

Nevri, I have an acquaintance who is a transgender male. He prefers the term trans man. And he would take serious offence to "there are no trans people" statement. While there certainly are those who prefer just man, or woman, that is not true for the entire group. I have not actually asked him why he insists on that term, but my theory is that many trans people, sadly, go through a lot of anguish, not only because of their inner turmoil, but, even more reprehensible, because of society that lacks acceptance. So, in a way, the word transgender, and similar terms, accord them a measure of acknowledgment of the hardships they went through.

I must stress out that this is purely a personal speculation of mine, as I said, I did not actually ask him why he insists on that expression. I apologise if I unknowingly offended anyone, it was not my intention to do so.

There are also genderqueer / gender fluid people who fall somewhere in between the two extremes of the spectrum (male / female), and hence prefer a different pronoun, as do some intersex individuals.

Independent of the exclusionary nature of "he or she", it is also quite clunky, which is why "they" has been used as a substitute in the English language for hundreds of years. Still not too common outside of academic papers today, but I generally prefer using it both because is more inclusionary, as well as being a great replacement for the other "neutral" method of defaulting to "he" in phrases such as "when a manager makes such a purchase decision, he should" That one irks me on so many levels...

Nya-chan

I have a friend who identify as "non-op DFAB genderqueer, gyne-skoliosexual, and pan-romantic."

Ie, neither male or female. Dunno how they want to be called though...

I'm talking strictly about people who were born with wrong body and want to change it. If... them(?) is happy about identifying as genderqueer, good for them. (Seriously, those terms are getting more and more ridiculous...)

UranusAndNeptuneAreJustCousins

So, in a way, the word transgender, and similar terms, accord them a measure of acknowledgment of the hardships they went through.

I get the need to being able to identify and by part of the group, but when I meet someone, I don't care. They identify as male? They are a man. They identify as female? They are a woman. Clearly that is how they want to be perceived so I will treat them as such. But when such person goes and tell everyone "Hey! I had a male/female body before it! Just so you know!" It is like they want to be perceived this way. Not just male or female, but like some third gender or something. Also w/e you like it or not, there is a lot stuff that you will be thinking unconsciously once you learn "the truth" and even most tolerant people can have slips or won't be able too see them as 100% the gender they want to be because of that.

Sure, they might want pat on the head for all their hard work, but isn't that what friends and/or family are for? For total stranger all it does its making them feel as if you are playing sympathy card in order to show them how much you went through. It would only make people either afraid to say something wrong and tiptop around you or they wouldn't care and maybe even start to say/ask really unpleasant thing. I will just never understand it. If they went all the trouble to be able to express themself and be perceived the way they feel is right, why would they then ruin it by going and telling everyone about their "sad past".

last edited at Nov 29, 2015 9:24AM

I get the need to being able to identify and by part of the group, but when I meet someone, I don't care. They identify as male? They are a man. They identify as female? They are a woman. Clearly that is how they want to be perceived so I will treat them as such. But when such person goes and tell everyone "Hey! I had a male/female body before it! Just so you know!" It is like they want to be perceived this way. Not just male or female, but like some third gender or something. Also w/e you like it or not, there is a lot stuff that you will be thinking unconsciously once you learn "the truth" and even most tolerant people can have slips or won't be able too see them as 100% the gender they want to be because of that.

Sure, they might want pat on the head for all their hard work, but isn't that what friends and/or family are for? For total stranger all it does its making them feel as if you are playing sympathy card in order to show them how much you went through. It would only make people either afraid to say something wrong and tiptop around you or they wouldn't care and maybe even start to say/ask really unpleasant thing. I will just never understand it. If they went all the trouble to be able to express themself and be perceived the way they feel is right, why would they then ruin it by going and telling everyone about their "sad past".

Some people haven't fully transitioned yet. Others never will. For those people, it'd make sense to clarify by saying they're trans.
Some will have struggled for years to figure out who they are. If it's such an important part of their identity, they may want to express it freely which doesn't mean they'll tell everyone, especially strangers. Even if they do, all they're saying is that they were born in a body that didn't line up with their gender. It doesn't imply a third gender, but it's still very unusual.
Hence it's fine to have a lot of subconscious thoughts about it as long as long as you still treat them as equals. They probably have thought about it more than you.

I doubt they're asking for a pat on the head. It's about acknowledgement and whether you accept them anyway.
Some may not have friends or family (anymore). In that case, I dare say they deserve sympathy (which they aren't entitled to but it's nice if they get some). If people are afraid to say something wrong or tiptoe around the subject or start saying or asking unpleasant things, it is because they're uninformed or even ignorant which is hardly the trans person's fault.

You say you'll never understand it and that leads to you arguing against your own impressions and reactions. You argue against a hypothetical trans person who's so aggressive with their identity to the point that they yell at strangers. You argue against implications that you read into it and weren't necessarily made by Uranusmyname'stoolong.
All it "ruins" is your personal perception.

I get the need to being able to identify and by part of the group, but when I meet someone, I don't care. They identify as male? They are a man. They identify as female? They are a woman. Clearly that is how they want to be perceived so I will treat them as such. But when such person goes and tell everyone "Hey! I had a male/female body before it! Just so you know!" It is like they want to be perceived this way. Not just male or female, but like some third gender or something. Also w/e you like it or not, there is a lot stuff that you will be thinking unconsciously once you learn "the truth" and even most tolerant people can have slips or won't be able too see them as 100% the gender they want to be because of that.

Sure, they might want pat on the head for all their hard work, but isn't that what friends and/or family are for? For total stranger all it does its making them feel as if you are playing sympathy card in order to show them how much you went through. It would only make people either afraid to say something wrong and tiptop around you or they wouldn't care and maybe even start to say/ask really unpleasant thing. I will just never understand it. If they went all the trouble to be able to express themself and be perceived the way they feel is right, why would they then ruin it by going and telling everyone about their "sad past".

Some people haven't fully transitioned yet. Others never will. For those people, it'd make sense to clarify by saying they're trans.

Some will not "pass" well and be easily picked out visually by others. Some will want to pay the kindness they've received during transition forward by being advocates. Some are surrounded by people who knew them pre-transition who will never forget that fact.

People have a lot of reasons for doing what they do, and identifying how they do. This is nowhere near an exhaustive list.

The golden rule is if you don't know how to address someone, ask. Then respect what they tell you.

I didn't try to make an exhaustive list. One example would've sufficed to show that there are reasons to say you're trans (as opposed to Nevri's opinion).

I didn't try to make an exhaustive list. One example would've sufficed to show that there are reasons to say you're trans (as opposed to Nevri's opinion).

Huh? At no point was I criticizing what you said or claiming you were making an exhaustive list.

Lordy, I wish there were any yuri stories with at least one of the protags being a trans woman... I've tried to rake through pixiv's yuri & girls' love tags and p much all the characters are written as cis (with the exception of futa, but that's just a fetish, or then theres when a male character gets physically transformed). And good lord, if I could find something western which was decent evough with storytelling, I'd jump on it...

Lordy, I wish there were any yuri stories with at least one of the protags being a trans woman... I've tried to rake through pixiv's yuri & girls' love tags and p much all the characters are written as cis (with the exception of futa, but that's just a fetish, or then theres when a male character gets physically transformed). And good lord, if I could find something western which was decent evough with storytelling, I'd jump on it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkHicPm7C6Q

It's a web series but it's the only thing I can remember right now.

@jtt I love your avatar :D

Also, I always thought transsexual was someone who had gotten the Sex Reassignment Surgery and someone who was transgender had not gotten said surgeries and is living in the sex they were born in, albeit reluctantly.

@jtt I love your avatar :D

Also, I always thought transsexual was someone who had gotten the Sex Reassignment Surgery and someone who was transgender had not gotten said surgeries and is living in the sex they were born in, albeit reluctantly.

This is not the case. "Transsexual" is largely a medical term referring to Gender Identity Disorder, or Gender Dysphoria. "Transgender" is a non-medical umbrella term covering a wide variety of gender variant and non-gender-conforming identities, including "transsexual", a term which isn't often used since it (a) focuses on sex rather than gender, and (b) medicalizes things a bit much for comfort, particularly in day-to-day life.

Lordy, I wish there were any yuri stories with at least one of the protags being a trans woman... I've tried to rake through pixiv's yuri & girls' love tags and p much all the characters are written as cis (with the exception of futa, but that's just a fetish, or then theres when a male character gets physically transformed). And good lord, if I could find something western which was decent evough with storytelling, I'd jump on it...

It's not western and you may have already seen it, but try Mermaid Line ch06: Ayumi and Aika 1 and Mermaid Line ch07: Ayumi and Aika 2. I really loved that story.

a short cute Transgender work, by p-reavz

https://exhentai.org/g/1000754/b709d69ff8/
or
http://g.e-hentai.org/g/1000754/b709d69ff8/