D'aww~

Cute.

Top/Bottom dynamics are good for NSFW one-shots, but for a full series, I see it more like a switch is better to avoid it being seen as a "heterosexualized" relationship (example: "who wears the pants in the relationship?")

Straight couples can be switches too, though. Case and point: my GF and me.

I know English isn't your first language, and the expression is "case in point" (I'll delete this if you decide to edit your post)

So sure, they could both be switches, but the actual evidence in the text is that once their relationship normalizes, Touko-senpai Mk. II actually backs off and lets Yuu take over the driver’s seat.

You are actually arguing backwards a little there, by saying because Yuu couldn't act aggressively, she definitely would have, which is not entirely accurate.

Your example of when Touko visited Yuu's room is a very good one for both sides actually.Touko was embarrassed and completely besides herself from all the feelings she had and still tried to be forward, while Yuu... was still in denial. We have seen several times that Yuu had surpressed her feelings to a large degree and that's why she appears so "cool and collected". It's because in that situation her heart wasn't pounding like crazy, like Touko's did.
So because they weren't on the same level it's not even fair to compare their reactions.

Furthemore the holding back argument applies to Touko as well. She was deathly afraid of making Yuu hate her, so her requests were always in moderation and she second-guessed her every action. Touko without those inihibitions might as well have been way more aggressive.

See, this is kind of ignoring anything post mutual confession though. Who was the one who initiated almost everything there too? Touko send the e-mail to call for the meeting, Touko confessed first, Touko was the one who made the preparation for the sleepover and planned their first time. And she let Yuu top, it was not like Yuu took charge.
Post time-skip it very much seems like Touko is still doing her own thing and dragging Yuu along.

If anything Touko still has the bigger control of the relationship, but honestly they are obviously switches and have a very even dynamic.

last edited at Dec 13, 2019 1:58PM

So sure, they could both be switches, but the actual evidence in the text is that once their relationship normalizes, Touko-senpai Mk. II actually backs off and lets Yuu take over the driver’s seat.

You are actually arguing backwards a little there, by saying because Yuu couldn't act aggressively, she definitely would have, which is not entirely accurate.

You’re misreading the argument—I’m saying that the evidence of their encounters prior to Touko’s confession is at best equivocal, and, while suggestive, can’t be used to prove anything one way or the other about the underlying dynamic of their relationship going forward. For instance, Touko initiating the situation where she confessed is the prerequisite to a “normalized” relationship.

And of course, every bottom “lets” the top top them—otherwise it’s non-consensual sexual assault.

The point is, we have seen exactly one intimate encounter between Touko and Yuu without the artificial constraints imposed by Touko’s previous psychological weirdness and/or the senpai/kouhai dynamic, and in that one Yuu took the lead (as some previous hints suggested she might).

the expression is "case in point" 

First: thank you.
Second, which was my initial internal reaction to seeing that: ominous voice resembling a horror movie scene: My life is a lie...

last edited at Dec 13, 2019 3:22PM

You’re misreading the argument—I’m saying that the evidence of their encounters prior to Touko’s confession is at best equivocal, and, while suggestive, can’t be used to prove anything one way or the other about the underlying dynamic of their relationship going forward. For instance, Touko initiating the situation where she confessed is the prerequisite to a “normalized” relationship.

Hmmm, seemed to me more like you were trying to lean towards Yuu just not acting like a top because she wasn't allowed to, at least that's what several people here seemed to think, but I apologize for misunderstanding then.

And of course, every bottom “lets” the top top them—otherwise it’s non-consensual sexual assault.

Ouch. You know what I meant. There is a difference between letting someone do something on a whim/for a change and actually prefering it, you silly goose.

The point is, we have seen exactly one intimate encounter between Touko and Yuu without the artificial constraints imposed by Touko’s previous psychological weirdness and/or the senpai/kouhai dynamic, and in that one Yuu took the lead (as some previous hints suggested she might).

You know as well as I that's not a real argument. If we only see Yuu eat cheesecake one time, does that means she only likes cheesecake and doesn't eat strawberry cake? I wouldn't even have said anything if you didn't explicitly say that you think Yuu is more of a top according to the text. What you actually should have said is "We don't have enough information to judge", wouldn't you agree? :P

So cute I shat and pissed myself.

I still wonder how squishy Yuu actually is

So cute I shat and pissed myself.

ok

What you actually should have said is "We don't have enough information to judge", wouldn't you agree? :P

No, what I “should” have said is what I said: by the only reliable evidence we have from the text itself (as opposed to wishful thinking imposed on the text): so far, Yuu is a top.

last edited at Dec 13, 2019 7:13PM

Me at page 0: no don't do it Touko it'll just make you want to kiss her
Me at page 2: welp

What you actually should have said is "We don't have enough information to judge", wouldn't you agree? :P

No, what I “should” have said is what I said: by the only reliable evidence we have from the text itself (as opposed to wishful thinking imposed on the text): so far, Yuu is a top.

Well aren't you just all sunshine and rigid as a rock? I just told you why that's not very reliable (you cannot and should not judge things in a vacuum). You tend to use a very mathematical approach to these things, which doesn't really work for stories and relationships.

last edited at Dec 14, 2019 8:24AM

What you actually should have said is "We don't have enough information to judge", wouldn't you agree? :P

No, what I “should” have said is what I said: by the only reliable evidence we have from the text itself (as opposed to wishful thinking imposed on the text): so far, Yuu is a top.

Well aren't you just all sunshine and rigid as a rock? I just told you why that's not very reliable (you cannot and should not judge things in a vacuum). You tend to use a very mathematical approach to these things, which doesn't really work for stories and relationships.

LOL. And you’re excellent at making up shit about stories and characters to fit your personal preferences. Enjoy.

last edited at Dec 14, 2019 9:19AM

Yuu is top in text. She was top when they had sex so by definition she is top.

yuu is top

this discussion is very compelling and thought provoking
yuu is top

more