My only problem with the fact that Liz is a trap is that sakura ripped off Liz's underwear in like chapter 4. She saw the hair and not the dick? I call bull

My only problem with the fact that Liz is a trap is that sakura ripped off Liz's underwear in like chapter 4. She saw the hair and not the dick? I call bull

Must resist.....must....resist......can't....hold on....

My will is weak. Weak!.

That kinda tick me off as well, honestly. Even if she have no idea what a dick is, she's been bathing with the other girls, so she should at least wonder why Liz had something different there, on top of the hair. She was shocked by the hair because it was different from her, so how come she wasn't even more shocked by his dick, which is a much more drastic difference ? :/

Well yeah, it's easy for you to see it as neutral because, well, it doesn't really affect you.

Actually it affects me a lot. That is why I said I somewhat agree. I see how it can be used to offend but I myself never see or use it that way.

100% this. To me the term "trap" is, as you said in a comment before: "To me it means a boy who looks like a girl and likes to cross-dress because he enjoys people mistaking him for a girl". That is what "trap" means to me..I've never thought about it as anything bad.

Well that is just me.

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 10:36AM

This is a fantasy world. So maybe he can hide it completely by magic. Lets not dive into what can and cannot be in that strange world.

This is a fantasy world. So maybe he can hide it completely by magic. Lets not dive into what can and cannot be in that strange world.

Actually ..seeing a "mushroom" ;) in a world full of mushrooms ..is it really that strange? :0

ew?

This is a fantasy world. So maybe he can hide it completely by magic. Lets not dive into what can and cannot be in that strange world.

Actually ..seeing a "mushroom" ;) in a world full of mushrooms ..is it really that strange? :0

splutter Darn it, there goes my coffee. BRB, need to clean my keyboard.

Isn't this the plot of the Super Mario Brothers Movie?

So is there a reason this is still being tagged as yuri?

Edit: No longer relevant.

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 12:23PM

So is there a reason this is still being tagged as yuri?

I guess to troll new readers.

Because it's yuri.

Anyway, does Liz count as Trans? Because S/he doesn't seem to particularly like the idea of coming off a girl, just doing it because they have to. So...Trans with an asterisk (Trans*)?

Edit: No longer relevant.

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 12:23PM

There's still the possibility it's all a delusion of Sakura. After all, the title is "Sakura's garden"

Well yeah, it's easy for you to see it as neutral because, well, it doesn't really affect you.

Actually it affects me a lot. That is why I said I somewhat agree. I see how it can be used to offend but I myself never see or use it that way.

100% this. To me the term "trap" is, as you said in a comment before: "To me it means a boy who looks like a girl and likes to cross-dress because he enjoys people mistaking him for a girl". That is what "trap" means to me..I've never thought about it as anything bad.

Well that is just me.

I agree with that, for me it's just a boy who like to dress, look like and be treated like a girl, not someone who want to troll others.

And about Liz, I guess he really can hide his "mushroom", because don't looks like there's anything down there in this page...

Yeah, another reason why it really seem to be out of the blue, every indication were that Liz was an actual girl, so really hope there will be a good explanation for that. -.-

Well yeah, it's easy for you to see it as neutral because, well, it doesn't really affect you.

Actually it affects me a lot. That is why I said I somewhat agree. I see how it can be used to offend but I myself never see or use it that way.

100% this. To me the term "trap" is, as you said in a comment before: "To me it means a boy who looks like a girl and likes to cross-dress because he enjoys people mistaking him for a girl". That is what "trap" means to me..I've never thought about it as anything bad.

Well that is just me.

I agree with that, for me it's just a boy who like to dress, look like and be treated like a girl, not someone who want to troll others.

And about Liz, I guess he really can hide his "mushroom", because don't looks like there's anything down there in this page...

He probably tucks.

not someone who want to troll others.

By troll I meant that someone who just likes to cross-dressing or is not bounding himself to norms of how each gender dresses isn't a trap. Guy who likes when he is mistake for being a girl and gets enjoyments from reveling that he was a guy all along is a trap aka troll.

Isn't tagging this as cross-dressing super spoilery tho.... And I'd argue for the Yuri tag since there are def at least Yuri crushes?

Just throwing in my two cents that trap as both a term and a trope is insulting and offensive, but IMO this isn't trap, since there appears to be a reason Liz is dressing as a girl other than "tee hee boys dressed as girls is hilarious"

not someone who want to troll others.

By troll I meant that someone who just likes to cross-dressing or is not bounding himself to norms of how each gender dresses isn't a trap. Guy who likes when he is mistake for being a girl and gets enjoyments from reveling that he was a guy all along is a trap aka troll.

Well I agree that some traps and reverse traps definitely like to see other people reactions, but I doubt that would be the case for all real life traps and reverse traps that exist in japan, not sure if there's any ocidental trap, of course we'll never know for sure unless someone talk with real traps, but I don't think you can say that all are trolls...

Yeah, another reason why it really seem to be out of the blue, every indication were that Liz was an actual girl, so really hope there will be a good explanation for that. -.-

Not necessarily, they live in a strange and alien world for us, even their biology seens to be different, we don't know yet how he did that, but I agree that it's possible Liz was a girl but the mangaka decided to turn in another trap, after all once you go trap, you'll never go back.

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 1:48PM

k8

Isn't tagging this as cross-dressing super spoilery tho....

Well tags are mainly so you know that there are some elements that you can/don't enjoy. It just say that in this series someone is cross-dressing so out of context it doesn't really spoil much imo. Just makes you be wary that some character can turn out to be the one.

And I'd argue for the Yuri tag since there are def at least Yuri crushes?

I agree. From what I read in comments (yes, I only read comments xD, I'm too afraid to read this manga x3"), there is still possibility for others girls to end up in yuri route so yuri/subtex/yuri crash/whatever tag isn't that out of place.

Just throwing in my two cents that trap as both a term and a trope is insulting and offensive, but IMO this isn't trap, since there appears to be a reason Liz is dressing as a girl other than "tee hee boys dressed as girls is hilarious"

Again. I guess there is some reason he dresses like that, either he had to, he likes it or he is actually a girl with male body. Traps for me are special kind of cross-dressers. I don't use this term left and right towards everyone that just cross-dress.

Thiaguinho-sama

Well I agree that some traps and reverse traps definitely like to see other people reactions, but I doubt that would be the case for all real life traps and reverse traps that exist in japan, not sure if there's any ocidental trap, of course we'll never know for sure unless someone talk with real traps, but I don't think you can say that all are trolls...

I'm talking strictly about traps in manga/anime (fiction). I don't even think there is anyone who considers themself/can be described as trap in real world. I'm basing my definition on series I read with traps as selling point. Usually trap character does it for lolz or to confuse main character or both. It's true that it is usually used for comedy, but to me it always looked as trap himself is never forced to do it and just enjoys it so I don't have any negative feelings about term used in that context.

I'm talking strictly about traps in manga/anime (fiction). I don't even think there is anyone who considers themself/can be described as trap in real world. I'm basing my definition on series I read with traps as selling point. Usually trap character does it for lolz or to confuse main character or both. It's true that it is usually used for comedy, but to me it always looked as trap himself is never forced to do it and just enjoys it so I don't have any negative feelings about term used in that context.

It's japan, there's definitely some real life trap there, you can even find some pictures of supposed real traps, most traps that I remember seen in fiction do it because they enjoy, they already did it before knowing the main character and trolling him is just a bonus they discovered, most traps are not forced but there is some cases like Himegoto, and like you said it's usually for comedy so it's useless to think too much about it, but now I get what you meant, I think Bokura no Hentai is the only serious trap manga I have read, someone remembers any other?

T, did you read that before posting?

T, did you read that before posting?

Yeah, I'm on my job now, need to be carefull with my boss so I had to write fast, maybe I said something that was already said, didn't have time to check it. ( - 3 - )

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 2:13PM

No point in arguing. There's no trap here. I'm not even sure it's cross-dressing.

And Sakura is a rapist. It's the second time she takes the panties.

last edited at Jul 27, 2015 2:19PM

and like you said it's usually for comedy so it's useless to think too much about it

I pointed comedy thing because some people here consider comedy trap to be use as mocking the idea of truly transgender people and I agree. Sometimes the humor with cross-dressing or trans people is insulting. That is why I so hardly stress that good comedy with trap is only when trap in question is doing it willingly and doesn't actually want to be a girl like transvestites. I don't want to go into exceptions like Himegoto. He isn't forced to being a trap, he is forced to cross-dress against his will. At least from what I know, I didn't read it. Unless someone tells him to cross-dress in order to be mistake for girl by some guy as a joke, it isn't anywhere close to trap.

but now I get what you meant, I think Bokura no Hentai is the only serious trap manga I have read, someone remembers any other?

You mean that 3 main characters are traps? Cos I'm not sure if I got your sentence right ^ ^"