roamsl and Izz

I really tried getting what you meant by the similarities between this chapter and ch8 (open Sesame) chapter.. could not feel it.. do you mind elaborating a bit ?

I can only speak for myself, idk if its the same with izz.

Earlier i was referring to the panel in which sumin had this shocked/surprised look. Then izz pointed something similar in open sesame. So i went back to that chapter to find that particular facial expression,(sumin said, you are so beautiful) but what i see is love and longing in ch 8. And in 81, its as i mentioned above. If it isn't too much, can u put up both facial expression side by side and we can compare.

last edited at May 22, 2017 2:38PM

roamsl

yes I agree with you.

if these are the two scenes:

last edited at May 22, 2017 2:46PM

Izz

if you mean that Sumin is very shy means that she is back to her old self, then let me break this down:

Sumin never ever changed from being shy about addressing her sexual needs, in a matter of fact, she sometimes keeps her pants on even during sex, you can see this in ch30, ch46, ch69 and this chapter. However, this does not mean that she is now more innocent compared to the times she was with Seju, remember, Seju and Sumin were doing it since they were in college years or something.. Sumin wouldn't need to say anything or address it to Seju after all this time.

shyness =/= innocence or childish.

No, I meant Sumin is different now than she used to be before, but she's getting back some of the characteristics she had years ago thanks to Sungji. What they have now is important, true. But who Sumin used to be is also very important because the way she lived for 10 years changed her into quite a cold fish, hard to reach. Sungji was able to break through this wall and thanks to that, Sumin had started changing again, going back to move forward. Getting back good things from the past so she can build a good future with it. She's a bit like a puppy right now, she kinda seems to be lost from time to time and that was a part of ch. 81, I think. She wanted to please Sungji all the way she needed and wanted it, Sumin's own needs were completely pushed aside. And it was a week without sexy times so... ;) And then, look at her face after Sungji says ILY. This is happiness, bliss. It looks like she was going to kiss Sungji, maybe even let her own needs to come out too, but that damn phone had to ring frustrating both of them ;)

Yeah, that was what i compared. Now i can see more of the difference. Thanks!

Izz

Sumin's own needs were completely pushed aside. And it was a week without sexy times so

you know, this is exactly what I find problematic while you find it nice. I tell you why.. remember when Sungji asked her in ch63:
Sungji: was there ever a time you expected something from me?
Sumin: ...
Sungji: can love exist when you expect nothing in return ?
..
even outside the bed room.. Sumin never really demand anything.. not at all. just complying with Sungji's demands.

as the "I love you" part, I really felt it was shocking not only for me but even for Sumin.. is it the timing or the context .. not sure..the way it was said and the way it was received all in all was weird even before the phone rang .. however I posted above the "I Iove you" that Sumin said in ch69, that one was sensual and you can actually feel it from your screen.. that's the difference .
....
roamsl

You're welcome :)

last edited at May 22, 2017 3:01PM

^To answer Sungjis question, I'd say: yes, love can exist if you don't expect something because you don't need to expect anything when you simply love someone. Sumin does love Sungji. And Sungji loves Sumin too. She wouldn't try so hard to get her if she didn't. That's a fact. But if I had to dig a bit, maybe even reach... I'd also say, Sumin didn't answer her because she didn't trust herself and now all she wants is the answer that Sungji is keeping for herself. Sumin is scared she may lose her. That's why she looked happy when Sungji said ILY. If she'd answer her back then, I think she'd say "love me in return" or something like that. Because if you love someone, you need that person to love you too if you want to be truly happy together.

last edited at May 22, 2017 3:21PM

Izz

it is rather a general behavior that frustrates her other partners, not only Sungji who suffered from that but also the lawyer pointed that out as well .. ch23 (Sangmi words to Sumin last few panels.. very accurate description to what Sumin does to even Sungji)
..
in no case did I say that Sumin didn't love Sungji, she did .. but she has this distance from her.. conflicting feelings.. feeling guilty at times and unsure.. you can see this very clearly in her bubble thoughts in ch51 + 52

last edited at May 22, 2017 3:46PM

Izz

it is rather a general behavior that frustrates her other partners, not only Sungji who suffered from that but also the lawyer pointed that out as well .. ch23 (Sangmi words to Sumin last few panels.. very accurate description to what Sumin does to even Sungji)
..
in no case did I say that Sumin didn't love Sungji, she did .. but she has this distance from her.. conflicting feelings.. feeling guilty at times and unsure.. you can see this very clearly in her bubble thoughts in ch51 + 52

That's why I said I believe it's because Sumin is insecure and she's like that bcause of everything she experienced in the past. Even Nami pretty much told her so: I understand where you're coming from since you've been hurt once. Midget, you think too much.

The lawyer is lawyer, Sungji is Sungji. If she's still with her, I believe she'll be with her. She may not know about Sumin's past yet, but I'm sure she knows something bad happened to her and it wasn't just her parents' death. She's quite good at reading people. And... she's reading Sumin better than anyone else, even Seju.

since you brought this:

Even Nami pretty much told her so: I understand where you're coming from since you've been hurt once. Midget, you think too much.

remember that Nammi also told her: "you really live an exhausting life, it's not like you're gonna open up to her. "

but no, Nammi doesn't read Sumin better than Seju nor does Sumin confide to Nammi more than she does to Seju.. I could give examples of that.

I brought up the Lawyer so you could see the similarities in Sumin behavior and that both girls were annoyed by it.
.....
now, we could go around all the excuses that Sumin has and doesn't have..
what truly matters at this point is Sungji's feeling about all this ⚇

last edited at May 22, 2017 4:18PM

since you brought this:

Even Nami pretty much told her so: I understand where you're coming from since you've been hurt once. Midget, you think too much.

remember that Nammi also told her: "you really live an exhausting life, it's not like you're gonna open up to her. "

I think this part was a lie because she told Seju she's hoping for her "abomination of relationship with Sumin" (or sth like that) to finally end. She was never a fan of Seju & Sumin so she gave Sumin a little push too, but had nothing bad in mind by doing it - unlike Seju.

but no, Nammi doesn't read Sumin better than Seju nor does Sumin confide to Nammi more than she does to Seju.. I could give examples of that.

Sungji reads Sumin better than Seju.

I brought up the Lawyer so you could see the similarities in Sumin behavior and that both girls were annoyed by it.

And I don't disagree, but we can't say Sungji is the same as the lawyer and will leave ;)

what truly matters at this point is Sungji's feeling about all this ⚇

"I love you" ^^

Btw, Sumin is probably going to have a bite mark. Can't wait to see Seju's reaction, haha!

I think this part was a lie because she told Seju she's hoping for her "abomination of relationship with Sumin" (or sth like that) to finally end. She was never a fan of Seju & Sumin so she gave Sumin a little push too, but had nothing bad in mind by doing it - unlike Seju.

what Nammi said: "then that messed up relationship between you two will finally end"

there is no hopping, but wait! were Nammi's intentions innocent ?
mmhm.. constantly hitting (seriously ) on Seju was innocent ?!
no matter what excuse you may come up with, YOU DON'T SLEEP WITH YOUR FRIEND's EX ! period
Nammi wanted Seju and that's a fact since they were young.
....
back to the context, why did I remind you of that line?
to tell you NO sumin truly didn't open up to Sungji not even today. only when Sungji saw them.. finally Sumin admitted her connection to Seju.. where is the lie in Nammi's sentence again ?

Sungji reads Sumin better than Seju.

hahahha.. not at all .. not even close ! not even once

And I don't disagree, but we can't say Sungji is the same as the lawyer and will leave ;)

not what I argue, my argument: Sumin is acting the same way.
back to ch23, read her lines, go again to Sungji break up talk in both ch56 and 63.. read it closely.. same exact points.

what truly matters at this point is Sungji's feeling about all this ⚇

"I love you" ^^

that awkward "I love you" before Sumin DECIDED to drop her off, blatantly lie to Seju not even bothered to give her a lame excuse to spend extra time with Sungji.. Sungji won't be mad or insulted by that you think ?

Btw, Sumin is probably going to have a bite mark. Can't wait to see Seju's reaction, haha!

well, depends on what Sumin would wear XD
what I can assure you tho, she will try to hide it if needed the same way she tried to hide having a date or some business while she was intimate with Sungji ;)

last edited at May 22, 2017 5:33PM

no matter what excuse you may come up with, YOU DON'T SLEEP WITH YOUR FRIEND's EX !

One of the main reasons why I don't like Nami even a bit.

no matter what excuse you may come up with, YOU DON'T SLEEP WITH YOUR FRIEND's EX !

One of the main reasons why I don't like Nami even a bit.

I don't blame her tho.. even Sumin wasn't angry at Nammi !
why?
Sumin feelings for Seju is something but not getting angry on Nammi is another thing!

Lol who made up some rule that you can't sleep with your friends ex? That sounds like a personal moral, not a hard and fast rule.

last edited at May 22, 2017 6:09PM

^About Nami - I don't mind her wanting to have sex with Seju because they're all adults and they know when to say "no". The question is - will the other part listen? Because Seju seems to be deaf.

Also, Nami pushing Sumin and Sungji together was for a good thing while Seju pushing them together was part of her game in which Sumin was supposed to end up hurt at her doorstep again because Sumin is responsive and shows emotion only when she's:
a) happy
b) in pain
c) angry
Since Seju can't make her happy, she's using b) and c) to get what she want.

Later in the story, when Nami told Sumin Seju is getting married, she did that to make Sumin question herself and see if she's finally able to let go. She wasn't. Not yet. And Seju used it. Sumin needed Sungji to dump her to finally let go and if Seju wasn't attacked and her bro didn't beg for Sumin to get Seju with her, she'd be living a happy life with Sungji already, away from Seju.

If Seju read Sumin so well then why did she cheat on her? Where was she when Sumin needed comfort? The only thing she gets with Sumin is sex. Even "healing her from flu" was all about sex. Sungji on the other hand, knows when Sumin needs simple comfort and when she can screw up with her. True, she needed some learning, but the instinct was there right from the beginning which chapter 13 is proving best.

last edited at May 22, 2017 6:12PM

About Nami - I don't mind her wanting to have sex with Seju because they're all adults and they know when to say "no". The question is - will the other part listen? Because Seju seems to be deaf.

wow .. just wow!
my honest advice tho, don't skip Seju's lines that show loyalty and deep love to Sumin because they aren't evil enough

If Seju read Sumin so well then why did she cheat on her? Where was she when Sumin needed comfort? The only thing she gets with Sumin is sex.

I believe we went through the insecurities part.. and the Author herself did say that both were at fault and immature !!

Sumin needs simple comfort and when she can screw up with her. True, she needed some learning, but the instinct was there right from the beginning which chapter 13 is proving best.

Sumin wanted a simple F*ck that night .. she admits it!
Sungji was a virgin.
nothing complicated nothing instinctive..
since you remember this chapter, continue to the part when Seju came and brought porridge to Sumin (maybe she put drug in it to kill Sumin.. evil Seju hehehe)
just by looking at the chair located next to the bed she read the situation.
...

last edited at May 22, 2017 6:27PM

Lol who made up some rule that you can't sleep with your friends ex? That sounds like a personal moral, not a hard and fast rule.

If I curse your mom, it wont be illegal.. but what does that make me to you ?
ethics or whatever they call it in english..
in a matter of fact, if you wanna talk about rules, there is nothing official against a boyfriends/girlfriends cheating.. doesn't make it right. does it?

but wait, wasn't it you who were against Seju being morally wrong!

last edited at May 22, 2017 6:41PM

Lol who made up some rule that you can't sleep with your friends ex? That sounds like a personal moral, not a hard and fast rule.

If I curse your mom, it wont be illegal.. but what does that make me to you ?
ethics or whatever they call it in english..
in a matter of fact, if you wanna talk about rules, there is nothing official against a boyfriends/girlfriends cheating.. doesn't make it right. does it?

but wait, wasn't it you who were against Seju being morally wrong!

Not quite sure what you're arguing but my problem was that you seemed to be stating it as a fact, which is why i brought up that it is more a case of personal morals (If that wasn't your intention then I'm sorry).

When did i say Seju was morally wrong?

last edited at May 22, 2017 7:22PM

^
what I was trying to say, some stuff in life don't need to be written rules.. they are well known, ethics, etiquettes, morals or whatever. sleeping with a friend's ex is a big NO NO! I don't need legislations to know if its wrong

....

When did i say Seju was morally wrong?

I remember it clearly somewhere in the discussion.. you, yoonie0104 and I were discussing this.. mah ! I will look it up later

^
what I was trying to say, some stuff in life don't need to be written rules.. they are well known, ethics, etiquettes, morals or whatever. sleeping with a friend's ex is a big NO NO! I don't need legislations to know if its wrong

....

When did i say Seju was morally wrong?

I remember it clearly somewhere in the discussion.. you, yoonie0104 and I were discussing this.. mah ! I will look it up later

I think we have some confusion here. The reason why i mentioned hard and fast rules is that your original statement made it sound like a hard and fast rule, that was all. Never said things had to be a written rule, just that your personal morals are not neccesarily universal. To me sleeping with a friends ex isnt morally wrong.

We can all agree though that killing someone in cold blod is morally wrong for instance, but not everyone is going to agree with smaller scale morals.

last edited at May 22, 2017 7:40PM

To me sleeping with a friends ex isnt morally wrong.

I'm speechless.
...
back to the context, Nammi knew it's wrong, and that's why she was angry at Sumin that she didn't take her anger on her and instead took it on Seju.
...
whether my morals are universal or uptight, it seems to be consistent with what Nammi thinks shouldn't be happening in the first place.
...
ah, I need to ask my people if they share this moral so I know who to unfriend right away.. life is too short to deal with backstabbers !

last edited at May 22, 2017 8:05PM

Once people are broken up for good who has the right to say who they can or can't sleep with. We're adults.

I'm amused you're so shocked about this lol.

It is off topic though i agree. Carry on.

last edited at May 22, 2017 8:11PM

Lol who made up some rule that you can't sleep with your friends ex? That sounds like a personal moral, not a hard and fast rule.

I'm not sure about your country's culture but in most Asian countries, including mine, sleeping with your friend's ex will ruin your own bff friendship. Simply put, one word, betrayal. You don't sleep with your friend's ex without telling your friend first and foremost about what's going between you and that ex and confine her opinion about it.

(Oh, and its different story if you dont know but when you do know that's your best friend's ex, and you still go ahead with it, it's not ok, at least in my book)

And one more thing, you should be mad at you bff for that betrayal, not come to that ex and put all the blames into that ex's head

last edited at May 22, 2017 9:13PM

Lol who made up some rule that you can't sleep with your friends ex? That sounds like a personal moral, not a hard and fast rule.

I'm not sure about your country's culture but in most Asian countries, including mine, sleeping with your friend's ex will ruin your own bff friendship.

Fair enough if it's a part of your culture, even if i don't agree with it. I just question everthing, especially what society tells me ; )

last edited at May 22, 2017 9:24PM

since we were talking about the hot stuff, did you notice that Seju is into face/body licking much !! ch10 +ch21 (face licking), ch74 (shoulder licking).. adorable !!
-> no wonder she taught Sumin how to savour the taste of black coffee

last edited at May 22, 2017 9:45PM