Poor Seol-A!!!! She finally moved passed everything only to be emotionally clam jamed. You got this Seol-A!! Get your girl!

Somehow, while I love the characters, as I said numerous times, the plot devices Ssamba uses are a bit too artificial. I see the ropes there. Overearing conversations in the classroom, check. Riding a Ferris-wheel, check. Truck-san killing, or injuring, a character, check (twice). Interrupted in the middle of a confession, check. I feel like I've read this kind of devices in a million shoujos

I still like it, but she doesn't aim for originality. Same sins than Lily Love.

I'll probably be flamed to death by the FF fans, but oh well, once I've read this chapter, I was like..."hmmm, where did I read something like that before? Oh right... EVERYWHERE!"

And yet, you'll keep coming back week after week to see what happens. Common plot devices aren't necessarily a bad thing. You can have cliche plot devices with an amazing story, great dialogue, and multi-dimensional characters. You can have cliche plot devices with a shitty story and flat characters (i.e. Citrus or Valkyrie Drive).

I for one, have never read a yuri manga/manhwa that focuses so much on the nuances of the initial attraction between two characters. Add to that a variety of interesting side characters and a story that doesn't follow the typical beaten-to-death yuri tropes. If FF isn't original because of its plot devices, then it'd be hard to say that any story at all is "original".

I feel like everyone forgets No-Rae's conversation with her brother, about the right path. And ssamba probably wont get too deep with the sexuality stuff until our girls get together (remember we still have around 50+ chapters left)

About cliches, yeah FF have them but all love stories have them too. Or stories in general. Animes and mangas (yuri or anything) always have no matter how good they are. The cliches arent dumb so its fine. No-Rae and Seol-A are great characters that never have acted OOC and have character development so that what I like the most.

It's not that I dislike cliches in my manga. It's just cumulative in the case of FF. She used the "conversation overhearing" twice. The "car/bike/bus accident" THREE TIMES, the "love rival" multiple times, the dead ex, the "I run away from my feelings by going back home", deep conversation on the beach, etc...

I'm used to these cliches. But they rarely show up all simultaneously in the same story.

What was the probability of the ex showing up in the middle of the confession? He disappeared for years, but he shows up and interrupts a confession. He must have had a spider-sense tingling.

I'll keep reading it, because Seol-a and No-rae are really nice characters, with a great personality, they are both adorable and I want to see them kiss (in chapter 100? I doubt they go further than that), but my enjoyment gets spoiled whenever I roll my eyes up because yet another cliche shows up.

I guess what Ssamba lacks is actually an editor, who can help her shape her story better.

last edited at Oct 19, 2015 3:48PM

I actually like how author takes it really slow. I saw a kinda ecchi fan art picture with them, and if that really happened the story would be destroyed for me. If they start making out etc, the manga will loose its shine imo. Because we've seen lots of mangas with fanservice and they are preety bold.
I think every manga or book has some cliches. Whether we like it or not, nothing can be 100% original. There are millions of stories out there, so the possibility that this has happened before in another manga are very high.
I agree that the ex showing up right at the moment where Seol-a was going to confess may be a little cliche yes. But maybe there is a significanse why author choose to do so.
And even if it doesn't, every manga has its flaws. We cannot get something that will satisfy everyone. Some people don't mind these "cliches" while other might find it boring. It's a matter of personal taste and whether you feel like it's getting to much for you

last edited at Oct 19, 2015 4:23PM

kami-sama:

well, the cliche turn of events never bothered me cause it's the same genre. [...] but I never saw Seol-a and No-rae struggle to the fact that they're falling in love with the same sex. [...] I can relate to everything Seol-a and No-rae's struggles from the past but I can't relate to them when it comes to the forbidden love situation. cause it never was brought up.[...]

MacySan:

Regarding the cliches. Yes there are quite lot in here. But despite them, the way the author handles the situations make the story real and interesting. Besides, it's drama and slice of life, so sometimes these can not be avoided.
There is actually a very good character development. The story flow doesn't get trapped into repetitive cycles for the shake of more chapters.

I think the author doesn't mention sexuality as a way to show that it's ok to fall in love with the same sex, and it's the same as falling for the opposite. Basically, acceptance of gay/bi people. Or a hope for the future when gender won't be such an issue when it comes to romantic relationships.
Btw, anyone mentioned what is Seol-a and No-rae's sexuality supposed to be? I'd say Seol-a is most probably bi. No-rae as well, although she might be gay too idk.
[...]

My thoughts are very similar to MacySan. I'm actually glad that Ssamba didn't go that route of dwelling on the forbidden love. I thought it was fantastic that she chose to do it the regular shoujo manga way, spreading the message of love to the readers, that two seemingly straight girls could fall in love with each other so naturally just like any other couples. But it doesn't mean they didn't struggle with the nature of liking someone in the same gender. Ssamba did give us subtle views of the characters' anxiety and worries (Norae's immediate shutting Seola out harshly after finding out her own feelings, or Seola's sadness that Hye-Kyung noticed. Seola just chose to bounce back real quick due to her "utterly cool" nature lol).

Regarding the weak plot devices that Nya-chan mentioned, I agree about the cliché. But like I said, I loved it that Ssamba chose to stay "faithful" to her title "Fluttering Feelings" and follow the shoujo manga way. I don't think she set out to create a masterpiece in the first place. And to me that's what made it great, and exactly what the current community is in need of. It's just a message of pure love. All the feelings and character development just felt very real and natural. And thats how it became the most read comic on Korean Comico, followed by many straight fans of both genders. It's like Ssamba was saying "Let's talk about their love instead of contemplating whether they should be together or not because they're two girls." If Ssamba had started talking about the nature of their forbidden love, I'm sure it had been full of hate talk by now. Comico wouldn't have put an ad with this couple in the middle of the city where there are many hard-core religious people.

To sum up my opinion, Ssamba's [not dwelling on the forbidden nature of their love] + [exploring deep into their past] + [repeating clichés of romantic/dramatic love fictions] = an emphasis that [they're just like a regular straight couple, portrayed million times by the media] (even better because the girls are so cute and pretty xD)

last edited at Oct 19, 2015 6:48PM

It's not that I dislike cliches in my manga. It's just cumulative in the case of FF. She used the "conversation overhearing" twice. The "car/bike/bus accident" THREE TIMES, the "love rival" multiple times, the dead ex, the "I run away from my feelings by going back home", deep conversation on the beach, etc...

I'm used to these cliches. But they rarely show up all simultaneously in the same story.

What was the probability of the ex showing up in the middle of the confession? He disappeared for years, but he shows up and interrupts a confession. He must have had a spider-sense tingling.

I'll keep reading it, because Seol-a and No-rae are really nice characters, with a great personality, they are both adorable and I want to see them kiss (in chapter 100? I doubt they go further than that), but my enjoyment gets spoiled whenever I roll my eyes up because yet another cliche shows up.

I guess what Ssamba lacks is actually an editor, who can help her shape her story better.

Haha, of course you believe those are clichés. Girl, love rivals happen in reality all the time, especially if you or your crush is hot. And in a long love story love rivals need to appear or do you want the story to be boring?
Accidents are definitely cliches so I'll give you that (though car accidents in Korea sadly happen a lot irl)
But deep conversation on the beach? Going back home to get time to think?
The ex stuff was a cliché but you exaggerate a lot. Some things happened because of the context of the moment and based on real life. They are common things but because they actually happen a lot in real life, a story that wants to be realistic might have them at some point.

By the way, how can you read something that makes you roll your eyes in every chapter because of its lack of originality (according to you)? Thats like me reading Citrus, because at least thats what happened to me when I read a few chapters.

It's so funny to see FF fandom's reaction on Tumblr on the cockblock from last chapter. Just made my day to feel the passion of the readers lol, even though I gotta say I've been expecting the Ex to appear for a while. Ssamba already foreshadowed the coming of Yuji and SungPyo in the early chapters. It's just a matter of time and to Ssamba it's time now lol. Hang on guys. We still have over 50 chapters left. Many more fluffs to come after they both settle with their past.

last edited at Oct 19, 2015 7:36PM

An in-depth analysis of Chapter 48 by lvl19-doodler:

Source:
http://lvl19-doodler.tumblr.com/post/131496815695/lets-get-this-straight-no-pun-intended-lel
http://36.media.tumblr.com/7eec192b985f0311c4a526cd1b76e35f/tumblr_nwh8ddEmCv1uvquvmo1_1280.jpg

 
lolo

last edited at Oct 20, 2015 12:36AM

It's not that I dislike cliches in my manga. It's just cumulative in the case of FF. She used the "conversation overhearing" twice. The "car/bike/bus accident" THREE TIMES, the "love rival" multiple times, the dead ex, the "I run away from my feelings by going back home", deep conversation on the beach, etc...

I'm used to these cliches. But they rarely show up all simultaneously in the same story.

What was the probability of the ex showing up in the middle of the confession? He disappeared for years, but he shows up and interrupts a confession. He must have had a spider-sense tingling.

I'll keep reading it, because Seol-a and No-rae are really nice characters, with a great personality, they are both adorable and I want to see them kiss (in chapter 100? I doubt they go further than that), but my enjoyment gets spoiled whenever I roll my eyes up because yet another cliche shows up.

I guess what Ssamba lacks is actually an editor, who can help her shape her story better.

Okay, so how exactly did you want Ssamba to cater to your specific needs in order to move the plot forward? If you're rolling your eyes at every attempt from Ssamba to advance the story because it's 3cliche5you, it's hard to believe that you're enjoying this series as a whole. I'm not quite sure where you got the "dead ex" thing from. There's no solid evidence to prove that there was anything romantic between Yu-ji and Seol-a. It sounds like you're just listing a bunch of events from the story and calling them cliched.

Why don't you send a resume to Comico and tell Ssamba that you could be their editor? Since clearly you know what's best for FF's story. /s

I'm pretty sure that a webtoon as popular as FF at least goes through a basic editing process before being published.

Fluttering Feelings is the worst. The yuri plot was too weak. THE END!

Fluttering Feelings is the worst. The yuri plot was too weak. THE END!

I wish people could just keep this to themselves, I know it's your opinion but I if its downgrading or not real constructive criticism I don't wanna hear it

I expected the "if you think it's so bad, why do you read it?" and "If you are so smart, why don't you do better?" flames.

That is also cliche... :)

Also, about ^, I think ekw79 was just trolling. No need to overreact like this.

I expected the "if you think it's so bad, why do you read it?" and "If you are so smart, why don't you do better?" flames.

That is also cliche... :)

Those weaksauce comments are better left for Youtube Nya... We write essays to tell you how wrong your opinion is here. ;-P

Also, about ^, I think ekw79 was just trolling. No need to overreact like this.

Yeah, it was purely sarcastic and nothing to get your undies bunched up about.

I expected the "if you think it's so bad, why do you read it?" and "If you are so smart, why don't you do better?" flames.

That is also cliche... :)

Also, about ^, I think ekw79 was just trolling. No need to overreact like this.

I'm confused about what you mean. Do you actually like FF but find the "cliches" annoying, or you just plain dislike it? I always thought that when someone really dislikes something, they just stay away from it. If they keep on coming back, there is usually something that gets their attention.
Regarding the yuri aspects, I actually believe this manga is popular because there is not a forced yuri action as the plot focuses on their feelings and the way they act. If someone is looking for yuri action, naked scenes etc this is not for them. But I like how the author treats the protagonists as real human beings, and not just a piece of meat like a lot of yuris out there

I expected the "if you think it's so bad, why do you read it?" and "If you are so smart, why don't you do better?" flames.

That is also cliche... :)

Also, about ^, I think ekw79 was just trolling. No need to overreact like this.

Maybe if you had more substantial criticisms than just "A is cliche, B is cliche, your mom is cliche, everything is liek sooo cliche!!!! Ssamba pls get a real editor and fix ur horrible story, my eyes can't handle ALL THIS ROLLING!! 1!1one! 1", you'd get those sweet, sweet non-cliche replies you're looking for :^))))

I already explained why I keep reading it : because of the characters which have a life of their own beyond their shoujo prison (and because of the yuri). Characterization and plot are two different things. While I think that Ssamba made a wonderful job of Seol-a and No-rae characterization (their personality, their emotions) somehow, they get caught in a cascade of impropable situations straight out of stock shoujo mangas and I feel it weakens her work.

I've read literally thousands of manga. I'm no expert but I recognize patterns.

And please, don't attempt to belittle my opinion by making me sound like a stupid internet troll.

You, yourself, called the latest development, "predictable".

When a series is predictable, it loses strength. Not that we need a plot twist every chapter. Just the flow could be better.

What's next?

I can almost see the dreaded arranged marriage trope coming.

last edited at Oct 20, 2015 12:52PM

somehow, they get caught in a cascade of impropable situations straight out of stock shoujo mangas and I feel it weakens her work.

I've read literally thousands of manga. I'm no expert but I recognize patterns.

And please, don't attempt to belittle my opinion by making me sound like a stupid internet troll.

I wasn't asking you to repeat your reason for why you're reading it. I was asking for more substance in your criticisms. You said you don't dislike cliches, and yet at the same time your justification for your criticism is that these cliches weaken Ssamba's work because YOU feel like you're rolling your eyes when you see said "cliches" (unless you have another more reasonable answer as to why you believe cliches contribute negatively to FF). It's a weak argument that contradicts your previous statements and it hardly justifies saying cliches=weaker story, because like I mentioned before, the two have no real correlation.

In other words, come up with something better than "I don't like it" before you make a general sweeping statement.

last edited at Oct 20, 2015 5:14PM

I have the impression I could rephrase it in 10 different ways, you'd still say it's no good. The cliches can be good in moderation.

But can you swear she's not going to pull an arranged marriage?

last edited at Oct 20, 2015 2:33PM

I have the impression I could rephrase it in 10 different ways, you'd still say it's no good. The cliches can be good in moderation.

But can you swear she's not going to pull an arranged marriage?

Lol I personally don't think that will happen. Maybe Seol-a's parents will talk to her about guys, but not sure if they will make her marry a guy. And to be honest, even if that would happen Ssamba could still find a way to make it interesting even if that is considered "cliche". After all, if Seola and Norae start dating, at some point their famillies will have to know. And we will get reactions from it. It doesn't have to do with chliches, it's the way that things work in reality

I have the impression I could rephrase it in 10 different ways, you'd still say it's no good. The cliches can be good in moderation.

But can you swear she's not going to pull an arranged marriage?

What does having an arranged marriage even have anything to do with whether FF is a good story or not? Did you not read anything I said? Once again, cliches are not inherently something negative; it is largely dependent on the context and how the author uses them.

How would having a dramatic, cliche arranged marriage affect the story negatively in an objective manner? Especially if it's necessary to advance the plot? In other words, how would you back up your argument of "cliches=something negative" aside from using your opinion as the golden standard for how cliches are supposed to affect a work?

Certainly whether we find a story enjoyable or not ultimately comes down to personal opinion, but to say thay using cliches automatically means that a work is subpar, is silly.

I expected the "if you think it's so bad, why do you read it?" and "If you are so smart, why don't you do better?" flames.

That is also cliche... :)

Those weaksauce comments are better left for Youtube Nya... We write essays to tell you how wrong your opinion is here. ;-P

Also, about ^, I think ekw79 was just trolling. No need to overreact like this.

Yeah, it was purely sarcastic and nothing to get your undies bunched up about.

Oh sorry my bad, didn't mean to overreact

i think nya-chan was just trying to say the amount of cliche's the author is putting in makes the events in the story unimaginative. not that the story itself isn't good, but just that the author is almost going down a checklist for the story. however, the way the characters deal with it/develop in it are what drives the story and makes her/him like it. the thing about it though, is that there is no avoiding cliches. any story is going to have them. it's taking them and making them your own that makes an author good. which ssamba does by her character interactions and their development. i never once thought about how any of these things were cliche as i read this until it was brought up here, so at least for me, it's a job well done.

and mezmerize, your avatar really had me laughing XD that's just great

What does having an arranged marriage even have anything to do with whether FF is a good story or not? Did you not read anything I said?

An arranged marriage would be an arc. A "bad" arc would certainly have something to do with FF being a good story or not. A bad arc would weaken the overall quality of a story.
Do note here that I'm not taking any side(yet), no bully pls.

Once again, cliches are not inherently something negative, it is largely dependent on the context and how the author uses them.

Oh but they are. Clichés as a definition are something that has because so commonplace that it has approached the realm of banality. They've become so commonplace that the majority have become numb to them. Be it a story or a saying ie. Raining cats and dogs.

When something is commonplace, as an individual you react less strongly because it has become routine. That's just "normal" human heaviour, his is why repeated actions, like a factory job makes one feel numb.
A story is definately weaker if the emotions it gives the reader is reduced.

A cliché is inherently something negative. As for the second part, it's true that it helps if the action(s) that stereotype helps reduce the negative aspect.
But if someone were to do a literary critic of FF, this would surely be pointed out.

Certainly whether we find a story enjoyable or not ultimately comes down to personal opinion, but to say thay using cliches automatically means that a work is subpar, is silly.

So to recap, you asked Nya-chan to be a bit more objective than "I don't like it". I think her saying this work uses a decent amount of a well established prejorative term in liteature is fair.
I think you would be hard pressed to find something more "objective" than that.

Now it would seem you contest this idea that it is inherently bad, well that's a rather tall ordeal would you not agree? To go against centuries of establishment.

Do you dare?! =P

Now I'm a scrub, I'm sure someone better at Engrish and language arts go discuss this at length but I also think this might not be the best forum for this, I think the derail would be too real.

last edited at Oct 20, 2015 6:34PM

xxcindybeexx
You explained nya-chan's argument about 100x better than he/she ever did. Thank you for actually reading and understanding my questions.

events in the story unimaginative
the author is almost going down a checklist for the story
the way the characters deal with it/develop in it are what drives the story

Is informative, substantial, and way more objective than

it weakens her work
I roll my eyes up because yet another cliche shows up.
I guess what Ssamba lacks is actually an editor, who can help her shape her story better.

And I'd have to agree with you; it's difficult to avoid cliches. But I was never particularly bothered by any cliches in FF because of how Ssamba delivered those scenes (characters, dialogue, etc.).

Clichés as a definition are something that has because so commonplace that it has approached the realm of banality
When something is commonplace, as an individual you react less strongly because it has become routine. That's just "normal" human heaviour, his is why repeated actions, like a factory job makes one feel numb.

Cliches are unoriginal. But that doesn't mean that they necessarily establish a stale, unoriginal story. Writing, plot development, characterization, etc., are all elements that contribute heavily to any story, so just because a situation or event is cliche or common, it doesn't mean that we should presume said situation to be boring/numb/uninteresting. A story being cliche and a story being well written/interesting/strong are two disjoint factors.

I think you would be hard pressed to find something more "objective" than that.

I think if you actually read his/her arguments, you'd be hard pressed to find anything objective at all. Refer to my comparison above.