ForumCage discussion

joined Jan 8, 2014

Wow again, so dark but so..like "real" with the intensity, and the twisted-ness...
I dunno if this really deserves the rape tag, well yeah the tag needs to be there, but ... ya know ?_?
A good read for sure, I like how that inner monologue was constant, and contrary...and then at the end when she holds her, just like in her thoughts, and then she practically breaks because of it ....ugh! Amazing stuff

B25e08d9df956cc70b30a6cce4e9e9cb
joined Aug 27, 2013

Thank Goddess it got finished. At least I hope so. This is SO typical story about a victim falling in love with her rapist made with some nice arousing art. I'm tired of artists seeing rape like this, showing the rarest incidents of all dark disgusting rape happenings. Please stop this crap already. Use your cute art somewhere without this sick pleasure of other people getting hurt and broken.

last edited at Oct 31, 2015 5:29AM

joined Mar 25, 2013

Is it finished? And rearranged chronologically? It doesn't say on the page that it's finished, so I kind of want to know it's over before I get it over with xD

Z%20ss
joined Oct 15, 2013

tbh, pretty shoddy writing. Everything seemed so uncanny and dry.

Did not notice who the artist was until now lol, lots of the mangaka's works are swing and a miss when it comes to writing.

2x2-shinobuden-m001
joined Dec 14, 2014

I had a hard time following the plot and the author's notes didn't make it any clearer with refering to the prequels as side stories 1-3 instead of the titles. I really don't have the faintest which stories he is referring to. Fake could be side story 1 because Shoukaku knows about Houshou's wounds but it was uploaded last. sighs

At times I also wasn't sure if the thought bubbles were still Nagato's or if they had switched over to Houshou.

last edited at Oct 31, 2015 8:31AM

Whome2
joined Apr 2, 2013

Warning, long wall of text summary below:

I had a hard time following the plot and the author's notes didn't make it any clearer with refering to the prequels as side stories 1-3 instead of the titles. I really don't have the faintest which stories he is referring to. Fake could be side story 1 because Shoukaku knows about Houshou's wounds but it was uploaded last. sighs

At times I also wasn't sure if the thought bubbles were still Nagato's or if they had switched over to Houshou.

For which chapter? The chapters in this story (as in the series as a whole) are all fragments of things that happened in the past and present. Since most of the later chapters have already been translated over at danbooru, I personally read through them all more than twice so I have a pretty good grasp of what's going on now. If you don't understand what's going on I'd be more than happy to explain.

I think it's easiest to understand if we take the setting of Cage as the present (for now). Houshou and Nagato's relationship have already progressed to the stage where Nagato is very forceful with her actions and feelings because she's been in love with her for a very long while but someone else (Shoukaku) 'stole' her. This makes this realization on the battlefield when she sees Houshou struggling but refusing help from her. We'll learn later that it's Shoukaku who nominates Houshou for the flagship position and it's Nagato and Houshou's first time in a while that they saw each other.

Edge is, obviously, a prequel story. From Nagato's point of view we see all the way from the beginning when Nagato first met Houshou and started falling in love with her. Along with the reoccurring theme of the entire story being that all the ship girls are very much conflicted on who to fall in love with. It's evident in Shoukaku's pov 'fake' the best that both Nagato and Shoukaku aren't satisfied falling in love with their sister ships (Mutsu and Zuikaku) just because that's what they're 'supposed' to do. Mutsu in a later chapter that hasn't been uploaded here yet (if you don't mind spoilers) recognizes Nagato's dilemma over this as well and even confronts Zuikaku.

The issue with the story order is that... there sort of isn't one. Cage doesn't make much sense until you read the later stories and the later stories don't make much sense without Cage. They all make references with each other and they all have interlaced references. This is a surprisingly complicated series that I'm enjoying because of how all the characters are being portrayed and apologies for the wall of text. And again, if anyone needs the story explained further I'd be happy to make another wall of text but I think just this explanation is enough to get most people started on understanding the story themselves.

2x2-shinobuden-m001
joined Dec 14, 2014

^
Thank you very much for the summary. I appreciate it and it helped me make sense of it.

At times I also wasn't sure if the thought bubbles were still Nagato's or if they had switched over to Houshou.

For which chapter?

I had just read the scene on the Kongou's couch in 'TOGE'. I reread it and figure everything that's in voice-over is Nagato's thoughts.

If I can think of any meaningful questions, I'll make sure to ask them here. Looking forward to the remaining chapters.

Pic1
joined Aug 29, 2013

Warning, long wall of text summary below:

There seems to be a spite of order amongst the chapters, if you just go by the fixed lettering.

"Front" = "Cage" + "Kodoku" + "Airen (Front special)"

"Middle" = "Tenohira" + Zangai"

"Last" = "Gekkou" + "Uso"

"Specials" = "1/2" + "Edge (Prologue)" + "Fake (Prologue)"

"Extra" = "TOGE"

The other half hasn't been translated into English yet.

last edited at Nov 1, 2015 12:09AM

Orgasmic_opt%20(1)
joined Dec 20, 2014

Ah, finally it's here. It's Bai Lao Shu, I don't know what to feel every time I read their doujins. So masochistic of me to read even though I know it's aaaangst/draaamaa (because Houshou yuri that's why)

Whome2
joined Apr 2, 2013

There seems to be a spite of order amongst the chapters, if you just go by the fixed lettering.

"Front" = "Cage" + "Kodoku" + "Airen (Front special)"

"Middle" = "Tenohira" + Zangai"

"Last" = "Gekkou" + "Uso"

"Specials" = "1/2" + "Edge (Prologue)" + "Fake (Prologue)"

"Extra" = "TOGE"

The other half hasn't been translated into English yet.

Yeah, definitely. danbooru has the chapter order listed as Cage, Tenohira, and Gekkou being the main 3 chapters in order (like what you said) and 1/2, edge, and fake being side stories. Which I'm inclined to believe in because the main chapters actually advance the storyline with only minor references to other events that get expanded upon on the extra chapters. Except with Cage having bits and pieces of Gekkou. The additional extra chapters is where it gets super interesting. Zanngai makes more sense once you've read Airen and Airen's scenes interlace with Uso's. Plus Airen has a scene that's a direct result of Kodoku since it's... well, part of the same 'timeline'. Even in order, it skips around a lot, but that's fine. It's a really big complicated mess of fun and interest. Storylines where literally everyone is flawed interest me a great ton.

I had just read the scene on the Kongou's couch in 'TOGE'. I reread it and figure everything that's in voice-over is Nagato's thoughts.

Fun fact: Houshou doesn't actually get that many narrations to herself. Most of the stories are with Nagato, Shoukaku, Zuikaku, or even Mutsu's thoughts. Also, the issue with TOGE is that since it's an extra chapter it has the prerequisite that you understand what Nagato's inner conflict is and Houshou sense of loyalty to Shoukaku. I know it definitely took me until about the 4th story in this series to finally understand what Nagato's deal was. And now whenever I look at her I just feel sad :(

joined May 3, 2014

I don't understand this story and i don't like it :/......if this kind of a story exist in reality ....thous people are REALLY FUCKING IDIOTS!!!

DAMN i don't even know wtf happen ...

Light_blue_429604_i0
joined Sep 28, 2014

Maybe it's just me but I feel like there COULD have been more potential to this story, but I had no idea what was happening since the chapters and characters are all over the place. The artist seems to be dragging this on while it could have been finished in 3 chapters.

Nevertheless, I hope Houshou finds happiness in the end...?

Yurilover
joined Feb 8, 2013

I cant quite get... All the storyline. Like cant grab the thought of author at all. Jeez

Img-20190201-wa0005
joined Sep 21, 2015

Why are the ships so in heat!? And why does everyone rape Houshou!? Also what's with the bitting fetish, it seems like it's contagious (from Mutsu to Nagato, and from Nagato to Shoukaku)

As I understand, Houshou is the mother-protective type and just wants to give her "sisters" (other ships) comfort, since all her sisters have a determined partner (sister) but she's a useless foreveralone. Ships are always in heat but when they do it with their sisters (the ones they are "supposed" to love) they can get a hold of themselves... but since they're doing it with someone they're not supposed to love their feelings run wild and they can't control themselves. That's why they act like animals in heat? (I didn't think that theory of Houshou being the slut-type but the latter chapter left me the impression, I can't understand how she thinks).

I don't get the author's point in this story, the plot is not consistent at all. Did he just want to draw a girl getting raped by numerous people, SM and a lot of H-scenes? I just hope that this is not the case, and he will explain himself in the latter chapters.

last edited at Nov 6, 2015 1:40AM

Whome2
joined Apr 2, 2013

Oh boy. Seems like there's a lot of misunderstanding and a lot of people are confused. If anyone is interested, I'll type out a full explanation with in-quote citations and everything. I'll go full English research essay for you guys. Until then: Mountain of text below:


Why are the ships so in heat!? And why does everyone rape Houshou!? Also what's with the bitting fetish, it seems like it's contagious (from Mutsu to Nagato, and from Nagato to Shoukaku)

Are you referring to the scene in fake? Page 29? Here's a very important hint: Shoukaku doesn't actually bite her. She attempts to as she's struggling with her own emotions. The reason for her desire is more subjective. For me, I personally interpreted as her trying to emulate Nagato's lust. This, to me, is evidenced by her monologue saying how they're all 'animals'. Her lust is becoming raw and uncontrollable. However she abstains from actually biting Houshou because that's not how she shows her physical feelings for her. <- this is the conclusion that you end up with no matter how you look at it and is the more important thing to take note of from that scene. Why? Because one of the biggest conflicts in this story is the difference in treatment/love/emotion between Nagato to Houshou and Shoukaku to Houshou.

Also Nagato (and by extension, Mutsu) will bite their lovers because that's just their fetish. There's probably additional reasons for Nagato to bite Houshou, but the important thing really is just that biting people gets them off.

Spoiler alert as to why you think Shoukaku bit Houshou: the bites and scratches from the page before (page 28) are from neither Shoukaku nor Nagato

Even more spoilers if you literally do not care about having an entire chapter spoiled for you: Zuikaku is the one who did it

As I understand, Houshou is the mother-protective type and just wants to give her "sisters" (other ships) comfort, since all her sisters have a determined partner (sister) but she's a useless foreveralone. Ships are always in heat but when they do it with their sisters (the ones they are "supposed" to love) they can get a hold of themselves... but since they're doing it with someone they're not supposed to love their feelings run wild and they can't control themselves. That's why they act like animals in heat? (I didn't think that theory of Houshou being the slut-type but the latter chapter left me the impression, I can't understand how she thinks).

That's an interesting take on it. I'm not going to say that my interpretation is more correct than yours, or that yours is wrong but the evidence in the story, to me at least, points more towards something like the story is very much more about the various ship girls opposing the preprogrammed notion of falling in love with someone. Both edge and fake say how "alive" they felt/what it meant to actually love once they acknowledged their feelings for Houshou vs how they were feeling very dull or sad upon hearing that their sister ship was recovered (especially since it meant that their peaceful time with Houshou will end). Them being unable to control their feelings is actually more of a result of different things for different people. Nagato can't control her feelings for Houshou because she was 'taken' by someone else already despite having loved her for a very long time. So having someone you love snatched away + waiting such a long time to hold in your feelings made them boil over. Shoukaku can't control her feelings primarily because Houshou isn't trying that terribly hard to cease contact with Nagato. Remember, at the start she was fairly gentle with her love and affection. And it sort of evolves into more aggressive actions because... well... How would you feel if you were together with someone and they kept sleeping with someone else? I'm talking about how Houshou keeps going back to Nagato, btw, not how Nagato forced herself onto Houshou the first time.

Also I think not being able to understand Houshou is rather deliberate. And it contributes very strongly to the 'confused' feeling Shoukaku and Nagato have. Houshou has very little monologue throughout the entire series so as a result you just understand less of her. I wouldn't call Houshou a slut (nor would I actually agree with anything that comes out of Zuikaku's mouth in this story), but she's not a completely innocent character at all. Even the author tells us this in the notes for edge (which btw is a fantastic source of evidence for a lot of the themes of the story). As the author puts it, she's the type of person who falls in love easily. You were correct in saying that she's destined to forever be alone (I don't know how much I agree with your statement on providing comfort, though? 'cause I'm not quite sure if you mean comfort as in friendship, or comfort as in a warm body to sleep next to while naked sort of thing) because everyone else has sister ships that they're predestined to fall in love with. Which... is why the point of the story is more about the girls overcoming that. My take, anyway. Houshou is forgiving and kind, so it makes it easy to take advantage of her for various reasons. She lets Zuikaku do it without resistance because she felt bad she took Shoukaku away from her, for example. She falls in love easily because all she wants is a little company. And that's sort of her problem. She does actually love Nagato and Shoukaku. But this isn't a sweet or romantic thing. That's her fault. Nagato's fault is that she can't properly express her love for Houshou and as a result she displays it in an aggressive way even though she wants to treat her well and have their relationship go back to being peaceful and happy like it used to be (like how they acted in fake). Shoukaku... well. read other chapters and find out. Houshou knows this herself, though, and she's seen multiple times saying she's just a lonely person.

I don't get the author's point in this story, the plot is not consistent at all. Did he just want to draw a girl getting raped by numerous people, SM and a lot of H-scenes? I just hope that this is not the case, and he will explain himself in the latter chapters.

I think the story really is more about ship girls overcoming what it means to love and battling the concept of falling in love with your sister ship. And then to add onto that, being unable to express your feelings properly (in the case of Nagato) or slowly turning more and more aggressive because someone you love is essentially cheating on you right in front of you (in the case of Shoukaku). I mean, all the ship girls are adults, except for Zuikaku I guess. It's normal for adult relationships to be... adult. It can feel a little rape-ish at times with Shoukaku, I suppose, because Houshou is sort of unresponsive to her advances and says how she doesn't actually want to sleep with her in her thought panels.


But anyway, I hope I properly clarified some of your confusion? I don't actually pay attention to the forums all too often so I can't, nor do i sort of want to, respond to every question from every person who is confused. It just sort of makes me sad to see people dislike the story just because they don't really understand it. It's not without its faults, though. I'll be the first to admit it's really convoluted. It's not really a fluffy story about people falling in love and it's probably not going to have a happy ending, so I guess a lot of people are having a hard time just from those reasons alone. But again, apologies for the huge mountain of text, and if anyone is interested I will write up that essay length spoiler laden summary to explain the story for people who are confused still.

Tumblr_lhn2y5j5rz1qbc0x9
joined Jul 26, 2013

Wow this storyline was really confusing for me until I read the comments haha

joined May 5, 2015

hi guys, i just want to ask is there something news about this story yet? i do really like this story so if someone knows news, can you tell me? thanks a lot

Cromartie%20highscool
joined Jun 7, 2014

sweet didn't know this would continue. I don't know why some people don't like it but it's other people's taste. Nice to read stuff like this time to time/

joined Aug 19, 2012

This is still very hard to follow.. It's too bad cause I like S&M stuff even if its a dark.

Z%20ss
joined Oct 15, 2013

sweet didn't know this would continue. I don't know why some people don't like it but it's other people's taste. Nice to read stuff like this time to time/

well, its kinda shallow writing, disjointed. and maybe due to that characters feel very uncanny and just kinda phasing through the story, or semblance of what there is of it. The artist's writing is not particularly great, pretty "janky" so to speak.

I feel no angst... I barely feel anything for this.. not even mild amusement it seems... But I kinda like the artist's simple artwork, shading and expressions...

Its as if I am staring at a bunch of random artwork/sketches.

last edited at Jan 6, 2016 11:38PM

I_whosonline
joined Oct 18, 2015

I thought that's gonna be love triangle between Houshou x Shoukaku x Nagato but Zuikaku and Mutsu were also involved so what can I call for this "crazy" romantic situation ?

joined Apr 25, 2013

Like most, I've been having trouble understanding this but I think this chapter actually makes everyone involved in the story a bit more sympathetic. They're struggling against what appears to them to be fate, some going to extreme lengths to prove that they have control over their lives.

I actually think Mustsu's rant from pg 8-12 sums it up pretty well. It actually seems to be even breaking the fourth wall and condemning the creators/fanbase for forcing them into essentially incestuous relationships.

Images
joined Dec 7, 2014

Yoori-san, I didnt understand the last chapter. Shoukaku broke off with Houshou because she couldnt take the pain of being cheated on anymore. Houshou turned to Nagato. Mutsu is still sleeping with Nagato, but she is resigned to being cheated on. I guess I got it right until there. But then, the last chapter was really confusing, and I don't know who is with who anymore. I thought all what was going on were memories/flashbacks, but the timeline is still confusing for me. Could you please, if not much trouble, explain it to me?
That aside, I think that the story is so real, and the feelings are so exposed, as if the characters bared themselves. Even Houshou, that confuses everybody, is just plainly clueless, a person that doesn't know what she wants. I really, really liked the story, just would be better if it was wrote in chronologic order.

Pic1
joined Aug 29, 2013

The one problem is that "Kodoku" is supposed to be before "Zangai" otherwise you won't understand the "Accepting my Kindness!" line, which is a flashback, and the deal with Yamato. And all the chapters aren't in proper order. Once the two more get done and uploaded. Some order needs to be tabulated.

last edited at Jan 14, 2016 12:15PM

Hanako
joined Jan 26, 2014

Um, what? I'm so confused.

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