LumberingCrane posted:

Oh yeah, sorry that I forgot to mention the thing that would probably be a huge deciding factor for a lot of people. It's kinetic. I am gonna say though as someone who prefers the presence of choices, the lack of them here helps make the story feel more focused; it's still understandable though if it being kinetic will make some people dismiss it.

I used to dislike them but after reading one that was really good, I started to appreciate them more as they are sort of mix between book and anime (I know it is kinda the point of VN), but without interactive part it is much less demanding on "player" so reading them once in a while isn't a bad thing. What I'm more concerned about is lack of actual yuri as from what I understood it has strong subtext at best. I guess it is worth considering if the story itself is at least good.

last edited at Oct 1, 2016 12:12PM

I'm too easily amused

Saw the Two Best Friends playthrough of a game called Anatomy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYX2nPpWp8o

This... is quite something.
Different enough for me to bother pointing out.

Is it kinetic novel by chance?

Oh yeah, sorry that I forgot to mention the thing that would probably be a huge deciding factor for a lot of people. It's kinetic. I am gonna say though as someone who prefers the presence of choices, the lack of them here helps make the story feel more focused; it's still understandable though if it being kinetic will make some people dismiss it.

While I prefer VNs with choices, I don't really see anything wrong with kinetic novels either. They're basically just books but with pictures and music, and I like reading them (the good ones anyway) so I don't have a problem with them.

Out of curiosity though, what are the types of VNs anyway? Like, what would you call a VN with choices? Is it just a VN? I know that there are kinetic novels and sound novels, but what are the other kinds anyway?

Is it kinetic novel by chance?

Oh yeah, sorry that I forgot to mention the thing that would probably be a huge deciding factor for a lot of people. It's kinetic. I am gonna say though as someone who prefers the presence of choices, the lack of them here helps make the story feel more focused; it's still understandable though if it being kinetic will make some people dismiss it.

While I prefer VNs with choices, I don't really see anything wrong with kinetic novels either. They're basically just books but with pictures and music, and I like reading them (the good ones anyway) so I don't have a problem with them.

Out of curiosity though, what are the types of VNs anyway? Like, what would you call a VN with choices? Is it just a VN? I know that there are kinetic novels and sound novels, but what are the other kinds anyway?

Aren't there VNs with actual gameplay?
RPG and action gameplay.
Referring to that or just by narrative?

last edited at Oct 1, 2016 11:44PM

Is it kinetic novel by chance?

Oh yeah, sorry that I forgot to mention the thing that would probably be a huge deciding factor for a lot of people. It's kinetic. I am gonna say though as someone who prefers the presence of choices, the lack of them here helps make the story feel more focused; it's still understandable though if it being kinetic will make some people dismiss it.

While I prefer VNs with choices, I don't really see anything wrong with kinetic novels either. They're basically just books but with pictures and music, and I like reading them (the good ones anyway) so I don't have a problem with them.

Out of curiosity though, what are the types of VNs anyway? Like, what would you call a VN with choices? Is it just a VN? I know that there are kinetic novels and sound novels, but what are the other kinds anyway?

Aren't there VNs with actual gameplay?
RPG and action gameplay.
Referring to that or just by narrative?

There are definitely a few like that. Most of Hanako Games' more recent games are basically VNs with some gameplay. I think there was a yuri VN beat-em up somewhere, but I forgot its name. But, yeah, I'm referring more to narrative kind of stuff.

Super Robot Wars games are VNs with gameplay.

So... much... text.

Super Robot Wars games are VNs with gameplay.

So... much... text.

I'd give it a pass if they didn't say my waifu looks stupid

flips posted:

Aren't there VNs with actual gameplay?
RPG and action gameplay.
Referring to that or just by narrative?

As far as I know VN started as interactive books. So it having text, visuals, music and multiple choices was the main feature. Then some started making VN without choices and they are called kinetic novel. And then some games adapted VN format but starting added features like rpg/combat etc. but they are still called VN.

UlquiorraSchiffer1

Lol i know. But killing countless no. of people just to much fun and lets out all of frustration :)

flips

I don't remember much of that game, I only know that I spent more time launching people at cars and buildings, loved seeing them bounce/splatter/fly.

Fun times...

UlquiorraSchiffer1

Thats Prototype for you. I usually used to grab random civilians and throws them off the building to see how much far i can throw them :P

Yeah, killing civilians, and anything else in our way, was pretty fun, only problem was when a group of hunters showed up, or helicopters, throwing people and things at them was pretty much the only way to defeat them in the worst cases, though it seens 2 is better at that, and everything else besides that story that apparently was really dumbed down. : /

Man that sure wsas a late reply...

So the starter evos for sun and moon have been revealed starting to doubt those leaks

last edited at Oct 12, 2016 11:55PM

Aw yeh, Terumi continues his streak of having at least one good theme per character

Hello Neighbor looks interesting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eut-ehTyUJs

But I get the feeling that its gonna be another one of those games... that disappoint.
10 minutes of gameplay
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoNjZboQ3Ss
pre-alpha my ass

Since it's fairly close to release date, I'll just give my brief thoughts on Ne No Kami:

It's alright.

Obviously no spoilers, but as for the yuri side of things, I can't help but feel this trope pervading the whole thing: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IfItsYouItsOkay

I think it's the same thing as what Nya-chan (iirc) said here in the forums about Morinaga Milk's characters too -- how they would've lived perfectly happy het lives if they didn't meet their "destined partner", or the feeling that this entire game could've also been easily het too and barely anything would change; it's only yuri because this person that this character likes just happens to be a girl.

As weird as it might sound, I think I prefer the yuri romance of their previous game, "Sacrament of the Zodiac". I'd like to give more specific reasons but what I said above is as spoiler free as I think I could go.

(and if this is still too much spoilers for someone out there, I'll happily edit it)

last edited at Oct 8, 2016 9:25AM

LumberingCrane posted:

I'd like to give more specific reasons but what I said above is as spoiler free as I think I could go.

Can you give spoiler version?

Can you give spoiler version?

I'll still try to be as vague as I can: the game kind of goes out of its way to tell you that "if this character was a boy, it wouldn't make a difference!" quite a few number of times. Plus a character liked another one while thinking that person was a guy because she was tomboyish as a kid. And the main character, as the game points out, is as dumb and as dense as bricks. Seriously, I haven't seen the inner monologue of such a dunce in a long while now. This is shown when she's the one that constantly says the whole spiel of "but we're girls!" or "why am I feeling this way, she's a girl!" or....argh I'm gonna go full spoiler on this one: "I'm using her to satiate my lust (which is the first 18+ scene of the game) and then NOT reciprocate her feelings (showing this in a blatant way I might add) because dating a girl scared me but apparently having sex with one is A-ok!" OR literally doing the textbook example of what NOT to do when you find out your friend is in a gay relationship by asking the oh-so-important question of: "how do you two have sex? c'mon it's just for general curiosity!" I kind of got side-tracked there, but the main thing I wasn't exactly fond of was that whole shoving it in your face how this could've easily been het. Yeah, I get it game, gender doesn't matter.

Edit: Funnily enough, the game I played before this is one is the exact opposite of this game when it came to its "yuri". While "Dead End Junction" doesn't have two female characters in a relationship, it had a female protagonist that found almost every single female character in the story to be attractive in some way while showing clear disinterest towards men. I'll continue plugging it by saying that I enjoyed that game's story more than this one (at least not including part 2).

For comparison with actual yuri games with action elements in it, Aoshiro is still better. The soundtrack for this game is pretty cool though. The background music for the 18+ scenes literally put me to sleep with how relaxing it was, although I don't think that was the intention.

last edited at Oct 8, 2016 11:10AM

Thanks. While I personally don't mind "because it is you" thing, I can get how understating the gender importance can hurt more than help. In theory messages like, "there is no difference between het and yuri" could be a good thing, showing that yuri is just as normal and natural as het, but then I can't help but think that it will only make people say "in that case just make it het".

Thanks. While I personally don't mind "because it is you" thing, I can get how understating the gender importance can hurt more than help. In theory messages like, "there is no difference between het and yuri" could be a good thing, showing that yuri is just as normal and natural as het, but then I can't help but think that it will only make people say "in that case just make it het".

You said it way better than I could. That's actually what I was worried about when I was listing this part as a complaint of mine. I know it's supposed to be a good thing that gender doesn't matter, but it still somehow made me feel uneasy in this specific case.

last edited at Oct 8, 2016 11:20AM

LumberingCrane posted:

You said it way better than I could. That's actually what I was worried about when I was listing this part as a complaint of mine. I know it's supposed to be a good thing that gender doesn't matter, but it still somehow made me feel uneasy in this specific case.

I'm really split about it. Loving someone for who they are, not what they are (as in this case, for their gender) is kind of love I can get behind and think it is just as genuine as any other (and honestly you should love someone because of who they are), but then from experience I know I love girls, because they are girls and I'm not attracted to guys because they are guys. So while I don't think either approach is fundamentally wrong, they are both mutually exclusive by nature and I'm not sure how to reconcile those 2 ways of thinking.

I'm really split about it. Loving someone for who they are, not what they are (as in this case, for their gender) is kind of love I can get behind and think it is just as genuine as any other (and honestly you should love someone because of who they are), but then from experience I know I love girls, because they are girls and I'm not attracted to guys because they are guys. So while I don't think either approach is fundamentally wrong, they are both mutually exclusive by nature and I'm not sure how to reconcile those 2 ways of thinking.

Are we supposed to even reconcile those 2 ways of thinking? I think it's perfectly fine to like a specific gender (or not have any interest whatsoever with any). I do agree that ideally, it would be nice to love the person for who they are and disregard all that stuff, but that's not how all people act in real life, and it's not like they should either. It's great that pansexual people exist, but it's not like it's a superior form of love because they love the person without caring about the gender. In the end, every person is different when it comes to that and that's A-ok.

That makes me realize what might specifically be my problem with the concept that the game presents. It's kind of underplaying the fact that girls who specifically only like girls exist. I assume I only realized it with this game so it became glaringly obvious when it happened here, but I think that a lot of japanese yuri works are kind of guilty of that too.

last edited at Oct 8, 2016 12:00PM

LumberingCrane posted:

Are we supposed to even reconcile those 2 ways of thinking?

In this case I was talking specifically about myself, since I find both ways of thinking valid‚ but only follow one.

That makes me realize what might specifically be my problem is with the concept the game presents. It's kind of underplaying the fact that girls who specifically only like girls exist. I think I only realized it with this game so it became glaringly obvious when it happened here, but I think that a lot of japanese yuri works are kind of guilty of that too.

I don't mind when they just say "I like girls" cos to me it is more natural way to say it than "I'm a lesbian", but I agree a lot works had a tendency to brush it over and make it look like only time girl fails for girl is when it is "because it is you".

In this case I was talking specifically about myself, since I find both ways of thinking valid‚ but only follow one.

Ah, sorry, my bad.

The last thing I'd like to say about the game's yuri is that the main difference between this and other yuri works that don't specifically acknowledge a female character only liking girls, is that this game shoves the whole "gender doesn't matter" thing a bit too much. In any other genre, that would not matter at all, but since this is advertised as yuri, hearing the characters say that they would still like boys so blatantly isn't exactly a great thing.

last edited at Oct 8, 2016 12:34PM

In this case I was talking specifically about myself, since I find both ways of thinking valid‚ but only follow one.

Ah, sorry, my bad.

The last thing I'd like to say about the game's yuri is that the main difference between this and other yuri works that don't specifically acknowledge a female character only liking girls, is that this game shoves the whole "gender doesn't matter" thing a bit too much. In any other genre, that would not matter at all, but since this is advertised as yuri, hearing the characters say that they would still like boys so blatantly isn't exactly a great thing.

"You're an exception" always bugs me, since it's a terrible foundation for anything that's gonna last and suggests there are things you normally like that the other person simply doesn't have. So if there's trouble, there's not that much other than "the unique situation" keeping things together.

"You're an exception" always bugs me, since it's a terrible foundation for anything that's gonna last and suggests there are things you normally like that the other person simply doesn't have. So if there's trouble, there's not that much other than "the unique situation" keeping things together.

I suppose in the game's defense, they all also specifically state that they've never fallen in love before until they met their partner during the course of events in the game. You're right though, the game is entirely a case of "the unique situation" pulling all these characters together (e.g. there's no one else besides the characters seen in-game that are actually their age, the village is filled with old people). Maybe it's that I personally don't trust the fact that it's a lot of circumstantial factors that brought these characters together; there's a lot of "this person coincidentally came up to me at this specific low point in my life, and now I love them for being so nice at that time." Combine that with the whole "gender doesn't matter" thing and it doesn't paint a nice setup for the yuri aspect of the relationship. I rather prefer Sacrament of the Zodiac's love at first sight that grew as they continue on with their relationship, since it's not really about the circumstance or the situation but rather it was solely the person themselves that caused them to fall in love in the first place.

Phew, now that I was able to pinpoint why exactly the yuri felt off I'll stop there. Sorry for hijacking (?) the thread a bit.

LumberingCrane posted:

Sorry for hijacking (?) the thread a bit.

Don't worry about it. I enjoyed our talk ;3