Anyone have any good recommendations for Yuri that you're reading atm ? Just finished vol 2 of the Sayaka light novels, Flowers part 1 visual novel, and caught up to Otome no Teikoku so I'm looking for something more to read.

Not explicit yuri but Nettaigyo wa Yuki Ni Kogareru is my favorite on going manga. It does a phenomenal job of exploring the emotional side of female relationships, The latest chapter we do get a confession from one of the characters, so this manga might be going the yuri route soon!

Nice start! Totally keeping up with this, it kinda reminds me of the mute girl and her new friend.

Guys, I finally found out why Hagino was pushing that boy into the story by putting him in every chapter, it turns out he was the former main character of her one shot that she submitted to the magazine, allowing her to serialize her own manga!

https://mangadex.org/chapter/694406/1

His name is Aoshima Haruto.

Literally who. ' -')

This guy
https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/nettaigyo_wa_yuki_ni_kogareru_ch28#18

Guys, I finally found out why Hagino was pushing that boy into the story by putting him in every chapter, it turns out he was the former main character of her one shot that she submitted to the magazine, allowing her to serialize her own manga!

https://mangadex.org/chapter/694406/1

His name is Aoshima Haruto.

Also, Riku makes a little cameo in it too

last edited at Jul 7, 2020 3:25PM

I think the author says this is ch 24.5 for those wondering about how it relates to the story
https://twitter.com/ajiichi_nomoto/status/1278984668231036929?s=21

Lol the art style has quite the change in the later chapters. The characters go from middle school to graduating looks-wise in like two volumes.

I bought volume one in English, but now I’m broke, however I have no complaints about spending any extra money I have on this beautiful manga. I can totally see your interpretation; in fact when this hopefully inevitably gets to a romantic relationship, I hope they skip over that “but we’re both girls” or “what is this feeling” my heart will melt if we simply get a chapter of them standing by the seaside, gradually get closer and lean in for the kiss (hopefully a response to that tease we got when they went on a fishing trip). I feel like the characters will go kinda like how Crescent moon and doughnuts is going: where it’s not the fact that the person that they’re in love with is the obstacle, but just accepting that it IS in fact love, which we already see Koyuki doing. I really see a resemblance in Konatsu and Uno in a way, how they both feel isolated until mysterious beautiful black haired senior lights up their world lol. I have total faith in Hagino and what’s gonna happen next, when next moth’s chapter comes out, I’ll probably find different meaning in everything that I assigned a meaning to this month. Just for fun, I might go back and mark all of the intentional parallels and references Hagino makes. Maybe we will see somethings yet to be revealed.

Ooo nice interpretation there! I think the biggest thing to look out for at this point is whether or not the characters are messing around or being truly serious about how they feel. Maybe it’s because Kaede is in here; where her character has her written into a box: she’s the energetic airhead, where in reality she’s afraid to be alone, and is very perspective of others. In her case, she’d probably just laugh at herself if she was put into a hard situation, or she would do whatever she could for the other person, neglecting her own feelings (as she did with pushing Koyuki and Konatsu closer together, even though it objectively raises the chances of Konatsu leaving her)

You’re right about the setup for leaving for university, but I still feel that it’s further down the road than we think, the first objective is Koyuki having cram school every day in matsuyama over the summer. I feel like it’s more like a trial period for the two, how will they make this coming summer work out? We’ve only seen them hangout on non school related business ONCE, what will they talk about? I think a very interesting point in this manga is that we don’t really hear what they talk to each other about besides the few lines Konatsu says regarding her dad. If I were to compare to Yagakimi, it’s like 1/3 of that manga is spent on talking on the way home. Even in citrus: we see Yuzu only talking about mei to Taniguchi (tho citrus had a slew of characterization issues regardless).

Just as a little side note: it’s really cute that Konatsu says that it’s rare for Koyuki to call, even though we all know she’d love to call konatsu all day

Looking at the ending interaction on ch 28 I can’t help but think that konatsu is trying to distance herself from Koyuki. You made a good point: the dad coming in was set up for us to see how konatsu had grown, and reassures is that she will be ok with Honami leaving, however this interaction makes me feel like she wants to distance herself from Koyuki. “I have to concentrate on myself right now””If I came to you for advice I feel like I would lose my nerve” This line especially seems contradictory to her development, as we know that she herself has confirmed to be fine apart from who she loves, yet in Honami’s case, she can’t be. Foreshadow for more development later?? The fact that she erases “frog” from the survey: I can’t help but think that she knows she wants to be with Koyuki but she is stopping herself from doing so. Maybe it’s an internal response to chapters 21 and 21: where she kept stating that she was being selfish. I don’t really think that Konatsu’s character arc is over yet, I mean if we were to put in a serious diagnosis of her having depression or something, it’s not something that just goes away. With her father, she got really sad about him leaving but then forced herself to be optimistic. With Koyuki, it appears that her being wants to be attached but she is forcing distance. Now this could be for one of two reasons: She's doing this for herself, so that she won't be as sad, and she is trying to gain some independence from her senpai, or (which I think is the real reason) She is trying to make it easier for Koyuki to leave. We get an interesting flashback at the beginning of the chapter; Konatsu obviously didn't have anyone she considered a friend (the girls she spoke to her referred to her as Amano), but her dad assumes she has some, and ask if she told them about the move. She lies and says yes. It appears that Konatsu was emulating a little bit of Kaede here, as she lied to her dad about having friends to reassure him that she wasn't feeling lonely, and she lied about telling them that she was leaving. I speculate that this would be so that the move would be easier for her dad. She reassures his choice by telling him that it was his dream, and he should go for it. I see massive parallels with Koyuki. Konatsu states that she doesn't have anything she wants to do, unlike her senpai, establishing the fact that Koyuki has dreams. Learning about her massive move, it would appear to be more in character for her try and make Koyuki feel less pain, rather than making her move harder. Personally, given how indebted she feels to Koyuki, I really wouldn't put it past Konatsu to say something that would put distance between them, so Koyuki wouldn't stop herself from leaving, or would feel less homesick. This is a stretch though, but I can't help but think about this occurring given Konatsu's actions having a pattern of not lining up with her emotions. I way say that sign of growth would be Konatsu not going along with this method, although it begs the question of why the author chose that specific flashback.

As for the analogy, I do agree that I'm sure this arc's literary allusion will have to do more with moons and less with amphibians, but I still think that it is an interesting speculation, granted that their roles have flipped multiple times in this series.

Back to ch 28. It's obvious that Koyuki even called Konatsu in the first place because she couldn't stand not seeing her for two days. She states that nothing is wrong, and then... "Well seventh period dragged longer today so I couldn't come to the club." Big hint that Koyuki is missing Konatsu, where Konatsu replies abruptly that there's nothing she can do about it. Once again, putting distance between them. If Konatsu really wanted to get closer, she would have said something along the lines of "Yeah I was missing you at club too. It was lonely without you." Which something like this would be plausible for her character. She then interrupts Koyuki to talk about how she also got the survey. I feel like she may even be discouraging or preparing herself for they inevitable breakup. rather than healthily confronting her feelings: "You're leaving, but it's oaky because this distance won't break us up." It appears that she is tying to mentally prepare herself for what is to come, Like prepare for a life where she can't have her senpai all to herself or be with her all the time. People do this often. When they feel like someone is leaving, they try to make distance to save both parties pain, or they learn to cope with the distance. Konatsu has done both within this series; but it becomes harder to understand why.

When Honami says her infamous line, she isn't blushing or being dorky as she would be expected to be, rather her face is a little indifferent, maybe this confession is her way of trying to close the distance that konatsu is attempting to create. I will say that it would be to jarring to go straight into an acceptance of a confession. I mean, I already find Konatsu's behavior odd, and Koyuki not being a dork, where she was clearly so when Konatsu picked up the phone. I truly don't think that they would spring into a romance immediately.

for what it's worth, I've seen the author stream a few times (her oldest streams might still be up) and the scene for the next chapter takes place at the beach. The most interesting picture that she spent most of the stream on was a full page of Koyuki and Konatsu standing on the beach, Konatsu turned away from Koyuki, with her hand up. I'm not sure whether this is negative or positive. This Ould be the stereotypical "I'm shy so I can't say what I want to say to your face" Move, or a heavy "I don't want to hear any more of this. Idk, it just made me look forward to the chapter more.

Lastly, I understand your point about the back story, the author really has been particular about what she reveals to the reader, as there isn't a lot of pandering with the characters: the delivery of information is very minimalistic , as if this is actually a much longer manga, and she's picking out the most important parts and condensing the rest into backgrounds and implications through character interactions. Sometimes I really just want to see everything. As a reader I'm really curious as to why Konatsu is the way she is, is it because of some tragic backstory as with all manga, or is she really just a depressed high schooler who can't seem to make true friends? Honestly I'd love to know anyones's thoughts on anything Iv'e said, I really want to see the story from different perspectives, mostly because there are many routes this way can go, with what we are given.

I'd also like to make a point that isn't related to previous posts much. Remember that girl who was about to drink in ch 24 ish ? She's the same girl from chapter 2, and from Kaede's chapter. Her character is very interesting, almost as though she is a reflection of who Koyuki wants to be. She's the one who invites Honami out to eat; she's the one who see's Honami out and is shocked to see that Honami can be normal too. It alway appeared to me that Honami was jealous of this girl, or that she was put to be how Honami would have been if EXPECTATIONS were stacked on her. Even so, when asked for a drink, Honami wants to order an Oolong... oolong what? granted her usual conservative nature, the reader can assume that in reality, she just likes to drink tea rather than soda, but this girl orders an oolong hardball. It was probably at this point where Honami really gained a truer sense of self, that she saw this girl that she may have been envious of or a societal role model to, and she realizes that that image she yearned for isn't truly who she wants to be.

Ah, sorry for going on a tangent again.

I totally agree with you. I think the author has really taken care of the characters emotions, and that there isn’t really a need for romance, but I can’t help but wonder what this next arc will be. Granted with that line drop we got last chapter, I think it was the authors way of telling the reader what’s next. Understanding the structure of the literary allusions in the story so far, it is easier to assume that Konatsu wouldn’t immeasurably understand Koyuki’s message. Honestly it would be too jarring for them to go straight into dating right now for me, I would enjoy it if we really get to see the process of their feelings. From the beginning it is implied that Koyuki liked Konatsu more than a friend (if were looking at their interactions through a romantic lens) : “If you gave me your number, I’d call you all the time!” “There’s something wrong with me, ever since I met Konatsu I’ve been so...” and of course, taking a pic of her bae’s sleeping face. Koyuki appears to understand her feelings, which can lead to the reader coming to the conclusion of “I want to always be together” as “I want to spend the rest of my life with you and no one else” Koyuki saying “The moon is so beautiful” If we are implying that this ain’t just a gag from the author, is probably her way of saying that the only person she’d want to spend the rest of her life with is Konatsu. This scene actually parallels one form chapter 25, where Honami walks to Konatsu’s place and we can see the Konatsu is looking out the window with the curtain shut. Symbolical this would be that communication rift that they had between them, as neither of them had admitted that “I’m lonely without you” yet. The author actually has a knack for these parallels: we can see that Koyuki shares a drink with Konatsu during in “Koyuki can’t concentrate” a parallel to the indirect kiss she got so worked up over. Every single time Koyuki has done something that opens herself up, it was always as a result of Konatsu setting it for her. The same thing can be seen when Koyuki takes hours to reply in one chapter, and a few chapters later she’s neglecting club duties to talk to her friend.

Based off of her interactions, we can see that Honami is sure of herself. She knows what she wants to do and how she feels about others: her issue is just doing these things. So upon that conclusion, I’m sure that this line is something she’s been meaning to say for a while, but she was too afraid to put her words into action, or be that person she wants to be. I’m just speculating, but I’m the sports festival chapter, Kondou talks to Konatsu about Honami and says “she’s smart, she’s pretty, and then there’s...” I’m sure that Koyuki’s story is still being withheld to the reader a little. If we get a little more of her backstory besides her isolation and dorkiness, it would even more solidify what it is she feels for Konatsu

That being said, this is Konatsu’s chapter. She won’t be deferred. But defferred from what? Getting into a a relationship with her senpai, despite knowing that she’ll be clinging on to a person who will leave in a year, or deferred from rejecting Koyuki’s feelings, despite knowing that it would be painful for both of them? Konatsu is full of unknowns. What happened to her mom? Her dad says the first time he can around “I’m so glad you’ve found something you’re engrossed in here too” What are her interests? Does she even like salamanders? Lol. She apparently has always been lonely and has placed a bar between herself and others, I wonder why. We know now that she understands that she can no longer have an unhealthy dependence on people, which is why she may end up rejecting Koyuki, or hiding her feelings.

A user posted a very interesting analysis of the salamander and frog story a while back. It Wen along the lines of “the salamander’s cave is their shyness, the frog enters the cave of the salamander, satisfying the unapproachable salamanders loneliness. The frog starving itself to death is an analogy for it starving for something more in their relationship” if Koyuki is the frog and Konatsu is the salamander, then maybe she will get rejected (initially) and we will enter an arc where the emotional love turns into one that is non-platonic. Idk I might be looking too deeply into things, but knowing the author, we are definitely going to get a display of explicit feelings. If this goes the yuri route. If it doesn’t, then i wouldn’t know how to justify this previous interaction. Sorry if I’m not making any sense, but do you understand my analysis?

Hmm, maybe not directly, but indirectly at least? He might serve as someone for Konatsu to project on to, as she does when he sees him sucking the aquarium water. Maybe he ends up confessing to Koyuki or something, and Konatsu can see how his feelings for her parallels her own. Kinda like how that girl from the sports festival didn't do anything for the plot, or even had a name, but she sparked Konatsu's interest to learn more about Koyuki, and also let Konatsu know that the version of Koyuki she sees is different than everyone else's. Tbh, I wouldn't think that he would be as important if it weren't for his appearance in ch 24, around page 25. There are the signature fish appearing in their interaction, and Konatsu stares at him after he leaves. He's also the person who pulls her out of her depressed daydream about being lonely. I mean, there HAS to be some kind of role he plays after that.

^
Nice catch! With how many yuri doujins she wrote, I kinda have to wonder if she's struggling to hold back with Nettaigyo, heh.

You know, I've been wondering that too. I don't think she's trying to make them not go into a relationship, it's more like it would be out of character for our main girls to develop in any other way than they have now. I was re-reading the earlier chapters, and it was obvious that Koyuki was very infatuated with Konatsu from the start, though even through the festival, we see that she never took time to understand her own feelings and whether or not she wanted to be friends or more than friends with Konatsu. Whereas with Konatsu, she just didn't want to be lonely, and needed to find someone to trap in her cave of loneliness, which is what she did with Koyuki. It was originally Koyuki's choice to open up and deepen the friendship with Konatsu, we see this when after Konatsu says she already knows Honami, Koyuki replies by telling her her first name (this was like chapter one, I think).

Granted the nature of their relationship, it feels entirely natural that Koyuki would be the one to confess, but Konatsu may not be able to completely understand the nature of her feelings. Neither characters put a label on their feelings, so it's in the nature of the story for the two of them (or at least Konatsu) to truly figure out what they feel. Personally, I think it will take the work of a third party, maybe that nameless boy we see at the club to confess, or be like the Maki from YagaKimi of this manga. It might even be Kaede, who would be the designated wingman (I mean seeing the two follow each other out the classroom may be interpreted as a confession rather than a confrontation in ch 26). But I think that the pacing of the story really makes sense once reading it all the way through: These two girls form a relationship with one another, confront their individual problems, confront the problems that had with one another, and now we can see them possibly grow into a healthy romance.

Sorry for such a long post, but this series is for sure my favorite ongoing, there are so many subtleties that I could go on for forever.

https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/a_doujin_where_shikinami_became_the_secretary_ship_ch04#22
https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/a_doujin_where_shikinami_became_the_secretary_ship_ch04#23
I was taking a look at the author's other works, and it turns out she's pulled "the moon is beautiful" line before! I really hope that this time won't just be for comedic purposes though.

Also more conflict means the story isn’t over yet, really hoping this isn’t the final arc, although the journey has been very satisfying so far.

https://twitter.com/haginomakoto/status/1276176640054198276

The author said here that this isn't the end yet and to keep following the series.

Yeah I was wondering what her tweet meant, google translate isn’t always the most clear. But yeah we need to know more about Konatsu’s family, Kaede and her sisters, this mysterious boy whose face we’ve seen every chapter, and this budding romance between Konatsu and Koyuki （＾ν＾）cheers to a long run of this art

I feel like the momentum of the story is going back to the starting chapters, especially around the festival, where As the reader we were able to see how deeply Konatsu feels about Koyuki. Maybe next chapter we get to see explicitly how Koyuki feels about Konatsu.

Volumes 5, 6 and half of 7 were a tour-de-force in terms of giving the characters a deeper emotional understanding of their own issues and due to how long it took them to be released, I've seen several readers feel fatigued, but now should be the time to really start paying all that build-up and development off with the interactions between the two. Koyuki would certainly be able to give a more proper answer to Konatsu's question from the previous year's summer festival. Actually I wonder if there will be a chapter where they go to the festival again since summer break is coming up and Koyuki's father suggested she take a break from cram school and go have fun once in a while.

I’d love to see a reiteration if the summer festival. I really think the next chapter can go two ways: it’s the long awaited confession chapter, or it’s that start of a new conflict chapter. Honestly I think and hope it will go the second way, mostly because we just got past major development, and I think that it would be a littler jarring to go straight into a relationship given how the pace has been going, and so we can see that realization of feelings ourselves. Neither character has said to themselves how they feel about the other, it was mostly us the reader deducting their feelings. I think the payoff would be great to see that character growth of acknowledgment of feelings. Also more conflict means the story isn’t over yet, really hoping this isn’t the final arc, although the journey has been very satisfying so far.

Also, anyone have an idea on what Konatsu was talking about towards the end of the chapter when she said “So we should....More Properly...”? It could be a subtle way of talking about dating, as in “we should more properly define our relationship” or something about spending more time together, but I’m really curious as to what the author is going with those lines

Follow-up to page 18 where she thought to herself they "should've talked more about a lot of other things and about each other". Find out what she meant next chapter, maybe.

I feel like the momentum of the story is going back to the starting chapters, especially around the festival, where As the reader we were able to see how deeply Konatsu feels about Koyuki. Maybe next chapter we get to see explicitly how Koyuki feels about Konatsu.

Also, anyone have an idea on what Konatsu was talking about towards the end of the chapter when she said “So we should....More Properly...”? It could be a subtle way of talking about dating, as in “we should more properly define our relationship” or something about spending more time together, but I’m really curious as to what the author is going with those lines

But maybe Koyuki isn’t very aware of famous Japanese literary allusions, so her saying, “The moon is beautiful” is just a random meteorological observation—you know, small talk.

(Sometimes I crack myself up . . .)

I really wouldn’t put it past her, she was socially awkward until like four chapters ago

Given that the controlling metaphor for the entire series has been an extended series of allusions to a classic literary short story, I’m pretty confident the “moon is beautiful” reference is more than a random coincidence.

Haha, you’re totally right! In this case I guess it’s Koyuki’s turn to use classical literature to convey her feelings!

last edited at Jun 27, 2020 2:08PM

But maybe Koyuki isn’t very aware of famous Japanese literary allusions, so her saying, “The moon is beautiful” is just a random meteorological observation—you know, small talk.

(Sometimes I crack myself up . . .)

I really wouldn’t put it past her, she was socially awkward until like four chapters ago

^^ I will say that I absolutely LIVE for the character development in this manga. I really like that even though we may not ever see a romantic relationship between the two, we still see how much they mean to one another, and how they each have grown as a result of the other person.

It took me 26 chapters to realize that this was a story of two girls with depression trying to open up about it to each other. Beautiful.

If hanigare ever gets past the arc it’s in now and becomes a romance that would for sure be the top yuri.

Honestly, not even counting the whole "it's not a yuri" tweet, I think Nettaigyo totally killed its momentum with the recent chapters. I don't think I've ever read a less enjoyable angst fest.

Tbh the “it’s not yuri” thing is probably her way of saying that she’s not taking the conventional route towards the romance. After re reading the arc we’re in, I think it’s so frustrating because the two MCs can’t understand their feelings because they don’t know what they are. Idk, I kind of feel a romance coming in there but I honestly have no idea where the story is going.

last edited at Dec 1, 2019 2:27PM

If hanigare ever gets past the arc it’s in now and becomes a romance that would for sure be the top yuri.

oh so konatsu is the salamander all along?

What a tweeeest!

I'm glad we're getting the payoff to all the time Konatsu spent out of focus, it finally feels like there was a clear point to it all and to Kaede's increased importance.

Yo, just to point out, this is the first chapter where the title doesn’t have “isn’t, wasn’t, won’t” or any type of “not doing something”. Totally not ready for this

I mean it could be platonic. But I just think that the fact that we see Konatsu’s jealousy is a sign that she values Honami more than we may have originally thought.

Based just on the first pages of this thread, I think you underestimate what we may have originally thought. ;)

Oooo true, I was just talking about after Makoto Hagino wrote that tweet about not defining her work as yuri lol.

I mean it could be platonic. But I just think that the fact that we see Konatsu’s jealousy is a sign that she values Honami more than we may have originally thought.