I wanna say this is worth reading even if it regressed into subtext, for how cute it is, but I despise the idea that she was forced to dial it back because of government interference. May it consume me as much as it will, it changes nothing.

Hopefully Tanjiu can give her vision form in a careful manner.

Others have disagreed (vehemently) with me on this, which is fine, but I really think Tanjiu's strength is creating strong individual scenes rather than working a large-scale narrative, and the previous cast was rather extended, with a lot of characters to service (and--the part where I get pushback--I didn't care much about those other characters except for Mophead anyway).

So I'd prefer more of a focused story if I could get it, but this does play to what I see as the author's strengths.

(Autocorrect wants "Hophead" rather than "Mophead," which is definitely not OK.)

last edited at May 24, 2019 1:30PM

Others have disagreed (vehemently) with me on this, which is fine, but I really think Tanjiu's strength is creating strong individual scenes rather than working a large-scale narrative.

I see what you mean actually. Whenever I think of this story I have trouble remembering any real arcs or character development, but I do rermember really strong moments. Or scenes if you will.
Tanjiu is good at conveying a mood and clearly has a real talent for framing moments.

PS: At least it wasn't Bophead.

last edited at May 24, 2019 1:38PM

I wanna say this is worth reading even if it regressed into subtext, for how cute it is, but I despise the idea that she was forced to dial it back because of government interference. May it consume me as much as it will, it changes nothing.

Hopefully Tanjiu can give her vision form in a careful manner.

Woah, hey, a plotline may have been dropped, but it is -not- subtext. They've been repeatedly shown that they end up living together, and the most recent storyline made reference to them dating, had QT hop in SJ's lap, involved them sharing their second kiss, and had Sun Jing explicitly refer to herself as Qiu Tong's girlfriend.

Even this latest strip, while not explicitly romantic, speaks to the importance SJ holds to QT.

Their relationship is text, and there's no sign that Tan Jiu has backed off on that.

The theory that matches the fact pattern is that she ditched the sad storyline because life was depressing, not that she's censored the story itself. Unless you have another source of info that I haven't seen.

The theory that matches the fact pattern is that she ditched the sad storyline because life was depressing, not that she's censored the story itself. Unless you have another source of info that I haven't seen.

It’s worth remembering, though, that SJ & QT were far from the only thread the “narrative” version of the story had going. Off the top of my head there was:

• Mophead and That One Girl
• The Guy Who Was Gay
• The Basketball Rivalry
• The Angst of the Really Big Guy

To say nothing of Mopey Mo and Tattletale, who barely survived the Narrative Implosion.

Others have disagreed (vehemently) with me on this, which is fine, but I really think Tanjiu's strength is creating strong individual scenes rather than working a large-scale narrative, and the previous cast was rather extended, with a lot of characters to service (and--the part where I get pushback--I didn't care much about those other characters except for Mophead anyway).

So I'd prefer more of a focused story if I could get it, but this does play to what I see as the author's strengths.

(Autocorrect wants "Hophead" rather than "Mophead," which is definitely not OK.)

I think Tan Jiu has the talent for large narratives but seems unfocused and impatient. She jumps around and backs up to fill out backstory like someone who has a good eye for how to structure a narrative, but lacks the patience to finish out plans and execute them.

The theory that matches the fact pattern is that she ditched the sad storyline because life was depressing, not that she's censored the story itself. Unless you have another source of info that I haven't seen.

It’s worth remembering, though, that SJ & QT were far from the only thread the “narrative” version of the story had going. Off the top of my head there was:

• Mophead and That One Girl
• The Guy Who Was Gay
• The Basketball Rivalry
• The Angst of the Really Big Guy

To say nothing of Mopey Mo and Tattletale, who barely survived the Narrative Implosion.

I mean, the Basketball rivalry was dealt with in the short term, the big guy -is- the gay guy, and he's an upperclassman and wouldn't be involved in the class trip, and I think the girl is an underclassman, so she probably wouldn't be around for it either. And that also was at a point where nothing specific was happening.

Mo was straight up derailed. The others could just be on the backburner while the A story goes.

I think Tan Jiu has the talent for large narratives but seems unfocused and impatient. She jumps around and backs up to fill out backstory like someone who has a good eye for how to structure a narrative, but lacks the patience to finish out plans and execute them.

No offense, but that sounds like my point.

Someone who could do A but finds themselves distracted into focusing on B would seem to be strong in B rather than in A.

Edit: There’s also the Other Gay Guy, the not big one.

last edited at May 24, 2019 7:18PM

Woah, hey, a plotline may have been dropped, but it is -not- subtext.

Maybe subtext was the wrong word. Indirect is more like it. Sure, they can talk about what they mean to each other and be cute together, but they can't really show it as explicitly anymore.

At least that seems to be the direction its going in. Fuck China.

last edited at May 25, 2019 2:13AM

I'd been wondering why the story changed so dramatically. I'd been invested in all the side characters too, not to mention Qui Tong and Sun Jing's progressing relationship...

Fuck China.

Fuck Westerners. I'm so tired of seeing baseless China-bashing on every English website, and I'm not even Chinese. This tall tale about self-imposed censorship of the story is a complete fabrication with absolutely no basis in reality. Literally somebody just made it up and you instantly take it as fact without hesitation because it fits your preconceived notions of China as a country to be looked down on with contempt. I really, really hate how Europeans and their descendants across the pond seem to base their self-worth on perceived moral superiority to non-Europeans.

I have dozens of reasons to dislike China. Whether this is one more or less makes no difference.
I don't have any self-worth to speak of, but I sure know that the Chinese government is terrible. Despite their efforts at censorship, more than enough of their crimes are evident. The West ain't all peachy either, but that doesn't mean anyone should ignore the facts.

And before this goes downhill, the people aren`t bad, it's the nation.The Chinese people does not deserve the way they are treated.

last edited at May 25, 2019 2:28PM

Fuck China.

Fuck Westerners. I'm so tired of seeing baseless China-bashing on every English website, and I'm not even Chinese. This tall tale about self-imposed censorship of the story is a complete fabrication with absolutely no basis in reality. Literally somebody just made it up and you instantly take it as fact without hesitation because it fits your preconceived notions of China as a country to be looked down on with contempt. I really, really hate how Europeans and their descendants across the pond seem to base their self-worth on perceived moral superiority to non-Europeans.

The author says the following (translated):

"“Regarding the issue of (SQ) publication I would like to update everyone, originally the second volume was set to be published in October but it was temporarily suspended because of the general assembly (*note: if I’m not wrong she’s talking about the 19th CCP Congress 2017). Later in November the publishing company requested to remove the confession scene on the bridge before publishing the manhua, their meaning is that even though this would be a cut version at least we can still earn royalties. My company and I roundly rejected this, really find it hard to accept my work being censored in this manner, in the end we decided at this stage to suspend the publication of the second volume for the time being. Regarding this matter, towards everyone who have been waiting for the publication I would like to express my deepest apologies. Publishing their work is how artists survive, and it is also every artist’s wish and dream, so (this incident) had a definite impact on my condition. But I am already slowly recovering, regardless of whether I have the chance to publish my work or not, I will still continue to draw on.”

https://velvetrouge.tumblr.com/post/169814029146/regarding-the-issue-of-sq-publication-i-would

Literally somebody just made it up and you instantly take it as fact without hesitation because it fits your preconceived notions of China

Yeah, can't imagine why people would be willing to believe that of a totalitarian police state whose current Great Leader has managed to turn himself into a Diet Mao - budding personality cult and all - and openly pursues rather explicitly conservative-nationalist cultural policies on the side...

last edited at May 25, 2019 4:13PM

This was a story I used to like but dropped a year ago due to non-existent plot. Has anything changed?

This was a story I used to like but dropped a year ago due to non-existent plot. Has anything changed?

Are you trolling?

No? Just wondering, looks like from the discussions there is still no plot.

No? Just wondering, looks like from the discussions there is still no plot.

It’s a little hard to explain why questions like this come off so badly. But they do.

On the surface, it’s just a simple question: “This used to have a plot, then it it went SOL. Does it have a plot again or not?” Short answer: no, it’s still SOL.

But the more extreme version (I’m not saying this is what you’re doing—I’m making a parallel) is the person who comes into a forum and says, in effect, “I dumped this because it sucked. Hey idiots who have been reading it all along—does it still suck?”

The people who have been reading it all along and presumably don’t think it sucks have no inclination to save that person any labor by answering the question. (Not answering sincerely, anyway.)

In this case, reading any three chapters would take as many minutes or fewer, and then you could answer the question yourself.

last edited at May 25, 2019 9:47PM

Ok I got the point, sorry if it came off badly. I actually decided to ask because the last time I tried to pick up the series again, I couldn't tell if there was a plot or not, even after reading several chapters lol hard to explain. And then I read the posts above, again trying to figure out if there is a plot or not, and found a discussion about China and indirect vs subtext lol So I was like...ok, the only option is to ask if the story has some direction or not now.

No, it hasn’t changed much, and looking back over the whole thing, it was always fairly indirect and made up of embedded SOL mini-arcs, so maybe any three chapters at any point wouldn’t necessarily tell you all that much about continuity.

But they’re still cute, anyway.

I've always read this as SOL with a sub plot about a GL romance. I think the blurb sometimes makes it feel like they aren't selling it as one.

I think Tan Jiu has the talent for large narratives but seems unfocused and impatient. She jumps around and backs up to fill out backstory like someone who has a good eye for how to structure a narrative, but lacks the patience to finish out plans and execute them.

No offense, but that sounds like my point.

Someone who could do A but finds themselves distracted into focusing on B would seem to be strong in B rather than in A.

I intended it to expand on your point. You said she was better at character scenes than managing a large narrative, I was pointing out that I think the skill and instinct for a narrative is there, but lacking the focus to piece things together in order.

Edit: There’s also the Other Gay Guy, the not big one.

Upperclassman is the only gay guy, though. I'm assuming you mean Sun Jing's and Mophead's friend, who Upperclassman likes, but nothing Tan Jiu has shown us so far indicates that he reciprocates UC's feelings. In fact, most of his reactions so far are of crippling discomfort and panic.

In other words, if he's gay, he's at least closeted, in denial, and maybe even self-hating. Is it possible that the story is about him becoming comfortable with himself and dating UC? Maybe, but there's no real indications of it.

Or is that the wrong person, and I'm forgetting someone else?

Woah, hey, a plotline may have been dropped, but it is -not- subtext.

Maybe subtext was the wrong word. Indirect is more like it. Sure, they can talk about what they mean to each other and be cute together, but they can't really show it as explicitly anymore.

But....They -just- had their second kiss. They were explicitly flirting. They're a couple. Tan Jiu hasn't shied from -any- of that.

The censorship just has to do with her work not being -published-, keeping her from making money off of it. She's still making it as an explicitly romantic relationship.

Fuck China.

I know how you meant this, and the person that got pissed over it was explicitly wrong, plus you clarified, but it might be better to go with "Fuck the Chinese Government" from the get-go in the future. ;p

Upperclassman is the only gay guy, though. I'm assuming you mean Sun Jing's and Mophead's friend, who Upperclassman likes, but nothing Tan Jiu has shown us so far indicates that he reciprocates UC's feelings. In fact, most of his reactions so far are of crippling discomfort and panic.

You’re right—I was reading his reaction in that “you’re cute, girls would like you, also guys” scene as an “Oh shit, my secret feelings have been revealed” panic. Then that random guy kissed him in the restaurant, which is certainly an unfortunate coincidence if not a gaydar reading.

In other words, if he's gay, he's at least closeted, in denial, and maybe even self-hating. Is it possible that the story is about him becoming comfortable with himself and dating UC? Maybe, but there's no real indications of it.

People have been making the point that even the narrative sections of the series were pretty diffuse and indirect as far as which threads were important for future development. Along with the elements we’ve mentioned, there was the budding “friendship” with the rival basketball guys, as well as the academic rivalry between Mophead and Tattletale (Mophead saving Tattletale from falling off the chair is for me of the more visually memorable scenes in the series).

It’s pretty clear that Tanjiu was gearing up to continue the series as it had been going by focusing on SJ & QT while throwing Mo into the mix, with Mophead and Eager Girl as a subplot, when something happened and everything swerved (in terms of story format). But there’s no indication that the story was going to become more sexually explicit—and it’s always been about a lesbian relationship.

It’s almost like Dynasty needs a new term. This series and, say, A Room for Two are about girls in a loving relationship that’s as “text” as text can be, but neither may ever (for various reasons) supply the kind of evidence the yuri-skeptics are looking for.

(My own preferred term is “yuri.”)

It’s a little hard to explain why questions like this come off so badly. But they do.

That wasn't it at all. I was exasperated because that topic was discussed in at least 163 posts, including the ones directly above the question. ^^

It’s a little hard to explain why questions like this come off so badly. But they do.

That wasn't it at all. I was exasperated because that topic was discussed in at least 163 posts, including the ones directly above the question. ^^

Sorry to misspeak on your behalf, then. I myself do get exasperated at the “I dumped this, did it get any better?” or the “I used to read this and hated it, now bring me up to speed on the plot” posts simply because of the maladroit rhetorical strategy.

Audience matters.