I really don't get the impulse to rank these characters on some "optimal behavior" scale. The preceding conversations have done a thorough job of showing how Aya, Koto, and Erika are each in their own individual "damned if she does and damned if she doesn't" dilemma.

It seems to me that the whole point of Aya's "spirited away" time-shift (indeed, so far the only point that I can see) was to put all three of them into a "no win" situation and then see how it plays out.

I'm not interested in ranking the characters by morality, but I do think the manga is designed to prompt these sorts of discussions. It's a character drama where each of the three hurts the other two due to her own flaws and limitations, and I do think analyzing the morality of a character's actions is one way to reveal their personality and motivations.

In this case, it's particularly relevant because I still believe Aya's jump through time happened because each of the three, in her own way, wished for it. Aya wanted to escape from her shitty home situation; Erika wanted to drive a permanent stake through Koto and Aya's relationship; and Koto, as we're learning, wanted Aya to be dependent on her. What they're all learning now is something Slavoj Zizek once said, that the term for a dream becoming real is "nightmare."

I don’t disagree with the points you make, but judging the “morality” of the characters’ actions is ultimately subject to the extreme artificiality of the “spirited away” situation—what exactly should a person do when they or their crush or their rival disappears one day and then reappears seven years later physically unchanged and with no memory of time passing?

And you certainly could be right—that situation may in some sense have been triggered by all the characters’ wishes, but that’s basically irrelevant to judging the morality of the characters, because, at least so far, the story hasn’t shown the slightest inclination to make that premise explicit or to otherwise explore the mechanics of how the “supernatural” works here.

I really don't get the impulse to rank these characters on some "optimal behavior" scale. The preceding conversations have done a thorough job of showing how Aya, Koto, and Erika are each in their own individual "damned if she does and damned if she doesn't" dilemma.

It seems to me that the whole point of Aya's "spirited away" time-shift (indeed, so far the only point that I can see) was to put all three of them into a "no win" situation and then see how it plays out.

That Komichi is such a good girl. A bit of a handful at times, but a very good girl.

Your "husband" is trash. Your "family" is trash. Your :Life" is trash. Just elope with the Mirror Ghost woman and live happily ever after. (after cleaning out your "husband's" safe, of course. A shady guy like him is bound to have cash around)

I think the logistics of “eloping with the Mirror Ghost woman” might be a bit of a challenge.

She's been moving the mirror all around the house. She's built up some muscle by now.

I’ve been enjoying the image of her fleeing in a taxi with the mirror, vengeful asshole husband in pursuit.

Or checking into an out-of-the-way inn, when the clerk says, “Any luggage?”

“Just a small bag. And this full-length mirror.”

For me, the great villain of this arc is neither Kase (who does not act well, I repeat) nor Fukami, who at least has a point. It's Inoue, who even knowing that Kase is going to live with her girlfriend forces an absurd situation with her authority.

This is a great point, and it shows why for me the big problem is (as you say) an author problem rather than a character problem, because the Inoue in this arc doesn't act like the same character who had been established in the rest of the series. Sure, she often razzes Kase a little bit, but she's regularly been a faithful wingwoman for the Kase-Yamada relationship, and her going along with the race business was just entirely inconsistent with who she had previously been.

As for the death flag comments... what are you talking about? This manga doesn't really have the kinda vibe that we should be expecting a major character death. Or any character death for that matter. Or is something going over my head?

Yeah, at least as far as I can tell so far, Mashiro has a fairly mild case of the "Delicate and Sickly" trope--an unspecified "medical condition" that positions her as vulnerable but plucky and which can make her BSOD and end up in the infirmary from time to time as the plot requires.

As a general principle, "Delicate and Sickly" ultimately could go in any number of directions, ranging from being entirely cured by love alone or by some random health improvement (medicine, exercise, etc.) on the one hand to, yes, death, on the other.

But for the plot to head off in a tragic direction would constitute a truly epic tonal swerve for this particular series.

EDIT: I almost mentioned the contrast with "The Summer You Were There," which announced from the beginning and then regularly reminded us throughout: "She gonna die. Not kidding. Take it to the bank--dead as a doornail. I'm serious."

last edited at Apr 24, 2024 10:08PM

Two weirdos, I love it. I also hope that "director Shen" is the one who...how should I say it...makes both realize what this is. She had a bit of a think already.

Right—her intellection, such as it is, has reached much deeper into the emotional complexities of their present situation than has Director Jiang’s, whose own thought process hasn’t got much beyond: “Director Shen . . . looks . . . really delicious.”

I've been going through the old /u/ reclist, and there's a lot of aggressively mediocre stuff on there, but this is absolutely excellent. I love how well defined Hotei's viewpoint is. I see a lot of talk about how ambiguous the love is here, and like yes, kind of, they explicitly say that's what they were going for in the extras, but Ebisu compares Hotei to her old boyfriends that her sister stole away. I can't say I wouldn't have liked to see a kiss, though...

As I suspect is the case with most other readers of yuri, I agree with your last sentence. But I also agree that this one sticks with me because we really see Hotei's growth as a person as well as Ebisu's emotional, not "thawing" exactly as much as "unclenching." Despite the "just show them kissing already!" aspect, this indeed top-notch stuff.

Your "husband" is trash. Your "family" is trash. Your :Life" is trash. Just elope with the Mirror Ghost woman and live happily ever after. (after cleaning out your "husband's" safe, of course. A shady guy like him is bound to have cash around)

I think the logistics of “eloping with the Mirror Ghost woman” might be a bit of a challenge.

You can't love the person your lover USED to be. It never works out.

And it’s very clear that Aya is already completely transformed by her time-shift experience and is still changing.

The flashback scenes emphasize that past-Aya was flirty, teasing, and borderline dommy, i.e., definitely always putting herself in the one-up position in her relationships, while now she’s dependent (for obvious reasons) on Koto but trying to be diligent about getting reoriented to her current circumstances. Good for her, but I agree with Nya-chan that it does not bode well for the Koto-Aya relationship.

last edited at Apr 23, 2024 9:10AM

I'm starting to think that Koto is delusional or something, Aya is in her mind cause she can't forget her and Erika is just pretending to believe Koto, knowing the situation, just for her sanity (and waiting for her recover to finally be with her).

Wait--you mean that Aya never actually came back and everything has just been Koto's hallucination?

But we've seen returned-Aya interact with other people when Koto isn't around--kind of a lot, actually.

Maybe the Power of Lesbian Angst actually turned Koto's memory of Aya into a physical manifestation. It wouldn't be the first time someone let their ex dominate their existence.

The Power of Lesbian Angst is certainly strong in this one--no doubt about that. I don't get the impression that's where the story is going, though.

But if so, then maybe Erika was hallucinating wishing that Aya would disappear, which means . . . Aya has been there all along!

An intriguing theory, to be sure . . .

I'm starting to think that Koto is delusional or something, Aya is in her mind cause she can't forget her and Erika is just pretending to believe Koto, knowing the situation, just for her sanity (and waiting for her recover to finally be with her).

Wait--you mean that Aya never actually came back and everything has just been Koto's hallucination?

But we've seen returned-Aya interact with other people when Koto isn't around--kind of a lot, actually.

You know, I think eventually these two might come to like each other.

Narita should get together with Maki from Bloom into you and start a '' I'd rather just watch from the sidelines '' club :⁠-⁠P

My very thought—“another love-watcher.”

The Joe-Kanna dynamic is a pretty entertaining show.

I really hate that guy, what a creep

He just hasn't read the title.

And latching onto the word "raised", my gosh, you ... know she's not an orphan who went to live at the idol company, right? She meant "raised" as in, into an idol, as her mentor. That's not grooming, ya weirdos. She wasn't a teacher, just a (slightly) older idol she looked up to.

LOL. (And I'm being mostly facetious here--I know what the conversation is about) that's exactly what "grooming" used to mean before the phrase "sexual grooming" got truncated--a naive and untutored newcomer (a "diamond in the rough") gets polished into an experienced professional entertainer.

Motown Records literally had a finishing school (called "artist development") where performers were taught how to behave on and off stage--posture, deportment, "the social graces," and--wait for it--grooming. Most big time music organizations have a formal or informal version of the same thing.

last edited at Apr 17, 2024 8:34AM

You’re not going to get dumped—but keep doing your best anyway.

Without taking sides, I just find it fascinating how far the pendulum swings here. One party claims to see signs of grooming here, whereas another claims that there is, in fact, nothing special going on between these two.

Really makes you think how art is always in the eye of the beholder...

Sometimes there is art about which two contradictory and mutually exclusive things are simultaneously true.

I do not believe that this is an example of such art.

But you know.. when Yamada san said "Kase san, I wanted to be with you forever.." it made me sad a little on the inside. Because in our world, it is really or hardly ever to have someone to be by someone's side "forever".. If i get to change the way she said, I think I would say, "I wanted to stay by your side now.. I wanted to cherish you now".. "Kase san, I am a little pessimistic on the inside when it comes to relationship and love, but ever since I'm with you, I've been living in gratitude. As long as I'm breathing,I will keep holding your hand until the day it's over. When that time comes, would you still hold my hand..?" Or.."if you ever had found someone else , do tell me. I'll let you go to find your happiness. You know I.. love you right,Kase san?"( But i don't think Yamada san will let go anyway.. but who knows? Maybe when this series has a long serialization and they were about their midlife crisis...)

If a happy little line like that already made you sad, why would you possibly change it to actually sad lines?

"Needs Indirect Reminder Of The Inevitability Of Death tag."

Sometimes schoolgirl manga series seem to be pretty much the same, at least in broad outline.

This series . . . was not that.

The Shiki residence is very lively lol

I’ll admit that I’m kind of a sucker for the “OMFG—[family member] brought home an actual friend! Strike up the band!” trope.

Aki will finally meet the real Shiho, a Shiho only she can see.

You've certainly got that right.

I think we all know what's on the menu haha

Right—clams.

Also the nurse seems sensitive to the possibility of escapades. "Why are the two of you out here by yourselves."

Maybe not escapades, but she’s certainly on the lookout for shenanigans.

Little does she know that it was actually canoodling that was about to turn into hanky-panky.

given speculation about the boy

it'd be a twist if spiriting away happens regularly in this world, at some low rate, but people don't talk about it, because it's not frequent enough to be "not crazy".

Right--and somehow it always happens around Tanabata, so if anybody does think they notice anything, they just shrug their shoulders and think, "weird--Tanabata, man . . ."