I always felt deep intimate friendship + sexual desire = romantic love. I've been "yelled at" several times, for that belief, in the story comment sections. However I honestly can't think of any other way to define it.

I will say, sexual desire isn’t necessary for romantic love and romantic love isn’t necessary to feel sexual desire for someone. They are separate things and while they are often intertwined that is not always the case.

Then define romantic love. How is it different from platonic love? Say the love for a close friend, or a family member.

Defining love in general is pretty hard. But a parent for example isn't going to have the same feelings towards their children that they have towards their best friend. And claiming that romantic love is just platonic love + sexual desire means that friends with benefits are automatically in a romantic relationship. Even if they've never been on dates and just meet up whenever they feel like it. Following that logic all those butterflies in the stomach that people like to mention in regards to falling in love are in that case only a sign of the person being horny. Because most people don't experience this sensation when with their friends and we've established that the only difference between friend and crush is sex, right? And what do we do with the fact that people in love can get pretty jealous? Most people don't get that jealous over their friends, so is that also just a sign of being horny?

Ok but, boobs confined in fabric protected from the cold with several layers would be warmer than the rest of the body, and sharing body heat is warmer. I can excuse everyone being after boobs and other odd things, but I cannot excuse these inaccuracies!

Shouldn't they more or less have the same temperature as the rest of the upper body? Also the reason why they got cold was probably because while the parts where they touched got warmer, the rest was now completely exposed to the cold. Had they used blankets it would have worked

"An exception has occurred"

"Isn't it kind of a breach of privacy? ... I gently open the door."
Let's just hope this doesn't happen. Though with what we last saw of her and the time that has passed since then almost anything could have happened

I really like the way they did it here. It always feels a bit weird to me that people expect characters to just instantly become aware of some hidden feelings as soon as somebody confesses to them. At least give them time to figure things out. Just because the reader thinks it's obvious that they are in love doesn't mean it's as obvious to them. Not to mention that there are different forms of affection that you can have for a person and sorting out what is what isn't always easy. So I really appreciate that both this manga and Futaribeya have characters acknowledging this and openly communicating where they stand. It just seems more natural to me

last edited at Nov 11, 2022 12:35AM

This chapter blindsided me with how wholesome it was, feels like the first time the series focused mostly on discussing love over sex. It's kinda weird since at this point Nanao's feelings for Asumi seem more deeply explored than Asumi's feelings for Mai.

Was ever actually stated that Asumi has feelings for Mai? The way I understood it she basically just wants to meet an important person from her childhood and clear up a misunderstanding. I never had the impression that she had been in love with Mai all this time or something like that.

I have five times as much reading time, five times as much studying time.

On the downside that also means that you need to buy five times as many books and while you don't have to study as much you still have to do the same homework five times in a row.

If I feel like, I can be a massive child prodigy, skip grades and whatnot.

First of all this would pull a lot of attention and not everyone is comfortable with it. Second, what happens after you finish school? At least in school what you actually do in class doesn't matter as much, as long as you have good grades. At work on the other hand she would have to do the same work five days in a row, essentially giving her a minimum of 25 five days of work without brake

But if something bad happens on some day, that I really don't want to become the "set past", I can overwhelm it by also making a bunch of money that day, leaving the "chooser" with a quandary.

That's actually an interesting idea

I can hone my social skills by trying social interactions various different ways on different days and seeing the reactions; sure, in the short term I may get whichever day was worst as the day other people remember, but in the medium term I can quickly stop making stupid social mistakes that my age-mates are still totally making.

I mean you could definitely try, but it's more that you have to keep in mind which day was chosen. On one day you might have gotten close to somebody but that exact day might not be chosen, making you complete strangers from their perspective. And depending on your emotional investment this can seriously hurt, especially when it happens over and over again. Also, you always have to keep in mind what happened "canonically " since the rest doesn't remember ever telling you certain things while you do. It can be the little things, like information about their family, what train they take to school or big things that completely changed the impression that you have of them. You have to consistently pretend that you don't know these things because as soon as you slip up they are gonna get suspicious.

Not really a fan of how this is being handled right now, it completely ignores the underlying problem. Evie didn't just lash out without reason, she was feeling cornered and didn't know what to do. The chapters leading up to the fallout were filled with her anguishing about how by being close to her she is forced to hurt her. Now, this isn't even mentioned. I understand that she misses her, but what happened to her inner conflict?

Just apologizing to each other and saying how they won't leave the other person no matter what won't be enough. After all, it's only a matter of time until the system strikes again and Evie is forced into the exact same situation that caused this whole drama.

last edited at Jun 18, 2022 11:01PM

Well... If their relationship has no romance and/or sex thats just friendship, though she wont be able to be in a non romantic relationship anymore since she already demonstrated a gist of jealousy so non romantic relationship will end up out of the question for her.

I'm actually not sure about that, since I don't think jealousy is exclusive to romantic love. It could very much be a different form of strong emotional affection that she mistakes for romantic love since that's what most people expect her to feel. Of course it's very much possible that she is in fact in love but right now I'm not fully convinced yet.

In the matter of sex... Idk i never really understood this sort of stuff i barely understand the basics of homosexuality and asexuality but if by any means what Yuriko's reason to "not love the same way as others" is related to her scars, the outcome of this can be may end up being quite disappointing to some... Those types of scars dont look like theyre something that she got a year or 2 years ago so if she had to live with them since a long time ago i would expect some kind of trauma behind them

I really hope that they don't try to attribute her asexuality to these scars. That would effectively discredit asexuality as a sexual orientation, the same way for example Doctor House did it by "blaming" it on a brain tumor.
I think a good way to describe asexuality is by saying that asexuals feel the same way towards women as either a straight woman or a gay man would and towards men the same a straight man or a lesbian would

Or she could simply enter a close non-romantic relationship. This too would be new territory for her, since she expected to stay alone and it would include opening up to the partner, communicating what they want out of this relationship and all this stuff. She could slowly find out about other options outside of romance and how she can be happy and close to other people without having to confirm to others expectations. Isn't that also a theme in yuri mangas, that the mc learns that they can in fact defy societies expectations of a hetero marriage and instead be in a relationship with another woman? The hardship of going against the majority? Why wouldn't that be a possibility here with non-traditional relationships?

That could be interesting, although I'm having doubts about the last couple of sentences there. It seems to me that a close relationship that was neither romantic nor sexual would simply be a close friendship. And even people who are both romantically and sexually inclined are mostly capable of, and do not reject the idea of, close friendships. So I'm not sure there would actually be any hardship or defiance of societal expectations involved in being an asexual aromantic who was close friends with someone.

The relationship that I'm talking about is called QPR - Queer Platonic Relationship. Calling it just a very deep friendship doesn't really capture it in my opinion, since it is very much on the same emotional level as a romantic relationship. So moving in with each other, spending quality time together and even raising kids are very much possible if the involved parties are up to it. So it's not just being close friends with each other but choosing somebody as a potential life partner. Of course non aspec people can get into such relationships too, but since romantic relationships are just that omnipresent most don't know about it and so for many the expectations that you should end up in a romantic relationship still holds true. And that's kinda the point, society right now is so focused on romance and sex, that saying that you're not interested in either will likely be meet with disbelief or dismissal

I think in fact that there is a noticeable difference between asexuals and aromantics on one hand, and gay, lesbian, trans and various other groups on the other, in that asexuals and aromantics have never been particularly discriminated against. In a minor, tacit sense yes--since they're a smallish minority people make inaccurate assumptions, don't talk much about their particular concerns, don't target them with advertising and so on. But nobody gets beaten up or murdered or reviled as an evil sinner for being asexual, nor have there ever been laws against not being romantic. All these things do happen to gays and lesbians and trans.

I mean yes, since there aren't as many asexual people as lets say gay or bisexual people and they don't stick out as much they usually get a lot less attention, which includes witch hunts. However, asexuality was until pretty recently still categorized as an illness and to this day a pretty common response to mentioning being asexual is that people either tell you to go see a doctor because obviously something has to be wrong with your hormones or maybe a therapist because you're clearly just traumatized, or they tell you that you just haven't found the right person yet. Which can very much lead into corrective rape. So yeah, less getting beaten up and more just your existence getting denied and having to explain what you're talking about every time you mention it. Which we actually kinda see in this manga with characters automatically assuming that they are gay because they show no interest in men.
In fact most asexuals don't figure out what they are until their twenties or thirties since the term and what it means is barely mentioned anywhere, instead you're just showered with the good old "someday you'll fall in love and have sex". Romantic asexuals get into problems in relationships a lot of the times because people intrinsically link love with sex and don't realize that not finding your partner sexually attractive or actively initiating sex doesn't mean that you don't love them. These issues of course need to be discussed in an open manner, which is pretty difficult when you don't even have a clue about why you're different in the first place because nobody ever talks about it.

I mean, nobody's going to be un-ironically saying "Those two women living together aren't lesbians living in sin! They're just good friends! Disgusting, I tell you, somebody ought to do something about it!"

Yup, instead they tell you that romance and sex are important parts of being human and that something is wrong with you if you don't long for them. That you're an emotionless monster, that you need medical treatment, that you're actively defying god by suppressing your natural, god given impulses. There are actually churches out there that accept gay and bisexual people but denounce asexuals

Nah, Girl, you are neither aromantic nor asexual. What you are has a name, and it's called a late bloomer.

Actually, this is exactly why you shouldn't try to diagnose yourself, but rather let a doctor/specialist do it. Because be it medicine or psychology, most people will get it wrong. Also asexual people are rare. Most people have some kind of sex drive, sometimes weak, sometimes suppressed, but nothing at all is just very rare. Thinking that you are asexual, without even trying to date is... well you're likely mistaken.

"Late bloomer" my ass, go be acephobic elsewhere. She's demi, likely demiromantic asexual. Acespec people are more common than you think, and saying

Being "asexual" is not a spectrum, at least that's not how most people use it. Its the very end of the spectrum, where sexual orientation is not even applicable. Otherwise you could just call them, straight, gay, bi or whatever. And like most edge cases they are very rare.

The most commonly accepted definition for asexual is "feeling no or little sexual attraction". That includes people that feel sexual attraction in very rare cases and people that never feel it in their entire life. It includes people that are repulsed by sex, people that don't care about it and people that don't mind having sex. It's an umbrella term for people that feel significantly less sexual attraction than other people. Of course, if they do feel small amount of sexual attraction they can also identify as straight, gay or bi. Some do this based on which gender they feel romantically attracted to - which is also completely separated from being asexual. So yeah, I think you could call it a spectrum. And why wouldn't it be a sexual orientation? Being straight means feeling sexual towards people of the other gender but not towards people of your own gender. The part of who you're not attracted to is important to differentiate between the different orientation. So why can't you define one by saying that they are not attracted to any gender?

Thinking that you are asexual, without even trying to date is... well you're likely mistaken.

is like saying "Thinking that you are gay without even trying to date the opposite gender is... well you're likely mistaken"

Well, actually yes. I don't think you can completely rule out liking a gender without actually making an honest effort. Trying to date someone isn't the only way, its just the way I thought most applicable to Matoi. She could also just download a wide range of porn, and see what tickles her fancy - but I think that Matoi wouldn't do that.

You can actually enjoy watching porn without wanting to have sex with anybody. Just like people enjoy watching sports without actually wanting to do it themselves.
If she isn't interested in anybody in a romantic sense, doesn't have any desire to participate in sexual activities and doesn't feel drawn to anyone in that way, why should she go out of her way to try dating someone? That's like telling a straight dude to go date another guy for the off chance that they might be bi. Most likely you'll just get an extremely awkward situation where they try to imitate a relationship without actually feeling anything - if they're not outright uncomfortable with it. Which is extremely unfair towards the other person in the relationship.

Alos need to stop acting like they're the default and that acespecs need to "prove it", it's no different than cishets doing it to other queer people.

I don't expect anyone to prove anything, as I don't usually care how someone "identifies". But if someone - for the argument's sake - would want to know if a label fits her, before adopting it, then yes, I'd suggest going from the more probable options to the less probable ones.

But the reason I don't think Matoi is asexual, is because the story is perfectly set up for her to be wrong. The main conflict for Matoi is that she struggles to understand others or herself. From a narrative standpoint, she needs to overcome this conflict by learning about herself, and the people around her. And that works the best, when what she thinks she knows about herself is completely wrong. If she was right from the start, then there wouldn't be much left to learn for her, would it?

There is still a lot that she can learn. She could end up in a romantic relationship without having sex - that would still be new for her as she has never been in a relationship. On top of that it also includes the struggle that a majority of society views sex as an integral part of a relationship and thus has little understanding for people that don't work that way.
Or she could simply enter a close non-romantic relationship. This too would be new territory for her, since she expected to stay alone and it would include opening up to the partner, communicating what they want out of this relationship and all this stuff. She could slowly find out about other options outside of romance and how she can be happy and close to other people without having to confirm to others expectations. Isn't that also a theme in yuri mangas, that the mc learns that they can in fact defy societies expectations of a hetero marriage and instead be in a relationship with another woman? The hardship of going against the majority? Why wouldn't that be a possibility here with non-traditional relationships?
And even if she ends up in a romantic relationship, why would she have to have sex? Just to prove that she was wrong?

last edited at Mar 24, 2022 8:28PM