I feel like if either of these two would have a tan it would be Kita not Bocchi. I'd assume Bocchi would be super pale considering she never leaves the house lmao

This idea of young boys bullying and harrassing girls they like being a funny ha ha ha moment in Japan has to die.
He bullied her enough that she never want to go back to school again and despite the author trying to make a redemption arc for him I'm not warming up to that brat anytime soon until he bend his ass over to the kid.

This idea of westerners seeing something they don't like in a manga and claiming "JAPAN needs to change" has to die.

Getting horny by being molested by a total stranger... Yeah, I don't think the people who meet a molester during their train travel blush this much and phantasm about their molester. At least they could have showed the molester being arrested to enforce that this behavior is really not okay.

First off, you can't get someone arrested without proof of action, and considering it seems to have happened right before a train stop the guy probably just left the train. Having that guy be arrested for it, deserved or not, just would not be realistic at all.

Secondly, I feel like the blushing, and specifically the lack of situational awareness (for example, not just turning around, moving, or brushing the guy's hand off) is supposed to be a way to illustrate the MC not understanding what it means to be a Woman, along with their nervousness. The arousal is due to the confusion of the MC both being put in a very negative situation (getting touched on the train), while at the same time getting positive confirmation that their fears in the previous chapter that they look to much like a guy were unfounded.

last edited at Feb 19, 2023 3:20PM

I think that the issue people have is that "genderbender" stories are treated as wholly separate from trans identity. It's treated as a fantastical or fetishistic thing, rather than a very grounded reality that many people experience. It comes across as something meant for cishet men to enjoy "safely," without having to consider any messy issues like gender identity or discrimination. Like how "pure yuri" will avoid any actual lesbian/sapphic identity in order to keep it "clean."

That's not to say people can't enjoy genderbender (as many trans people will tell you, it's super common to be drawn to GB stories long before being aware of their own transness), but I feel like the themes are inescapably trans no matter whether you use the term or not. And attempting to say it's somehow some separate, totally unrelated thing is at best tone-deaf and at worse active erasure of trans identity and perspectives.

I would somewhat disagree. Take that new anime that just came out, Onimai. It is part of a long running "genderbend" trope which lies completely outside of real-life gender identity culture. While I would agree that it does stem from a "fetish" I would disagree with your assumption it is made for and by "cishet men." I understand as the viewer, you can interpret the feelings of a character however you please. Coming from the creator's point of view, however, I feel like there is a large difference between the trope of "I turned into a girl and now I'm suddenly acting more girly" and the trope of "I wish I was a girl and decided to become one." It's similar to the debate surrounding the character Bridget from Guilty Gear, who while created as a "femboy/trap" trope character has been widely interpreted as trans. Going back to the original comment I responded to, I think understanding that there are different tropes, none "better" or "worse" than the other, and that there is commonly some overlap between tropes which can confuse people (specifically people coming from a different culture than the creator) into thinking one trope (like genderbending) is a badly written or demeaning form of a completely different trope such as transgender.

All in all, you can perceive a character or a character relationship anyway you personally please as the viewer, but taking that personal interpretation and using it to attack/make generalizing statements about a creator or a genre is not the way to do it in my opinion.

last edited at Jan 17, 2023 7:03PM

my longest, exasperate sigh ever.... why can't these ever be about trans women? Not well oops ive magically become a woman and now that my bodies physically like this I guess it'd be wrong to not be a woman! Transition back?? Nonsense!!

god, it always winds up so cisnormative.

You do realize Genderbending is in itself a separate trope right? Genderbend and Trans can exist separately.

Apparently the author of this manga was suspended from Twitter? How the hell did that happen?

I usually take the side of the woman no matter what.
Like the saying goes "support women's rights and support women's wrongs too!" I'm like that.
But that woman...
When she tells her husband the truth in ch.1 I couldn't but think "Uwaah... she's the worst."

I think that phrase is supposed to be used when a woman responds to a wrong, not just for a woman being an asshole.

I'm not sure. At least in this forum, I've mostly seen it quoted when some girl cheats on her significant other. Bonus chance points if the SO is a good person who doesn't « deserve it » and the girl is inexcusable by any regular standard.

Maybe I'm not reading the right things since this is the first time I've seen it and then I went and read some articles about it. It seems like it's a real quote, and one of the articles was about reframing women who are villainized by the patriarchy. The metaphor they used was the Salem witch trials.

Bro, its a comedy manga. No need to write a philosophical thesis about it. I wife literally only exists for like 2 pages lmao

Your Honor, League of Legends

Why does she get so embarrassed? They’re just cuddling a bit?

Sad that it’s ending so soon but it was pretty inevitable it wouldn’t last long.

Public displays of affection, even between straight couples, is kind of taboo in Japan for many people. It’s a cultural thing more than anything.

This truly was the moment Walter became Heisenbaka

Here's a solution to her wish at the end: Move to one of the many countries in this world that don't have a fascist, chauvinistic culture.

Ages of MC’s?

I’m a little weirded out, so I’m skipping this one.

That’s covered on Page 9, I believe.

GN FluffyCow, if you check this post out, in the morning, I just want to say, I totally missed Mamiya's hands around Kuzawa's throat at the end there. That obviously changes everything. That takes Mamiya's words from simple emotional blackmail, to a way WAY darker and scarier place. Um so yeah. I concead the point.
It's funny how missing one single detail, (admittedly a glaring one) can change your whole perspective on a story.

Ah okay, interesting!

Murder and sucide is a bit too much, maybe Kuzawa will just leave one day, either way, I think fucked up people can have fucked up relationships until, well..they can last a long time, until something happens, which is not death. Now I gotta look more from this author.

People shouldn't underestimate how bad these relationships can get, and murder in abusive relationships IRL happens. Mamiya was already shown to be completely unhinged and willing to turn the tables at any time with the strangling, I think it's more than possible that she could eventually kill Kuzawa and not bat an eye about it. I think it's also possible that after years of feeling trapped in this relationship Kuzawa could one day snap and just beat Mamiya to death, probably in a moment of sudden uncontrolled rage. Along with possible regret afterward and potential suicide.

I figured I'd check the discussion one last time after properly waking up but I don't want to keep talking about it in all honesty. Their relationship is legitimately scary and disgusting to me.

Oh, you Americans are so pure.

So there is this thing called covid. And see, there's these people in the states that have concluded that wearing a mask to ward off an airborne disease actually makes you MORE likely to get this covid thing. And so they choose to not wear masks and go to church and do these big family gathers. And, unsurprisingly, suddenly my home state has the highest case count in the nation.

So, uh, yeah. High school level scientific knowledge don't mean shit. Especially when you bring some form of faith into the mix.

Continuing to live life the way people had before a virus unexpectedly took over is an unfortunate choice people have to make in order to not have to lock themselves inside and go insane. It is very different than believing in something which is fundamentally incorrect, something which skimming through any Wikipedia article or high school science textbook will tell you is wrong. It isn't something unavoidable, or something they are being forced into. It's just stupidity.

Why do all Japanese people believe that you will catch a cold if you do anything? Do they not have basic scientific knowledge there or something? I don't understand how anyone could believe stupid superstitions like that in the 21st century, and yet it seems everyone just does over there, for no reason at all. Scary.

"They keep the uni freezing."
Do Japanese people love being unnecessarily uncomfortable and depriving themselves of basic human rights or something? It feels like denying a university of heat should be illegal. Not to mention its supposed to be so cold and yet both of them are wearing shorts.

Is the rubbing under your arm thing actually helpful, or is it just another weird, un-scientific Japanese superstition like getting a cold by sleeping under a kotatsu or walking in the rain?

Do all Japanese people just have a kink for nonconsensual sex or assault in some form or another? It is kind of concerning.

Who cares if she's wearing her clothes backwards? And why is it so embarrassing that you can't even tell her directly that her clothes are backwards? Is Japan really that ultra-conformist?

EVERYWHERE I GO I SEE AMOGUS

I wonder what Ranma would have been like if Akane ended up being more attracted to Ranma's female form than his male form...

That tricycle gag felt like a Family Guy joke and I don't know if that's a good thing or not...

A good set of lines to end on. It kind of summarizes the work's thesis, that you can love and support someone even if you don't understand them (and that it's okay to not understand someone)

I agree with this whole heartedly. I think there are a lot of people who try to force understanding, facts, data and knowledge on people in the hopes to "change" or "redeem" them, and if they don't immediately conform to their ideals they label them as "evil" or "backwards." I honestly what is great about the manga is that it shows people that you don't need to understand people, or post all of your opinions on everything so the world can pick you apart. All you should work towards is being respectful and kind to everyone, and respect their choices in life, whether you understand them or not. I think it gives a much more welcome alternative to the whole "if your not part of the solution your part of problem" mantra being exposed everywhere nowadays, which can be quite pressure inducing and suffocating.

Are you sure? I remember hearing (in a school setting mind you) that females do actually release pheromones. Obviously not to the extent this MC is at, but it might be real.

Well, maybe I should have said "no substantial evidence". It's not inherently pseudoscience like climate change denial or anti-vax, but it's far from being proven, or well understood. The evidence for the various theorized pheromone molecules having any effect on humans is a mixed bag so far. There's also a difference between sex pheromones having any effect on humans, and sex pheromones playing an important part / serving a purpose in human biology. In any case, no human sex pheromones have been isolated yet.

Interesting, I distinctly remember being taught in a middle school health class that females release pheromones from the top of their head or something. Either way, it doesn't seem to make much of a difference.

So MC says he used to wash other boys backs in Junior High and is now fully comfortable being naked around them. What sort of locker room antics were going on? xD

I like to think there was some thirsty girl posing as a guy back then who was like "Yeah, totally normal for you to strip in front of me and wash my back."

Being naked in front of other people of the same gender is very normal/expected in Japan