The picture of Mel snuggled in next to her master, eagerly awaiting her story, on page 2 of Master and an Autumn Day, was so cute and innocent. Mel seemed way younger than twelve. Later in the story when master had Mel on the the bed, I was totally creeped out by it. If Itou Hachi truely means to make Mel and the master a couple, she should stop portraying Mel so child like.

Do you even know the author? She makes tons of amazing lolicon content and it's wonderful.

It's a cute story, and I'm going to keep reading. I'm just saying, Having a romantic relationship, between a 12yr old and an adult is already pushing my sensibilities. Please don't make it harder by having Mel look, and act younger. There's lolicon, then there is pedophilia. Making Mel look like a 3yr old sitting on her mother's lap, waiting for story time, is dangerously close to latter, for me.

last edited at Oct 6, 2018 1:14AM

Yet another woman that messes around with married men, to avoid facing the fact she is gay.

I bet you're fun at parties.

Um, I don't get it. I'm a blast at parties. My knock knock jokes leaves everybody in stitches.

The picture of Mel snuggled in next to her master, eagerly awaiting her story, on page 2 of Master and an Autumn Day, was so cute and innocent. Mel seemed way younger than twelve. Later in the story when master had Mel on the the bed, I was totally creeped out by it. If Itou Hachi truely means to make Mel and the master a couple, she should stop portraying Mel so child like.

last edited at Oct 5, 2018 12:44AM

Yet another woman that messes around with married men, to avoid facing the fact she is gay.

Ugh. On the one hand I like that this is a series with adult women and they often speak frankly about more adult things. On the other, I'm sooooo tired of the manga trope that literally any kind of normal, healthy physical contact that any couple would do is lewd and embarrassing beyond belief. It made sense for a few chapters given the scenario here, but it's worn out its welcome for sure.

Well said.

Oh man, Yae, and Chitose are the cutest together. I can't get enough of them.

I'm surprised we're at the 25 chapter mark. It feels like there's been much, much more. The series is cute in all, but for goodness sake, kiss already. Tamamusi couldn't possible expect to get another 25 chapters out of the same tired gag.

This was a good start. I'll definitely looking for more.

I think this whole "what is the morality of cheating" is going around in circles by this point, so I'm closing down that particular ride. If you want to talk about cheating, leave it to her personal reasons (which at this point are pretty much entirely speculation) and the narrative reasons for it. Leave the overarching morality discussion for some other venue.

I quite agree. looking over the debate, I realised I lost my original point several posts ago, after getting caught up in this morality, issue. I was just going to shut it down, and make peace with Nya-chan myself.

last edited at Sep 26, 2018 12:25AM

You didn't get my point. You invoked the disapproval of "society" to invalidate any reason Hikari would be justified to get in an affair with a married man.

Who is that society that has the right to judge her reasons? Even Moe doesn't judge.

As for the wife, her hurting is, as far as we know, totally virtual: what she doesn't know doesn't hurt her (and obviously, the manager doesn't intend to divorce). If anyone is hurt here, it's Hikari herself, but since it's self-inflicted and she's an adult, you still don't have the right to judge.

My point is, Hikari has one or more reasons to be in that relationship. We may think she's mistaken and that she should get together with Moe, and were we her friends, we would probably advise her to break that relationship because it's actually hurtful to her (and possibly to the manager's wife). That's even what Moe tells her.

But you shouldn't judge her to be an horrible person just because her moral code isn't yours.

I Never said Hikari is a horrible person. I said cheating is wrong. Good people commit murder. Sometimes for very understandable reasons. But, murder is still wrong, and they should still be punished for it.
Also, under your logic, if the victim of a crime is unaware then there is no crime. So if a person embezzles money, carefully enough that they don't get caught, then we shouldn't judge that person as a criminal.
I'm not talking about forcing Hikari to wear a scarlet 'A' or anything. She is already getting what she deserves, in my opinion. A sad and empty relationship, with a man that won't give her the emotional investment she so obviously wants. Hell, even if the manager leaves his wife, for Hikari, then all she's won is a known cheater. Who's to say, he won't cheat on her when the next cute OL comes along.
I know society is full of judgmental hypocrites, that can't wait to tell other people how to live, while their own lives are a mess. I just wanted something to put behind my statement, to give it more weight. Bad choice I know.

last edited at Sep 25, 2018 3:39PM

johnb posted:

johnb posted:

Why do women let themselves get tangled up with married men!? It's not like there is a damn shortage of single men.

Because some women like the thrill of it, or "taking a man from another woman" reinforces their self-confidence about being better than others.

Or because not all women seek commitment (or are already committed) and having a married man is a way to lessen the possibility of him sticking to her.

Or because he seduced her and she hopes he will leave his wife for her.

There's plenty of valid reasons. But someone is probably bound to be hurt.

I'm not sure I'd call any of those reasons valid.

You're not them.

I'm not sure society would call those reasons valid.

The Almighty Society.

The same society that looks at homosexuality as deviant or immoral?

People invoking morality in order to condemn cheating creep me out.

You can condemn when someone is hurt, not when some highly subjective and abstract principle is bent.

These reasons could be valid for Hikari. It's enough for me. She doesn't need my approval. Nor yours.

Woe there tex. No need to get all riled up. Cheating is wrong because someone gets hurt, plane and simple. Hurting someone should be against everyone's moral code. I think, what your thinking of is a polyamorous relationship. That's not cheating, because everybody involved should have agreed to ground rules, that have been set beforehand. I myself would never agree to a polyamorous relationship. Your right though, if everybody involved is okay with it, it's not my place to judge. Just remember, what a man does with a woman, another woman, and a goat, in the privacy of their own front lawn, is nobody's business, but their own.
It's possible that Hikari, the manager, and the manager's wife are involved in a polyamorous relationship, but I highly doubt it.

last edited at Sep 25, 2018 4:22AM

I'm usually not a praying man, but if you're up there please help me yuri fairy.

Well, she says she "likes him". For some people, that's reason enough.

If we want to get full interpretation, Hikari's going out with a married man as some unconscious self-punishment, because she's afraid of her feeling toward Moe, as a desperate self-reaffirmation of her heterosexuality when she actually has doubts about it, but at the same time, since it's a "doomed" relationship that won't amount to anything (he keeps his wedding ring on, which she obviously interprets as him not going to divorce for her), it actually saves her from commitment with a "real" boyfriend, leaving her available should things evolve differently with Moe.

They are obviously both (not really) subtly trying to get out of the friend zone, but it's a tortuous, or even torturous, process.

They will get there. Eventually.

It's like Hikari is using the manager for sex and Moe for the romance. This can go on for a while.

No, the guy is most certainly more wrong than girl in this case in that he is cheating on his wife and breaking his marriage vows. If Hikari was also cheating on and betraying her partner their sins would be of a similar caliber but she is not. Really the only thing she has done that is a tad bit shady is she is encouraging and enabling someone else to do immoral things.

I must agree with you here. I think that there is an instinctive need to blame the “other woman” equally because people when they’re cheated on want to feel like it wasn’t just their partner that did this to them. Someone else “tempted them” or “made them”.

But no, it was just their partner’s responsibility to either not sleep with other people or break up with them first. Giving blame to Hikari in this case absolves the manager partially of his responsibility not to cheat.

Yes, there are better things Hikari could be doing with her time than seeing a married man, but she herself isn’t cheating and there is a huge difference between cheating and doing something really stupid.

Can't both of them be wrong? It takes two to cheat.* (unless you count masturbation as cheating lol.) So in terms of a crime, if the husband was guilty of adultery, wouldn't the other woman at least be an accomplice.
*That doesn't count, if the cheating spouse lied, and said they were single, obviously.

johnb posted:

johnb posted:

Why do women let themselves get tangled up with married men!? It's not like there is a damn shortage of single men.

Because some women like the thrill of it, or "taking a man from another woman" reinforces their self-confidence about being better than others.

Or because not all women seek commitment (or are already committed) and having a married man is a way to lessen the possibility of him sticking to her.

Or because he seduced her and she hopes he will leave his wife for her.

There's plenty of valid reasons. But someone is probably bound to be hurt.

I'm not sure I'd call any of those reasons valid.

You're not them.

I'm not sure society would call those reasons valid.

Well um... hem... yes well... At least I figured out why it doesn't have an Age gap tag. At least I think I did.

johnb posted:

Why do women let themselves get tangled up with married men!? It's not like there is a damn shortage of single men.

Because some women like the thrill of it, or "taking a man from another woman" reinforces their self-confidence about being better than others.

Or because not all women seek commitment (or are already committed) and having a married man is a way to lessen the possibility of him sticking to her.

Or because he seduced her and she hopes he will leave his wife for her.

There's plenty of valid reasons. But someone is probably bound to be hurt.

I'm not sure I'd call any of those reasons valid.

Why do women let themselves get tangled up with married men!? It's not like there is a damn shortage of single men.

Because people.

Yeah I guess. I just want to know why Hikari is with the manager, is it the cliché delusion of, he loves me, and he will dump his wife when the time is right. Or, is Hikari's feeling more complicated. (argh) This story line is going to be painful, to read. I hope Hikari realises her feelings for Moe, and kicks that jerk to the curb soon.

last edited at Sep 23, 2018 5:33AM

Why do women let themselves get tangled up with married men!? It's not like there is a shortage of eligible bachelors out there.

last edited at Sep 23, 2018 5:13AM

Human, beastkin, inappropriate age gap, both girls. The deck sure is stacked against Mel, and her master. Now I can't help, but root for them, because I'm a sucker for an underdog.

How in the hell do you slip standing still?

Oh my. That was cute, light and romantic. More please.

I love everything about this manga, but I think the facial expressions are my favorite part. I'm not sure if the translations or the likely plot take second, but they're both amazing.

besides half the characters in "happy end" romance stories probably broke up off-camera eventually after their series ended anyway
people change, feelings change, people move on, etc etc etc

NO! NO! NO! THEY MOVE IN TOGETHER, GET HERS AND HERS TOWELS! THEN ADOPT A COUPLE OF CATS, NAMED SIR FLUFFY BOTTOM, AND MADAM BLACK SOX! THEY LIVE HAPPILY UNTIL A RIPE OLD AGE, WHERE THEY DIE PEACEFULLY IN THEIR SLEEP KNOWING THEY SPENT A LONG AND FULFILLING LIFE WITH THEIR ONE AND ONLY TRUE LOVE! THE END! They leave that crappy real life drama and angst stuff, to bittersweet one shots, and country and western music.

You know, my life would've been a lot less miserable if I DIDN'T convince my 14-year old self that this is how the world works and that failure to meet that standard makes you a failure as a person.

Just sayin'.

I watch all the teen drama series, and movies, that show the girl falling in love with the broken "bad boy", and wonder how many women's lives are ruined, because they were taught, your love can fix them.

Also the whole love at first sight/suddenly head over heals thing.

I'm actually quite happy their likely to split up over the course of this series (and I'll be even happier if it follows them into their next relationships). They both have a lot of, probably, unhealthy ideas about love and didn't really get together for the most stable of reasons. That's going to reflect a lot of real life relationships and actually showing the flaws with that approach and how to handle it responsibly is a really good thing that doesn't come up often.

Your right the whole love at first sight/destined lovers is way overrated. I do like to see sparks when the main character meets their love interst, though. I admit it's a fine to walk, but I've seen it done well before.

besides half the characters in "happy end" romance stories probably broke up off-camera eventually after their series ended anyway
people change, feelings change, people move on, etc etc etc

NO! NO! NO! THEY MOVE IN TOGETHER, GET HERS AND HERS TOWELS! THEN ADOPT A COUPLE OF CATS, NAMED SIR FLUFFY BOTTOM, AND MADAM BLACK SOX! THEY LIVE HAPPILY UNTIL A RIPE OLD AGE, WHERE THEY DIE PEACEFULLY IN THEIR SLEEP KNOWING THEY SPENT A LONG AND FULFILLING LIFE WITH THEIR ONE AND ONLY TRUE LOVE! THE END! They leave that crappy real life drama and angst stuff, to bittersweet one shots, and country and western music.

You know, my life would've been a lot less miserable if I DIDN'T convince my 14-year old self that this is how the world works and that failure to meet that standard makes you a failure as a person.

Just sayin'.

I watch all the teen drama series, and movies, that show the girl falling in love with the broken "bad boy", and wonder how many women's lives are ruined, because they were taught, your love can fix them.

last edited at Sep 21, 2018 2:22PM

Give it a rest with the "wow i bet they're not happily married thing", this is way too trivial and dumb.

Ahh, but I was winning.
(sigh) Sorry Mr admin person. I'll be good.