Also are you saying the translation was dropped or that the series was cancelled?

Whining, stomping my feet, and holding my breath until I turn blue isn’t actually going to make the translation appear here any faster, is it?

You'll never know until you try.

Guess not--no new chapter and here I am with a pounding headache.

Back to waiting patiently it is, then. :)

Stop it, you're making me feel like I'm a bad person for finding all this I quoted funny... And I think everyone should know by this point what usually happens when I feel like bad person... self-worth and self-esteem plummit, while self-loathing and self-punishment skyrocket

BV, I realize I don't really know you outside of these forums, and I don't always "get" your posts, which I chalk up to language barriers mostly, but some things I'm pretty certain of:

1) You're definitely not a bad person.
2) You're supposed to find that stuff funny
3) You should never trust the little voice in your head that puts you down. It's a dirty little liar

I don't object to the line--it just struck me as a little on the nose as compared to Nakatani's own scripting. Now that I think about it, I'd have to go back to see if Yuu ever tells Touko that her feelings are other than what they actually are.

Geez, I said that horribly. I guess I mean that we definitely see Yuu making statements to herself about how she feels that readers perceive to be untrue ("It's just because I'm a pushover," "I'd have done the same for anyone," etc.). But do we see her telling Touko things that Yuu knows are not how she actually feels?

(Putting aside the "I promise not to fall in love with you" thing--the poor dear has only intermittently been convinced that that's even possible for her, even when--or maybe especially when--she was head over heels in her particular Yuu-esque way.)

Well, the biggest lie Yuu ever told Touko was that she didn't -want- to fall in love with anyone. She did. She new she did. We knew she did. Maki knew she did. Hell, she explicitly thinks that she wants to fall in love with Touko. But she told Touko she didn't, because she knew that "she can't fall in love with me" was a point of comfort for Touko and she was afraid of what would happen if she admitted that she wanted to.

Aside from that, there were some moments where she said she wasn't in love when she definitely was, but most of the times she expressed her feelings to Touko, she was usually being honest to her but lying to herself.

That's how I see this. Like she's convincing herself that -she- doesn't want to kiss while also reminding Touko that they were gonna, and, y'know, because you wanted to but not because I want to or anything...

last edited at Jan 26, 2019 1:48PM

That was cute, but I thought Yuu’s line “Let’s get this over with” rang a little false. That’s just never quite been Yuu’s attitude toward kissing/skinship—she’s fended Touko off from time to time or said, “That’s enough,” but to me that line didn’t come off quite right (nor did it seem like a parody or other transformation of the character—just like someone trying to do a pretty standard little YagaKimi story and making a slight misstep.)

The hair/button thing was pretty cute, though.

On the other hand, in this case, it's clear she's kind of acting put out just to get Touko back to the embrace, which Yuu was enjoying more than she let on, so I can buy it.

Meanwhile, as they confess wholeheartedly to each other, the truck driver, panicking after noticing them at the last moment, jerks the wheel, accidentally veering into a crowd of nuns and orphans and seven other yuri love interests.

And that's why you don't run blindly into the street!

last edited at Jan 26, 2019 12:25PM

Okay, the one with the cheesecake is borderline NTR.

She's got Sayaka taste-testing the cheesecake that she's learning to make for Yuu. Sayaka's worries are 100% founded, but from her perspective it's like -they're- having a moment.

Is it NTR if absolutely nobody involved has the slightest idea that it might be? It’s clear that in this author’s reading of Touko, she has no idea that Sayaka has a romantic interest in her, and Sayaka has no idea that the cake recipe is for Yuu.

Asking your best and most trusted friend to taste-test food ultimately intended for your (secret) lover-like person seems like pretty normal and benign behavior to me.

I think part of the point of the NTR genre is the sense of jealousy it instills in the -reader/player-? So in that sense, I'd say this qualifies, even though the characters themselves are clueless.

I mean, it was meant to be tongue-in-cheek, not a real analysis, but still. ;p

Actually, both 8 and 9 feel pretty spot on to me. Headcanon adopted!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZR3vHe7ON4

Okay, the one with the cheesecake is borderline NTR.

She's got Sayaka taste-testing the cheesecake that she's learning to make for Yuu. Sayaka's worries are 100% founded, but from her perspective it's like -they're- having a moment.

Ow! My diabeetus!

^ Thanks, Heavensrun. I had kind of considered all of those possibilities (and Nezchan's too). Maybe the most striking thing to me was that Miyako and Sayaka both assumed up front that Riko would scold them if she knew, while (to me) an upperclassman high-schooler chatting with an adult friend over tea and pastries seems like the most anodyne thing in the world.

Well, Sayaka might also be assuming that Riko would be jealous, because she's a kid and as mature as she is, she still might have a bit of a childish perspective, but yeah.

You have to remember how much conformity plays into Japanese society, tho.

We get such limited glimpses of our characters' home lives (except for Yuu's) and of the institutional hierarchy at the school that it's a little hard to conceive of a dramatic parental/administrative intervention at this late date, especially given the "Absurdly Independent" variation of this trope:

I don't think it's actually a thing that would happen, but it could still be something that weighs on the minds of the characters now and then.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AbsurdlyPowerfulStudentCouncil

Do we even know for a fact that any teachers are along on the class trip? (I mean, we assume they must be there somewhere, but most of the authority figures who could conceivably constrain the behavior of the main characters throughout the story are almost entirely invisible to us.)

Well, they haven't shown the teachers, but I assume they're there. Riko is Yuu's teacher, IIRC, so she's teaching the wrong grade for it, but the second year's teachers are probably there. There's no way they'd send everyone to Kyoto without supervision.

My brother and I just finished re-watching the anime. Just like every previous time I watched the train ride scene, I almost had a heart attack from sheer happiness... And considering how popular it got and how many blue-rays were sold AND to top it all off with the Phoenix award, I'm convinced that the making of season 2 isn't a matter of if, but when. overly excited mumbling

Well, I don't want to be a killjoy, but the problem is whether that interest is still there by the time they would be able to get started on a second season.

They don't necessarily have to wait until the manga is done to start development of another season, but there isn't that much material to make a season out of right now. The play is an episode, with another episode dedicated to the buildup, another after to do Yuu's confession, and another after that for the fallout, and one more still for Sayaka's confession. That leaves seven more, which at the pace they went at last season, is about 14 more chapters. That's another year, probably, before they even have enough material to fill a season, assuming they don't fill in Sayaka backstory with novelization stuff. Will the interest still be here a year from now? It's possible, but it's possible not.

I'm adopting "wait and see" and trying not to get my hopes up. It'd be awesome to see a second season, but I've been burned before. ;p

My impression is that Iori's sister is in her final year of high school since it is also Shizuku's final year. (They are in the same class together).

My assumption is they are both 1st year (assuming the author is consistent here). Because when Shizuku mentioned that it was her first time wearing uniform, Saori asked her 'what's about middle school'.

Saori has been delivering school note to Shizuku for only half of a year. So if they are in final year, Saori will likely to ask her 'what is about last two years' or something similar.

Not to mention if she didn't wear any uniform since leaving correctional facility (aka not going to school), she can't pass 1st year of high school anyway. The teacher also won't need to send Saori there every week if the student didn't even turn up in the last 2 years

Hence here I calls shotgun on Minami being 16 and only faked her ID so she can work in the bar

I'm pretty sure in Japan minors can serve alcohol as long as they aren't allowed to consume any. (and a fake ID isn't going to pass muster when it comes to employment forms anyway.) But regardless, even if Shizuku is a first year, it's also implied that she's spent some time out of school and only came back and enrolled because her guardian forced her to, so she's probably older than her classmates by a couple of years.

last edited at Jan 14, 2019 9:08AM

I re-read everything from the beginning, and the drama part feels a bit more natural that way, not as rushed or out of place as it did at first.

Inspired by you, I did too, and I agree—everything happens at a pretty fast pace in this one, but it no longer felt like watching a TV show where somebody suddenly changed channels. Once you know where the story is heading, it seems like it’s more of a piece—there are different tones at various points, sure, but not like the mangaka suddenly decided to switch genres entirely.

Well, a lot of people assumed that the event was a bigger deal than it ended up being, too. Like a bunch of people thought it was literally the -ending- at first.

How do you cut your hand more than once in your life? I just can't believe someone is that clumsy. After the first cut you would naturally become more careful and learn how to hold the knife right.
But then we couldn't have the "clumsy, but a hard worker" cliche I guess. lol

(or get one of those newfangled state of the art peelers...)

I still cut myself while cooking, sometimes more than one, I'm not saying it's normal, it's because I'm really stupid... :(

Don't get down on yourself like that. People have a wide variety of levels of motor skills, and a lot of people are careless because of other conditions like ADHD. I don't know what your situation is, but just because you're careless or clumsy while cooking doesn't mean you're stupid.

I wrote a whole post about how yeah, it's probably a tan but then I went back too look through to verify something and I noticed that she has no visible tan lines. Like, we've seen pretty much the entirety of her breasts , butt and legs and her dark skin tone is uninterrupted (including her nipples) so she's either tanning naked or it's her natural skin tone.

Aah... now I get your point.
I had completely forgotten about the thing with her tan lines, or lack thereof. It does raise some interesting questions...

I suppose the artist could have forgotten tan lines are a thing in like every one of her chapters too but that seems like more of a stretch than her just being dark skinned.

Or it could be she uses a tanning bed. But this is all beside the point: (I believe that) White Rose was saying that the dark skin makes her appealing, and was pleased that no one was disagreeing with that. The point was never about where the skin tone comes from or whether it is her natural tone or the result of tanning.

last edited at Jan 14, 2019 8:52AM

Half of me is on the this is cute side and the other can't get over the ping ponging between 4 characters.

Both halves are right imo. Its often very cute, but I really cant keep track of all the characters and who is who, with who..
I'd of proffered it if it had 1 sister/couple for the main focus for say 4-5 chapters in a row before switching, so I could get a handle on them all.

I'm glad I'm not the only one
I don't hate it, it's just confusing
I keep forgetting which character is the sister and which is the lover lol

So there are four couples, and the premises for each one are in the first four chapters. The chapters are just four pages (hmmmm) so it's pretty easy to just go back, use the tags, and refresh your memory on the particular couple for the update.

There's the age gap couple, the childhood friends couple, the adult life couple, and the one that doesn't have any special tags)

Also watching the two tsunderes flirt with each other is amazing.

Btw:
Iori's sister is in first year of high school apparently (based on her conversation with Shizuku's the deliquent). Shizuku repeat a year, but does not look like she is younger than Minami much. So my question is... did Shizuku repeat classes a lot of time , or is Minami even younger than the given 18?

I'm trying to find out where's the part when they mentioned Iori's sister is a first year.

And why Iori thought that it was a crime if she is in a relationship with an 18 years old girl?

Technically the age of consent in JP is 13, but many places (like Tokyo) have their own age set to 16-18. It is also "illegal to engage in sexual activities with partners who are below this age unless a parent approves of the romantic relationship"
Also their age of adulthood used to be 20 before being lowered this year. So if Minami is 18 and Iori doesn't have her parents' permission...

I know I'm late to the party here, but there's an important clarification to this: It is a -federal- crime if they are under 14. But that doesn't mean 14 is legal, because the Japanese government leaves it to the municipalities to decide their ages of consent, and 14 is basically not legal to consent anywhere in Japan. (There are places where the parents can consent for the child, which is a different kind of fucked up, but that aside) I see this misunderstood all the time (and I realize you didn't say otherwise)

In some places, the age of consent is set to 16, 18, or even higher. Obviously wherever Iori lives, Minami is not legal, hence she has to be careful how she interacts with people, because their relationship is legally tenuous.

I’ve got a couple of unrelated questions having to do with Sayaka. Maybe the first is just an observation:

Twice we’ve had examples of Sayaka starting fairly significant conversations that we haven’t actually been shown:

In Chapter 23, Sayaka asks Touko to tell her about her sister, specifically what Mio meant to her. The staging explicitly refuses to show what was said, because once Sayaka makes her request, we get 6 mostly silent panels of before and after the unseen conversation (some of which could have been used to show the scene). I assume the matter would simply repeat information that we know from before, but it is a scene of Touko opening up to Sayaka that should be of some emotional significance to their relationship.

Then in Chapter 36, Sayaka asks Miyako to tell her about her relationship with Riko. Miyako agrees, then we cut away to the two of them coming home. To some extent the subsequent special chapter stands in for that conversation (but isn’t a literal reenactment of it—Sayaka asked about the relationship generally, not for the story of how they met and got together).

No big point here, just a pattern that we don’t see too often unless there’s obviously going to be a later reveal—you know, two characters lean in together and one says, “OK, here’s the plan . . “ (Cutaway to something else, with the plan to be shown later).

The second one is a real question: Why is it a given that Miyako and Sayaka going somewhere after school together is “wrong,” and that Riko is going to scold them (which she does)? What rules are being broken, and why do teachers get to scold students for what they’re doing with their free time?

That “What are you thinking, taking some kid around?” implies that it’s a serious transgression of some kind (unless it’s implied paranoia/anxiety about potential lesbian sexual abuse charges or something).

So Nezchan mentioned the uniform rules thing and the "go straight home" thing, which is possible, though we don't know the rules for her school, so maybe that's part of it, maybe it's not.

But honestly, even without that, there are a -ton- of reasons why it could be problematic.

The simplest is jealousy. Not that I think Sayaka is any real threat to their relationship (as I said elsewhere) but some people just don't like their SO doing stuff with other people. That would speak to an insecurity that I don't think is likely for Riko, though. They seem pretty secure and happy in their relationship.

No, I think the others that come to mind are more likely, and it probably isn't just one of them. There's the possibility of the school rules forbidding it, but also:

First, Riko is in the closet at work. Nobody there, including her students, knows she's in a relationship with another woman, and if people found out, she -could- face discrimination. So it could just be "Why are you taking chances by hanging around with my students you're gonna get us outed!" It's not really implied that Miyako ever told her about Sayaka or her feelings for Touko, so she doesn't know with certainty that Sayaka is "a friendly". So it could just be that she's defensive about risks that can get them outed. (Like when she was worried in general about her students hanging out at the cafe too regularly.)

Also, a lot of people, including in Japan, conflate homosexuals with pedophiles. So if it DOES come out that Miyako and Riko are in a relationship, and somebody in Sayaka's class is like "Hey, didn't she go to that cafe with Saeki-san?" "Oh yeah, I saw them there!" "Is she one of them, do you think?" etc etc. I mean you shouldn't have to temper your behavior to avoid getting hostility from douchebag bigots, but it's still a thing that happens.

Then there's the responsibility thing. If there was an accident or something, Miyako would be responsible, Sayaka's parents didn't know about it, etc. etc. Parents can be pretty difficult when they're being protective, so that could also be a headache even if nothing serious happened.

But I think the most important thing is she hadn't been told about any of it. Given the way she calmed down after the explanation (Did you have fun being a sempai?) I think this is the main thing. She was annoyed at being out of the loop.

Anyway, my prediction is any of Rei, Maki or Koyomi kinda has a role play somewhere in it for Yuu’s side.

Maki (that is,his role in the story) is the one that’s been driving me a little nuts for some time. In 99 series out of 100, his seeing the kiss would have some repercussion or another down the line, even if it were a benign one, like being someone for Yuu to talk to.

But here, basically nothing—I can’t even recall any particularly knowing glances or raised eyebrows off to the side (there was that early exchange with Sayaka about Yuu being especially close to Touko, but that wouldn’t even require him seeing the kiss, just him being a noticing person). So while the discovery itself made Yuu reflect on her feelings, ever since then the discovery has been a dead letter.

In 99 series out of 100, it would be just another dropped stitch, something the author considered developing and either reconsidered or just forgot about. But this one doesn’t have many false moves or dead ends, so I keep waiting for Maki’s knowledge that Yuu and Touko had been in an intimate relationship (the only other person who knows that for sure in the series) to somehow come back into play.

I, of course, am Team Rei Intervention all the way. I don’t even care to predict how she might do it—I just want her to somehow open up a extra-large can of Super Big Sis sauce on someone.

I mean, he clearly noticed something is amiss with Touko and Yuu, so he might strike up a conversation, and he was there for her to talk to during the sports festival. I think he's partly there to provide a contrast to show the difference between Yuu and a true aro ace. (and possibly also to say "Yes, ace people, I know you are there and I am not trying to erase you by having Yuu fall in love."

I think it is very plausible that Touko's rejection could result in the end of their friendship. Even if there's no hard feelings, it's really hard to be around someone that you love, knowing they don't feel the same way. I tried to be friends with my ex for years, and it seriously damaged me, probably as much as the breakup did.

I dunno, this strikes me as an example of one of those things I was talking about that a good writer could make go either way.

In the case of Touko rejecting her confession, Sayaka inevitably would be taking some serious emotional damage points, no doubt about it. But Sayaka must have been imagining a Touko rejection the entire time she was hiding her feelings and so to some extent is prepared for it.

And a declined (“rejected” seems a bit too harsh for how Touko would be likely to do it) confession isn’t quite the same as a breakup, either. Tougher in some ways because she’s gotten her hopes up after holding off for so long, but not exactly that toxic mixture of shock, denial, confusion, and sense of betrayal, etc. that goes with the breakup of an established relationship.

Tougher yet for Sayaka would be the discovery (if indeed this is what’s in store) of the depth and nature of Touko’s feelings for Yuu; so to stay on the student council would not only entail being around Touko but also seeing the two of them together. I wouldn’t expect Touko and Yuu to come out as lovebirds around the stuco office, but we know how sharply observant Sayaka is anyway, so just being there would have to hurt.

On the other hand, I think her loyalty to Touko as a friend wasn’t just a cover for her romantic feelings, and her commitment to helping with the official responsibilities wasn’t only an excuse to hang around the person she loved, either. So to simply throw over that friendship entirely and dump her school duties would cut against the grain of her established characteristics.

So I’m really just saying that a number of elements exist in the story that could be combined and developed in a variety of plausible ways. Again, assuming that Touko does not accept Sayaka’s feelings, a complete reversion to the previous status quo would almost certainly be impossible (the play shows us that, if nothing else), but other outcomes short of Touko leaving the scene forever on a bus to Heartbreak City could well be in play.

If I were forced to submit an entry to the Million-Dollar Manga Prediction Sweepstakes, I might say that a rueful but stoical acceptance of the situation by Sayaka followed by a scaling back on her student-council participation in favor of a part-time job having something to do with the cafe would be consistent with the story and characters so far. Fortunately, though, there’s an actual writer at the helm instead of me.

Yeah, I just wanted to say I agree with pretty much all of this. Sayaka and Touko's friendship surviving would depend heavily on how Touko handles things, and Sayaka would definitely have a harder time metabolizing "I'm not the closest to her" than she would have metabolizing "She just doesn't want to date anyone."

My own predictions are pretty short term. I think we're going to get a Touko POV chapter where she tries to process Sayaka and Yuu's confessions, her own feelings, and I think it's gonna end with her making a firm decision to get Yuu back. I -also- think we're going to get another chapter of Yuu regressing away from her feelings and the people around her noticing and worrying about it. I still think Rei has a role to play somewhere in all this.

Name and avatar hold up on the first comment.

The bad end is Sayaka being toyed with, used and then broken up with afterwards. You know, the inevitable outcome of Touko accepting her confession?
You may be exceptionally hung up on the word "obstacle", but as a person I think Sayaka is way better off being rejected and getting a solid conclusion as early as possible.

This. Having read up to date on your exchanges on this, I spent most of the discussion agreeing with parts of both of your posts. I think it is very plausible that Touko's rejection could result in the end of their friendship. Even if there's no hard feelings, it's really hard to be around someone that you love, knowing they don't feel the same way. I tried to be friends with my ex for years, and it seriously damaged me, probably as much as the breakup did. And I wouldn't judge Sayaka if she just had to cut Touko off, and I doubt Touko would, although she would grieve for the lost friendship. I don't think losing the friendship is a foregone conclusion, but it's definitely possible.

But suggesting Sayaka doesn't have an identity outside of being Touko's second also isn't fair to her as a character, and I have no doubt that she could continue doing her job with the student council regardless.

But regardless of however she would respond to rejection, it's definitely worse to string her along than to just make a clear rejection. The only way a relationship with Sayaka makes sense (Edit: I mean, aside from just a -bad decision-,) is if Touko lets go of her feelings for Yuu, and I don't see that happening any time soon.

last edited at Jan 9, 2019 3:15PM

Speaking of little details, did anybody notice Touko getting uncomfortable when they talked about yatsuhashi? Looks like she's still got Yuu on the brain.

Good eye—I had completely forgotten about that little detail.

So, given the present state of their relationship, does Touko buy yatsuhashi for Yuu or not?

Since that was almost literally the last thing they talked about before the Confession Event, it would be kind of an artifact of their previous intimacy; I suspect Touko isn’t going to bring back a present for all the stuco kouhai. (It’s a little hard to tell from a quick Google search how expensive souvenir-level yatsuhashi would be in Kyoto.)

(Yikes—that just dredged up a memory of a fairly expensive backordered gift arriving after a breakup. —shudder—)

It's too early to say, but it kind of feels like a Checkov's gun, so I'm betting it comes back up. If I was writing it, Touko buying Yuu's souvenier would represent her making a decision about trying to get Yuu back.