Forum › Posts by Zormau

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joined Aug 29, 2019

By healthier, you mean not jumping to conclusions? Giving a benefit of the doubt?

Both of those, yes. Particularly in cases where the "offending" post is rather minimalist and might be bait.

Phrase "who's guy in relationship" ...

A person's perception and/or rationalization of said perception does not force any role upon another. We ultimately do not get to dictate how others perceive us, try as we might.

As for the topic of the thread, since you've touched upon it here, I assume that it's in large part a case of "art imitates life". A distribution of roles (active/passive, giving/receiving, top/bottom, call it what you will) in bed is probably a common occurrence when two people with differing personalities get it on (repeatedly). It doesn't have to be nearly as rigid as for example in the much lauded So, Do You Want To Go Out, Or? (where there seems to be a pathological cause for its rigor), but I'd be surprised if it wasn't common even in homosexual relationships. Thing is: I don't know that, just as I don't know how common rigid roles actually are in straight relationships. I'd only be extrapolating from a) my own experience with all of [one] partners, and b) what I see in het media that "go there" (mostly porn, obviously).

Are there any scientific studies or decent investigations into the topic?

While it's true, especially for dude, ...

Being German (a prime example for a language full of gendered words), having a degree in English linguistics and having grown up as the son of a sociology/gender studies lecturer, I do have my own, rather informed opinion on topics of language and gender, but this is certainly not the time and place to debate that.

last edited at Jul 6, 2021 3:51PM

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Daviddv0601 posted:

I like it because it helps me imagine the scenario as who's the guy in the relationship.

But they're both women, so neither is guy in relationship. I know you mean who has what role, but I find that insulting at best, even in het. There's no like universal split of roles in relationship. It's unique to each individual one.

Wouldn't it be healthier to view it as their attempt to integrate the concepts with their lived experience — which is unique to each individual? I don't think they made a claim to a universal split of roles, just extrapolated from their own experience.
Also I'd say "guy(s)" and "dude(s)" have long since transcended gender-locks in common parlance.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Oneshot

No.

I'm hoping for sequels, "Cat"-style.

last edited at Jul 6, 2021 7:50AM

Zormau
Yuri Ichigo discussion 05 Jul 18:27
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joined Aug 29, 2019

Has anyone who's more connected than me (low bar, I know) heard anything from Yuri Ichigo? Are they completely defunct or do they plan a grand return? I miss Hino-san...

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joined Aug 29, 2019

I don't really see the appeal for MT in entertainment and arts. Sure, I've read a few MTs of newly released manga that hadn't been picked up yet, but for a novel I can't really think it's a worthwhile endeavour.

Even for advertisment and technical texts, the MT+Post-Editing approach only saves around 25% time and IMO produces inferior results compared to a fresh translation. So I guess: maybe they really are providing "the best MTL in the world", because "the best" doesn't have to mean "good".

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joined Aug 29, 2019

(And anywhere else, really, I just liked Wakana's face here hehe)

Edit: Just realised I liked Wakana's face in almost every panel lol. She made some nice faces in this chapter.

Must be the Moe Fang...

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joined Aug 29, 2019

What if Sara and Wakana are actually in the same place right now?

That would kinda fit the recurring theme of conveniently (in)convenient occurrences in this manga, and for once I wouldn't mind.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Ok, uh, wow. I love how this is currently going. Not only did Wakana get her back story detailed (and by confessing having a yuri crush no less), but Sora also seems to be pushing towards being more open about her relationship with Ayaka instead of just hiding it from everyone. I hope it goes down that way.

last edited at Jun 26, 2021 2:52PM

Zormau
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joined Aug 29, 2019

there’s no romance tag so :(

Pretty sure the tag list will grow as more chapters arrive.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

i have got chapter 7-22 (end) and i can translate them but looks like everyone hates this manga so ehhhh.

Not sure where you got that impression. Go for it if you feel like it!

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Um, as Aya would say: contract.

Exactly. And what consequences would violating or breaking off that contract have? Marika wouldn't get the money (there is indeed a psychological trap in form of "escalation of commitment" here) and her pride would definitely be hurt. She's a tsundere, of course her stubborn pride would be hurt. I don't think she is so naive to think that she couldn't find a part time job that doesn't involve her boss creeping on her. It doesn't seem like it's about the money anymore (thereby diminishing or even invalidating the influence of aforementioned trap), though, just about her pride and proving a point.

It's kinda about how much agency, independence and maturity we ascribe to the characters, and for the sake of entertainment I'm willing to go with "more rather than less". It's not a particularly realistic story to begin with, as has been pointed out more than enough.

while you were drafting your little grooming plans I made sweet love to your mother

It was long and sensual and she fell long before your first date

Assuming she didn't post to the wrong place or thread, then somebody explain to me if she's talking to Aya or Marika or to whom and wtf point is she trying to make.

I think the point was to make a "yo mama"-joke mostly about the "how I would go about grooming her with food!"-subthread and how that was kinda weird. Not that me arguing back and forth about the questionable nature of consent and boundaries in a fictional context isn't weird as well.

last edited at Jun 22, 2021 5:17PM

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joined Aug 29, 2019

If groping the erogenous zones of a person who doesn't have the right or power to resist was enough to make them go frantic with desire for you, then every rape victim in the world would think of their rape experiences as the best sex of their lives.

Great, now how am I supposed to enjoy Arioto after reading this?
Thanks a lot dude.

Simple: by realizing that Marika does have the right and the power to resist.

Use anything that will facilitate suspension of disbelief.

last edited at Jun 22, 2021 4:30PM

Zormau
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joined Aug 29, 2019

Wow a blackmail tag and no one had sex, that we saw (important distinction!), on the first chapter! Impressive! also "edgy" sweet summer child, check out this title https://dynasty-scans.com/series/kitanai_kimi_ga_ichiban_kawaii or oshiiko sensei :P

What's so edgy about anything Ogu, anyway? ;) They're just What the fuck am I reading?-Material. And porn. So more ecchi than edgy I guess.

If you want edgy you can always go to the forums for any drama series and get your fill. We're happy to provide.

Zormau
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joined Aug 29, 2019

Yes please, I'm interested in reading more of this. The forum will surely be fun as well.
That credits page tho... I'm sure they really were just being super friends there.

last edited at Jun 21, 2021 9:36PM

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joined Aug 29, 2019

I feel really bad for the translator and editor of this series, this thread always full of stupid arguing. Like this author's works cannot be taken seriously lol, everything is just for comedy...

But isn't the "arguing" part of the fun?
I mean, if the TL team weren't doing such a bang-up job, we probably wouldn't be quite so giddy about it, would we?

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Chapters: 1
Jimmies rustled: lots

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Says who? Let's ignore the genre and our experience with these sorts of mangas and look at the situation from a more detached perspective - a young girl lures another young girl with money and slowly gets her used to escalating sexual acts, starting with skinship that the latter initially finds uncomfortable and eventually moving to outright molestation - and this is with around 3 months of time left in their deal. If you ignore things outside the work and look at it critically, it's really disturbing, or at least that's the way it seems to me.

Hindsight (which will come with time) and prior experience with the genre aside, "you are really into it, even if you refuse to acknowledge it" sounds like something a rapist would say. In fact, if the art style was different and the same things were portrayed in a different perspective, it'd totally be seen that way. I strongly ask you to shelf your gut reaction and take a bit of time to think it through, even if you reach the same conclusions at the end.

I am probably speaking to a wall, but it's really frustrating to non-stop hear the same copy and paste reactions.

I agree insofar as we can't know Marika's "genuine" sexuality (if you will), and I totally agree that the framing of the situation does influence its interpretation and gut reaction.
That's what fiction is for. It's not real, so we can have thought experiments and unrealistically cutesy things that would normally be at least morally dubious or would never happen that way. I mean, isn't that basically all that porn is? Even so, I think our understanding of the characters' motivations and their agency is the more important factor that allows us to not be upset by it. (edited to highlight the most important sentence here)

Take this example from the first chapter of Warikan. Two charcters of which we know that they'll end up at least somewhat pursuing a lesbian relationship, yet this first encounter feels radically different from what Arioto does.
Both series have amazing art, but where Arioto is a cute, super horny comedy, Warikan is a beautifully wretched, super horny drama series. The comparison, especially considering that scene, is rather apt: Both Kaburagi (Aya) in Warikan as well as Marika in Arioto originally enter the situation willingly, thinking they know what they're getting into.
Granted, Kaburagi wants a lover while Marika is initially motivated by money, yet Kaburagi is the one to remove herself from the situation because she's just so taken aback. Marika's reaction is always "meh, this isn't so bad, totally worth it for the pay". She can stop at any time, yet she keeps coming back for more. That should be hint enough that Fuwa isn't the only one here that's slightly messed up ;)

Edit: Oh yeah, forgot to make the second point of that tangent, picking up on characters' motivations again: We know Fuwa's (and Marika's) motivation in Arioto, because she's very much upfront about it. She's manipulative, but she literally tells Marika that she's trying to manipulate her. We did not (fully) know and understand Sei's motivation in Warikan, thus being much more critical of the latter's interaction. Not that knowing Sei's motivation would have changed all that much in this case, she was being really toxic and not one bit playful there.

last edited at Jun 21, 2021 9:42AM

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joined Aug 29, 2019

^Did I ever say she was a straight girl? I said she THINKS she is straight but is really a lesbian and doesn't know it- the other girl is not CONVERTING her- just making her realise her true self. As I said.

Sure, that possibility can't be ruled out. I thought I remembered her mentioning being interested in guys at the start, but looking at it now she basically only ever says that she's totally not into girls. The point is that Fuwa can't really know Marika's "true self" (we rarely truely do), so some people quite forcefully asserted that she's converting her, which is just a malapropism that rubs me the wrong way. Even if she were actually straight at the start, Fuwa still wouldn't be converting her, as she's not erasing any interest in guys, but simply adding an interest in girls.

And sure, yes, maybe bi not lesbian- but since the manga will obviously end up with them a couple there is no way to guess any possible future interest in guys assuming they ever broke up- so since we will leave them (im betting) in a happy sex filled relationship - I'm just gonna consider her a yuri girl from then on.

She'll end up being "effectively lesbian", regardless, yeah.

last edited at Jun 21, 2021 8:18AM

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Yay, a side chapter!
And the remastered version will be the perfect chance to re-read it before the new chapter comes out in July.

The protagonist is a dumbass for engaging in prostitution effectively on a whim.

Absolutely!

gradually grooming the femc into liking it despite not agreeing to it.

Except Marika did, and repeatedly does, willingly agree to it, regardless of what her motivation may be. She could always just walk away.

@elevown
I don't see how y'all keep thinking that she's being turned into a lesbian. She's not being converted, her strike zone is being expanded and she's at best being turned bi. Marika, who was more or less completely ignorant of a lesbian perspective, is being given insight and has her horizons expanded. Conversion, turning a straight girl into a lesbian, would require actively making her not interested in guys. While we don't know how much she's really into guys, there are no hints that Aya is trying to induce a revulsion towards guys and het romance and sex.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Oh yeah, this is gonna end up going wrong so hard. Count me in.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

This was good, I hope there’s more. I like this couple a lot.

this.

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joined Aug 29, 2019

Wow, just... wow.
What the fuck was I reading?

Zormau
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joined Aug 29, 2019

Yay, The Cat Returns.

Zormau
Remote Yuri discussion 10 Jun 16:21
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joined Aug 29, 2019

So cute.
It's Shimi Iriko, of course it's cute.
But it's just so cute!

Zormau
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joined Aug 29, 2019

Ok, she really should have seen that one coming.