YuuTouko interactions are borrrring!
More of Sayaka, sensei and cafe manager would help. Yuu's friends finding she is dating Touko would make for an engaging chapter too.

Sounds like it'd make for boring melodrama that'd take away from the entire purpose of the plot, actually.

I want to see that powerful story begin and end as it should, with a clear purpose and idea behind it. Knowing that it exists because two women loved each other only makes the satisfaction sweeter. We've got popular works, shows, songs, poems, classics and epics galore about heterosexual love and the humanness behind it; I want more involving gay people. That really shouldn't be too much to ask for.

Mai-HiME.

:^)

last edited at Nov 30, 2017 7:43AM

I dunno. I have a thing for smooth lines and scales of grey, which is why I like it now better

Different strokes for different folks.

...Literally!

Thanks for the RAWs. Interesting chapter...

Man oh man! Look at the art! How far have we come!

I still don't like the new art. This made me nostalgic. :(

The author is telling a single story. Their lives are influenced by others and they influence others. We learn more about the main two by seeing them from other perspectives.

That works for people who interact directly with Shiramine and Yurine, and who can offer alternative perspectives on their relationship, but not for the side characters who never interact with them, and whose narratives never refer back to or mention Shiramine and Yurine at all, nor have any allegorical connection to the relationship between Shiramine or Yurine.

Also, incredibly bizarre choice to make reference to the Odyssey. Surely something like Simmons' Hyperion might be better, given that it's 6 independent stories that all reflect back on one singular entity (the Shrike)? I dunno. Seems kind of weird.

last edited at Oct 17, 2017 8:12PM

I enjoy this person's sense of humour, for the most part.

Hmm… I don't really see it. =[ The current art is indeed more "moe" to an extent, but it does a stellar job at conveying conflicting emotions to me. Ah well, different people have different appreciations I guess.

True enough! Hopefully, I'll get used to it, and come to share your opinion as well.

Regardless of the art, I'm glad to see Shiramine and Yurine as the focus of the story again.

I have the opposite impression on that… The facial expressions feel more diverse and nuanced to me in later chaps. Though I did prefer Ayaka's big fluffy hair. =[

Eh, I dunno. With the new art style, everyone looks like they're constantly about to burst into tears, and attempts to make Shiramine look like she's mad amount to her looking like she's going to cry instead. Their expressions have lost a lot of individuality for me; Yurine's expressions were either really open/enthusiastic, whereas Shiramine's were kinda subdued/frustrated. Now, they both just look moe.

The more I think about it, the less of a fan I am.

I agree with the comments about side couples feeling like random doujins rather than part of a cohesive story. Either commit to one-shots or commit to a central narrative, and don't constantly interrupt the latter for the former.

I'd be interested in hearing what others see as specifically changing in the drawing style.

I just reread the older chapters to give you a more detailed explanation of my thoughts, and I think it's less about the individual elements used in isolation, and more about how universally they're applied? Like, everything feels way more "shiny" and "moe" now, from the colours to the style.

imo, that feeling is strongest in how the eyes are drawn now. They have, like, 50 light circles in them at all points, instead of just for emotive effect, and the shading for them feels softer and lighter, with greys rather than blacks, even for characters who used to have exclusively black eyes. They're also substantially larger, with the pupils often not even touching what's supposed to be the upper lid, and they're contorting with the brows less.

Yeah, idk. Everyone just feels a whole lot less expressive in general because of the changes.

Huh, what's with the art?

I wonder why all of these are getting cleaned up and reuploaded all of a sudden. No complaints at all, but weird timing!

Ahhhh, I love anything that lets me revisit this stuff. My favourite fictional narrative to date.

Doesn't that put a different spin on these pseudo-incest stories?

Wow, that's actually extremely interesting. Might that be where a lot of the whole "onee-sama" thing in manga and such came from? I know it's probably something to do with a lot of the Maria-sama type stories that proliferated in early yuri, but...

Looks like there's still a lot I need to learn about the history of these things.

I like reading everyone's comments on here. Lot of stuff I wouldn't've thought of on my own.

I echo the people who say that this series has decent characterisation but bad actual story. The drama is dumb, but the whole thing shines when it's trying to actually focus on the main two growing and learning from each other.

Very nice art. I like it a lot!

completely dismiss the relationship between all sorts of parents and their children.

But I'm not talking generally - I'm talking specifically about this manga. I don't understand why you're insisting on forcing a generality to my statements that isn't there.

If you won't do me the basic respect of reading my posts, I'm not going to reply any further. Feel free to continue insulting me based on an invented caricature of what I've said.

Because no amount of "But he's just an 'Uncle,' and noting more" will stop him from being the biological father.

But that's irrelevant. My brother isn't biologically related to me, but he's every bit my brother. Meanwhile, I have genetic siblings that I would never consider to be family. Your insistence upon biology being the determining factor in familial relationships is both reductive and insulting. Adoptive parents are no less parents because they have no genetic relation to their child. Similarly, a biological progenitor has no innate right to the sociological label of "parent" if they don't fulfill that actual role in the child's life.

When you stop pretending that there's literally no emotional weight put on being someone's actual father that isn't there as an uncle, it's a lot easier to understand.

I don't understand this sentence. Kou-kun isn't a father and actively rejects that label. You can't just enforce an interpretation of a character that's not only openly false, but openly denied. Kou-kun does not consider himself the father. There's no "emotional weight" being placed on him. In fact, his objection is mainly to the fact that he'd rather not be involved at all, because he assumes the involvement they're asking for is more than it is.

the biological father is openly and happily involved in the child's life

Not "involved" to the extent your sentence implies. He'll exist as a distant relative or godfather--which Kou-kun actively wants--to babysit on occasion, but will have no parental role in the child's life. They basically just want to be able to offer an explanation to the child if they ask. They're not asking Kou-kun to be a parent, and Kou-kun doesn't want to be a parent.

That's why Michael's claim on the child is ridiculous. Michael has no social or genetic stake in the child's life; why is he insisting on being considered its parent? He's not, in any capacity.

Wanting to have a child with your partner isn't unreasonable.

And I never said it was unreasonable. My contention is the fact that Michael is asserting a place in a child's life that Kou-kun is actively rejecting.

If Kou-kun doesn't want to be the child's father, why is Michael insisting that he deserves a fatherly role? What about Michael's position allows him that authority over the child?

And no, saying "but he's not the actual parent" does not somehow dissolve that.

Biological relation is meaningless when all involved parties dismiss it as such. Kou-kun considers the biology irrelevant to parental responsibility, and so do the women. Michael is the only one insisting upon the biological component, against the wishes of his partner.

I don't understand the hostility in your post, tbh. You seem annoyed that I disagree with you and are behaving rudely towards me because of it. Please drop the patronising attitude.

last edited at Jun 24, 2017 4:46PM

And that's the problem: they want a babysitter who's around when it's convenient for them. Michael wants to be a dad and start a family with Kou and wants to be involved with any children Kou is having. But that's supposed to make him some unreasonably selfish person crushing our heroes' dreams rather than someone who is basically in the same position as them.

How is that a problem, though? Kou-kun has a child that's genetically related to him but that he has no parental involvement with, nor any desire to be parentally involved with, which is pretty much exactly the same as having a niece or a cousin. I'm more than willing to babysit for my uncle or aunt if there's a need, but if a girlfriend of mine decided to use my willingness to exist as a genetic relative as leverage to demand I raise a child with her in a parental capacity, that would be ridiculous.

I just don't understand Michael's logic. His insistence upon being considered a "father" to the lesbian couple's child is nonsensical when you factor in that not even Kou-kun considers himself a father. It seems like either Michael doesn't understand that you can be genetically related to someone and not be a parent or he's trying to pressure Kou-kun into having children with him when Kou-kun isn't ready and this is a poor excuse for it. Either way, Michael is being unreasonable.

Not every man is okay with spreading his seed around, making kids and never wanting to hear from them, ever. This kind of men, actually, are usually considered "scum".

Consensual sperm donation isn't irresponsible unprotected sex.

Or worse, being around them but being told that they're "just" a distant godfather, not their father and should have no say in their education.

...But, again, Kou-kun was fine with that. That's what he wanted. Kou-kun didn't want the responsibility of being involved in a child's life because he didn't want to be a parent, and he was only considering it because the women told him that his role would be minimal. I understand Kou-kun's hesitancy and I think it's perfectly sensible.

The thing I don't understand, however, is Michael's insistence that he's also a father to the child. He's not. Not even Kou-kun wants to be a father, and it's his sperm.

Even if they are not carrying the child for 9 months, fathers exists. Having part of their genes transmitted and their bloodline continuing, is a strong feeling, and desire, for a lot of men.

There's nothing stopping him from doing that in the future, in fact, when both him and Kou-kun are ready to take that step. But, all parties involved in the current process agreed that Kou-kun would not be a parental figure to their child, and neither does Kou-kun want to be.

Weirdly, Michael is the only one who's insisting upon having parental rights.

It'd be easier to understand if you didn't obfuscate it as if we're talking about literally any child related to Kou. It's just his actual child, a child that he will be involved with as a family member.

It's not his child, though; the actual parents were very clear that they wanted him as a distant godfather that could babysit on occasion, just so they had an explanation to give the child for how they were born. He'd have absolutely no parental role in their life, and therefore he isn't their father, and they aren't his child.

last edited at Jun 22, 2017 7:29PM

I mean, it's genetically related to him, sure, but a regular niece would be genetically related to him, too, and I'm sure Michael wouldn't argue that Kou-kun refuse his familial status as an uncle. I mean, they were all clear that he won't be part of the familial unit raising the child anyway, so the genetic relation is irrelevant, unless Michael also wanted to argue that adopted parents have less parental rights than a biological parent who's never seen the child.

It's a bit ridiculous for Michael to essentially demand Kou-kun never involve himself in a child's life unless Michael is allowed to exist as a parental figure. What if someone wanted to make Kou-kun a godfather? Would that be unacceptable, too?

I dunno. I can't even understand it, logically.

I don't think it's interested in exploring the idea of sexuality as a concept, but it's definitely interested in exploring the sexualities of the characters, because it's a romance manga. While Nakatani isn't writing a story about characters coming to terms with specific sexualities (for the most part), she's definitely got a clear idea of what they are and how to integrate them into the rest of a character's personality and development.

with no interest in attaching any labels on them

I dunno, Sayaka seems pretty obviously gay.

Blast from the past, huh. Universe needs to stop facilitating my Mai-HiME addiction, for real.

Yes, the main couple is back, thank God.