suletta and her wife miorine,,,,,,,, canon,,,,,,, OFFICIAL,,,,,,,,,,,
Takasaki Reika
Jul 4, 2023 2:09AM
They're just precious
herenowforever
Jul 4, 2023 5:21AM
I think the relationship was handled kind of poorly where it comes to actual romance.
Not because Suletta and Miorine aren't cool characters or they don't have any chemistry, they are and I kind of liked quite a few of the cast. But where is the sexual tension between them during the series? Not only that, but it's more like guys hitting on Suletta and her being vaguely interested that comes to mind. OG yuri like Sailor Moon, or reboot of She-Ra did this a lot better. Hell, even RWBY managed to do decent job with it after ages of finger-twiddling.
Honestly, if I didn't understand what the writers are intending you to take from it, I'd just call it a platonic relationship coming through arranged marriage (duel stuff is a twisted version of that).
I am satisfied on what we had - they are both alive and they got married - despite the circumstances the show had like the 5PM timeslot, being in a mainstream franchise, and JP still not legalizing or even recognizing same-sex marriage. I imagine execs also had a hand on how many episodes we had. The writers and the other people behind just did what they could on what they had. (Regarding the timeslot, i read somewhere [can't find the source anymore] that ep 12 tomato smash scene received complaints from the parents to the tv regulatory board because of the violence lol but it's gundam).
Is it better if we had more episodes? Hell, yeah!
Maybe if we could have an OVA, they could expound on those loose/unsatisfying points without worrying about certain constraints such as consideration of the timeslot audience.
Honestly, if I didn't understand what the writers are intending you to take from it, I'd just call it a platonic relationship coming through arranged marriage (duel stuff is a twisted version of that).
Maybe they intended it to be that way so other people that are not fond of f/f relationship can still somewhat digest it. "such great best friends!"
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 9:41AM
botmj
Jul 4, 2023 10:48AM
Can't write good gay shit if we gotta pander to the homophobes
Mugino
Jul 4, 2023 11:16AM
Oh, it was good 9 months and it seen the world is empty without them again, ;(
Tnaks gundam
The Real Haman Karn
Jul 4, 2023 11:40AM
^^^ The show really did fall to pieces in the last couple episodes, having so many plots but no time at all to follow through on them (and then dedicating way too much time for a really bad Lauda arc, Fuck Lauda) Before the finale almost everyone watching was certain they'd announce another season, like they did with IBO, so there was some pretty massive whiplash when they just wrapped everything up the way they did. Unfortunately, Suletta and Miorine's relationship was the biggest victim of that pacing. I love the messy politics and themes of the older series, but I would have even forgiven them dropping the ball on all that and its characters if they really focused on their relationship, and sadly they just didnt allocate enough time. Even a few more minutes for them instead of everyone in meetings relaying things we already know would go a long way. Between the horrible production conditions and Okouchi dropping the ball every show he writes, I'm not surprised.
I'll also push back on the narrative that Gundam doesn't and has never done explicit romance or kissing. Turn A, IBO, thunderbolt, 00, 08th MS Team, even the worst hetero nightmare show SEED, theyve all done explicit romance and kissing. IBO in a roundabout way ends with a lesbian domestic partnership executed extremely similarly to Suletta and Miorine. Turn A in its own way is extremely queer in themes and coding, the main character Loran can very easily be read as trans or nonbinary, etc. Now, the scene of them floating in space is evoking a very romantic scene from F91, but like the sword fight a couple episodes prior it kind of ends up using the reference to scaffold all the meaning and weight into that scene, rather than doing the work itself.
All that said for all my problems with the end of the show, I don't mind the ending these two got itself all that much. It's cute it's nice i'm glad they got married and i'm happy for everyone who's happy. Personally I just really wish they put the time and effort to give it the weight it deserved.
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 11:47AM
lenne18
Jul 4, 2023 11:51AM
theyve all done explicit romance and kissing
Unironically, most of them end up dead
The Real Haman Karn
Jul 4, 2023 12:08PM
thats a different issue
luinthoron
Jul 4, 2023 12:23PM
Very nice. ^_^
xyth
Jul 4, 2023 12:39PM
^^^^I agree. There are so much more that could have been done if we are given more episodes. Unfortunately, we didn't. For me, basing on what was happening in ep 23 and the tweets that they are posting, I was sure that it will be the last episode. 1 ep for 24-25 mins, that's an awful little time to fit all the narratives that are left to be explored. So I went into ep 24 with low expectations and got happy after. (At this point of my life, I just want to have happy things and not stress over the stuff I can't control.)
On the Lauda arc, it felt to me that it came out of nowhere, though I might've just missed the clues. Maybe they just pushed those scenes to showcase Schwarzette more. You know, monies lol. If that's the case, then it's just sad that other better arcs are axed to make way for this.
I haven't watched a lot of Gundam shows so I am just basing on people's accounts. I am taking in your accounts as well. So maybe it's because the MCs are both female so the explicit scenes are much, much less likely. We got a long way to go for non-hetero ships for main franchises it seems. At least we can treat this as a step closer to getting better queer shows, especially those from JP. Like big anime franchises or super popular anime/manga with queer MCs.
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 12:41PM
Zormau
Jul 4, 2023 12:48PM
That moment when you realize that the pictures wouldn't really be spoilers if they weren't tagged as such :D
HumbleBumble
Jul 4, 2023 1:44PM
I don't know how to quote on this website, so I will just say that I am extremely happy that I CAN understand what Okouchi was writing for these two, although you'd have to be extremely dense not to pick up on the longing gazes, the constant physical contact, how every single song on the OST is talking about how desperately these two need each other, etc.... It truly would be tragic to have that much hate in your heart.
OMG! They've already reached the stage of handholding!!!
UrsaTempest
Jul 5, 2023 4:21AM
I agree lack of kisses or overt sexual tension does rob the pairing somewhat; but I'll disagree it made them 'less' yuri. In the series, SuleMio has chosen each-other over and over again, refusing or rejecting other options that's easier/more advantageous to them in favor of being with each-other.
Well, except when Miorine entered her Lesbian Self-Sacrifice via Separation arc. it's short, fortunately.
This is also because for interpersonal conflict, WfM favor, well, actually talking. And in most case, both parties are 1) willing to talk, and 2) it's actually effective.
The one where it doesn't, of course, lead to giant robots fight.
So, combined this signals all those choices given? Yeah, most of the time they both get pretty clear pros/cons of it. And they choose each-other. And that's why I don't mind much there's no kissing and clam-slamming.
Eggon
Jul 6, 2023 4:04PM
Many people in this site are really fixated on sexual tension to validate a romantic pairing when it really doesn't have to be that way. The show simply isn't very sexual (unless you count Secelia's mere presence sexual). You can see it in the het pairings too, they didn't have any sexual tension either. Norea and El5n, Petra and Lauda, or even Guel's crush on Suletta, these are clearly romantic (it's a more ambiguous with El5n and Norea because of their extraordinary circumstances but I think it's pretty clear that the show is trying to convey it) but there was no sexual tension at all. The closest we have to anything sexual is El5n creeping on Suletta. It's just how the show is, you could call it prude sure, but Sulemio completely falls into what this show categorizes as romance.
This doesn't mean the characters are ace either (god the absolute shitshow everytime there's an ace pairing on this site), some relationships in media simply don't explore the character's sexuality and that's completely fine. When you watch "Inception" or some shit, do you question that Leo and his wife's relationship was romantic just because there wasn't any explicitly sexual scene? And if you walk away from Ep 17 thinking, "Ah these 2 are just platonic" I have no idea what to say to you.
Ask yourself this and answer honestly, if these two were a het pairing, would there be any doubt that their relationship is romantic? I just "love" how if we were watching a show like SAO, there would be no question that Kirito would end up with Asuna from the very first scene they are together but if the pairing is gay we second guess even when they are married.
The show IS most definitely rushed though. Just another season would've made it a truly great anime I feel.
last edited at Jul 6, 2023 4:17PM
HumbleBumble
Jul 6, 2023 4:21PM
I'd like to argue that there are plenty of scenes that show Sulettas, er, appreciation of Miorine's body. There was a post flying around Reddit that I believe originated from 4chan, where a user pointed out that pretty much any shot of Miorine's legs is explicitly shot from Suletta's point of view. I think the show does a splendid job of showing as much as it can through the actual animation without saying a single word. Also, in the epilogue, Suletta's index and middle nails are nice and trimmed ;)
The Real Haman Karn
Jul 6, 2023 8:42PM
"And if you walk away from Ep 17 thinking, "Ah these 2 are just platonic" I have no idea what to say to you."
Are people saying this?
Eggon
Jul 7, 2023 12:07AM
Are people saying this?
Literally the comment that started this chain. Scroll up.
anim8tur
Jul 7, 2023 3:04PM
I do think that last sequence, with that utterly adorable confirmation of Mio as a clingy wife, could have pushed the envelope a bit with an almost kiss - interrupted by Eri - that ends with foreheads touching instead.
macfluffers
Jul 8, 2023 7:56PM
The handholding scene was more intimate than any kiss they could have shown. People getting bothered by the lack of a kiss or other sexual tension are missing the forest for the trees.
kokoa
Jul 13, 2023 3:50PM
I agree with people who said they kind of rushed the final and Miorine and Suletta’s relationship was a victim of it. I can say their relationship was really good-written and is one of the best things of the show but they didn’t give them a proper conclusion due to the lack of episodes, it doesn’t necessarily ruin it but it’s one of it flaws. Though I disagree with people saying it could be read as “platonic” or that the fact they didn’t kiss or had sex ruined it, the show did good establishing their mutual feelings, my problem was that they didn’t exactly convey it to one another, the audience understood it and both characters make it clear but individually we never had a scene where they tell each other how they feel about one another just that one time in episode 17 where Suletta explicitly tells Miorine to choose her but then they separated them for 6 episodes and when they reunite we still don’t get a respond to Suletta’s feelings(we as audience know ofc how Miorine feels but both characters still don’t say it)or smth that tells us “OH! they are dating now” it didn’t have to be a kiss just something that makes u think they “confessed and started dating” even if it was indirectly the hold handing was cute but it weighed more to Miorine’s resolution than their romantic relationship.Instead we get a time skip which give us the confirmation they got married and that’s great! I mean it! And this is definitely not me making less the fact we got a married queer-couple on screen but it’s impossible to not think: What happened in the middle?
CindertailtheKistune Jul 3, 2023 11:24PM
Happiness.
WhyNotYuriAnime Jul 3, 2023 11:31PM
this was such a great way to end the series T^T
FluffyCow Jul 4, 2023 12:55AM
Adorable
nio_neka Jul 4, 2023 1:04AM
before marriage
Adawal Jul 4, 2023 1:05AM
suletta and her wife miorine,,,,,,,, canon,,,,,,, OFFICIAL,,,,,,,,,,,
Takasaki Reika Jul 4, 2023 2:09AM
They're just precious
herenowforever Jul 4, 2023 5:21AM
I think the relationship was handled kind of poorly where it comes to actual romance.
Not because Suletta and Miorine aren't cool characters or they don't have any chemistry, they are and I kind of liked quite a few of the cast. But where is the sexual tension between them during the series? Not only that, but it's more like guys hitting on Suletta and her being vaguely interested that comes to mind. OG yuri like Sailor Moon, or reboot of She-Ra did this a lot better. Hell, even RWBY managed to do decent job with it after ages of finger-twiddling.
Honestly, if I didn't understand what the writers are intending you to take from it, I'd just call it a platonic relationship coming through arranged marriage (duel stuff is a twisted version of that).
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 5:21AM
xyth Jul 4, 2023 9:40AM
^ https://twitter.com/ErzasRightHand/status/1675568024403730432?s=20
I am satisfied on what we had - they are both alive and they got married - despite the circumstances the show had like the 5PM timeslot, being in a mainstream franchise, and JP still not legalizing or even recognizing same-sex marriage. I imagine execs also had a hand on how many episodes we had. The writers and the other people behind just did what they could on what they had. (Regarding the timeslot, i read somewhere [can't find the source anymore] that ep 12 tomato smash scene received complaints from the parents to the tv regulatory board because of the violence lol but it's gundam).
Is it better if we had more episodes? Hell, yeah!
Maybe if we could have an OVA, they could expound on those loose/unsatisfying points without worrying about certain constraints such as consideration of the timeslot audience.
Maybe they intended it to be that way so other people that are not fond of f/f relationship can still somewhat digest it. "such great best friends!"
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 9:41AM
botmj Jul 4, 2023 10:48AM
Can't write good gay shit if we gotta pander to the homophobes
Mugino Jul 4, 2023 11:16AM
Oh, it was good 9 months and it seen the world is empty without them again, ;(
Tnaks gundam
The Real Haman Karn Jul 4, 2023 11:40AM
^^^ The show really did fall to pieces in the last couple episodes, having so many plots but no time at all to follow through on them (and then dedicating way too much time for a really bad Lauda arc, Fuck Lauda) Before the finale almost everyone watching was certain they'd announce another season, like they did with IBO, so there was some pretty massive whiplash when they just wrapped everything up the way they did. Unfortunately, Suletta and Miorine's relationship was the biggest victim of that pacing. I love the messy politics and themes of the older series, but I would have even forgiven them dropping the ball on all that and its characters if they really focused on their relationship, and sadly they just didnt allocate enough time. Even a few more minutes for them instead of everyone in meetings relaying things we already know would go a long way. Between the horrible production conditions and Okouchi dropping the ball every show he writes, I'm not surprised.
I'll also push back on the narrative that Gundam doesn't and has never done explicit romance or kissing. Turn A, IBO, thunderbolt, 00, 08th MS Team, even the worst hetero nightmare show SEED, theyve all done explicit romance and kissing. IBO in a roundabout way ends with a lesbian domestic partnership executed extremely similarly to Suletta and Miorine. Turn A in its own way is extremely queer in themes and coding, the main character Loran can very easily be read as trans or nonbinary, etc. Now, the scene of them floating in space is evoking a very romantic scene from F91, but like the sword fight a couple episodes prior it kind of ends up using the reference to scaffold all the meaning and weight into that scene, rather than doing the work itself.
All that said for all my problems with the end of the show, I don't mind the ending these two got itself all that much. It's cute it's nice i'm glad they got married and i'm happy for everyone who's happy. Personally I just really wish they put the time and effort to give it the weight it deserved.
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 11:47AM
lenne18 Jul 4, 2023 11:51AM
Unironically, most of them end up dead
The Real Haman Karn Jul 4, 2023 12:08PM
thats a different issue
luinthoron Jul 4, 2023 12:23PM
Very nice. ^_^
xyth Jul 4, 2023 12:39PM
^^^^I agree. There are so much more that could have been done if we are given more episodes. Unfortunately, we didn't. For me, basing on what was happening in ep 23 and the tweets that they are posting, I was sure that it will be the last episode. 1 ep for 24-25 mins, that's an awful little time to fit all the narratives that are left to be explored. So I went into ep 24 with low expectations and got happy after. (At this point of my life, I just want to have happy things and not stress over the stuff I can't control.)
On the Lauda arc, it felt to me that it came out of nowhere, though I might've just missed the clues. Maybe they just pushed those scenes to showcase Schwarzette more. You know, monies lol. If that's the case, then it's just sad that other better arcs are axed to make way for this.
I haven't watched a lot of Gundam shows so I am just basing on people's accounts. I am taking in your accounts as well. So maybe it's because the MCs are both female so the explicit scenes are much, much less likely. We got a long way to go for non-hetero ships for main franchises it seems. At least we can treat this as a step closer to getting better queer shows, especially those from JP. Like big anime franchises or super popular anime/manga with queer MCs.
last edited at Jul 4, 2023 12:41PM
Zormau Jul 4, 2023 12:48PM
That moment when you realize that the pictures wouldn't really be spoilers if they weren't tagged as such :D
HumbleBumble Jul 4, 2023 1:44PM
I don't know how to quote on this website, so I will just say that I am extremely happy that I CAN understand what Okouchi was writing for these two, although you'd have to be extremely dense not to pick up on the longing gazes, the constant physical contact, how every single song on the OST is talking about how desperately these two need each other, etc.... It truly would be tragic to have that much hate in your heart.
xyth Jul 4, 2023 1:56PM
^you can refer to this: https://dynasty-scans.com/forum/topics/17927-forum-rules-v2-userscripts-forum-post-formatting?page=1
Missigno Jul 4, 2023 4:43PM
OFFICIAL OFFICIAL OFFICIAL WE ARE WINNING
Nene Jul 4, 2023 10:14PM
OMG! They've already reached the stage of handholding!!!
UrsaTempest Jul 5, 2023 4:21AM
I agree lack of kisses or overt sexual tension does rob the pairing somewhat; but I'll disagree it made them 'less' yuri. In the series, SuleMio has chosen each-other over and over again, refusing or rejecting other options that's easier/more advantageous to them in favor of being with each-other.
Well, except when Miorine entered her Lesbian Self-Sacrifice via Separation arc. it's short, fortunately.
This is also because for interpersonal conflict, WfM favor, well, actually talking. And in most case, both parties are 1) willing to talk, and 2) it's actually effective.
The one where it doesn't, of course, lead to giant robots fight.
So, combined this signals all those choices given? Yeah, most of the time they both get pretty clear pros/cons of it. And they choose each-other. And that's why I don't mind much there's no kissing and clam-slamming.
Eggon Jul 6, 2023 4:04PM
Many people in this site are really fixated on sexual tension to validate a romantic pairing when it really doesn't have to be that way. The show simply isn't very sexual (unless you count Secelia's mere presence sexual). You can see it in the het pairings too, they didn't have any sexual tension either. Norea and El5n, Petra and Lauda, or even Guel's crush on Suletta, these are clearly romantic (it's a more ambiguous with El5n and Norea because of their extraordinary circumstances but I think it's pretty clear that the show is trying to convey it) but there was no sexual tension at all. The closest we have to anything sexual is El5n creeping on Suletta. It's just how the show is, you could call it prude sure, but Sulemio completely falls into what this show categorizes as romance.
This doesn't mean the characters are ace either (god the absolute shitshow everytime there's an ace pairing on this site), some relationships in media simply don't explore the character's sexuality and that's completely fine. When you watch "Inception" or some shit, do you question that Leo and his wife's relationship was romantic just because there wasn't any explicitly sexual scene? And if you walk away from Ep 17 thinking, "Ah these 2 are just platonic" I have no idea what to say to you.
Ask yourself this and answer honestly, if these two were a het pairing, would there be any doubt that their relationship is romantic? I just "love" how if we were watching a show like SAO, there would be no question that Kirito would end up with Asuna from the very first scene they are together but if the pairing is gay we second guess even when they are married.
The show IS most definitely rushed though. Just another season would've made it a truly great anime I feel.
last edited at Jul 6, 2023 4:17PM
HumbleBumble Jul 6, 2023 4:21PM
I'd like to argue that there are plenty of scenes that show Sulettas, er, appreciation of Miorine's body. There was a post flying around Reddit that I believe originated from 4chan, where a user pointed out that pretty much any shot of Miorine's legs is explicitly shot from Suletta's point of view. I think the show does a splendid job of showing as much as it can through the actual animation without saying a single word. Also, in the epilogue, Suletta's index and middle nails are nice and trimmed ;)
The Real Haman Karn Jul 6, 2023 8:42PM
Are people saying this?
Eggon Jul 7, 2023 12:07AM
Literally the comment that started this chain. Scroll up.
anim8tur Jul 7, 2023 3:04PM
I do think that last sequence, with that utterly adorable confirmation of Mio as a clingy wife, could have pushed the envelope a bit with an almost kiss - interrupted by Eri - that ends with foreheads touching instead.
macfluffers Jul 8, 2023 7:56PM
The handholding scene was more intimate than any kiss they could have shown. People getting bothered by the lack of a kiss or other sexual tension are missing the forest for the trees.
kokoa Jul 13, 2023 3:50PM
I agree with people who said they kind of rushed the final and Miorine and Suletta’s relationship was a victim of it. I can say their relationship was really good-written and is one of the best things of the show but they didn’t give them a proper conclusion due to the lack of episodes, it doesn’t necessarily ruin it but it’s one of it flaws. Though I disagree with people saying it could be read as “platonic” or that the fact they didn’t kiss or had sex ruined it, the show did good establishing their mutual feelings, my problem was that they didn’t exactly convey it to one another, the audience understood it and both characters make it clear but individually we never had a scene where they tell each other how they feel about one another just that one time in episode 17 where Suletta explicitly tells Miorine to choose her but then they separated them for 6 episodes and when they reunite we still don’t get a respond to Suletta’s feelings(we as audience know ofc how Miorine feels but both characters still don’t say it)or smth that tells us “OH! they are dating now” it didn’t have to be a kiss just something that makes u think they “confessed and started dating” even if it was indirectly the hold handing was cute but it weighed more to Miorine’s resolution than their romantic relationship.Instead we get a time skip which give us the confirmation they got married and that’s great! I mean it! And this is definitely not me making less the fact we got a married queer-couple on screen but it’s impossible to not think: What happened in the middle?
altoonaxc Jul 24, 2023 1:19AM
Still a better love story than
Any of Gundam SEED's?
The Real Haman Karn Jul 26, 2023 3:37PM
oh god lets not even think about SEED