Forum › Sakana no Miru Yume discussion

Sdfsd
joined May 21, 2013

Oh, man. These twists are just mangling my feelings.

Akari
joined Apr 16, 2013

The dad is soooooooo creepy. I really hope he doesn't cross the line...that would ruin everything for me.

Gaara.600.995526
joined Oct 2, 2014

What how is Tomoe selfish?Everyone is hurting her with their ideals and wants,they are hurting her cause she cant give them what THEY want,from her...First Kujou destroying someones life just cause you want them to remember you cause you know they will never return you feeling,and how is it that you can say you love a person if you are able to hurt them to such a large extent for you own 'benefit' ?Then Mikage,she tells her sister not to force her ideals of a family on her(like a label?) but she is a total hypocrite,how many times has she imposed herself on Tomoe trying to assert herself constantly as being more than a sister,she forces her own ideals on her sister...Tomoe although she wants her relationships to be in her terms as Mikage said she has never ever had a close relationship with anyone that has allowed her to set the terms of the relationship,she hasnt ever been allowed to be selfish...so how the HELL is she selfish!!??
Sorry just raggingTT

1601027_795818500441432_7671980177939230942_n
joined Apr 14, 2014

Up until now i really loved yandere characters , but this one its a new whole shitty level for me, its no more love, we have a fkin psycho here, a big nope for me ಠ_ಠ

2015-01-21%2018.42.01
joined May 17, 2014

What the fuck just happened? Kinda wierd how the bff just went crazy over there... And no questioning of why a little girl was alone with a grown man naked? It's okay for me to assume he's a rapist now right?

1410744948313
joined Mar 9, 2014

And no questioning of why a little girl was alone with a grown man naked?
It's okay for me to assume he's a rapist now right?

He was painting her. And covering yourself with a sheet is fairly common practice instead of just being fully naked.
She fell asleep and let the sheet drop and when he saw that he covered her back up. So if anything he's not all that bad of a father.

last edited at Oct 11, 2014 8:52PM

joined Oct 12, 2013

And no questioning of why a little girl was alone with a grown man naked?
It's okay for me to assume he's a rapist now right?

He was painting her. And covering yourself with a sheet is fairly common practice instead of just being fully naked.
She fell asleep and let the sheet drop and when he saw that she covered her back up. So if anything he's not all that bad of a father.

Although there has been a strong inference that he did something to her in the past, which is why Tomoe keeps freaking out every time Mikage goes over there by herself.

What how is Tomoe selfish?Everyone is hurting her with their ideals and wants,they are hurting her cause she cant give them what THEY want,from her...First Kujou destroying someones life just cause you want them to remember you cause you know they will never return you feeling,and how is it that you can say you love a person if you are able to hurt them to such a large extent for you own 'benefit' ?Then Mikage,she tells her sister not to force her ideals of a family on her(like a label?) but she is a total hypocrite,how many times has she imposed herself on Tomoe trying to assert herself constantly as being more than a sister,she forces her own ideals on her sister...Tomoe although she wants her relationships to be in her terms as Mikage said she has never ever had a close relationship with anyone that has allowed her to set the terms of the relationship,she hasnt ever been allowed to be selfish...so how the HELL is she selfish!!??
Sorry just raggingTT

Don't be sorry, I agree with you one this to a point. Tomoe is being a bit selfish, but not in a bad way. She wants a family where she has a non-incestuous relationship with her sister and her father is molesting her little sister. She wants a friend who won't stab her in the back. Tomoe's life isn't ruined, she can always appeal or just apply the following year, but it definitely has been derailed. If it were me, I'd tell all of them to piss off and go hang out with those other girls from before, they were nice.

Tumblr_lhn2y5j5rz1qbc0x9
joined Jul 26, 2013

And no questioning of why a little girl was alone with a grown man naked?
It's okay for me to assume he's a rapist now right?

He was painting her. And covering yourself with a sheet is fairly common practice instead of just being fully naked.
She fell asleep and let the sheet drop and when he saw that he covered her back up. So if anything he's not all that bad of a father.

"Not a bad father"......I don't know about that. If you let your father paint you nude while you were still in middle school, I think that's pretty twisted already. Unless that's a normal thing to you then okay, I won't judge, everyone has weird family traditions (-:

This manga is so bleh, but I have to continue reading to get to the ending...fml.

Imgres
joined Sep 23, 2013

there's something fundamentally about their personalities... all of them

Nyohohoho
joined Apr 20, 2013

And no questioning of why a little girl was alone with a grown man naked?
It's okay for me to assume he's a rapist now right?

He was painting her. And covering yourself with a sheet is fairly common practice instead of just being fully naked.
She fell asleep and let the sheet drop and when he saw that he covered her back up. So if anything he's not all that bad of a father.

"Not a bad father"......I don't know about that. If you let your father paint you nude while you were still in middle school, I think that's pretty twisted already. Unless that's a normal thing to you then okay, I won't judge, everyone has weird family traditions (-:

"he's not all that bad"

Is what she/he said.

I think the part where he covers her, is the form of saying "Although he made her get naked, he is not gonna touch her"
I think that's what happened in the past and now, and there isn't much left of this manga so you better take the subtle messages or be forever in anguish.

joined Feb 7, 2013

Drama~

I also don't think Tomoe was being selfish. Having a "normal" family life is considered the default. "Friends" has a publicly accepted meaning. Fathers shouldn't be doing disturbing things to their daughters (referring to painting nudes; I don't think he's done anything more), two sisters aren't romantically involved, friends do not stab each other in the back like that.

Relationships are two-way agreements. Mikage could stop being a little sister all on her own by breaking off their default family relationship if she wanted, the way Kujou destroyed their friendship, because Mikage's end of the family relationship is hers to deal with.

But if Mikage wanted to be more than a little sister to Tomoe, then she'd need Tomoe's agreement. Mikage has no right to demand that Tomoe give her anything other than a default family relationship just because she wants it. She can only try to convince Tomoe to change their relationship, but doing so could involve destroying their original "sisters" relationship.

Download
joined Apr 23, 2013

Yoooo, that girl is surrounded by a group of straight up sociopaths. Like how does that even happen? It can't just be trauma. Some god put their finger on the cosmic trajectory of her life and was like "Yup. This one. This is the one that I will personally dedicate my celestial existence to fucking up the most. But I'ma be super classy and dramatic about it."

How on earth is she being selfish? How are her expectations unreasonable? And how did she end up being friends with that one person who's like "yes, I love this person so much that I will spend my entire time at high school planning for that single moment when I crush her dreams. Yeah. That'll be so fuckin' romantic. I can't fucking' wait." I mean, what even is Kujou going to do with her life now? Become a homeless person who spits on people? She clearly doesn't give a fuck what people think. Maybe she goes on to actually grow a conscience, and when she does I hope she just pauses one day and is like "oh yeah. That was a seriously fucked up thing that I did. Wow, I was literally the worst person."

Anyway, cool beans chapter. Can't wait to see what happens next.

Tohka%20not%20crying
joined Jun 6, 2014

This is actually a very true ideal that no one wants to look at...because we are all guilty of it.

We still don't know what the dad did...whether he truly is an indecent person or simply a man devoid of care and emotion. We need to look at him not as our preconceived notions given to us by Tomoe, but rather what we are shown. It seems like he isn't a good father in some regards, but he is in others. Tomoe can't see him for who he is, and simply shut him out from her life in response. Not healthy or appropriate.

Tomoe was being selfish. That's reality. She refused to look at the people around her seriously, the same way Mikage used to not do so either. I don't blame her for her shell-shocked response to Kujou...and quite frankly I don't think she was particularly at fault in any significant way leading up to her serious convo with Mikage. But in that moment she started thinking and seeing thinks in the aforementioned selfish manner...and it was Mikage who snapped her out of it. Mikage was in the same place, and was lucky to have such a wonderful friend in Takayanagi to see her out of it.

You can certainly want - in this case, Tomoe wants a normal family life and a normal friendship. But you must never impose your wants on reality. You can try to change reality into your wants, but to do so you must first accept reality for what it is and embrace it head on. And sad reality for Tomoe is that Kujou has a messed up perception of love, and her family was snapped and broken at the roots. She needs to accept as such, even if it requires gritted teeth and swollen eyes.

I can't say Mikage is perfect either. She tends toward coldness and needs to be more tactful in her approach toward sensitive topics at times...but in this one instance her blunt attitude is for the better, as it woke up Tomoe. And maybe in the future once Tomoe starts taking Mikage seriously, she can get her little sister to start letting a little more light leak into her life.

See, Mikage is toeing the line properly, believe it or not. She is staying aggressive to try and wake Tomoe up from her misconceived dream (looks like she was successful finally) without throwing her coins all-in and destroying her relationship completely. And in the end here all she did was verbally wake-up slap Tomoe from this dream by asking to be looked at not as a little sister. More than that, she refused to let herself be seen as a little sister.

However had Tomoe accepted immediately, she would be succumbing to someone else's desires rashly without some introspection of herself. That's what her final line of "things won't change if we keep them like this" indicates. She recognizes this, and will finally play her role as ultimate heroine in the upcoming events. She will see reality, not her wants, and tackle it head on. She will open her eyes to the world that is hers, and find her true place in it. And ultimately, I suspect she will see how all her wishes revolve around caring for Mikage. I think the incest end is immanent, as I don't see Tomoe caring for Mikage solely as a little sister anymore, but rather partially as one, and partially as a young woman as well.

Interesting to see what happens moving forward. I had started to lose hope in this, but things are picking up now that resolutions are tying up and concepts are coming full circle rather cleanly.

last edited at Oct 11, 2014 11:22PM

Ymir-and-christa-lenz-historia-reiss-shingeki-no-kyojin-kittyluv57-38197762-736-429
joined May 19, 2014

Cmon guys. What's the fuss all about? Kujou just wanted to be BADLY remembered by Tomoe.

It's super normal right? She wanted to confess her love in a grand way, like no other. Now she'll be forever ingrained in Tomoe's memories. I say job well done!

Now Mikage, I thought her ideals were also spot on! How dare Tomoe expect a normal family from her family? She wants a little sister persona from Mikage because she is her little sister.. Very selfish demand! One can't expect something normal from a group of disturbed sociopaths.

joined Sep 25, 2014

Shouldn't the only solution to this whole mess of a story is to kill off one main character?

The angst, envy, jealousy, anger, confusion and lust these pathetic characters are feeling, the cause of one particular character?

2641afdd-9dc4-4327-a1c3-a5b558c33522
joined Mar 12, 2014

I just want Tomoe to be happy. IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK. Happy in a healthy way. Not happy as in I'm gonna get mind fucked by all my friends and family who actually just want to have weird twisted relationships with me, but I'm totally selfish for seeing them as friends and family /RANT

joined Apr 26, 2014

Glad that it didn't turn out as I expected and glad to know that siblings get the grip together.

sweet little lie
joined Mar 17, 2013

OHHH!! I love Mikage.

I don't think it's Tomoe's fault for wanting to have a normal life. She just couldn't accept things that happened in her life.

I was wondering the whole time I read about what kind of relationship Mikage has with the father.
In the end, I just can't jump to the conclusion that they really have THAT kind of relationship.
I admired the author that she didn't directly tell, but instead, expressed with all those character's facial expressions and other subtle compositions. She left a lot of space for us readers.

This story plays with emotions. All emotions we think we can have in our lives are there. It's kinda reflecting human nature.

can't wait for the next chapter.

joined Apr 1, 2014

0/10

Soralaylaff
joined Oct 16, 2013

I still think that everyone needs therapy besides the two "idiot lovebirds"...

"I got into lots of tangled, confused thinking..." Yes Ogawa-sensei, that came across pretty clear in the story.

Everything past ch 8, pg 60 is dead to me.

Thanks for the all the work on this series Yuri Project!

Tumblr_m6qk60jppk1r95frro1_500
joined May 28, 2013

I'm actually really confused and maybe I need to reread this, but I feel like that won't clear the mess in my head when I think about this manga. It was good but I feel like I need a commentary alongside it to fully understand.

1134551561851
joined Aug 1, 2013

Everything past ch 8, pg 60 is dead to me.

Thanks for the all the work on this series Yuri Project!

Yup. That's a great way of thinking. I completely agree.
Even though it was so predictable, the incest route just seemed so off for me. Meh. The whole story was a bit of a disappointment.

last edited at Oct 18, 2014 5:57PM

1601027_795818500441432_7671980177939230942_n
joined Apr 14, 2014

Mmm... i have mixed feeling for the end, very blurry, like the author said, he/she didnt know how to end the story: "i got into lots of tangled ...", i dont know if both sisters got in a romantic relationship ? ( to me from the last chapiter, its not the case), some parts remain unclear like what id the dad to Mikage, why Tomoe hate him and not Mikage. I was really hoping for a pov of what happened to mikage and her dad from both sisters. Well that was mehh.
ty Yuri Project .

Z%20ss
joined Oct 15, 2013

What a fucking mess, that was terrible =/

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