Forum › I Favor the Villainess discussion

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

Favourite moment was Relaire joining in with the Princes doing their Rei impression.

This, absolutely. :D

joined Apr 6, 2017

I loved the part where she made the tungsten carbine walls. In the novel she also makes bullets to take out the fire balls is I remember. She could revolutionize the whole kingdom right there with making that stuff. Make furnaces out t and walls that no monster or enemy could break through, Tools, weapons and just so many more.

Cornonthekopp
D05536d6-01d1-4527-9102-4cc772fad5ed
joined Jul 6, 2020

I’m sorry for your loss, feel free to take as much time as you need. Your mental health is more important than getting the series out on time.

Cornonthekopp
D05536d6-01d1-4527-9102-4cc772fad5ed
joined Jul 6, 2020

Favourite moment was Relaire joining in with the Princes doing their Rei impression.

This, absolutely. :D

Relaire has had a lot of funny little background gags in the manga that never would have been possible in the LN

Internet_lied
joined Jul 15, 2016

I loved the part where she made the tungsten carbine walls. In the novel she also makes bullets to take out the fire balls is I remember. She could revolutionize the whole kingdom right there with making that stuff. Make furnaces out t and walls that no monster or enemy could break through, Tools, weapons and just so many more.

I was actually kinda bothered by that moment. Because as long as they just stick to the Aristotelian four elements as the base of their magic system, I am fine with not looking too deeply into it, but once Rei starts pulling composite alloys out of her ass, I am starting to have questions. For instance, tungsten is a rare metal on Earth, but Rei is able to haul at least a ton of it out of the floor of the arena -- does this mean the arena is composed of chunks of rare metals (and if so, which ones?), does a geode of a tungsten-rich ore just happen to run under it, or is tungsten just naturally abundant in this universe? Or, the most heretical thought: do Rei's earth-based powers just let her nucleosynthesize tons of precious metals on a whim? If so, can she also synthesize gold, like a living Philosophers Stone? If so, is this capacity unique to her? If not, what does the society use as the monetary standard instead of precious metals?

Circling back to the alloy, how did she actually carbide all that tungsten? AFAIK that substance does not occur in (our) nature, so does it mean that it is naturally abundant in this world's soil? Or does she pull the carbon out of the earth or air (less likely, given how she is not an air mage) and let it react with elemental tungsten? If so, how does she achieve the necessary temperatures of 1000+ degrees without having an affinity for the fire element?

last edited at Jul 25, 2021 2:50PM

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

Favourite moment was Relaire joining in with the Princes doing their Rei impression.

This, absolutely. :D

Relaire has had a lot of funny little background gags in the manga that never would have been possible in the LN

Definitely. I already declared Relaire one of the best parts of the previous chapter as well. :D

I loved the part where she made the tungsten carbine walls. In the novel she also makes bullets to take out the fire balls is I remember. She could revolutionize the whole kingdom right there with making that stuff. Make furnaces out t and walls that no monster or enemy could break through, Tools, weapons and just so many more.

I was actually kinda bothered by that moment. Because as long as they just stick to the Aristotelian four elements as the base of their magic system, I am fine with not looking too deeply into it, but once Rei starts pulling composite alloys out of her ass, I am starting to have questions. For instance, tungsten is a rare metal on Earth, but Rei is able to haul at least a ton of it out of the floor of the arena -- does this mean the arena is composed of chunks of rare metals (and if so, which ones?), does a geode of a tungsten-rich ore just happen to run under it, or is tungsten just naturally abundant in this universe? Or, the most heretical thought: do Rei's earth-based powers just let her nucleosynthesize tons of precious metals on a whim? If so, can she also synthesize gold, like a living Philosophers Stone? If so, is this capacity unique to her? If not, what does the society use as the monetary standard instead of precious metals?

Circling back to the alloy, how did she actually carbide all that tungsten? AFAIK that substance does not occur in (our) nature, so does it mean that it is naturally abundant in this world's soil? Or does she pull the carbon out of the earth or air (less likely, given how she is not an air mage) and let it react with elemental tungsten? If so, how does she achieve the necessary temperatures of 1000+ degrees without having an affinity for the fire element?

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Internet_lied
joined Jul 15, 2016

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

last edited at Jul 25, 2021 3:24PM

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

She does know a bit more than one would expect from a dead OL, yes, although I suppose it could have featured in one of her games... On the other hand, this also may explain why she can do something others can't - most mages can only imagine the magic elements as what they know them as, while she uses her advanced knowledge to use specific materials covered by that element.

New%20dynasty%20reader%20profile
joined Oct 22, 2018

Really nice chapter. Thank you for delivering this to us, TLr. And also, my condolences.

Ezgif.com-resize%20(6)
joined Jun 6, 2020

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

Just think of it like metalbending in ATLA. Same idea

Ezgif.com-resize%20(6)
joined Jun 6, 2020

So sorry for your loss :(

Altair Uploader
Reisen%20ds
joined Nov 30, 2016

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

At some point in the novel Rei goes into the details a bit more (she's up to quite a bit behind the scenes and I think it took her a long time to develop this technique). The short of it is that this magic system can and does become whatever the plot needs it to be. Your concern of if X exists then why in the hell don't they do Y is valid and will be recurring

Relaire has had a lot of funny little background gags in the manga that never would have been possible in the LN

I think this is what they call "fan service"

last edited at Jul 25, 2021 11:48PM

Internet_lied
joined Jul 15, 2016

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

She does know a bit more than one would expect from a dead OL, yes, although I suppose it could have featured in one of her games... On the other hand, this also may explain why she can do something others can't - most mages can only imagine the magic elements as what they know them as, while she uses her advanced knowledge to use specific materials covered by that element.

That begs the question of how exactly does a non-specialist differentiate elemental tungsten from, say, elemental tantalum in her imagination. I somehow doubt that she's picturing nuclear structures and electron shells...

Just think of it like metalbending in ATLA. Same idea

IIRC metalbending is only ever used to physically deform and levitate metallic objects, and (at least in its original form) actually works by manipulating silicate impurities within the metal (though Bryke seem to have retconned that in Korra). While the "idea" may be the same, it's still a leap from mechanical manipulation of trace metals to nucleosynthesis and cold alloys.

At some point in the novel Rei goes into the details a bit more (she's up to quite a bit behind the scenes and I think it took her a long time to develop this technique). The short of it is that this magic system can and does become whatever the plot needs it to be. Your concern of if X exists then why in the hell don't they do Y is valid and will be recurring

Then I am relieved. :-) Still, it's fun to nitpick at world-building so I think I will engage in it more in the future...

joined Jun 30, 2015

uh... pretty sure Wolfram is Tungsten, not Tungsten Carbide.

joined Jan 6, 2017

IIRC metalbending is only ever used to physically deform and levitate metallic objects, and (at least in its original form) actually works by manipulating silicate impurities within the metal (though Bryke seem to have retconned that in Korra). While the "idea" may be the same, it's still a leap from mechanical manipulation of trace metals to nucleosynthesis and cold alloys.

Guru Pathik said "Even metal is just a part of Earth that has been purified and refined", so I used to interpret it as metal just being a part of earth and metal benders simply extended their understanding of "Earth".
It was actually in Korra where it was further clarified that they bend the impurities left within the metal; hence why extremely "pure" metals, such as platinum, can't be bent.

last edited at Jul 26, 2021 8:53AM

Ykn1
joined Dec 20, 2018

That begs the question of how exactly does a non-specialist differentiate elemental tungsten from, say, elemental tantalum in her imagination. I somehow doubt that she's picturing nuclear structures and electron shells...

I guess it's just her imagining the material's properties known to her and magic doing the rest. It's not all that different from imagining a "rock" for usual earth element magic without going deeper into its composition, or for that matter a water mage summoning water without knowing anything about its chemical composition.

uh... pretty sure Wolfram is Tungsten, not Tungsten Carbide.

That mistake did hurt my brain, yes.

Webp.net-resizeimage%20(1)
joined Jan 7, 2018

How far the raws go?

Tron-legacy
joined Dec 11, 2017

One would assume that, as usual, mages simply summon/create their respective elements. Less noticeable with air users or earth users who create walls like that, possible even to explain away with water and fire to an extent, but certainly noticeable at the very least with earth type projectiles. Well, never a good idea to think too much about most magic systems in any case.

Indeed, as long as specific chemical elements aren't a plot point, I have no trouble switching my brain off and enjoying the fireworks. But in this instance, Rei specifically lampshades that she is using advanced technical knowledge from modern Japan (why does an ex-office lady know so much about metallurgy, by the way?), so the author has deliberately brought real-world chemistry into their magic system and willingly invited a critical examination thereof.

It's...magic. It literally doesn't matter how much real world chemistry is involved, at the base, it's all bullshit, and the details are dressing. This isn't any different from Rodd's flame troops sucking up the oxygen in the room, or any number of similar tricks in various fantasy settings. Even the fact that fire magic is hot (which is probably universal to all magic systems in all fantasy settings) is bringing in a feature of the real thing while ignoring the fact that humans can't summon or control it at will.

All stories with magic assume a certain blend of fantastical elements with various degrees of common sense and real world knowledge. You bridge the gap with suspension of disbelief in all cases. Rei's ability to summon tungsten and turn it into a real world alloy is not more unbelievable than her ability to magically control dirt and earth in the first place.

Book%20and%20cloakhbq1
joined Aug 1, 2011

If so, is this capacity unique to her? If not, what does the society use as the monetary standard instead of precious metals?

I don't think the monetary standard is that big of a problem, in part because there economy must already look very different from any real life analogs. For example, I suspect the ability of an earth mage to nigh instantly create stable, incredibly durable, structures with no meaningful resource requirements should completely change their economy. At a minimum, stone castles, walled cities, and good roads are now much easier to build, which should have far reaching implications for both warfare and trade. Beyond that, any jobs that would have been based on either extracting resources for construction (e.g. forestry and mining) or actually building structures are now significantly less in demand.

In terms of the currency itself, there are three relatively straightforward solutions.

  1. If the countries are stable enough, they could have switched to a fiat currency sooner than real-life. This mitigates would mitigate the problem of mages pulling precious metals or other things out of their rears while also allowing for a more stable economy. (The gold standard and mercantilism were not actually good things.)
  2. Currency could be based on some magical substance that cannot be easily replicated, rather than a naturally occurring one.
  3. Magically created materials could have specific tells that allow them to be recognized as such, like a detectable magical charge, or they could be temporary in nature and will fade over time. I find this last possibility the least satisfying, but it would also help reduce the economic changes caused by mages pulling entire ramparts out of thin air. (Though it wouldn't completely eliminate them, since you can still do a lot by just moving the earth around.)

Circling back to the alloy, how did she actually carbide all that tungsten? AFAIK that substance does not occur in (our) nature, so does it mean that it is naturally abundant in this world's soil? Or does she pull the carbon out of the earth or air (less likely, given how she is not an air mage) and let it react with elemental tungsten? If so, how does she achieve the necessary temperatures of 1000+ degrees without having an affinity for the fire element?

I'm not sure if that's a reasonable set of questions? Even FMA style alchemy, which explicitly cares about the presence of the correct atomic elements, doesn't require you to exactly replicate the normal chemical process to create compounds and wouldn't involve heating the substance to any particular temperature. If this system is more conceptual, with people performing effects based on how they perceive the world to work, then it becomes even less of an issue: Rei did not create her wall by pulling atomic tungsten and carbon out of the earth and then combining them, she summoned a wall with the properties of Tungsten Carbide, rather than more common stone.

Given the way Prince Rod was able to create detailed, animated, flame constructs and Clair was able to utilize some form of plasma or laser cannon, which isn't an obvious form of fire magic, I suspect their magic is conceptual in nature and most people simply don't have the concepts they need to really abuse it.

last edited at Jul 26, 2021 1:32PM

Internet_lied
joined Jul 15, 2016

I'm not sure if that's a reasonable set of questions? Even FMA style alchemy, which explicitly cares about the presence of the correct atomic elements, doesn't require you to exactly replicate the normal chemical process to create compounds and wouldn't involve heating the substance to any particular temperature. If this system is more conceptual, with people performing effects based on how they perceive the world to work, then it becomes even less of an issue: Rei did not create her wall by pulling atomic tungsten and carbon out of the earth and then combining them, she summoned a wall with the properties of Tungsten Carbide, rather than more common stone.

Given the way Prince Rod was able to create detailed, animated, flame constructs and Clair was able to utilize some form of plasma or laser cannon, which isn't an obvious form of fire magic, I suspect their magic is conceptual in nature and most people simply don't have the concepts they need to really abuse it.

So you are arguing that it wasn't actual tungsten carbide (and, indeed, not even wolfram, which has an even higher melting point), but rather some magical mumbo-jumbo Rei called that because some part of her brain associates the words "wolfram" and "tungsten carbide" with melting points in the ballpark of the surface of the Sun? I... am actually satisfied with that explanation.

Also, interesting suggestions for fixing the monetary system. I am personally in favor of 2 because 1 sounds too real-world'y and mundane to me and 3 is, as you also pointed out, quite unsatisfying.

last edited at Jul 26, 2021 2:19PM

Ezisrudvkaylvds
joined Jan 19, 2021

Thanks everyone for the kind words

How far the raws go?

we've been caught up the entire time, I release chapters as they come out.
they come out on the 16th-18th every month (with a month break every 5 chapters) and I release them on the 24th/25th every month.

Rsz_1screenshot_7
joined Aug 23, 2015

im sorry for your loss.

joined Apr 11, 2021

Sorry for your loss

Altair Uploader
Reisen%20ds
joined Nov 30, 2016

So you are arguing that it wasn't actual tungsten carbide (and, indeed, not even wolfram, which has an even higher melting point), but rather some magical mumbo-jumbo Rei called that because some part of her brain associates the words "wolfram" and "tungsten carbide" with melting points in the ballpark of the surface of the Sun? I... am actually satisfied with that explanation.

Also, interesting suggestions for fixing the monetary system. I am personally in favor of 2 because 1 sounds too real-world'y and mundane to me and 3 is, as you also pointed out, quite unsatisfying.

This just got some clarification in a tweet (are you secretly Thunder Finberg on twitter???):

"[Rei] first learned about tungsten carbide during her training period after she joined a trading company and before she was assigned to the auditing department. It was because one of the products they handled at their company was made of tungsten carbide."

So, uh, I guess that adds to the idea that she was familiar with the product but not at any meaningful level.

Internet_lied
joined Jul 15, 2016

are you secretly Thunder Finberg on twitter???

No, I am not (I am not on any social media, in fact, since I hear they're bad for one's health). But I am clearly not the only one interested in consistent world-building -- it's almost as if there is a demand for that kind of fiction. :^)

"[Rei] first learned about tungsten carbide during her training period after she joined a trading company and before she was assigned to the auditing department. It was because one of the products they handled at their company was made of tungsten carbide."

So, uh, I guess that adds to the idea that she was familiar with the product but not at any meaningful level.

Yes, that fits in rather nicely with the magical-mumbo-jumbo-that-does-whatever-the-mage-can-conceptualize-in-her-mind theory. :-)

last edited at Aug 4, 2021 3:55PM

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