There is no universal truth when reading a fictional story. There might be some general consensus from the majority, but others are able to interpret and insert their own biases into a character. Because it's a character and not a real person, so there is no objective truth or real motives.

There’s some truth to that, but there’s also the bedrock principle that readings of fiction need to be grounded in specific evidence from the text.

There’s also the principle that hypotheses about interpretive questions can have internal as well as external answers. For instance, there’s the question, “Why did the issue of an arranged marriage for Mei suddenly come up apparently out of nowhere when it seemed to have been taken off the table with the collapse of the engagement to McRapey-sensei?”

Readers have parsed Grandpa’s initial statement about Mei living her own life as being provisional, and they’ve had various explanations for Mei’s failure to bring up the subject of a future marriage being her responsibility to the family during the entire time between then and the big reveal, and they’ve explained Mei’s erratic attitude toward physical intimacy with Yuzu in several different ways. But very few of those theories can be supported by concrete evidence from the text.

The simpler answer, and one that can inferred from the wandering plot of the middle chapters of the series, is that the author was rather desperate for a big final plot arc and returned to an old trope—that the events depicted in the story are not a function of a character’s well-planned, deeply nuanced psychology, but of an author’s haphazard plotting of a series that had been slipping out of control.

The fact that the series went to great lengths to set up a whole array of unanswered questions and apparently insurmountable barriers to Mei and Yuzu ever being together then hand-waved them all away in a single page of silent panels (after spending many pages of action-comedy hijinks just getting Yuzu to the house where Mei was staying) makes the external answer—sloppy writing—much more likely than any theory about psychological depth and nuance.

I also agree that the last arc was poorly written. It's a major flaw in the overall story, but name one long-running series in history that didn't have a major dip in storytelling at some point. I also believe that Citrus+ has been doing a great job of making up for all the problems that Volume 10 caused. If the last arc was a big poorly-written reset button, then Citrus+ is working hard to be the best darn reset it can possibly be, and to great effect In my opinion.

You say my rationalization of Mei's behavior comes from "theories" and not actual evidence from the text. Well, where do you think I get the basis for those theories? From reading Citrus several times and finding evidence to back up my supposedly incorrect interpretation of Saburouta's bad writing.

However, what it all comes down to is my personal enjoyment. I know I keep repeating that, but I like enjoying things even if they're flawed. Does me, in your words, rationalizing inconsistent character behavior and sloppy writing mean I get to enjoy something I like? Then I will gladly continue to be wrong ¯_(ツ)_/¯

I can't find any of these "inconsistencies" you talk about. If anything, I love her character more and more upon each read and I've concluded her to be one of the deepest and most complex characters in any Yuri manga

lolwut

This one was personal

Does me liking Mei offend you somehow? How dare I enjoy something?

Also, Mei continues to be my favorite character. She's grown so much and is trying to face a problem together with Yuzu for the first time since the election arc. I can't wait to see how she deals with Sayaka.

Yea seeing her give such a nice response saying that they will solve the issue together was pretty moving.

How exciting—Mei and Yuzu are determined to move bravely forward together, putting them in the same position they were in, (checks notes) 37 chapters ago.

If the train keeps moving at this rate, I may need to sit down.

You really can't let us have nice things, can you? I get it, you don't like Mei. You can at least refrain from mocking those who do like her.

Also, when Mei said that to Yuzu the first time, she wasn't being honest. Because she knew, or rather believed, at some point she would have to leave Yuzu to marry her fiancé and live up to her responsibilities. Now that she's found a new path, her declaration to work together with Yuzu is truthful this time.

Even if you don't see it that way, let me see it that way. Let me have my own opinion without passive-aggressively telling me I'm dumb.

You’re taking this ludicrously personally—it’s not that I “don’t like Mei,” because Mei doesn’t actually exist. What I’m mocking is not you (go ahead and thrill to any supposed development to your heart’s content) but Saburouta’s ridiculously inconsistent writing and glacial pacing.

Far from disliking her, I’ve always thought Mei was the only truly interesting character in the series (Yuzu is likable, but hardly interesting). What I’ve disliked is the botch job the author has made of her characterization, with Mei’s behavior at any given point based on the needs of a rather wandering and unfocused plot rather than on a plausible simulation of an actual human being.

Readers have worked far harder at rationalizing Mei’s actions and attitudes than the author ever did.

You're right, I did take that way too personally. I assumed you were deliberately calling me out because you quoted my post, and I got caught up in the moment. I'm sorry.

Maybe I'm just overlooking something, but I've read Citrus many times and every time dug as deep as I could into Mei's character, and try as I might, I can't find any of these "inconsistencies" you talk about. If anything, I love her character more and more upon each read and I've concluded her to be one of the deepest and most complex characters in any Yuri manga. But hey, that's just me.

Your criticisms about the pacing are entirely valid, but honestly don't bother me one bit. I don't mind a slow build-up, even if it's the slowest burn ever made, as long as there's a rewarding payoff. Who knows? Maybe once that payoff is delivered it will be unsatisfactory and my opinion on the story will do a complete 180.

But until that day comes, I say to each their own.

Also, Mei continues to be my favorite character. She's grown so much and is trying to face a problem together with Yuzu for the first time since the election arc. I can't wait to see how she deals with Sayaka.

Yea seeing her give such a nice response saying that they will solve the issue together was pretty moving.

How exciting—Mei and Yuzu are determined to move bravely forward together, putting them in the same position they were in, (checks notes) 37 chapters ago.

If the train keeps moving at this rate, I may need to sit down.

You really can't let us have nice things, can you? I get it, you don't like Mei. You can at least refrain from mocking those who do like her.

Also, when Mei said that to Yuzu the first time, she wasn't being honest. Because she knew, or rather believed, at some point she would have to leave Yuzu to marry her fiancé and live up to her responsibilities. Now that she's found a new path, her declaration to work together with Yuzu is truthful this time.

Even if you don't see it that way, let me see it that way. Let me have my own opinion without passive-aggressively telling me I'm dumb.

This chapter is overdramatic? At least for me. There's a lot of shouting going on, and it sucks that Nanaki just wants to be Kanade's number 1 gal pal. Disappointing.

youre right, teens are known to be peak mature and rational and not drown in a glass of water, v unrealistic

Finally, I've found another sensible person in these comments.
My brother is still in high school and him and all his friends are completely mature and never get emotional, loud or dramatic when faced with conflict ¯_(ツ)_/¯

I know Saburouta probably won't go this far, but I'm wondering if the reason Sayaka is so against homosexuality is because she was once openly one herself, or at least had a girlfriend. But her family is extremely conservative and old-fashioned, so they began abusing her when they found out about her sexuality. It would explain her "love between girls is impossible" belief and why she's so quick to resort to violence.

Probably not the case, but it would be an interesting twist.

Also, Mei continues to be my favorite character. She's grown so much and is trying to face a problem together with Yuzu for the first time since the election arc. I can't wait to see how she deals with Sayaka.

"Why are they shouting so much? This is so dumb and over the top!"

Yeah! How dare these teenage girls with raging hormones get overly emotional when they're put in emotionally difficult situations!

Wait...

This definitely isn't gonna help mine arguing against my cousin claiming that I still adore Citrus just because I did so in summer 2018...

Dark past, revealed?

Well, to be fair, it was the second ever yuri series I watched/read (and I will take the secret of which yuri series watched/read first will go into the grave with me, that's how much I'm ashamed of it and of its author, as well as the fact that I think of a scene from it whenever I hear Claire de Lune)

Claire de Lune? Kannazuki no Miko mayhaps?

I can tell this is an unpopular opinion, but while Chie x Ai is my favorite couple in this series, Shizuka is my favorite character. She's complicated, and at times not a good person, but that's what makes her so interesting. In my opinion, a character isn't truly human until they do something that makes you hate them.

Despite how hard she's trying to be a good person and a good partner for Mio, she's still struggling to get over someone she loved so dearly in the past. This isn't easy for everyone, and it's clearly taking a huge emotional toll on her and, possibly soon, Mio as well. As much as I want to say she doesn't deserve Mio and that they should break up, I also want to see her talk to Mio about her problems so they can figure out how to work through them together. Given how much they love each other, I feel like they'd both be up to the challenge.

Thinking back on the original series, each volume told a self-contained story with a distinct beginning and end, like the Election arc in Volume 5 or Mei’s breakdown in Volume 9.

Hopefully this means Sayaka’s plot will be resolved by the end of Volume 2 and push YuzuMei forward a step

Wasn't Citrus + mean to be more laid back than Citrus and be Mei/Yuzu wholesome everyday life ?

Can I get a source on that? I recall it being advertised as a spin-off/continuation, never anything about being “wholesome and laid-back”

I think Sayaka is an interesting character. She's definitely not the most original, i.e. Girl who thinks lesbians are impossible so she tries to ruin a lesbian relationship, but I do want to know why she thinks that way. Either because of a traumatic past or just the Class S environment that Aihara Academy was before Yuzu came along.

I'm of course looking forward to her getting shut down by Yuzu and Mei's love, which may or may not open her eyes to her own feelings for Miyabi. I sincerely hope this conflict is handled in a civil manner and doesn't go full drama, keeping Citrus+ grounded and relaxed like it has been so far.

Although, I would LOVE to see Sayaka jump up on a pedestal and "expose" Yuzu and Mei in front of the whole school, only to have everyone be like "Yeah, we know. We don't give a shit. I'm actually dating this girl right next to me!"

First actually good chapter so far

It's been too long

What about Chapter 6?

I can't decide if this or Chapter 6 is my favorite of Citrus+ so far. Chapter 6 was great for Mei's character progression, but this chapter gave us some much needed downtime for our lovely couple.

That being said, I absolutely adore everything about this chapter. Mei is trying so hard to be more open about her emotions, which after repressing them for nearly 5 years, probably isn't an easy thing to do. Yuzu's obviously frustrated, especially after Mei promised to say "I love you" once a day, but she's willing to let it go because she knows how Mei feels. Do I wish she could have actually said it? Of course. But I'm glad Saburouta is keeping Mei a flawed character. If she was able to be so open after just one little promise, it would've felt a little rushed.

I also loved Mei's little diary. Granted, we've never seen it before, but we never saw much of Mei's personal life or hobbies in Citrus anyway, since the focus was on Yuzu. I'm glad she decided to immediately tell Yuzu about her encounter with Sayaka, and their conversation that followed was fantastic. Mei is growing. She's not just changing her life for Yuzu anymore, but for herself and others around her.

Alright, now time to discuss the uwu kawaii stuff... OUT-OF-THE-SHOWER MEI! PUPPY YUZU! MEI PLAYING WITH HER HAIR JUST LIKE IN CHAPTER 16! AAAAAHHHHH!!! YEEEEESSS!!!

And to top it all off, to make up for not saying "I love you" like she promised, Mei gives Yuzu a little goodnight kiss. This chapter has officially solidified Mei as my favorite character in Citrus. Good goddesses of Yuri, I love this series with all my heart!

Why are people so upset about the misunderstanding in this manga? It's not even the focus. 90% of the story so far is the fluffy developing relationship between these two and Kanda realizing she might be (totally is) gay.
As for Kanda's constant repetition of "we're both girls"... are y'all just forgetting that gay marriage still isn't legal in Japan? Even if Ookuma is okay with it, Kanda is clearly suffering from some internalized homophobia, hence why she tenses up and stops herself whenever she feels something for Ookuma.
Also, as for any potential "forced drama" between these two, does that really sound like Mochi's style? Anyone?

I know this genre isn't particularly up their alley, but I could totally see Studio Trigger or Gainax animating this. Especially the "hard-boiled" scenes >_<

If Tatsubon is really having Kirigaya crush on Nikaidou, Tadokoro, and her best friend all at once (in other words, she's attracted to numerous girls and not just one single girl), then she's probably the most realistic lesbian in this entire manga.

Nikaido-san might want to learn from a certain model from a certain visual novel who wanted to show off her lover's beauty but regretted it in the end. Though the damage has been done and said lover's beauty created an impact albeit shown for a day only. Rumor has it that the model has been reaping the consequences of her action up until now.

Is that a motherf*ckin' SONO HANABIRA reference?! XD

Which one? I want to play it now! I played until the nurse/student (maybe it was a teacher? I don't remember that well) 5 years ago, and I kind of want to look through them again.

It's from the 2nd and 4th SonoHana games. The ones featuring Kadeem and Sara, "My Dear Prince" and "Beloved Photograph." ^_^

Nikaido-san might want to learn from a certain model from a certain visual novel who wanted to show off her lover's beauty but regretted it in the end. Though the damage has been done and said lover's beauty created an impact albeit shown for a day only. Rumor has it that the model has been reaping the consequences of her action up until now.

Is that a motherf*ckin' SONO HANABIRA reference?! XD

The monster-to-pussycat makeover was actually something of a Citrus specialty, including the sociopath Matsuri becoming the voice of reason; Harumin’s big-sis student-council-president-from-Hell turned siscon, and Shirapon—who once looked liked a quasi-supernatural threat to reveal the MCs secret romance—became the keeper of wacky yakuza henchmen.

Not to mention Grandpa . . .

To be fair, Matsuri already was kind of a voice of reason when she was first introduced. She hammered into Yuzu the idea that step-sisters dating would never be accepted, and we saw her helping her friend recover from a breakup when she first appeared (even though she wasn't being genuine XD). I think her (arguably) quick turnaround is due to the fact that, despite her devious nature, she actually did care about Yuzu. And when Yuzu gave her that snap-back-to-reality talk about love, she realized that, knowing Yuzu loves someone else now, the best way she can show her love for Yuzu is by supporting her all the way.

The others, however, I can agree out of the blue. Especially Grandpa and Mitsu... ko... wait, she's a siscon? Isn't she supposed to be involved with Maruta? Kowalski, Analysis!

last edited at Oct 20, 2019 11:28PM

I agree with this point. A lot of the characters only came off as romantic rivals or other ways to develop Yuzu and Mei, help facilitate their relationship, and ended up coming off as extras once their introductory arcs were done. By comparison, Bloom Into You had only one "rival"- Sayaka- who came off as an actual three-dimensional character, rather than a plot device.

Some may disagree, but I found Sayaka to be the only 3-dimensional character in Bloom Into You. Everyone else, from Doujima, Maki and even Koyomi were no more "developed" than any of the other less-significant characters in Citrus. But that's the thing. They don't need to be. They're side characters. They stay in the background and do their own thing, occasionally interacting with our main cast and getting some moments to shine. Like side characters are supposed to do.

Also, why is everyone sleeping on mah gurl Himeko? She had some great development over the course of the story! Not to mention her role as a "love rival" lasted less than a chapter and was never really taken seriously by either Mei or Yuzu.

And Matsuri's transition from manipulative and devilish gremlin to the voice of reason who genuinely cares about Yuzu and Mei's relationship... she's unquestionably best girl!

If you ask me, the majority of Citrus' cast (besides the twins, Shirapon and Mitsuko) are far from plot devices.

But while Citrus was never a sophisticated work of narrative art, it started out being, in its own way, pretty much fun, and if readers are still having fun watching Yuzu and Mei blush at each other from across the room, well, more power to them.

Thank you, Blastaar. While I may not agree with everything you say about this series, I at least respect you for giving logical and well thought-out reasons for why you have disdain for it. As opposed to a lot of the others on here who are just like "lolz no scissoring? Saburouta must be lynched!"

I'll admit, maybe I'm a glutton for punishment, but I am one of those people who still squeals everytime Mei blushes at Yuzu being cutesy and lovey. It may get repetitive, but it just makes me smile for some reason. With the way Chapter 6 and 7 played out, I have full confidence that Saburouta is going to bring them closer eventually, and I'm willing to wait however long it takes. Because in the end, after all this conflict and struggle, it's going to feel all the more rewarding.

last edited at Oct 20, 2019 6:29PM

I seriously think Saburuta doesn't allow them to kiss or do more solely to keep the interest of the readers, because besides that, there's nothing else to look forward to the story. The new characters are just an excuse to keep the story going.

That's a bit of a harsh generalization. I'm so firmly attached to and in love with these characters that I could watche them in any number of situations and be entertained. And the new characters seem to have potential. Hopefully their motivations will be explored and they'll become welcome additions to the cast, unlike say the twins or Shirapon.

Also keep in mind, this is only Volume 2 out of of who knows how many. And the manga's popularity is still as high as ever. There's still plenty of room to explore Yuzu and Mei's relationship as well as the other characters.

You're free to have your own opinion and dislike this work, as all of your points are valid. But contrary to what this discussion may have you believe, some people, like myself, still love this story and these characters. Please don't invalidate that.

last edited at Oct 20, 2019 1:01AM

Thank you all for your answers. I understand your opinions wholeheartedly. I can see how Mei seemingly regressing throughout the story could be frustrating. I, however, don’t see it that way.

Mei clearly knew she was treating Yuzu terribly throughout the second half of Citrus, as she was basically leading her on he entire time they were together. Then, in Volume 10, the two were essentially broken up without any explanation, which caused Yuzu immense pain. However, she was willing to forgive Mei and get engaged to her in he blink of an eye. A plot point which, I think we can all agree, was rushed.

Mei, however, seems to know this and wants to make up for basically lying to Yuzu the entire time by taking their relationship slow and steady, and giving Yuzu the proper love she deserves. Of course, this is complicated since she has to balance being lovey-dovey with being a strict and upstanding Student Council President, and eventually the Chairwoman of the board.

Thankfully, this chapter finally acknowledged that their time as youths isn’t going to last forever, and now it seems like this arc is going to revolve around Mei learning to put Yuzu before her responsibilities, if that’s even possible. (It’ll be interesting to see how Sayaka plays into this all this...)

All in all, I understand everyone’s frustration with Mei being built up, then falling back to square one and having to essentially start over again, but given how she feels that she never treated Yuzu fairly to begin with, this path seems perfectly natural for her. Or maybe I’ve just been blessed with endless patience or something XD

This forum could honestly work as a “We Hate Citrus” subreddit.

I’m not here to change anyone’s opinion, as many of the points made here are valid. However, I feel like I have to bring his to the table:

If you all genuinely hate this manga so much, why are you still reading it? Wouldn’t it be easier to drop it if you feel it’s such a waste of time?

I’m not attacking anyone, but as someone who genuinely enjoys this manga (and thinks it greatly makes up for the rushed ending of Volume 10), I’d really like you all to enlighten me on this.

And don’t dance around the subject either. If you honestly just read this manga because you enjoy hating it, tearing it apart and berating Saburouta, just say so upfront.