Mark my words, the last scene of wdtfs will be Sumin and Sungji meet under the first snow of...next year and Sumin gives Sungji the red scarf she hasnt got the chance to give =)))))))))))

This is my ultimate prediction xDDDDDDDDDDDD

Would be a lie if I say I didnt expect this from Sungji :). And well, the chance of me winning the bet is going quite higher :).

I hope then I would see a better constructed argument with snapshots and all when someone argues back to me.. to show me where I had my delusions. I deserve that.. I guess.

People have their own way of giving you their explanation and it doesnt mean they have to snapshots to explain it. Like me, I dont interpret every facial expression, I see everything as a whole, so even if you tell me to snapshot, I dont know what to snapshot anyway, really.

yoonie
ok. But then you yourself said that she is doing NOTHING to get her back. See where the circle begins ?.. And if I say she is doing something, you go like: no she is passive. I tell you she is passive: you tell me she did this and that. (it will never end) This is only one of the circles.

I read your explanation but you give me Sumin's actions like how she apologise, which is not even Seju's doing. She is not the one who pushed Sumin to say sorry, she only childishly run away and if she didnt meet Sungji, is there even a good thing happened to her, let alone getting an apology? This cant be called Seju's doing. This is a sere luck she got to get an apology

Second point, Sumin is talking in her mind about how she is bothering everyone. Again, its Sumin. Is Seju even having a role in this? Partly, thanks to the scarf. However, was the scarf thing something Seju could predict? No, right.? it happened randomly and not from sth Seju actually actively did to get Sumin change, according to the "grand plan" you think.

If this time I dont get my point through, I dont know how to get you understand.

not even based on an event that actually happened in the story,

oh.. okay!

You show a panel then interpreted the way you think is right, for example, the converstion with Sungji, I see a desperate Seju who knows where she stands by saying "I could say anything I want so you better dont say it", you interpreted that sentence by "she thinks Sungji shouldnt know it because it could hurt her"

That is called a subjective view from you and me, not actually an event that could prove something or could convince people. I counter you back with my view cause of it where I prove my point not by snapshot but by words, but it's also a subjective view, to you.

You're proving your point by interpretation of facial expressions and words based on the talk or the bubble of thinking, which are very very ambiguous, it could mean anything to anyone, not by actual actions or actual events that could convince people.

I hope you can understand what I'm trying to say and I hope this is not a weak pov or lack of strong points for you to understand what I'm trying to say.

based on the context of the whole bed talk.. "how did we come to this.. why" in ch5 maybe XD..

See? Again. A word could mean anything to anyone. this, to me, is how did we come from a couple like match makes in heaven 10 years ago to the point of can not be together anymore and worse, cant even see each other anymore.

If she knows it, why did she leave?

in just 48 hours I explained this maybe 2 to 3 times.

Yeah, and you give me some explanation that I couldnt bring myself to believe completely. I open to that but I cant believe.

And to me, Sumin doesnt think she cant live without each other like you think. She thinks its about time for them to live without seeing each other ever again

last edited at Aug 17, 2017 12:14PM

1. you are conversing with retards.
2. you are indeed delusional.
3. the authors have gone too far with their concealing game, as a result missed a good chunk of their readers.

Then I'm pretty sure I'm a retard xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

Yoonie

Actually yoonie I interpreted it pretty much the same way you did... And I found Nora's way of looking at it interesting because it was different.. And like you, while I am open to the possibility, I still have my doubts even until now...

Nora's arguments are very logical - and so do yours- (something I greatly appreciate, especially being the scientist that I am) but as with any artwork there's always something that is subject to interpretation (like you mentioned) and this is where things start to branch and differ

Yeah, I do see her points and totally open for that possibility but the closer the end gets, the harder that becomes to believe but I still dont completely shut that out, I'm still waiting for more convincing facts and events xDDDDDDD

She argues well xDDDD but it's a little bit more on a hunch than actually scientific fact xDDDD. And I need scientific facts XDDDDD but I'll just shut up and wait for more for now. Things are coming out of hand because of me xDDDDD

All in all though while frustrations may arise here and there, I do enjoy reading the discussion a great deal. I really do appreciate everyone's efforts, especially Nora with her flowery handwriting diagrams and screenshots (because I am one of those lazy readers XDDDD)

She is amazing that way. No one else could ever be that dedicating xDDDDDD

last edited at Aug 17, 2017 3:14AM

Nora89

Wow, I came back to see a whole new mess xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. To think that my initial intention was just to discuss things that I avoided discussing before since I knew we would come to disagree big time xDDDDDDD. That's why I waited for more infos regarding to this "grand plan" but I got nothing so I asked and didnt think it would come this far

or whatever, I wanna do this instead XDD..

Doing this is more fun that exams, Nora. That's fact xDDDDDDDDDDD

my version and yours are not very far, both are the same.. what mine says is: Seju tries to take and do the best giving her circumstances instead of doing things on a whim. That's the only difference, I find motives to her actions rather than taking them as impulses.

the rest of your comment will be answered in a wite-out version XD

We all think she did have intention for choosing Sungji in the company but we're different about the motive. I think she wants to give Sumin her time out then going back to her while you think she want to break the circle by leaving.

While you think she is still doing according to her "plan" that you think is right, I, on the other hand, think she already lost to that stupid plan with Sungji that I think is right. You think she is still sticking to that plan here and there while I think she is now doing by her instinct to get Sumin back, not leaving Sumin or continue her plan

The difference makes it a whole lot more complicated xDDDD

I do understand your point as well as your proofs but things are, your proofs are not sufficient enough to make me believe. I want to believe, that's why I ask and that's why I still keep that in my mind to find proofs for that in every chap XDDDD. I do appreciate your efforts of snapshots and all but somehow, the explanation are too much on assumptions and subjective pov (like Seju's smirk, or implications of Seju's words and facial expressions in some scenes), those times, it totally based on your way of reading and we actually have all kind of different interpretation for one facial expression. So I literally cant abandon my thinking route to follow and accept your theory, simply cause that could mean I have to follow your way of interpreting all of their facial expressions and Seju's way of talking, which means I have to change, like completely.

For example:

ch66-85 (resuming the plan): since Sumin is not into the whole running away thing.. we return to the plan once again.. ironically, the assassin followed her that day.. so! her guts feeling was right about something wrong going to happen.

ch86-88 (re-evaluation of the plan): does it worth it ? the whole thing.. they both need each other.. and they both know it.. should she really let go or fight for Sumin.

that's because it's not a single rigid plan from ch1 up till now. The plan got changed, paused, resumed and many other things happened in between.

This is your way of interpreting Seju's thinking way, but its an assumption. You are saying you are running in circle because you keep on explain this whole process of Seju's mind but this is your assumption on a character's mind, not even based on an event that actually happened in the story, that we could see and understand. This is a character's MIND. Basically you're guessing something about one's mind, it cant be called a proof, how can a person believe in this and not question you back?

Like this

ch86-88 (re-evaluation of the plan): does it worth it ? the whole thing.. they both need each other.. and they both know it.. should she really let go or fight for Sumin.

How can you be sure that this is how Seju's mind worked like that? Based on her words? While to me, her words are from a desperate person who is going to lose the most important person in her life, not about reevaluation of a plan or anything.

The "they both need each other... and they both know it"? What proves this to Seju?

She is the one who said to Sumin, she is only the leftover love, Sumin gives all to Sungji, whatever left is for her, how can there is a "they both need each other... and they both know it"? Does Sumin even know it? If she knows it, why did she leave?

Just like when you look at one character's expression, one could say its happy, one could say its surprised, both could be true or false.

I could see your view as well as what you're trying to say but I cant bring myself to believe you

last edited at Aug 16, 2017 10:35PM

yoonie0104

hold up.. I will get back to you after my last exam on the freaking 18th of August

That's a very beautiful day to have an exams, Norah XDDDDDDDD. Next chap is very very crucial xDDDDDDDDDDD

subtly, she is trying to fix it here and there.. let's first identify the problems:

1. we have an inferiority complex (Seju understood it in ch56)
2. deep trust issues (Seju knew how bad it was in ch82)

working on #1 is mostly going from Sumin's side.. but even the employment of another TL who kept complaining about the amount of work she had to do while Sumin sees it as nothing but a normal load (would somehow send a message to Sumin and her previous team members about how capable she is AND that she didn't get the job by simply bedding Seju).. REMEMBER: Seju chose the new TL herself.

Sumin's side? So what is Seju's role in this? choosing the new TL herself? She would be a genius to be able to predict that Sumin would know how badly that new TL will under-perform, in which way could she think that Sumin will know? From Sungji? They might not even talk about work when they're dating. Too many assumptions for a simple action called hiring a new TL.

working on #2: happened subtly.. but it also needed Sumin's effort.. first of all: Sumin apologised for the first time ever to Seju in ch83.

All thanks to Sungji. So what is Seju's role in this? Childishly run off the house to meet Sungji then get an apology? She didnt even do anything to push Sumin to apologize. She chose to run away. Not helping right?

Secondly: she became more aware of how her assumptions and actions hurt people around her (ch87).. let alone the lines that Seju dropped here and there about trust and how it is easy to misjudge.

And what did Seju do again? This is all in Sumin's mind? What is Seju's role in this? Even the assumption is not even Seju's creation, it randomly happened in Sumin's house which cant be predicted so basically Seju didnt do anything.

saying that Seju didn't work on the problems is a bit underestimating.. Sumin is working on her problems as well.

Yeah, and I see you give information about Sumin doing things not Seju doing things.

Seju is like an outsider who doesnt actively do a single thing, according to the "plan" she has

yoonie.. again, ch1-54 (letting go) .. ch54-64 (getting Sumin back), ch66-85 (resuming the plan).. ch86-88 (re-evaluation of the plan).. ch89 no longer plans are required.

What kind of a person who keeps changing her plan like this? Like she doesnt even know what she wants, what she needs. She doesnt even control the situation, like everything is impulsive and just on the spot. This is not even a plan, this is like you drive me this way then I changed to go this way to suit the trend #___________#.

A plan shouldnt be like this, tbh.

Seju I know is the one who knows what she wants and what she needs so she would do anything get what she wants

the pleading part happened in ch88. (the reevaluation period)

or let me put it this way:

1. ch1-54 (letting go): she employed Sungji.. pushed Sumin to date her in a very suggestive manner (ch4).. pushed Sungji to date Sumin (ch14).. ch27: "I saw a lot of girls like you around Sumin.. hey, we have sex whenever we are bored, and you better not go all in emotionally because it will hurt eventually)

Doesnt that give you the vibe that she is intimidating Sungji? Instead of giving a warning or advice?

1. ch54-64 (getting Sumin back): oh, Sumin loved me all those years.. this time she won't be coming back even when I am done with what I have now.. (BUT there is still something between us to fight for).. but then ch64 (Seju knew about her father's plan.. Sumin: let's start over and get the fuck out of here together like we already wanted 10 years ago.. Sumin said NOPE.) .. (at the sametime Sumin was basically saying: you should have said that you loved me and fought for me when I wanted someone to held on to me.. but even then,10 years ago, Sumin was pushing her away.. see how Sumin's mind works ?)

All those chaps from 54 to 64:

Sumin's mind: Its too late for us, for Seju and Sumin, I'm now in love with another person, Seju is one step too late. She should've said something when she still needs it. Now she doesnt need it anymore since she also lost Sungji.

The important part, at that time, Sumin also lost Sungji, she lost sth she is considering important, hence " you should have said that you loved me and fought for me when I wanted someone to held on to me".

Seju's mind: I should take her back, in full.

1. ch66-85 (resuming the plan): since Sumin is not into the whole running away thing.. we return to the plan once again.. ironically, the assassin followed her that day.. so! her guts feeling was right about something wrong going to happen.

2. ch86-88 (re-evaluation of the plan): does it worth it ? the whole thing.. they both need each other.. and they both know it.. should she really let go or fight for Sumin.

that's because it's not a single rigid plan from ch1 up till now. The plan got changed, paused, resumed and many other things happened in between.

Seriously though, Norah -ah. I'm sorry to hurt you but your version of Seju's plan is very very absurd. It's not even far-fetched. It's unreal. It's like another version of wdtfs, really.

The Seju and Seju's plan all the time in your description sounds unfamiliar to me. She is like an angel in disguise who does things at its best interest for the person she loves while my version of Seju is a selfish and can go all out for love, who is too blind to realize Sumin's love and care for her all those years, who realized the chance she had minutes too late when Sungji is in the picture, who should blame only herself for losing Sumin to Sungji. Really.

and about Sungji, is it too hard to know if a person is idealistic, protective and stubborn in nature ? (I don't think so)

Yes, it's harder to realize a reckless person than a stubborn person. How can we see idealism and protectiveness in a person just by one meeting?

Idealism and protectiveness is not sth we could see in the eyes or talk

Anyway, unless you know a person, you cant be sure how that person really is. You are having a plan, you bet yourself in that plan, no way you choose a person you're not even sure to have a crucial role in your plan.

wouldn't Sumin actually find herself a "relationship that has no future" as Seju perfectly knows ? why would Seju involve in Sumin's hobby if it wasn't to break the habit!

Because she doesnt want to break it. She wants to prolong it to forever. She involves because she saw Sumin hasnt seen any new girl for a few months, so she brought in a new girl for her, then back to her.

That's the circle Seju has accepted and continued for her own sake and mantra that Sumin will be back

---

I forgot to add this.. everything happened from ch44 to now ch89 took place in a single MONTH. from min- October to mid-November

so, the part regarding fixing issues.. it's happening. and to be fair, it is quicker than that of a real life.

I dont see the fixing, Sumin is still the same, Seju is still the same, just that now they no longer see each other (at least for now)

---

Anyway, we might not be able to agree on this but this is my view:

Yes, Seju has a plan in the beginning, push Sungji to Sumin for them to date, not because she wanted to break the circle, she wanted Sumin to have a new girlfriend so that Sumin wont get bored of her after few months they have sex together. Their time out, just like 10 years. And when things fall apart, Sumin will be back to her and the circle to continue

Seju also needs SuminxSungji to break it off fast, so she intimidated Sungji at that night. However things didnt go as her plan since Sungji sticked around.

Everything changed the day Sumin confessed. She realized that Sumin still loves her, we're not sex buddies, this circle doesnt need to continue to have Sumin back so she fight

Then they had their bed talk and Seju realized its too late for her, too late for anything since they're coward who cant say their real feelings towards each other and Seju herself is the biggest coward of all time for not knowing and didnt dare to say she loves Sumin. All Seju's fault.

But Seju is still holding on because she loves Sumin too much and Sumin is the only one she could rely on so we have bed talk in chap 86 and how she has been living in Sumin's house.

last edited at Aug 16, 2017 6:22AM

Might just be me but I think this whole "Seju's grand plan" thing is some extreme over-analysis. I personally think Seju's pretty much just a love-stuck idiot acting out of desperation at this point.

There is nothing wrong with being an idiot for love?

Sungji is also called an idiot for love at this point, completely, just like Seju. Both of the are equally love-struck idiots who only knows love. Who is in their right mind to stick with a person full of baggage like Sumin, hurting you the way Sumin hurt Sungji, cheating Sungji the way Sumin did? Sungji is just better cause she can have her Sumin atm so people dont call her names. Is Sungji in desperation? Absolutely. Is she in distress. Of course. For what? For love. She is just a better idiot, if you said it like that.

So better than calling them idiot, giving all out for love is something we should appriciate in this manhwa. If using your head and judging them, it will lead you nowhere.

last edited at Aug 15, 2017 12:03PM

She was not feeling well. Seju has a high body temperature even when she is well. TG shows this in the way she clothed herself during sleep and her resistance to cold temperature. So, the touch of Sungji "discomforted" her. Thus, she instinctively remove it in the elevator. We have our moments when we are sick, easily irritated. Can you not empathize with that, yoonie?

As a normal person or a CEO with a stranger, I can empathize, as a CEO who has image to uphold in front of an employee, I cant xD. This is something not about just being sick and giving up to temper, its also about a CEO and how she treats her employees in every occasion xDDDDD

She won't. Sungji will always remind Sumin of Seju. In either case even, i.e., present or not present. But it is different with Sungji. The striking resemblance in intellect, appearance, warmth, comfort, caring ways can't be ignored. Take chap. 2 with the umbrella to a nostalgic Sumin in the car that leads to "Sometimes I feel you are still in love with me". (I guess by this line of thinking, continuing SuminxSungji is doomed but an advantage to SejuxSumin.)

Hmmm, this is debating.

This is classic of what the speech bubble can do. I discussed this in the previous chapters intended to mpgpeg.
In my perspective, Seju didn"t say it. It was up in the air. It was her thoughts only. The "please" as well was in her thoughts. Both of these functions of the speech bubble was well established in chap. 1. If you can remember, I"ve wrote this before, "so much I want to say... so much I need to tell you, so much I never can"...

HMMM, its not like everytime the bubble has to go with pattern, sometimes, we could use it another way to emphasize one particular sentence, like emotional sentences, like two of your examples?

Sixth sense. Sumin is very sexual (chap. 40). She doesn't want Sungji to commit a mistake. It is why it is called a mistake because you don't know. Thus, it is laying that foundation for a SejuxSumin as strengthened by Sungji in chap. 51, "It is by my choice."

I've pointed out my view about this to Norah and I'm pretty sure you read it xDDDDD.

Sixth sense is not good enough for a smart person to carry her plan by saying stuff like that to Sungji, too much of a risk and the talking gesture is not that friendly.

yoonie, please look at the whole picture instead of a situation by a situation:
- why she ran away that day is really related to PTSD symptoms.. her being sensitive at that point is not very surprising (ch82-ch83) dealt with symptoms other than sleeping and eating problems.

I do see that she has PTSD symptoms but what I tried to say is she did NOTHING to fix something she is supposed to know, and in constrast, she did things that makes people feel like she is not emotionally stable to get what she wants. Do you see she doing anything, aside from begging, working and throwing tantrum?

You said she knows the problems but I see her doing nothing to fix the problems. That's why I said she only focuses on one thing "Sumin is leaving her and she needs to make her back"

• the plea in itself came after ch87 and her bed talk with Sumin.. (she genuinely said that she is capable of saying whatever she wants and Sungji better not hear it, Sungji insisted.. so Seju said what she wanted. (whether we agree or not on the rest of the panels translation) but at least you know that Sungji insisted on hearing what Seju wanted to say.. and Seju said while telling Sungji that it's better for her not to know, hear or listen to it.

So she knows that she can say anything that is unpleasant to Sungji, and she knows that Sungji wouldnt believe her or listen to her. She knows her position. Her words, there is no other meaning than a pleading for Sumin to be back. So what is the plan of "leaving Sumin" when all of her actions said that she wants her back?

I guess we all had this situation at least once in our lives, wanting to move on, but not really.. because we do actions that somewhat keeps a door open for another chance. This is what Sumin was doing with her insistence on buying the house. As you said, we will need to see.

I wont argue on this since I agree. Sumin will leave, whether its definite or not, we'll see but she will leave. This is the established fact for quite a while already.

she does need to leave.. readjust and reevaluate everything.. her life, her relationships and her feelings.

She wont reevaluate anything. She makes up her mind and she will leave. For her to rethink, there should be a catalyst, and that's Sungji, we'll need to see what happens next but she doesnt leave because she needs to readjust or reevaluate. She leaves because she wanted this to stop.

because until her brothers realise that there is no battle, her life and Sumin's will always be in danger. Thus, ch76 attack.. even though it was clear that she told them in ch71 that she doesn't need any inheritance.. did they believe her or instead thought that she knew about the will !??
no matter what she did or said, they would have harmed her and blackmailed her with Sumin.

No, they wont, unless Seju did sth. Didnt they stay quiet until Seju stupidly but badass-ly throwed a fit to them? They have people stalk her but they wont do anything to harm her. They just need to have her in check. They CANT harm her. And Seju knows that

When they indeed harmed her, its because they wanted to teach her a lesson for being a smartass in the last gathering, not because they wanted to really harm her, they just want to scare her. The intention is different.

There is a difference between real danger and a bluff to scare someone and in Seju's case, its the latter.

they sent her an assassin to follow her before she even talked to them in ch71 ! and they still harmed her even though she told them about not wanting to inherit anything. the Timeline is important.

Of course they wont believe but that doesnt mean they will harm her, she still has her father as the shadow, they wont harm her.

flashback ch27/55 and what Sungji saw in ch55 itself. (I also wonder if Team Gaji said the final line as a narrative line or an actual dialogue from Sungji's side.. it works both ways anyway)

For both case, in Sungji's perspective, there is only one meaning "you want to ruin us right? Well, you will not have your wish, it wont end the way you want"

yes.. because at that moment, 64 bed talk, she knew it would take time to ever fix it now with all the things going on around her.. she even knew about her father's plan and transfer of a fortune in her name. time element plays a role in here. (if Sumin was to start over, she would just leave the hell out with her.. if Sumin insisted on staying then the plan must resume)

This is all your assumption, when actually all I see is a desparate Seju who begged to be able to be with Sumin

Like I said for someone who has a plan, Seju's actions are too inconsistent to be considered a plan.

Yoonie, I am running in circles.. There was a plan up to ch54, then off then ch66 resumed.. then ch86 (reevaluation of the plan and why the relationship went to that in the first place) then ch89: plan ends.

Yes, and that's why I dont understand what you are trying to prove? She has a plan but she keeps on begging, she has a plan but she stays put, she has a plan but she push Sungji to leave Sumin. What kind of plan is that?

well, she knew what Sumin likes the most.. she made an excellent set up to ensure that they both meet and interact.. she even knew immediately that "Sungji is nicer than she looks" ch4.. notice that Seju is more perceptive than Nammi.. you know what Nammi knew in ch19?? That Sungji is a virgin !!! even before Sumin knew it. Nammi is this sharp, can you get how sharp Seju is ?

Yeah but you are saying she knows Sungji right within the first meeting, I dont say about how well she know Sumin, I say about how you assume she knows Sungji so well that she could foresee that Sungji will not leave when she barely knows her TL and being dumped to a tons of bad infos about someone who she just started to like. Smart move from Seju with good intentions? I dont think so

for what.. to keep the endless circle ?.. the circle was on automatic mode .. why would she take the hassle ?.. she wanted to break the circle not maintain it.

That is exactly what Seju initially planned to!!!!!! The circle not to end. Never end. She pushed Sungji to Sumin for that Sumin to have her time out with new girl and back to her when she is bored. That is Seju's initial plan. That's why she personally chose Sungji cause she knows Sumin will like Sungji. She just didnt expect Sungji could go this far. It changed after hearing Sumin's confession and she realized she wanted Sumin back as a whole but its too late, that's why we have chap 64 and Seju realized its too late and its hopeless

That's why we have the bed talk in chap 86, she said "even if its hopeless...". She has realized it but she still holds on

well, it worked! Sungji changed from a person who would fuss at Sumin's touch in ch25, to a person who is so eager to have sex in ch29.. she sped up her pace a bit to catch up with Sumin's needs. Did Seju's talk has truth in it? YES, up to the last word.. call it warning or provocation.. what mattered is: Sungji worked harder to keep Sumin.

Are you sure its Seju's intention to have Sungji go this far or actually its the other way around?

last edited at Aug 15, 2017 11:19AM

yes, Seju being polite doesn't contradict with the fact that she loses it sometimes.. with the bartender in ch10 when he was initially just being nice to her, to ch52 and later when she snapped at Sumin and left the house ch82.. oh and that time when she slapped the hell out of Saehyun.

Yes, there is always a reason for her snap, emotion distress, tbh. And sickness isnt sth that bad for her to snap at some innocent person. Unless she hates to be in that state in front of a person she really dislikes, and Sungji definitely fits in that category

are you sure that Sumin made up her mind even then ?? let me just hint this: ch51 her inner bubbles, ch53: her face while talking on the phone and almost leaving the bed.. AND how fast she took off her ring. I mean come on, the sex scene in ch55 was a huge proof that there is SOME THING. Seju knew it, not only that, she discovered another root of their issues that she failed to sense all those years.

At the moment of the break up talk in chap 66? Yes, she has made up her mind, after the cheating and the break up with Sungji. I'm talking about the real break up in chap 66, not the last sex or sth

For someone who is supposed to realize the root of their problem, Seju is really bad at fixing it. Running away from home after being accused of a thief? How is that helping her situation with Sumin? Begging Sungji to not forgive Sumin? how is that helping her?

well, Sumin's words went on in another direction: remember, it was Sumin who pushed Seju away for over a month after her parents death and BLAMED Seju for it.. in ch64 she, on the other hand, blamed Seju for not saying that she loved her when she needed someone to hold on into her. Are you getting what I want to say.. a part of Sumin wants Seju to fight and reclaim her even if Sumin's pride prevents her from admitting that. why can't they start over? because they have problems that they were so coward to end properly. Till then, they can't be together.

I dont say that Sumin didnt feel possessive over Seju in the past but she has stopped now. Lets face this, she might still have feelings for Seju, no doubts, but she IS ready to leave her, she wants to. Whether she could do it or not, we need to see, but this is sth I can not lie to myself. Sumin wanted to move on, she felt guilty for leaving Seju like this for all the things she has done but she need to move on, for her sake and for Sungji's sake, Sumin has to do it.

please take a look at that scene again taking this perspective into consideration.

Yes, I've it a few times and I believe Sumin's choice has been made long ago. She will leave, she needs to leave.

Then why did they send her an assassin that threatened her and Sumin in ch76 ??.. it is only this chapter she is saying that she will be free soon. NOT before that.. how could she know when her father would pass anyways ?

She is already ready for it since the date he got submitted to the hospital. She already decided to not take anything long ago. To her brothers, there is a battle, to her, there is none, so why should she think about going head to head with her brothers to protect Sumin when she already knows her way out?

Her brother wouldnt do anything unless she harms them, so no worries for something happens to Sumin. The assassin, she brought it upon to herself. If she didnt threadten them, she should be fine

I am not contradicting, both exist.. she wanted to break the cycle her way, but no.. Sungji: "things will not end the way you wanted it to, now it's different" this line has at least two meanings.

Maybe, but how did Sungji know about her plan to have two meanings for that, btw?

before the confession, she had the plan of letting go.. after the confession, ch57: "I'm going to get you back"

Didnt you say that she has continued her plan after chap 66. So what's with the beg to Sungji? The desparate talk to Sumin in bed?

hahaha, what it matters is that the truth remains.. (her bubble before this one is what I cared about the most)

Yeah, one and only word, dont forgive her cause she is so desparate to have Sumin back, there is no plan of "leaving Sumin"

hahaha.. not really, Seju interviewed her personally.. she knows Sungji's idealism and tendency to be protective of others. Seju knew that Sungji won't let go.. even when Nammi in a later chapter came to Seju's office as if she was breaking a new news to Seju, she was like: I know, a serious relationship, then what.

You have to be a philosopher to be able to catch on a person's personality that fast and that's a big risk to take on to reveal Sumin's dark past to Sungji that early without chasing Sungji away.

She do have plan for Sungj but not to leave Sumin but for Sumin to like her and date her for a few months then back to her. That's why she chose Sungji personally, she knew Sumin will like Sungji

what I was saying, Seju has some expectations motivated by past experiences and thus her words had some truth in them.. a warning mostly rather than an advice.

And for a warning or a words with good intention, that's too early and very very not in a nice way. The way she talk, she wanted to intimidate Sungji, and honestly, no matter how many times I read it, it contains bad intentions from Seju, not an advice, not a warning, just make some ideas into Sungji's head for her own gain

maybe.. it is a possibility. However, that chapter was well translated.. it could mean this or that.

last edited at Aug 15, 2017 8:28AM

and yoonie would be that last to know XDDD

I was the last one to know? @______________@

yoonie
well, last time Seju had sex in present time was in ch21, then well, in ch55 incomplete moment.. I agree with you, all scenes after the bartender incident have some abuse or sadistic sense to them.. but yet, Seju has a tendency to pull Sumin's head towards her and loves licking Sumin's face and shoulder (not necessarily to turn Sumin on.. but because she loves it, the licking thing)..

Seju's sex scenes are still somewhat leaning more to sex than making love no matter how nicely we put her actions and gestures and it sucks, big time xDDD

isn't weird, that even the animalistic scenes they had are somewhat more natural than all of the other scenes in the Manhwa.

They have been sex buddies for 10 years for a reason you know xDDDD. It has to be natural xDDDD

But I like the fact that despite the lack of emotion in sex, somehow it still shows that Seju like it gentle, not animalistic xDDDDD

yoonie0104
ah, maybe there is a confusion between what Seju thinks about Sumin dating Sungji and Seju's personality.. you are forgetting that Seju is a very proud, yet a secretive person.. she would never show her weakness easily. If you look at ch79 Lunch with Sungji, Seju couldn't eat as a result of her PTSD but yet would provoke Sungji saying: "It became a habit of me to eat little, to keep my body in shape since there is someone I want to look good for" then she said: "this level of confinement means nothing to me" she says those words before asking Sungji a permission to stay with Sumin and she says such bold words when she is severely traumatised. Can you see what I want to say?

Seju is also a well-mannered person. No matter how much of pride she has, venting out or being impolite towards an innocent person who only wanted to help is not how Seju is, especially when she is fakingly overly-friendly with that said person in many occasions. She can politely get rid of Sungji, just like how she always is but her words are short and very demanding and irritating. And that's the only time she is being rude, btw.

So if we used Seju's personality to explain this, I dont find it fit, she doesnt show her weakness, sure but Seju isnt one to lose her temper, and clearly that day she is irritated and very very childish, and there is only way to explain this: She is angry at Sungji for being able to go that far with Sumin, her words in chap 27 didnt work and she knows it well after the talk with Nammi

before ch54, Seju thought that Sumin doesn't love her, she is only there for the good times.. yet, it is too dangerous for them to be together.. and it's not like Sumin would find a good person by herself given her past experiences. That moment in ch54 changed the whole game, Seju now had a reason and a responsibility to fight for both of them, because the reason behind Sumin constant coming back is that she loves Seju. Sumin: "what should I do if I want to come back to you again". Sumin's confession is the most crucial point in the whole 3 arcs, because it did changed the dynamics completely and forever.

Sure that Sumin's confession changed everything but not to "responsiblity of protecting both of them". Seju's mind changed like this: from accepting that she is the side dish, kicking Sungji in the picture for Sumin to play around a few months then come back to her, just like 31 girlfriends before, so that Sumin wont get bored of her after few months of sex buddies, its changed to completely take Sumin back as hers and hers alone after realizing that Sumin didnt hate her.

In ch64, bed talk.. it was a wise decision from Sumin to not start over.. they were not ready and if they did do it anyways, their relationship was doomed to fail at that point..

Yes, that's right but Sumin's intention has never changed since the day she decided to cut ties with Seju. She wanted to make new life with Sungji, that bed talk is just her confessing that its too late for Seju to take the chance, she has gone, things will not be the same anymore

in ch66, Seju was reminded by both, her battle with her family, Sumin's wish to be let free.. so nothing has changed in terms of the plan original motives.

There is no battle with family, Seju already decided to not taking any custody from her family since long ago. She knows that the day she got nothing from her family will be the day she'll be free

How can she know that Sumin want to be free? That particular previous scene only shows that Sumin said they're impossible.

In ch86, again there were moments when she knew that Sumin wants to be there more for her and so does Seju.. there is something between them.. and as long as it is there, Seju won't stop hoping.
That's what she means here:
http://imgur.com/a/puInJ

You're contradicting yourself, one way you said Seju is going by her plan, other way you said she is hoping xDDDDD

Anyway, so what if she thinks that Sumin still cares for her so what though? It proves nothing that she has a plan of leaving Sumin and all. So you're trying to prove that she has a plan and keeps up with it or trying to stay by Sumin? XDDDDDD

I would love to show you the original translation in here:
http://imgur.com/a/XsbfL

"Never" is such a strong word. Her actual word doesnt have "never". She only said dont forgive, that's all. This translation is making things a little bit more dramatic than usual.

Both, ch88 and ch27 play within the same area, Seju knows that Sumin would at some point (and she did) hurt Sungji.. The difference between ch27 and ch88:
ch27: Seju's warning comes from her experience with Sumin breaking up with 31 girls, AND her words came into reality, take a look:
http://imgur.com/a/mJ3M2

Hmmm, those paragraph cant prove that Seju is actually being nice to Sungji, actually its the opposite

Why? Because for someone who is supposed to push both of them together, she is putting ideas in Sungji's head and making her feel insecure and Sumin look bad? For what? If she is planning to leave Sumin to Sungji, that is definitely the last thing she should do, especially its so early in their relationship.

Those warings, for all its worth, could make Sungji leave Sumin in an instance anyway.

ch88: comes from the fact that she knows that Sumin would still hurt everyone in this process.. she even warned Sumin in ch86.. but you know then how it went. (this time is different than ch27, because now Seju does know how Sumin feels about her)

http://imgur.com/a/fVFkJ

That's another translation that could lead to misunderstanding, Seju's literal words that is cut off is like this "You, to me....", that can have thousands of sentences could finish that, but its definitely not "you are the one who..."

So if you're implying the next sentence is "you're the one who is getting hurt", no, its definitely not, the most I could make from Seju's cut off sentence is Seju is reminding Sungji of sth between them, something Sungji said or did to Seju in the past

hahahah.. it's been the same issue for me too XDD.. so confusing. I hope now this avatar is making everyone's life easier XD.. I love the fact that now you have an avatar.. it was about time girrrl!

Its coming to an end, the least I could do is setting my own fav character as my face for a while, hehehehe

arggh.. me too. Her scenes are just too sexy for Gaji not to make!! so unfair really !

To be fair, one of the reasons why I want a sex scene for Seju is becuz SungjixSumin has quite a few beautiful sex scenes while on the other hand, minus the flashbacks, Seju's sex scenes are too animal and have abuse tendency from Sumin, kinda feel like a sex slave sometimes, which is really awful so I do hope that for an erotic manhwa like wdtfs, I could see at least a meaningful sex for Seju xD. After all, she IS also the main character xDDDDD

I have question for Nora89 and Foxy Lady, this is sth I want to ask for quite a while XDDDDD

You two believe that this whole thing is Seju's plan since the beginning, right? I've been ignoring this prediction cause I want more proofs for this but here are some questions why I dont believe this is Seju's plan:

• For someone who is supposed to plan all those things, why was she being so hostile towards Sungji in chap 52 when she was sick? Very childish, I must say. Wasnt her plan going well back then? Before Sumin told her we should stop?

• For someone who is supposed to continue her plan after chap 66 or sth, why would she keep emphasizing that she wont leave Sumin in chap 86 and a few more other scenes about she wont leave Sumin?

• Why would she want Sungji not to forgive Sumin, if she wants someone to be by her side when she leaves?

• Why would she warn Sungji in chap 27?

last edited at Aug 14, 2017 6:42AM

soooooooo is it too much to ask for a 18+ rated scenes for Seju before the story ends? xDDDDDDDDDDD. I still want to see that creepy F-cup before saying farewell to it, LOLLLLLLLLLL

Jokes aside, for an adult comic like wdtfs and build to have such a body like Seju, Seju surely has so little sex scenes XDDDDDD.

last edited at Aug 14, 2017 5:56AM

No laaa, yoonie. Doesn't want or can't... the end result is the same: Seju is not getting what she asks for. She can hope that sumin will come back to her one day. In my previous post, I am supposing that the possibility of sumin coming back is zero (she moves to malibu with sungji or whatever),

Doesnt want and cant are different though xDDDD. Doesnt want means no hope for coming back, can't means there is a slight hope and in fact, there is a hope for that to happen, all of other people who root for sejuxsumin actually is hoping for that particular possible script, I believe xDDDDD. which I see is totally possible, based on Sumin's actions in the all the previous chaps xDDDD

then what?
A. Seju kills herself.
B. Seju keeps waiting.
C. Seju moves on.
Simple as that.

Didnt I already say that if the scene when Seju cant be with Sumin happens, I would choose A? xDDDDD

last edited at Aug 13, 2017 10:32PM

yoonie0104

LOLLLLLLL, you are hlama? LOLLLLLLLLLL

smacking my forehead XD

She will forever hate you for this xDDDDDDD

But btw Nora, your ava and my ava both use Seju's side profile, kinda similar so it's confusing sometimes, LOLLLLLLLL. Sometimes when I scroll too fast and look at the picture and read the post, I literally went "Oh, did I write this? how come I dont have any memories of this", turns out it's you who wrote it, LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

I know you discovered the manhwa later, but if you made the bet before chapter 58, I would give you a lot of credit. Still do, but even more so. Things were not as clear back then. You got guts...

yoonie0104, I don't blame you for changing your mind. At that time, I glossed over some key hints as well.

Not that I dont see things. Thing is what I perceived is what I want or what is actually told in the story? That is the question. This is what I'm afraid. Back then, things are not clear(seriously how can it be? Seju totally lost to Sungji, LOLLLL). I totally want Seju to be happy(clearly xDDDD) but everything I see might be affected by this. What if what the story wanted to tell is different from what I want? That because this is what I want so I see things that way?

I still doubt about the other ending because of it. Yes, it's a lot better now since the day I took the bet but it doesnt mean things would go that way xDDDDD

last edited at Aug 13, 2017 9:28PM

yoonie I agree that seju can use some acknowledgement and motivation, and sumin is the best one for this. You also should understand that there is a chance that sumin does not want to do it for reasons... What would you do if you need help from someone, but that person does not want to help you?

hmmm, do I need to answer this question now sine Nora has already answered you? XDDDDDD

Imo, Sumin's mind atm represents what majority of readers want, "Seju and Sumin's relationship is toxic and not good. We needs to cut off. It's better for both of us to separate" XDDDDDDD. She worried about Seju but at the same time, Sungji is there and Sungji is her responsibility, greater responsibility than Seju xDDDD. Simple example, the scarf, maybe alot of people would say, seju got that smitten because there were threads left but honestly, to me, that particular thing tells me that, in Sumin's heart, there is always a Seju besides Sungji.

I totally understand why Sumin did what she did the past few chaps, even the latest chap. This is sth Sumin has to do, if she has to choose, Sungji will be the chosen one, no matter what.

But will she ever stop worrying for Seju or stop thinking about her? xDDDDDD She didnt do anything, not because she didnt want to but because she CAN'T xDDDD. That's the difference xDDDDD

^shhhhhh. She is gone. Let her rest in peace, plz.

LOLLLLLLL, you are hlama? LOLLLLLLLLLL

I am shocked at how much romance with a touch of masochism lover you are ~

Hehehe, I'm weird after all, like Foxy Lady has said, hehehehe

as for the scenes, the one in ch74.. the transition in that talk alone is self explanatory to how their relationship went for the last 10 years:
a welcoming Seju, tucking her hair behind her ears.. a cold hard headed Sumin.. defensive Seju.. then both of them break in which Sumin barely held her tears. It was a very strong scene.

Hehe but it lacks a little bit of romantic xDDDD, its seer painful scene.

The other one in ch27 "you came..", is also one of the strongest.. in her deep despair, she still didn't change the locks.. she was expecting Sumin because deep inside she knew that she will comeback.. and when she did, Seju opened her arms for her, held her tight towards herself.. no admonition no anger.. just them colliding together in the now.

That's true but are you sure it was the first time Sumin came back, or there were a few times prior to that, that's why she knew key lock? After all, I dont think Seju has lived in that house for 10 years without moving

well, it is a combination of both. Sumin as well has low self worth that could be traced to her inferiority complex and PTSD.. this is clearly shown in her inner thought about whether or not she deserves to be loved or deserves Sungji and her other ex's.

Hmmm, that's partly true. This is why despite many people think Seju should move on, I, on the other hand, think that only Sumin could improve Seju's low self-esteem by her love and actions and that Sumin is the key for Seju to finally feel love and realize that she deserves to be happy xDDDD.

Just take a look at how Seju has made Sumin feel better about herself in the flashback of the ring, the words are simple, you just need to be by my side, that's the best gift. Or how Sungji said to Sumin also.

Sometimes words and a little bit of action means a lot more than we thought =))))))))

Seju doesnt actually need to move on to another person to be able to love herself, she just needs someone to assure her and treasure her for being her. Who could do that more than Sumin, tbh? XDDDDD

last edited at Aug 13, 2017 11:55AM

yoonie
there are actually five shots that I loved the most: once in ch71, when she was talking to Saehyun and another when she just cut her hair in ch56 (Now I know).. and maybe when she held Sumin's in ch27 (you came..), ch10 when she was laying down playing with her hair.. lastly in ch84, holding her drink..
dammit, I love all her shots !!! hard to choose
but all these shots are hard to put into an avatar sadly.
http://imgur.com/a/QYLbk

I tend to choose ava based on the meaning of the scene also, not just how beautiful she looks in that scene. And somehow I find sad scenes imprint in my mind the most xDDD

This particular scene with her unreadable expression, the shadow of the umbrella over her head, the sad words from Sumin, its perfect, so I choose it XDDDD

Every scene of Seju is worth making avatar, I tell you, especially in arc 3 =))))

interesting .. Gaji, the artist, said in her twitter account that she felt sad drawing this chapter, ch89. Well, there was no chapter that made me more worked up and heart broken than ch74.. that talk really broke my heart. hahahaha
this chapter, not so much.

Really? I find it more meaningful than any of other broke up talk they had, even the one when Seju cried in chap 66(65?), cant remember clearly, because Sumin talk about one of the things Seju used to do in the past, waiting for Sumin under snow. She also implied that Seju should stop waiting for her, not just under snow xDDDD, but snow is the most painful xDDD, Cause that's their thing

And they always spent snowfall together since young. Snow is their special thing in relationship, I believe, so choosing the snow, under the snow to say all that, this is more than any of their break up talk before xDDDD even though there is no tears, no yelling or bitter words from Seju, its just much sadder

Which is why I wonder big time how Seju didnt utter single word or showing any emotion. This is so not her when it comes to Sumin

what I noticed, was Seju's talk about death and self worthiness.. is it a thing from before or related to PTSD symptoms??

No, I dont think so. This is what has been in her head since she was a kid xDDDDD. the desire of living and self-worthiness.

last edited at Aug 13, 2017 9:49AM