Forum › Posts by circamoore

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Nah, if you get axed 30 chapters in, they give you a couple of chapters to wrap the story up. Let's say she got two, ch36 and ch37, for a total of 59 pages. She just wrote ch35, where Kaoru talks with Risako, learns the truth about her husband and ends up in tears.

So, how she starts her remaining two chapters? 13 pages to get from point A to point B, with 22% of the remaining pages wasted instead of being used more meaningfully. No way. If she just wanted Kaoru talk with Uta she could have continued from ch35 and made Kaoru go to Uta in tears, saying that she had nowhere else to go. Two panels instead of 13 pages, with the rest for more important stuff. Not the best, but better than this.

If she put those 13 pages it's because they are more important than the content of this chapter. Why? Simple, reread the last chapter and you'll see that that is the ending. The story of Uta's unrequited love ended last chapter with Uta saying that she'll keep her unrequited love, and it's now up to Kaoru. This chapter is just the aftermath.

The point of Kaoru's emotional growth over the recent chapters is that she doesn't do that anymore, she is learning to face her problems and is determined to make her own way. Uta was avoiding Kaoru, and Kaoru wanted to respect that - it needed a push to get them talking (the sequence also served to show Kaoru's resolve). It was because Kaoru wasn't having a breakdown that they could finally talk properly.

But I think you might be right about the ending not being forced on the author, since looking back I can't really find a point where the story abruptly changed pace/direction.

Back when that chapter was posted I commented that ch36 represented a climax of sorts for the evolution of Uta's feelings, an ending of sorts, and it seemed to follow fairly uniformly from the rest.

After Kaoru admitted she had been doing the same thing as Uta (on a slightly different wavelength), Uta finally stopped seeing her feelings as something she did wrong, a problem and a source of guilt even after she decided she liked them, and instead re-framed them as just a failure to connect. Combined with Kaoru's impending divorce she even opens herself to the possibility that they might connect some day.

Which makes ch37 an epilogue, where it fits fairly well apart from the issues around ambiguity I've mentioned elsewhere.

Uta came to terms with her feelings, starting a different story, although unlike Citrus+ I doubt we'll get to see this one.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

It is pretty clear that the author was determined not to commit to whether they end up as a romantic couple or a platonic one. In that context there wasn't much "more" they could do, any detail is bound up in one of the options (although I can't help feel that a non-committed ending should not have time skipped to a point where they presumably had resolved things one way or another - that is just teasing us).

Yeah, agreed. In that case, leaving us basically at the end of the previous chapter would have been okay, maybe with a little more development—they really want to be together again, and where it goes remains to be seen.

I spent too long posting my other comment to it crossed over rather.
Yes, I've said elsewhere that the end could have been better executed if, as it seems, ambiguity was the goal (shorter time skip).

But this weird grownup ménage with Rei in the same apartment building under uncertain emotional conditions, I dunno . . .

As someone who gets on really well with my siblings it doesn't seem that weird to me, choosing to live close to the people you care about. Reiichi was never in love with Kaoru, or emotionally invested in their marriage, so although he might have been a bit upset about her rejection of his "help", I don't think there is any reason for it to be a painful issue for either of them long-term, reverting to being "good friends" as Kaoru hoped.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

I have agreed all along in these discussions that readers are capable of making up material in their own heads that will enable this story to make sense--readers have in fact expended enormous amounts of imaginative labor doing so.

But I don't think anybody can point to one single piece of evidence contained in the actual text itself that Kaoru has ever had any sexual interest in girls generally or in Uta in particular. We do know, however, that she has had a serious and long-lived interest in heterosexual relationships, and we have seen her in sexual situations with her husband.

If the story means for us to believe that she has now developed romantic feelings for Uta, that means that we have had dozens of chapters showing in great detail Kaoru's growing awareness that her marriage was unsatisfactory, and exactly zero panels depicting her romantic/sexual feelings toward Uta.

Relationship**s**? I know it is a limitation of grammar, but let's not lose sight of the fact that it is just the one, and with special circumstances. Not much of a sample. When has Kaoru shown any sexual interest in anyone who wasn't Reiichi? As you say, the series has dwelt at length on how that was far from a case of simple uncomplicated het-attraction (a bad case of idolizing her onii-san). Not that prior het relationships have any bearing on the credibility of wlw in the first place.

I suspect this entire issue is a bit pointless, since I'm pretty sure the main reason for the lack of material on Kaoru's orientation (especially in the last chapter) is that the author was avoiding committing to a romantic outcome vs sororal.

The last chapter makes it very clear that Kaoru cherishes Uta's love for her, she even blushes when she talks about it. Her friends would presume she is talking about a hypothetical prince charming, but we know she is talking about Uta. That is about as far as it can go without committing to a romantic outcome.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

I think it was a pretty well put together ending. The only thing that's not completely clear is whether they are just living together or are together, but that's not necessarily a key point.

Kaoru found herself while living for herself, which was necessary to show that now she will do what she wants, not what she feels she should, or what her mother would want her to do.

Uta went to uni, seen more of the world, met more people, and with new knowledge reforged her conviction of waiting for Kaoru, giving those feelings more legitimacy and maturity.

Within a few more years Uta and Kaoru met again and are, presumably, together.

I don't see any need to expand on gap years, it's mostly self-explanatory as to what happened from other dialogue. I'm honestly at a bit of a loss as to what more people would want to see. I think being more explicit in unnecessary points would be to the detriment of the story.

I broadly agree, the story was about the emotional arc/personal growth, not about getting them together or not; how it ends is just a detail (although a detail that it would have been nice to know, not least because "don't ask, don't tell" is a nasty reminder of homophobia).

Sometimes in these forums I get the feeling that for a lot of people the story is just an unfortunate overhead in the way of getting to the girl-on-girl action, existing only to "justify" that end.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Then the ending just skips over the entire rationale for the story--what exactly happens between Kaoru and Uta once Numbnuts Husband is out of the picture?

"They get together. Somehow. And for some unstated reason. And their current life is happy, in some unspecified way. We can tell this because Kaoru smiles and says 'Welcome Home!' to Uta."

It is pretty clear that the author was determined not to commit to whether they end up as a romantic couple or a platonic one. In that context there wasn't much "more" they could do, any detail is bound up in one of the options (although I can't help feel that a non-committed ending should not have time skipped to a point where they presumably had resolved things one way or another - that is just teasing us).

last edited at Oct 21, 2020 5:30PM

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Blastaar posted:
As circamoore says, for recurrent-motif purposes it ought to be the same necklace, and readers are welcome to create headcanon saying that Kaoru has continued to make artisanal bling for what is now her little sweetie bedmate (or whatever the fuck we prefer to imagine).

But, as ever, we're left with the question of whether we're supposed make something of this detail or not, and if so, what.

KZA posted:
Edit: What if the author forgot what the orginal necklace looked like so she drew that. I honestly wouldn't be surprised, cuz they do look similar and well I doubt she'd go back and look at it.

The necklace makes so much sense, I wouldn't be surprised if it gets "fixed" for the volume release (even if it wasn't originally intended to be the same). Not only does it call back to the start of the story, it also shows Uta as having reached a point where she is comfortable "wearing" her feelings on the outside.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

I have no problems with open endings, but do it in a way you can actually connect the dots in the end? This story has ended, however, the big mystery are not the unsolved conflicts nor the plot holes, but the status of Uta-Trashoru's relationship, some have interpreted they are together, I personally don't think they are, but give us a hint? Like Uta wearing a ring or a ring holder necklace, or at their doorstep, like a newly-wed thing of sorts, I dunno, any hint even if it is to confirm otherwise, but to end it like this you disrespect every reader who stayed for the ride these past 4 years

She is wearing a necklace in the last scene. It looks a bit like it could be the one Kaoru gave her:
https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/my_unrequited_love_ch01#21
if so I guess it would be a bit significant, but we don't get a close enough look to be sure (its shape is not much more than round blob with cutout).

It is definitely not the same necklace as in Chapter 1. Same basic shape, but different orientation (open at the top in Chap. 1, open to the side in last chapter; with a small gem in Chap. 1, and some kind of blob in the last).

Yes I think it is also too small, having found another image of the original where there is some better size references... but thinking about it, it totally should have been that necklace, another casualty of rushed/sloppy writing, I suppose.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

I have no problems with open endings, but do it in a way you can actually connect the dots in the end? This story has ended, however, the big mystery are not the unsolved conflicts nor the plot holes, but the status of Uta-Trashoru's relationship, some have interpreted they are together, I personally don't think they are, but give us a hint? Like Uta wearing a ring or a ring holder necklace, or at their doorstep, like a newly-wed thing of sorts, I dunno, any hint even if it is to confirm otherwise, but to end it like this you disrespect every reader who stayed for the ride these past 4 years

She is wearing a necklace in the last scene. It looks a bit like it could be the one Kaoru gave her:
https://dynasty-scans.com/chapters/my_unrequited_love_ch01#21
if so I guess it would be a bit significant, but we don't get a close enough look to be sure (its shape is not much more than round blob with cutout).

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

I've defended the storytelling in this series in the past, but I'll admit this ending is a bit annoying.

It seems very likely it was rushed for some reason, with tmnr abruptly changing course to tie things up in only a few chapters (cancelled by magazine, other commitments, who knows?)

In that context the supporting characters and secondary plot was always going to miss out so I won't dwell on that (got more than I expected there with the first part).

Looking at the broad strokes it was done pretty well, trying up the main issues in the Uta-Kaoru relationship - Kaoru's divorce and independence, confessing their feelings to each other, and in the final chapter both of them doing the self-discovery/independence thing, but still returning to each other.

Obviously, the rushed condensed end has missed opportunities for years of subtexty slice of life moments, but that was unavoidable in the frame of tying things off quickly. I don't really see the complaint about Kaoru's sexuality either - we never expect women in relationships with men to "prove" that then can be attracted to men, why do we expect it of wlw? Kaoru never said Uta's gender was a problem, only that she couldn't answer her feelings.

The previous chapter made it clear that if they saw an opportunity to live together they would take it, so that doesn't really need explaining either.

My main complaint is about the lack of clarity in the ending. I can only assume the ambiguity was intentional, but if that is the case it feels like they couldn't even commit to ambiguity properly.

It would have been easy to end on an ambiguous "where will the future take them?" note as in the previous chapter, eg ending when they meet again after the first time skip and agree to live together. But the second time skip is so large (apparently several years - Uta seems to have graduated and been working for some time) that it is unlikely they haven't reached some sort of resolution (or at least another discussion)... "where to now...?" has been replaced with "It happened, but I'm not telling you what!"

The chapter sets up an very strong presumption that they are together - Uta resolving to hold on to her feelings, and the framing of Uta and Kaoru in the last scene, with a strong "welcome home hubby" vibe (seriously, who waits listening near the door to eagerly greet their "platonic roommate" when they are late home).

Failing to commit with that sort of framing makes it feel like "plausible deniability" more than true ambiguity - which makes me wonder why. Is ex-sister in law that controversial (seems unlikely), or are the anti K/U fans that much of a factor? (certainly I see some Kaoru hate here, and some SJWs that would cancel the series on the basis of age-gap if it got romantic).

I've come to expect plausible deniability from non-yuri stories indulging in bating (Japan seems to have a bit of a genre cringe about putting confirmed same sex relationships in gen stories), but getting it from a yuri story leaves a bitter taste.

circamoore
Citrus + discussion 01 Oct 22:13
joined Feb 14, 2019

More emphasis on Harumi being observent... I feel like it strengthens the interpretation that she knew what was going in between Yuzu and Mei through most of the original series, and chose to just be quietly supportive rather than calling it out (after all Yuzu was pretty obvious when she was figuring things out).

It seems almost like Harumi/Matsuri is a reflection of Yuzu's ambivalence wrt her sister role to Mei in the first series, except in this case a big sister may actually be what Matsuri needs the most.

circamoore
Citrus + discussion 01 Oct 22:00
joined Feb 14, 2019

Judging by the amount of people shipping Harumin and Matsuri (me included) I would say they have enough chemestry to gather a significant following.

When has in-series chemistry ever been a requirement for shippers to go nuts?

lol, for a certain subset it often seems like the opposite is true, the less canon foundation it has the harder they go for it, even the converse. Some of them are obviously just crack-shipping in a fun self-aware way, but some of them are weirdly serious about it - actively rejecting canon support of other ships as "service" for deluded fans that don't understand that their OTP is the only true way.

When people seem personally offended by a character's choices, I can't help wondering if there is some over-identification/projection going on (eg there seems to be an entire subculture in yuri fans who feel it always has to be the best friend).

The behavior of a certain character makes me think Saburouta is pretty familiar with the antics of shippers.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Hell if it weren't for hard feelings, Reichii could be part of this too, as brother and housemate/friend; he's just not a good husband for Kaoru.

It might yet. We haven't seen if he has any hard feelings. If he was honest about his only desire being to support Kaoru there should be no problem. Even from a selfish perspective it might suit him to live with them, since he is away so much. Probably ends up being about whether Kaoru feels she needs physical separation to get over him.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

The fact that she accepts with joy to live with uta while not rejecting her definitively in love leaves all the possible perspectives.
And excuse me for saying that kaoru is a bad partner when you see her when she is in her normal state (and not betrayed), that she is a warm, faithful, funny, generous, kind person that scares me on your criteria.
The fact that she will find herself will calm kaoru and uta, it's a huge evolution with all these depressive situations... they will be closer than ever, uta will become an adult and from then on everything will be possible, for me it's not the end but the renewal of their common history.

Given that Kaoru is very well aware of Uta's feelings, and also of the cruelty of leading someone on or trapping them (which was enough to finally make her call it quits on Reiichi), the fact that she hasn't told Uta "it will never happen" is almost as good as admitting she thinks that it might. If she was sure she could never fall for Uta, she would have said so.

Up until now she has never even considered a relationship with anyone but Reiichi, so it will take her a while to figure out what she feels.

I agree, I think living together would be good for both of them, whether or not romance develops. The difference with staying with Reiichi is that even without romance they are both still getting something they want, both still be happy (even if it is a bit bittersweet for Uta, she has still come to the considered conclusion it is better than nothing).

For me the really big evolution is that Uta has gone from seeing her feelings as a painful pointless problem, through accepting them as a part of herself she likes (but still impossible & unwelcome), now to finally embracing the possibility that they might even be reciprocated one day (and that she wants to be close to Kaoru regardless).

Particularly if you think of the title as "if I could reach you" or "the thread that can't reach", being the story of Uta's "hopeless" feelings, it seems to close the arc (since now there is hope).

I think there is a good chance the final chapter will time-skip (but maybe only a year ish), to moving in together and/or first date, maybe just flirting (I doubt it would go much further). Ironically I'm not sure there is enough space left for a "definitely not Uta/Kaoru" ending, since that would need to do some building around Uta moving on. Unfortunately with only one chapter left it also seems like we won't see any resolution for the supporting characters.

last edited at Sep 28, 2020 8:07AM

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Karou: it's selfish but I love you (not in that way though) and I want to live with you (walks away to get on bus even though uta hasn't said anything)

I really can't stand karou. Also uta even is like I know it's not requited but maybe?? One day??? It's down to her now??? And I'm like no uta this isn't the way to live, you can't revolve your life around this woman who literally gives you nothing back but these weak reasons to keep you around

Telling Uta how much she helped her and how much she liked having her around was a good thing. But if she had pointedly stayed even when her bus arrived she would have been effectively demanding an answer from Uta, which brings us back to unfair.

She does give back, it has been stated that she provided a lot of support to Uta when things were bad with her parents, not to mention that Uta likes being there for Kaoru.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

How egotistic is Reiichi, to think that just because their marriage has failed and possibly ended that his wife would only resort to killing herself. He must be up his own ass to think as the only possible answer.

I think it had more to do with the, “I’m visiting my [dead] mother,” followed by the line suddenly going dead (her phone getting broken) and being unreachable afterwards. It’s one of those perfect storms of “oh shit” that can cause a person to panic and assume the absolute worse. I don’t think it had anything to do with his ego.

Yes. I was 99% sure it was an author fakeout, but I don't blame Reichii at all, I could panic that way too. Upheaval in life + "I going to visit[1] my dead mom" + sudden loss of contact = reasonable chance of suicide.

[1] In English I would say 'visit' should lower the suicide chance, compared to 'see' or worse 'go be with'. I don't know the original Japanese or its possible subtleties.

The original Japanese was: 今からママに会いに行ってくる

Google translate says "I'm going to see my mom from now on" but that is probably a bit too much on the alarming side... my rudimentary Japanese suggests "from now going to meet/see mama" is along the right lines.

last edited at Sep 27, 2020 7:06PM

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

...eh, it probably was the same magical genie that caused Uta to happen to be in the exact place she was walking by when Reiichi called.

They were childhood neighbors and Uta has moved back in with her parents. Kaoru's mothers grave was presumably near where they lived, so it isn't as much of a long shot as it might seem.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Ch 36 was, for once, exactly what I most wanted to happen, and incidentally has also addressed the main issues I had with time skip:
They have finally said what needed to be said about their feelings for each other. While that was unsaid a time skip would have just let things fester, but now they are in a place where a post-timeskip romantic development would be a natural progression of a their new trajectory, rather some pulled out of nowhere "time fixes all" magic resolution (harking back to previous discussions that is what I meant by timeskip as deus-ex)

edit: not implying I disliked the unexpected directions in the past, just that I have had a terrible record at anticipating previous chapters.

last edited at Sep 19, 2020 7:28AM

circamoore
1 x ½ discussion 07 Sep 07:39
joined Feb 14, 2019

Your post clarified for me something specific about why this series appeals to a broader audience than the "incest is always wincest" niche, so thanks for that.

I have to admit I didn't fully realise that point myself, since I was coming from a very conscious analytical perspective when I was writing it, and most people don't "enjoy" stories that way. But all the things I listed do seem likely to be absorbed by readers on a subconscious level which would work well to take the "eeeww factor" out of the mother-daughter romance. Personally the first thing that hooked me was that I found Asuka really relatable, (incestuous obsessions aside) I was a lot like that as a teenager (also Tiayaki's sense of humour).

The theme of "wholesome" incest makes me think of the Elsanna fandom which is where I first encountered it.

I've always been fascinated by the question of how Taiyaki is going to resolve this story in terms of the wider social world--at this point my wild guess is that somehow Akira ends up running interference for the happy familial couple.

Definitely lots of potential there. Akira does seem to be shaping up as a staunch supporter. It would be a stretch to have them openly together "happily ever after", but hopefully Taikai comes up with some sort of way for them to be together. Lots of potential for comedy and drama (eg being proud gfs to some, mother and daughter to others, and juggling the different social spheres).

circamoore
1 x ½ discussion 06 Sep 19:15
joined Feb 14, 2019

We can enjoy this show as it is but to try and pretend like what went down was even remotely morally or legally excusable is just insane..

Anyway, still thoroughly enjoyed, despite what looked like a "this is all okay" message at the end. 7/10.

In addition to the "wrong, but ok in fiction camp" who have already spoken up, I'll point out there are those of us who, like Akira, think the specific situation as described would actually be ethically "ok" irl (that said a real situation that well justified is extremely unlikely).

I’ve snipped most of this really excellent post for space, but it does the best job possible in explaining why this particular series has earned a positive response as an interesting set of characters in a compelling situation rather than as just a titillating spectacle of taboo-breaking.

I still think the “it’s fiction” is a stronger counteragument against the “can’t you depraved fools see this is WRONG?!?” position than the “this situation is as OK as it gets” argument, because even though you’ve shown that the latter is true, even under the best circumstances any incestuous relationship obviously is still inherently immensely fraught.
...
So for me, the strongest analogy is to say that most rational people would agree that in real life the world would be better off if there were no such thing as assassins-for-hire, but that has nothing at all to do with the ethics of getting absorbed in the adventures of John Wick or Ogami Itto, and that enjoying the Fast & Furious movies does not constitute an endorsement of car theft, and that only a fool would think otherwise.

Yes, "it's fiction" is a good argument, and much more broadly applicable (& definitely, reading/enjoying, or even writing, isn't endorsement of character actions). I wasn't trying to dismiss it. It is definitely the go-to when people complain "why does this even exist?"/"how can you read/like this?", and of course some of the most interesting stories are where characters do the wrong thing for understandable/relatable reasons.

It was more that since the OP mentioned morality and "good endings" I thought I would raise the flag for the camp that do support it in that context. (I suppose it depends a bit on what the "this" is in "trying to excuse this" - the story or the actions in it).

circamoore
1 x ½ discussion 05 Sep 23:16
joined Feb 14, 2019

The fact that some people are trying to excuse this is disgusting tbh.

Look, I don't have a problem with the portrayal of immortality and criminality in fictional medium. To do so would be absurdly hypocritical.

That said.. that said. This is not a happy story or a good ending. Let's not get it twisted guys. A happy ending would be both the MC's guardians struck off their medical licenses, a conviction for child abuse and handed a sexual offender registry because that's what this is yo. It's 2020 not medieval times, they know right from wrong just like we do and they have the same responsibilities.
We can enjoy this show as it is but to try and pretend like what went down was even remotely morally or legally excusable is just insane..

Anyway, still thoroughly enjoyed, despite what looked like a "this is all okay" message at the end. 7/10.

In addition to the "wrong, but ok in fiction camp" who have already spoken up, I'll point out there are those of us who, like Akira, think the specific situation as described would actually be ethically "ok" irl (that said a real situation that well justified is extremely unlikely).

Since this has been discussed at length earlier in the comments (and more recently the in-story reasoning from Akira), I'll try to be brief (... and after writing it, so much for that hope).

First up law/morality/ethics are all different things; legal/illegal isn't good/bad, even if that is the aspiration it can never perfectly align. I'm not going to be talking generalities here, obviously parent-child incest isn't a good idea in general (in the sense of not intrinsic/universal good), but that is not the same thing always being unequivocally bad.

There are various ethical frameworks used to reason about right/wrong, one that seems relevant here is consequentialism - judging the"rightness" of an action by consideration of its consequences.

"they love each other, what is the harm?" it is a deceptively simple, but powerful argument.

The crux of it is risk vs harm. Sure there are myriad potential negative risks associated with power imbalance, age gap and overlapping family-romantic bonds, but none of them are guaranteed to materialize as harms. They care deeply about each other, and Asuka is actively trying to get better at considering Ayako's perspective - probably the only negative outcomes they couldn't work out together is what other people might do to them if they find out... which by modern sensibilities is a lousy thing to base your romantic aspirations on.

Much of the uniqueness of this story is in the situation that has been carefully crafted to set up a situation where the "normal" incest negatives are absent or mitigated, to create the potential for a "good" mother daughter romance.
* Asuka initiated things, and has been the one pushing the boundaries (ie not pressured/groomed)
* Asuka has a clear understanding of her feelings, having struggled with them for years. (ie not confused/displaced feelings)
* Asuka has never wanted for affection. (ie not substituting romance for missing maternal affection)
* They are the centre of each other's life by choice, not for want of other opportunities. (not desperation/loneliness)
* Ayako has been trying to do the right thing. Her primary motivation is what is best for Asuka. She has been wracked by guilt - Akira got though to her by emphasizing Asuka's feelings. (not selfish).

Without all that context it would just be a titillating story about mother and daughter making out, but with it it becomes something much more interesting making a hugely taboo relationship relatable and maybe even ethically justifiable.

If Ayako had just jumped on Asuka and seduced her when she found her asleep on her bed at 14, it would have been a very different story.

btw as regards legality - since they have only kissed so far it would actually be very tough to prosecute. Up until the tongue kiss only their knowledge of the feelings behind it put it definitely outside the limits of acceptable mother-daughter behavior (how much kissy is too much kissy?), and even the tongue kiss would be more eyebrow raising than definitely illegal (sex crimes are usually defined around genital contact, and ordinary assault would require Asuka to be unhappy with the situation. Some jurisdictions have corrupting a minor/grooming offenses, but it would be extremely unusual to use them for a "victim" that old, Asuka is over 16, well outside the intended purpose of those laws).

circamoore
1 x ½ discussion 05 Sep 20:34
joined Feb 14, 2019

Does that mean that we have to experience that Senpai flashback hell again? shudders

I don't hate the Miyuki arc, but I'd be surprised if it wasn't one of the more radical changes she makes to the story when she said she's focusing more on Asuka/Ayako for the re-edit. It's still important to the plot and Taiyaki loves her siscon characters, but it's weird to read the earlier volumes and not have it brought up much, aside from leading Ayako to think Asuka had a history with Jun.

Viewed like that seems like there would be a chance we would see more, or at least more refs to it in the early parts.

I agree it is important to the story - it establishes Asuka's discovery of her feelings as well as her experience/maturity (she knows what she wants and what she doesn't and she went far enough that she when talks of going "all the way" with her mom she definitely knows what that means in a concrete way - it isn't just some vague class-S fantasy about getting closer). The way she responds to Miyuki's advances also gives quite a lot of insight into her personality.

Part of the value of the arc is establishing Asuka's ability to have a "life" independently of her mother (she just doesn't like to), I'm not sure it would be possible to do that without temporarily shifting focus off Ayako/Asuka.

It will be interesting to see how Taiyaki handles it.

circamoore
Yuru Oyako discussion 03 Sep 19:09
joined Feb 14, 2019

Thought she was a futa real quick

Or furry.. all that sniffing and humping on all fours (esp since Taiyaki as gone there before).

circamoore
1 x ½ discussion 15 Aug 19:24
joined Feb 14, 2019

Damn.. while I wish them well and hope it turns out great- it sucks because it means like YEARS before we get a continuation. Also- Imo, second guessing and editing your work often makes it worse even if you have more skills now.
And making it snappier and less detailed and faster moving etc like edits often do is ALSO almost always worse I think.

I think you should just improve your work as you go and then bring what you learn to your NEXT work..

I can easily see them loosing interest half way through too.. I've lost count of how many fan fics etc i've seen 'start over'
only to stop after 1 or 2 chapters.

It also doesn't seem very considerate to your audience, to make them all wait so long.. couldnt they have done this re-edit after finishing part 2 as well?

Personally I'm ambivalent, so I think the only way to know is to see how it goes.

I've seen fanfiction where the author did complete a rewrite and it was significantly better. One problem with a large long lived work like this is that although to us it seems like early chapters are a done deal, for new readers they are the first impression. If as an author you feel your work has evolved that can weigh on you - with a "bad" ( or just mismatched) introduction it can feel like new work you do is "hidden" behind it.
Not to mention the commercial pov - the first volume is the "sales pitch" for the rest, another reason she may want to improve it (not just mercenary: in the interests of honest marketing, make it more consistent with her present style).

It is also one of the issues between a serialised work like this and a novel - with a novel the author will revise the completed work to fix inconsistencies in story and tone (usually multiple passes), and that sort of editing/rewriting can really bring a story together. Taiyaki now has a much better feel for the characters and the story as a whole, it is understandable that she has had some new thoughts about how best to introduce it.

As for the change in theme, I'm guessing, but up until now the story has been in a sense "teasing", but now we have a mutual declaration it seems like Ayako and Asuka will be moving towards a full relationship, and even sex - that presents new challenges in storytelling. Even from my small dabbling in fanfiction I've found that light pre-relationship stuff is a lot easier to write than trying to do justice to an deep authentic relationship (realistically addressing Ayako's guilt will be quite a challenge).
(Ironically I recently wrote a Ayako/Asuka first time as sex-scene practice, so far unpublished... feels like it needs a rewrite, lol).

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

but like that other person said what would that accomplish other than lengthy the story? Shes not gonna end up with Kaoru and she definitely won't learn anything from Kaoru or Uta about accepting herself. Her being a lesbian doesn't sound that interesting imo

After my post on that subject a few days ago (but given how busy this thread has been many pages back).
https://dynasty-scans.com/forum/posts/603184
Summary: Risako confessing to Kaoru wouldn't be accepted, and wouldn't advance Uta's story.

But thinking about it, there is at least one one story telling purpose Risako pining over Kaoru could serve. Kaoru has never directly addressed Uta's feelings, she has just said that it wasn't possible for her to respond to them (because of her marriage). Risako's story could be a warning/motivation for Kaoru. If Risako confessed, Kaoru wouldn't be interested, but she might also be saddened at all the angst the secret feelings caused down the years, and motivated to do some self-examination and clear the air with Uta instead of avoiding the topic because it is socially unacceptable.

circamoore
joined Feb 14, 2019

Everyone keeps talking about how Uta has been there for Kaoru but no one is mentioning how Kaoru hasn't shown any romantic signs of liking Uta back. Them getting together would be too sudden right now. From Kaoru's perspective it looks like she's only getting with Uta because she was the only person that truly loved her. That's not really fair to Uta to be accepted just because no one else was there for Kaoru like she was.

People have been discussing the "consolation prize" problem on and off for a while, since it has been implicit as a possibility in the story from a fair way back, all that happened here is that Kaoru finally noticed something readers have known for a while.

Kaoru's feelings have come up a lot too, eg recently that in a way she has shown some sort of interest: https://dynasty-scans.com/forum/posts/603188
Post from me explaining how she has been pursuing an ersatz relationship with Uta, fawning over her at every opportunity (and in the same discussion Blastaar talked about her "aggressive skinship").

She tried to drag Uta along on a date with Reiichi, and even concocted a scheme to trick Uta in to accepting goodbye hugs in the morning. She chose to sleep beside Uta, taking pleasure/comfort in it, even knowing she had sexual feelings. If a guy was making a fuss over a girl like that, we would have no doubt what was going on.

I'm probably reading too much into this, but I'd also note that the idea she was hurting/exploiting Reiichi because his guilt is keeping him in the relationship was presented as a death blow for Kaoru wanting to "try again". It horrified her. This could also be seen as an advance declaration that she wouldn't be comfortable using Uta in a similar way. Maybe the author is clearing the air for a possible Kaoru/Uta development.